news MTA Seeks Federal Funds for Canarsie Line Improvements

[Lance]

 

The Metropolitan Transportation Authority is seeking federal funding toward approximately $300 million in infrastructure improvements for the Canarsie Line, which runs from Manhattan to the Canarsie section of Brooklyn through neighborhoods that have seen the largest increases in population in New York City.

More than 300,000 customers use the Canarsie Line on an average weekday, an increase of 98% since 1998. Average weekday entries at the Bedford Av station, the busiest station on the line, have increased by 250%. The line has experienced a 27% increase in ridership since New York City Transit installed Communication-Based Train Control (CBTC) in 2007, a new signal system that increased NYCT’s ability to run more trains each hour.

 

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[MysteriousBtrain]

It seems 1 Avenue and Bedford Avenue need to be ADA accessable before there can be any major projects for the Canarsie line.

[Wallyhorse]

And 1st Avenue definitely needs the additional exit at Avenue A.

I suspect if they knew how much 60th Street was going to grow over the years, they would have put in a subway stop on the Broadway Line at 60th Street and 1st Avenue with exits at both 1st and York Avenues.

[bobtehpanda]

And 1st Avenue definitely needs the additional exit at Avenue A.

 

I suspect if they knew how much 60th Street was going to grow over the years, they would have put in a subway stop on the Broadway Line at 60th Street and 1st Avenue with exits at both 1st and York Avenues.

 

Such a station would be very difficult to build and wouldn't be particularly popular, since the tunnels need to descend to an appropriate grade to keep the East River navigable for ships.

 

The only reason the has a 1st Av station in the first place is because it has all of Alphabet City to descend down to the appropriate depths. Same with the at Delancey/Essex. A BMT station at 1st Av would only make sense if the subway could descend grades as quickly as the Roosevelt tram, but that is very clearly not the case.

[RailRunRob]

Such a station would be very difficult to build and wouldn't be particularly popular, since the tunnels need to descend to an appropriate grade to keep the East River navigable for ships.

 

The only reason the has a 1st Av station in the first place is because it has all of Alphabet City to descend down to the appropriate depths. Same with the at Delancey/Essex. A BMT station at 1st Av would only make sense if the subway could descend grades as quickly as the Roosevelt tram, but that is very clearly not the case.

 

Is 14th Street is the longest crosstown street? or is that Houston?  On that topic Steel on steel for the subway 2.5-3 % grade the Max?  what's the grade for the Steinway Tubes?

[bobtehpanda]

Is 14th Street is the longest crosstown street? or is that Houston?  On that topic Steel on steel for the subway 2.5-3 % grade the Max?  what's the grade for the Steinway Tubes?

 

I want to say the steepest is 5%, but there was definitely a thread around here that talked about this at one point...

 

It seems 1 Avenue and Bedford Avenue need to be ADA accessable before there can be any major projects for the Canarsie line.

 

Well, they have to comply with ADA to get federal funding.

[CenSin]

Such a station would be very difficult to build and wouldn't be particularly popular, since the tunnels need to descend to an appropriate grade to keep the East River navigable for ships.

Someone from Washington D.C. would feel just at home with the deep tunnels. I supposed it would be comparable to Roosevelt Island.

[Wallyhorse]

Such a station would be very difficult to build and wouldn't be particularly popular, since the tunnels need to descend to an appropriate grade to keep the East River navigable for ships.

 

The only reason the has a 1st Av station in the first place is because it has all of Alphabet City to descend down to the appropriate depths. Same with the at Delancey/Essex. A BMT station at 1st Av would only make sense if the subway could descend grades as quickly as the Roosevelt tram, but that is very clearly not the case.

Obviously, I was talking about the original building, but yes, that makes perfect sense.   There was no way back then anyone could have anticipated the explosion in building on the upper east side that would come much later.

[paulrivera]

If this rate keeps up, the line may have 10-car trains in the next century.

 

Good thing CBTC and the R143 cars came along when they did since the probably didnt see the ridership boom coming.

[QM1to6Ave]

Since CBTC was installed, is there any data on how many more trains per hour actually run now as compared to before CBTC?

[CenSin]

Since CBTC was installed, is there any data on how many more trains per hour actually run now as compared to before CBTC?

I'd like to say that the official schedule is a good indicator, but looking at the schedule myself, 3 minutes per train from Manhattan to Brooklyn is the most, which puts the upper bound of train frequency to 20 trains per hour—still short of the stated 26 trains-per-hour capacity.

[QM1to6Ave]

I'd like to say that the official schedule is a good indicator, but looking at the schedule myself, 3 minutes per train from Manhattan to Brooklyn is the most, which puts the upper bound of train frequency to 20 trains per hour—still short of the stated 26 trains-per-hour capacity.

That's disappointing. Maybe that's why the hasn't made a big deal about the service improvements on the L from CBTC lol

[bobtehpanda]

I'd like to say that the official schedule is a good indicator, but looking at the schedule myself, 3 minutes per train from Manhattan to Brooklyn is the most, which puts the upper bound of train frequency to 20 trains per hour—still short of the stated 26 trains-per-hour capacity.

 

The stated 26 TPH is only really possible if the MTA spends money to upgrade the power systems. The upgrade the MTA is planning now will allow up to either 21 or 22 TPH.

 

The computers could do it, but the physical infrastructure is simply not up to par to have that sort of service running.

That's disappointing. Maybe that's why the hasn't made a big deal about the service improvements on the L from CBTC lol

 

It was never actually meant for that; CBTC installation on the was just to prove that it could be done in New York, since the line was fairly isolated and screwups there wouldn't roll into the rest of the system.

 

This is the same agency that thought that the R143 fleet would be enough for the for decades.

[QM1to6Ave]

The stated 26 TPH is only really possible if the MTA spends money to upgrade the power systems. The upgrade the MTA is planning now will allow up to either 21 or 22 TPH.

 

The computers could do it, but the physical infrastructure is simply not up to par to have that sort of service running.

 

 

It was never actually meant for that; CBTC installation on the was just to prove that it could be done in New York, since the line was fairly isolated and screwups there wouldn't roll into the rest of the system.

 

This is the same agency that thought that the R143 fleet would be enough for the for decades.

 

That's very interesting, thanks for the info. Disappointing to read it, though.

[dkupf]

The only reason the has a 1st Av station in the first place is because it has all of Alphabet City to descend down to the appropriate depths.

 

That, and the 2nd Avenue El operated over 1st Avenue between Houston and 23rd Streets.

[MTA Dude]

That, and the 2nd Avenue El operated over 1st Avenue between Houston and 23rd Streets.

 

There is no need to revive this thread...

[Roadcruiser1]

The ironic thing was that the M.T.A. wanted to close the Canarsie Line a few decades ago. Now they want to expand it XD.

[MTA Dude]

The ironic thing was that the M.T.A. wanted to close the Canarsie Line a few decades ago. Now they want to expand it XD.

 

Wow, lol!

[AndrewJC]

The ironic thing was that the M.T.A. wanted to close the Canarsie Line a few decades ago. Now they want to expand it XD.

 

No they didn't. They proposed shifting the south end of the line (south of Broadway Junction) onto the parallel LIRR trackage. The line north of Broadway Junction wasn't going anywhere.

[bobtehpanda]

No they didn't. They proposed shifting the south end of the line (south of Broadway Junction) onto the parallel LIRR trackage. The line north of Broadway Junction wasn't going anywhere.

 

To be honest, that would actually have been a good thing, since at least that would give us an excuse to extend the into the southern half of a future RX.

[CenSin]

To be honest, that would actually have been a good thing, since at least that would give us an excuse to extend the into the southern half of a future RX.

Even better if half the work is done and residents in the served area complain about losing a few stations. The MTA would have to keep the new RX alignment and the old Canarsie one.