news Q train service modification beginning December 2014

[6 Lexington Ave]

Subway riders at a handful of Manhattan stations will have shorter waits between midnight and 6:30 a.m. come December. Trains on the line will make all local stops in Manhattan and pick up passengers at Prince St., Eighth St./NYU, 23rd St., 28th St. and 49th St. Those stations currently are served only by the N train. With trains running local instead of express overnight, riders at these stations will see wait times decrease from an average of 10 minutes to about five minutes, according to the Metropolitan Transportation Authority.

Read more: Source

[Union Tpke]

Why would they do this?

 

Can you copy the tweet if possible?

Using Tapatalk

[N6 Limited]

Interesting

[6 Lexington Ave]

https://twitter.com/NYCTSubwayScoop/status/458973186475180032

Here's the press release too

 

Wait Times for Customers at Local Stations in Manhattan will Decrease by 50 Percent

 

 

 

MTA New York City Transit today announced that beginning in December 2014, Q trains will make all local stops in Manhattan late nights between midnight and 6:30 a.m.  Q train service currently operates with express service in Manhattan during the late night time period, bypassing customers at Prince St, 8 St-NYU, 23 St, 28 St, and 49 St.  During this time period, these stations are currently served only by the N train, but with Q trains running local, customers at these stations will see wait times decrease from an average 10- minute wait to a 5-minute wait.

In examining MetroCard data from October 2012, New York City Transit’s Operations Planning Division determined that by shifting service on the Q to local tracks overnight, customers at the local stations would see reduced travel times of over six minutes on average.  Customers at other (express stop) stations would see average increased travel times of about one minute.  In the aggregate, running the Q local would save about 6,000 customer travel minutes each night.

On a typical night, operating the Q local would lengthen the trips of approximately 1,700 customers, but this would be off-set by the reduced wait times for about 1,300 customers at local stations, especially intra-Manhattan riders going to or from local stations, who would experience twice the frequency, from an average 10- minute wait to a 5-minute wait, as they could ride either an N or a Q.

“We are constantly analyzing service and ridership trends in order to provide the best service possible to all of our customers at all hours,” said New York City Transit President Carmen Bianco.  “As we saw increased ridership at local stations along the Broadway Line, it simply made sense to provide these customers with more service.”

In recent years, the areas served by local stations have seen higher than average increases in late night activity.  This has been reflected in MetroCard data from 2008 to 2012 that showed overnight MetroCard entries at local stations grew by 28 percent while entries at express stations grew by 12 percent.  If this trend continues the benefits of an overnight Q local will only grow in the near future.

Another benefit of a Q local: Currently, some Q line customers headed to Brooklyn walk to express stations to avoid making a transfer even if their origin is closer to local stations. In those cases, running local service might lengthen their train time, but would shorten their walking time. In addition, Brooklyn customers going to or from local stations would no longer need to transfer between N and Q trains.

In the past, overnight 2 and 4 service in Manhattan was converted from express service to local service. These changes resulted in a total net travel time savings for customers on the Lexington and 7 Av lines.

This service change does not require MTA Board approval and when implemented, will cost $73,000 annually. 

source

[Union Tpke]

Does it say why In the press release, I can't see it right now.

 

 

Using Tapatalk

 

 

[6 Lexington Ave]

Does it say why In the press release, I can't see it right now. Using Tapatalk

See above^^

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The will do everything BUT increase train service, which is what it should do...

[cl94]

Good. There's no reason for it to run express at that time. You could say the same about the north of 59th. Trim off some time at the terminals or add 1 train. And, unlike making the run its full route 24/7, the additional cost is minimal.

[realizm]

The will do everything BUT increase train service, which is what it should do...

 

I guess the only justification they have is trying to provide service in the cheapest way possible considering the additional payroll costs of extra RTO personel manning the trains if they were to run the 24-7. Thing is late nights the 4th Ave line is dead (depite how overcrowded it is peak and midday hours also weekends go figure) Three trains running late night on 4th Ave will cost too much, well in the eyes of the MTA executive committee anyway. So yeah they want the to stay the shuttle and compensate for the lack of needed B'way local service by making the run local, late nights.

 

So money and politics basically, thats my theory anyway. But that has to change when the hits 2nd Ave. No secondary Astoria service, necessitating the need to reinstate the and also to reactivate express service in Manhattan so as to utilize all four tracks to even out capacity. I can just see it coming in 2016.

Good. There's no reason for it to run express at that time. You could say the same about the north of 59th. Trim off some time at the terminals or add 1 train. And, unlike making the run its full route 24/7, the additional cost is minimal.

 

^ Simplified version of what I just said. Couldnt say it any better, I agree. Cant have three 4th Ave services late night at once and at the same time the express late nights are not that packed at say 2AM. Thats why in the old days they had the West End shuttle same reason, costs. So were locked down with a shuttle instead of making the route run 24/7.

 

Well I'm not paying the extra 25 cents for expanded service so I shouldnt be complaining then lol.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I guess the only justification they have is trying to provide service in the cheapest way possible considering the additional payroll costs of extra RTO personel manning the trains if they were to run the 24-7. Thing is late nights the 4th Ave line is dead (depite how overcrowded it is peak and midday hours also weekends go figure) Three trains running late night on 4th Ave will cost too much, well in the eyes of the MTA executive committee anyway. So yeah they want the to stay the shuttle and compensate for the lack of needed B'way local service by making the run local, late nights.

 

So money and politics basically, thats my theory anyway. But that has to change when the hits 2nd Ave. No secondary Astoria service, necessitating the need to reinstate the and also to reactivate express service in Manhattan so as to utilize all four tracks to even out capacity. I can just see it coming in 2016.

Yeah well the shuttle is a huge PITA.  It isn't coordinated with anything quite frankly, so unless you HAVE to take it to Brooklyn, most would just get a ride or take a taxi if needed.

[realizm]

Yeah well the shuttle is a huge PITA.  It isn't coordinated with anything quite frankly, so unless you HAVE to take it to Brooklyn, most would just get a ride or take a taxi if needed.

 

True on the BK end. It can get fustrating when one trying to get home to Bay Ridge misses that last from Forest Hills and then have to wait for a shuttle at 36th or 59th Street. Its like 20 minute waits sometimes. Horrible.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

True on the BK end. It can get fustrating when one trying to get home to Bay Ridge misses that last from Forest Hills and then have to wait for a shuttle at 36th or 59th Street. Its like 20 minute waits sometimes. Horrible.

Exactly... It's amazing how Manhattan centric the continues to be... Folks in South Brooklyn can wait 20 minutes for the while people in Manhattan have waits of just 5 minutes...

[NewFlyer 230]

In my opinion I believe the should run its full route at all times. The reason is because it serves Queens Blvd, 4th Ave and Bay Ridge lets say I have to go to Rego Park or Jackson Heights from Bay Ridge. I would have to wait for that shuttle then transfer to the or the take it either to 7th Ave or 42nd street and then transfer to the .

[CenSin]

I guess now I can hit the gym at night. It's on West 27 Street and I usually trek to 34 Street–Herald Square for the purpose of having 4 routes at my disposal ( , , , and ).

 

 

Exactly... It's amazing how Manhattan centric the continues to be... Folks in South Brooklyn can wait 20 minutes for the while people in Manhattan have waits of just 5 minutes...

I think you miscalculate.

 

At an interval of 20 minutes, the average wait time for each route is 10 minutes. That applies to all of the relevant routes: , , and . Since the and run together from 57 Street–7 Avenue to DeKalb Avenue, customers travelling from and to any of the stations along the way can expect to have an average wait time of only 5 minutes (out of a 10-minute interval). The , which runs alone from 59 Street to Bay Ridge–95 Street will have an average wait time of 10 minutes (out of a 20-minute interval). Blessed, however, are the folks at DeKalb Avenue with an average wait time of 3 minutes and 20 seconds between trains going to Manhattan.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I think you miscalculate.

 

At an interval of 20 minutes, the average wait time for each route is 10 minutes. That applies to all of the relevant routes: , , and . Since the and run together from 57 Street–7 Avenue to DeKalb Avenue, customers travelling from and to any of the stations along the way can expect to have an average wait time of only 5 minutes (out of a 10-minute interval). The , which runs alone from 59 Street to Bay Ridge–95 Street will have an average wait time of 10 minutes (out of a 20-minute interval). Blessed, however, are the folks at DeKalb Avenue with an average wait time of 3 minutes and 20 seconds between trains going to Manhattan.

I didn't miscalculate anything.  I don't care about average wait times.  I'm talking about how long people usually wait when taking the shuttle.  The stats may say one thing, but the actual wait times is what counts.

[CenSin]

I didn't miscalculate anything.  I don't care about average wait times.  I'm talking about how long people usually wait when taking the shuttle.  The stats may say one thing, but the actual wait times is what counts.

If a 10-minutes average to you is 20 minutes, then I guess it must mean 10 minutes for midnight Broadway folks when December 2014 comes around. You can't accept the stats for one, reject the stats for another, and then compare the two. It's a flawed thought process.

[ACEVE14]

https://twitter.com/NYCTSubwayScoop/status/458973186475180032

Here's the press release too

source

 

Here's a better idea. Why not keep the running express in Manhattan and extend late night Train service to 57th St-7th Av (if the Montague Tunnels are completely repaired)? Besides, I don't know how that will affect the service to the new 2nd Av. Line 2 years from now.

[RollOver]

In my opinion I believe the should run its full route at all times. The reason is because it serves Queens Blvd, 4th Ave and Bay Ridge lets say I have to go to Rego Park or Jackson Heights from Bay Ridge. I would have to wait for that shuttle then transfer to the or the take it either to 7th Ave or 42nd street and then transfer to the .

 

In that case, how about we just run the entirety of the , , , and routes 24/7? I mean its unnecessary, because not 85-90% of riders are riding each line from end to end. The isn't going to stress themselves by spending alot of money for very little portions of riders.

 

Here's a better idea. Why not keep the running express in Manhattan and extend late night Train service to 57th St-7th Av (if the Montague Tunnels are completely repaired)? Besides, I don't know how that will affect the service to the new 2nd Av. Line 2 years from now.

 

The Broadway Express only saves a minute or two. Those five local stations will always get priority so that way passengers don't have to transfer at the express stops and keep their one-seated ride. Running the overnight is extremely costy and would possibly might force the other five lines to run express for very little reasons.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

If a 10-minutes average to you is 20 minutes, then I guess it must mean 10 minutes for midnight Broadway folks when December 2014 comes around. You can't accept the stats for one, reject the stats for another, and then compare the two. It's a flawed thought process.

Do you actually stand at 59th street and wait for the ? I have, and the waits are usually MORE than 10 minutes. More like 20 minutes. Even realizm confirmed that.  Stats and actual wait times are two different things.

[j express]

I wonder how ridership is on 6 Av local stations overnights. I dont think the   should run local on 6 Av.

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

I wonder how ridership is on 6 Av local stations overnights. I dont think the   should run local on 6 Av.

It doesn't. It runs express.

[Union Tpke]

 

Does it say why In the press release, I can't see it right now. Using Tapatalk

 

 

See above^^

I know but I was wondering if there was any additional info on the page.

BTW I got braces today.

 

 

Using Tapatalk

 

 

[realizm]

If a 10-minutes average to you is 20 minutes, then I guess it must mean 10 minutes for midnight Broadway folks when December 2014 comes around. You can't accept the stats for one, reject the stats for another, and then compare the two. It's a flawed thought process.

 

 

 

Do you actually stand at 59th street and wait for the ? I have, and the waits are usually MORE than 10 minutes. More like 20 minutes. Even realizm confirmed that.  Stats and actual wait times are two different things.

You're both right. Technically the shuttle on paper is scheduled to run at 10 minute headways --- but that doesn't really happen in practice many times. Overnight track inspection work, yard moves (revenue rolling stock and/or work trains), layups on express tracks all delays the performance of the shuttle. I've seen it for myself living in the area one stop away: 8th Avenue on the .

 

Many times superintendents and T/Ds have a preference towards sending out the work or garbage trains trains for overnight GO's via the West End Line from either 9th Ave or Coney Island to 36th creating a late night congestion point another reason. If revenue stock, via the Sea Beach. (The late night shuttle needs the switches immediately past 36th Street for the turnaround) Alot of stuff happens on the BMT 4th Ave Line at night and it holds up the shuttle hence the longer waits then whats scheduled on paper.

[Art Vandelay]

Late night R is scheduled to run every 20 minutes, leaving 95th on the 6,26, and 46 after the hour. In my rather limited experience, the train was there exactly when it said it would be. (the only time of the day the timetable is worth a damn on the R)

 

Perhaps things have gotten better on the R with it being split. 

[realizm]

Late night R is scheduled to run every 20 minutes, leaving 95th on the 6,26, and 46 after the hour. In my rather limited experience, the train was there exactly when it said it would be. (the only time of the day the timetable is worth a damn on the R)

 

Perhaps things have gotten better on the R with it being split.

 

Yeah you're right, just looked at the schedule, 20 min intervals. Mystery solved.

 

http://web.mta.info/nyct/service/pdf/trcur.pdf