3rd Avenue El Posted March 25, 2011 Share #1 Posted March 25, 2011 okay i know this is old news and maybe most of you are aware this happened. but i do not know much about it. i would really like to know more of this accident because the only information i have is that an R62 train derailed outside of union square in '91 but i want to know what happened what caused it and if anybody got hurt. i would like to know why if they say it was a derailment the lead R62 car ended up like this if anybody has anymore knowledge of this please post it here. i would like to know how this happened why this happened and could it have been avoided Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted March 25, 2011 Share #2 Posted March 25, 2011 The lead car made it through the switch fine, as is typical for incidents involving excessive speed on switches. In most cases, the first truck of the lead car will make it through fine; however it usually mangles up the switch in the process pretty badly. When the second truck comes to the switch then a derailment typically occurs. This is due to the mangled switch and the fact that the weight of the car body is pivoting on that truck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fresh Pond Posted March 25, 2011 Share #3 Posted March 25, 2011 Wirelessly posted via (BlackBerry8520/5.0.0.900 Profile/MIDP-2.1 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/100) The M/M was speeding in the area (he was operating the train at the time of the incident. The consist of that train was 1431-1435, 1436-1440. 1435, 1436-1440 was all scrapped (1436 in 2006, 1437 scrapped on site. Since that left only 5 cars left, the surviving consist is 1431-1432-1433-1434-1438. That set is found on the only. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Paniagua Posted March 25, 2011 Share #4 Posted March 25, 2011 That was Robert Ray, who was then sentenced to 15 years in prison for the 5 riders that perished. He was doing 40mph on a 10mph zone at a curve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kamen Rider Posted March 25, 2011 Share #5 Posted March 25, 2011 Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RTOMan Posted March 25, 2011 Share #6 Posted March 25, 2011 okay i know this is old news and maybe most of you are aware this happened. but i do not know much about it. i would really like to know more of this accident because the only information i have is that an R62 train derailed outside of union square in '91 but i want to know what happened what caused it and if anybody got hurt. i would like to know why if they say it was a derailment the lead R62 car ended up like this if anybody has anymore knowledge of this please post it here. i would like to know how this happened why this happened and could it have been avoided Totally love the safety procedures there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbob60 Posted March 25, 2011 Share #7 Posted March 25, 2011 Totally love the safety procedures there... 1437 was not a lead car. It would have been the 2nd car of a 5 car set. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rd Avenue El Posted March 25, 2011 Author Share #8 Posted March 25, 2011 1437 was not a lead car. It would have been the 2nd car of a 5 car set. no i know its just got the info wrong. it was not the lead car Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nova RTS 9147 Posted March 25, 2011 Share #9 Posted March 25, 2011 That accident gave me nightmares as a child. How bad was 1436 damaged? It looked like it could have been repaired with the photo provided by nycsubway.org. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadcruiser1 Posted March 25, 2011 Share #10 Posted March 25, 2011 From NYC Subway.ORG. This is the fate of the cars, and the cars that were involved in the accident. Cars 1435, 1436-1440Cars 1436-1440 were the lead set of cars involved in the Union Square wreck of 8/28/1991. Car 1440 derailed, hit a pillar, and was left with a huge gash on the side. Car 1439 sustained end, roof, and side damage. Car 1437 hit a pillar and split in two. Car 1435, the 6th car in the train, was also damaged. Cars 1435, 1437, 1439, 1440 were scrapped. Car 1436 is still at the 207th St. Yard with some front end and body damage. Car 1438 is now in the series Cars 1431-2-3-4-8. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadcruiser1 Posted March 25, 2011 Share #11 Posted March 25, 2011 Pictures of the Cars involved in the accident today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nova RTS 9147 Posted March 25, 2011 Share #12 Posted March 25, 2011 From NYC Subway.ORG. This is the fate of the cars, and the cars that were involved in the accident. Not what was the damage, but how bad was the front end and body damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadcruiser1 Posted March 25, 2011 Share #13 Posted March 25, 2011 Don't know, but it sounds bad enough most of them were scrapped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LRG Posted March 25, 2011 Share #14 Posted March 25, 2011 I could be wrong, but I heard 1436 may have been reefed. Someone please verify this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EE Broadway Local Posted March 25, 2011 Share #15 Posted March 25, 2011 Mr. Stan Fischler included the story of The Union Square accident in 'The Subway'. Mr. Robert Ray reportedly was sleep deprived when he reported for work at Woodlawn. The ill-fated train, NYCTA Train 4-2333, overshot Mosholu Parkway by five cars (according to the C/R) then overshot Kingsbridge Road by one car and Fordham Road by two cars. The accident occurred at 12:12am. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4P3607 Posted March 25, 2011 Share #16 Posted March 25, 2011 The M/M was speeding in the area (he was operating the train at the time of the incident. The consist of that train was 1431-1435, 1436-1440. 1435, 1436-1440 was all scrapped (1436 in 2006, 1437 scrapped on site. Since that left only 5 cars left, the surviving consist is 1431-1432-1433-1434-1438. That set is found on the only. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Messino Posted March 25, 2011 Share #17 Posted March 25, 2011 Mr. Stan Fischler included the story of The Union Square accident in 'The Subway'. Mr. Robert Ray reportedly was sleep deprived when he reported for work at Woodlawn. The ill-fated train, NYCTA Train 4-2333, overshot Mosholu Parkway by five cars (according to the C/R) then overshot Kingsbridge Road by one car and Fordham Road by two cars. The accident occurred at 12:12am. This guy wasnt sleep deprived. He was drunk and hopped up on crack..There were empty crack viles found in the cab. The crack wouldnt have shown up in the piss test cause it stays in the system for very very short periods of time. After the Crash Robery Ray ran home and hid there until they arrested him. By that time he was sobered up and cleared the urine test. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nova RTS 9147 Posted March 25, 2011 Share #18 Posted March 25, 2011 This guy wasnt sleep deprived. He was drunk and hopped up on crack..There were empty crack viles found in the cab. The crack wouldnt have shown up in the piss test cause it stays in the system for very very short periods of time. After the Crash Robery Ray ran home and hid there until they arrested him. By that time he was sobered up and cleared the urine test. I heard somewhere that once he got out of the train, he spent some time drinking beer in Union Square Park while the rescue operation was going on. I found several articles about the wreck from the New York Times, and it paints a pretty disturbing picture of someone who's issues were allowed to spiral out of control, and a system that condoned drinking more times than it should have. http://topics.nytimes.com/topics/reference/timestopics/people/r/robert_e_ray/index.html?offset=10&s=newest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EE Broadway Local Posted March 25, 2011 Share #19 Posted March 25, 2011 I agree but the NTSB reported that Mr. Ray had finished his shift at 7:44am August 27, 1991 and didn't go to sleep until 8:00pm and awakened at 10:30pm. Sadly, he made his way through the carnage, upstairs at 14th Street-Union Square, purchased a beer at at a Deli and sat in Union Square Park drinking it while watching the activity. He bought two more beers, then walked to Grand Central Terminal and caught a subway home. Enroute he purchased yet another beer. He was located at 5:55am. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RTOMan Posted March 25, 2011 Share #20 Posted March 25, 2011 1437 was not a lead car. It would have been the 2nd car of a 5 car set. I wasn't talking about the car though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RTOMan Posted March 25, 2011 Share #21 Posted March 25, 2011 That set has been on the line yes i operated it last Pick... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rd Avenue El Posted March 25, 2011 Author Share #22 Posted March 25, 2011 That set has been on the line yes i operated it last Pick... don't you feel weird driving a train who some of the cars were in a wreck that killed people and hurt hundreds? does it not feel strange knowing that some of the cars in your train were involved on that fateful night? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoSpectacular Posted March 26, 2011 Share #23 Posted March 26, 2011 By looking at how badly mangled 1437 is I'd say IT'S A WRAP for that one!! How the hell do you do that?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Princelex Posted March 26, 2011 Share #24 Posted March 26, 2011 Robert Ray was drunk as a skunk. I remember he was way over the legal limit for intoxication. IIRC, he wasn't hurt from the crash. It was a huge, HUGE mess. I was in Florida when it happened and I heard about it on the news down there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
INDman Posted March 26, 2011 Share #25 Posted March 26, 2011 Totally love the safety procedures there... Only one guy has a vest, no hard hats or safety glasses, or boots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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