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MTA says Maspeth doesn’t need an express bus line despite lawmaker’s urging


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Councilwoman Elizabeth Crowley's request to bring an express bus to Maspeth was shot down by the MTA.

 

Taking public transportation around Maspeth can be difficult, time consuming and frustrating, especially with all the sewer work and a three-year-long (and counting) detour of the Q47 bus.


Now the MTA has declined a Queens lawmaker’s request for an express bus route for the neighborhood.


 


In March, Councilwoman Elizabeth Crowley advocated for bringing express bus service to Maspeth by writing a letter to MTA New York City Transit Acting President Darryl Irick. In her letter, Crowley points out express buses already run through Maspeth, yet do not make any stops in the community.

But in a July 10 letter to Crowley, Irick nixed the idea, noting that the express buses which run through Maspeth without making stops are operating on the limited access Long Island Expressway (LIE) route and take advantage of the HOV lane leading to the Queens Midtown Tunnel. If the express bus was to enter the LIE in Maspeth, Irick contends, it would prevent the bus from entering the HOV lane.


Additionally, these express buses may be seen traveling along the LIE service road in Maspeth due to traffic congestion on the Expressway, Irick said.


 


“In general, express bus service has been suffering from lengthening travel times due to traffic congestion, which has negatively impacted ridership,” he wrote. “Moreover, Maspeth already has ample bus-to-subway connections to Manhattan; therefore, we cannot add express bus service to the Maspeth community at this time.”


 


Since then, Crowley has penned another letter to Irick, outlining several points for the acting president to reconsider before shutting the case on bringing an express bus route to Maspeth.


 


In her letter, Crowley says that although there is currently no access to the HOV lane on the LIE from Maspeth, it does not stop the MTA from working with the Department of Transportation (DOT) to add a second access point, and that an express bus in Maspeth does not need to alter an existing route but can create a new route.


 


She also points out that although Maspeth is serviced by many bus routes to take commuters to subway connections, many of those buses are unreliable and are jam-packed during the rush hours.


 


“Finally, you must consider that not one of the buses listed has an average speed over 9 mph according to the Bus Turnaround Coalition and it takes Maspeth residents about 40 mins [sic] to get to work according to census data,” Crowley wrote. “While Maspeth has ample transportation on paper, commuting is not ideal for many of the residents that rely on local bus service. You should identify ways to speed up local bus service and re-examine the possibility of express bus service for Maspeth.”


 


http://qns.com/story/2017/08/01/mta-says-maspeth-doesnt-need-express-bus-line-despite-lawmakers-urging/


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Well it's about time.  The only question is where would the ridership come from? There would need to be enough ridership from Maspeth for it to have its own route, otherwise, you could have some QM24 buses start in Middle Village and make stops in Maspeth.  I would add additional QM24 and QM34 buses for this, but the service would need to attract enough Middle Village people for it to work.  They won't want to sit in traffic taking a tour of Maspeth.  

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Well it's about time.  The only question is where would the ridership come from? There would need to be enough ridership from Maspeth for it to have its own route, otherwise, you could have some QM24 buses start in Middle Village and make stops in Maspeth.  I would add additional QM24 and QM34 buses for this, but the service would need to attract enough Middle Village people for it to work.  They won't want to sit in traffic taking a tour of Maspeth.  

Some riders on the QM24 come down from Maspeth, so if a bus was to be made, then those riders would stop coming down to Middle Village for the express bus. With the current (M) shutdown, there's more people on buses too. 

 

Now that the QM12 serves Woodhaven Boulevard & Hoffman Drive, you don't even need the QM10 there anymore. The QM10 can use the ridership more than the QM24/34. EB buses can use 57 Avenue to the LIE Service Road, and WB buses use the LIE Service Road and 57 Avenue. That serves most of the residential areas in Maspeth (even some in Elmhurst). It's common on some routes in this area where stops are used as unofficial kiss & rides. That would also apply to the Maspeth stops (which would act as unofficial kiss & rides, for those who live a tad bit farther from the route).

 

What is also not being addressed in that above letter is that there is no PM lane, and as a result, buses run slower than on the service road. Despite the lights and stuff, it flows better. The QM10 PM ridership is very low, the AM ridership is somewhat better. At least this way, you don't have to eliminate the QM10 completely, and wouldn't have to start a new route from scratch. With all of the restructuring regarding the QM10 and QM12 in previous years, I wouldn't be surprise if they slash service (if they keep the QM10 as it is). 

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Some riders on the QM24 come down from Maspeth, so if a bus was to be made, then those riders would stop coming down to Middle Village for the express bus. With the current (M) shutdown, there's more people on buses too. 

 

Now that the QM12 serves Woodhaven Boulevard & Hoffman Drive, you don't even need the QM10 there anymore. The QM10 can use the ridership more than the QM24/34. EB buses can use 57 Avenue to the LIE Service Road, and WB buses use the LIE Service Road and 57 Avenue. That serves most of the residential areas in Maspeth (even some in Elmhurst). It's common on some routes in this area where stops are used as unofficial kiss & rides. That would also apply to the Maspeth stops (which would act as unofficial kiss & rides, for those who live a tad bit farther from the route).

 

What is also not being addressed in that above letter is that there is no PM lane, and as a result, buses run slower than on the service road. Despite the lights and stuff, it flows better. The QM10 PM ridership is very low, the AM ridership is somewhat better. At least this way, you don't have to eliminate the QM10 completely, and wouldn't have to start a new route from scratch. With all of the restructuring regarding the QM10 and QM12 in previous years, I wouldn't be surprise if they slash service (if they keep the QM10 as it is). 

If Maspeth is really serious about getting express bus service, I would be happy in trying to assist, but if this is just a one-off situation, I don't want to waste my time.  I could get some petitions started.  I may reach out to her office and see what response I receive. I think Middle Village, Glendale and Maspeth should have far more express bus service and there needs to be a serious push to force the (MTA) to step up and provide the service.  This could take years though, so there needs to be more politicians on board to get this going and keep up the pressure. Have you heard of anyone else interested besides Crowley?

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If Maspeth is really serious about getting express bus service, I would be happy in trying to assist, but if this is just a one-off situation, I don't want to waste my time.  I could get some petitions started.  I may reach out to her office and see what response I receive. I think Middle Village, Glendale and Maspeth should have far more express bus service and there needs to be a serious push to force the (MTA) to step up and provide the service.  This could take years though, so there needs to be more politicians on board to get this going and keep up the pressure. Have you heard of anyone else interested besides Crowley?

Two other representatives are Brian Barnwell (assemblyman) and Joe Addabbo Jr. (senator) Joe Addabbo Jr probably has more clout than the two regarding transportation (and he also represents this area), so he may be your best bet. IDK about Brian Barnwell, since he's "new". He is pretty vigilant with his constituents in Howard Beach/Lindenwood regarding the need of Metrocard Vans and expanded QM15 service (back in 2009-2010). He has been active in Maspeth (recently regarding opposition of the homeless shelter).

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Two other representatives are Brian Barnwell (assemblyman) and Joe Addabbo Jr. (senator) Joe Addabbo Jr probably has more clout than the two regarding transportation (and he also represents this area), so he may be your best bet. IDK about Brian Barnwell, since he's "new". He is pretty vigilant with his constituents in Howard Beach/Lindenwood regarding the need of Metrocard Vans and expanded QM15 service (back in 2009-2010). He has been active in Maspeth (recently regarding opposition of the homeless shelter).

That's good.  I'll reach out to them and see what they say.

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Some riders on the QM24 come down from Maspeth, so if a bus was to be made, then those riders would stop coming down to Middle Village for the express bus. With the current (M) shutdown, there's more people on buses too. 

 

Now that the QM12 serves Woodhaven Boulevard & Hoffman Drive, you don't even need the QM10 there anymore. The QM10 can use the ridership more than the QM24/34. EB buses can use 57 Avenue to the LIE Service Road, and WB buses use the LIE Service Road and 57 Avenue. That serves most of the residential areas in Maspeth (even some in Elmhurst). It's common on some routes in this area where stops are used as unofficial kiss & rides. That would also apply to the Maspeth stops (which would act as unofficial kiss & rides, for those who live a tad bit farther from the route).

 

What is also not being addressed in that above letter is that there is no PM lane, and as a result, buses run slower than on the service road. Despite the lights and stuff, it flows better. The QM10 PM ridership is very low, the AM ridership is somewhat better. At least this way, you don't have to eliminate the QM10 completely, and wouldn't have to start a new route from scratch. With all of the restructuring regarding the QM10 and QM12 in previous years, I wouldn't be surprise if they slash service (if they keep the QM10 as it is). 

 

I would personally have the QM10 run down 69th and then Eliot to get up towards LeFrak and then have the QM24 run down Fresh Pond Road to get to Glendale quicker.

 

Also, doesn't the HOV lane start at 58th Street? I think there's enough space for buses to get over to the left lane in the AM rush. 

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I think Maspeth would be well-suited for an express bus if the demand is there.  Residential parts of Maspeth are at least a good 15-20 minutes away from a subway by bus.  The biggest problem I can think of is getting to the HOV express lane in the morning.  The way the LIE is configured, you can't access the HOV lane unless you get on at Rego Park exit 19. 

 

The most obvious LIE access merge in Maspeth going westbound is at Maurice Avenue, it's a direct merge onto the lower level of the LIE where two lanes go toward the BQE and another merging with the LIE up around Greenpoint Avenue.  The lower level is most certainly less than ideal because the BQE traffic always backs up the entire lower level as you have people trying to go up the left LIE lane until the very last second to cut everyone else in line.  It's also less than ideal to take the lower level LIE lane and come up by Greenpoint avenue as you usually have two lanes of bumper to bumper lines waiting to get off for the Queensboro Bridge. 

 

The only thing I can think of is perhaps in the morning making the last pickup somewhere by Grand and 69th and then running express down Eliot to get to the LIE by the Queens Center Mall (though I don't really know how much time that would ultimately save) versus just going through the lower level and then going through the non-HOV westbound tube. 

 

The biggest problem is that you really save time with the HOV lane at the westbound AM tunnel approach because it gets backed up when the 3 lanes converge to 2, also I take the bus early and am in the city before 8 AM, so I have no idea how much worse the LIE gets around peak AM rush time.

 

It may be ideal for Maspeth to run toward the 59th Street bridge via Queens Blvd in the morning and then run down 5th Avenue to wherever, though I admittedly have no idea if that would be any better or worse in the morning. 

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I think Maspeth would be well-suited for an express bus if the demand is there.  Residential parts of Maspeth are at least a good 15-20 minutes away from a subway by bus.  The biggest problem I can think of is getting to the HOV express lane in the morning.  The way the LIE is configured, you can't access the HOV lane unless you get on at Rego Park exit 19. 

 

The most obvious LIE access merge in Maspeth going westbound is at Maurice Avenue, it's a direct merge onto the lower level of the LIE where two lanes go toward the BQE and another merging with the LIE up around Greenpoint Avenue.  The lower level is most certainly less than ideal because the BQE traffic always backs up the entire lower level as you have people trying to go up the left LIE lane until the very last second to cut everyone else in line.  It's also less than ideal to take the lower level LIE lane and come up by Greenpoint avenue as you usually have two lanes of bumper to bumper lines waiting to get off for the Queensboro Bridge. 

 

The only thing I can think of is perhaps in the morning making the last pickup somewhere by Grand and 69th and then running express down Eliot to get to the LIE by the Queens Center Mall (though I don't really know how much time that would ultimately save) versus just going through the lower level and then going through the non-HOV westbound tube. 

 

The biggest problem is that you really save time with the HOV lane at the westbound AM tunnel approach because it gets backed up when the 3 lanes converge to 2, also I take the bus early and am in the city before 8 AM, so I have no idea how much worse the LIE gets around peak AM rush time.

 

It may be ideal for Maspeth to run toward the 59th Street bridge via Queens Blvd in the morning and then run down 5th Avenue to wherever, though I admittedly have no idea if that would be any better or worse in the morning. 

I have reached out to Councilwoman Crowley's office and await an answer on this matter. My hope is to be able to work with all elected officials from Maspeth, Middle Village and Glendale to circulate an online petition to bring to the (MTA)'s attention to not only start some sort of express bus service for Maspeth, but also improve express bus service for Middle Village and Glendale. There should be service longer during the week, perhaps until mid-day as is in the case in other communities, and I would like to see the QM15 run on Sundays via Woodhaven Blvd to serve Middle Village and Glendale that way if a separate service can't run.  These are objectives that I think are reasonable and can be implemented with enough pressure on the (MTA), but it needs to be relentless. Queens residents need to start speaking up for the services that they need instead of accepting the garbage subway service that the (MTA) continues to provide.  The (M) simply does not cut it nor does that subway to bus nonsense.

 

It took a number of years to get weekend service on the X27 and X28 restored but I remember working with all of the elected officials in those areas and we got the job done in the end. They were all working together the way it should be. I'm hopeful that the officials in these areas of Queens will do the same, along the residents that live there because it won't get done if they don't speak up.  Bay Ridge was relentless in constantly requesting weekend service which is why they got it first.  It took a lot longer for the X28, but we had the political backing.

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I think Maspeth would be well-suited for an express bus if the demand is there. Residential parts of Maspeth are at least a good 15-20 minutes away from a subway by bus. The biggest problem I can think of is getting to the HOV express lane in the morning. The way the LIE is configured, you can't access the HOV lane unless you get on at Rego Park exit 19.

 

The most obvious LIE access merge in Maspeth going westbound is at Maurice Avenue, it's a direct merge onto the lower level of the LIE where two lanes go toward the BQE and another merging with the LIE up around Greenpoint Avenue. The lower level is most certainly less than ideal because the BQE traffic always backs up the entire lower level as you have people trying to go up the left LIE lane until the very last second to cut everyone else in line. It's also less than ideal to take the lower level LIE lane and come up by Greenpoint avenue as you usually have two lanes of bumper to bumper lines waiting to get off for the Queensboro Bridge.

 

The only thing I can think of is perhaps in the morning making the last pickup somewhere by Grand and 69th and then running express down Eliot to get to the LIE by the Queens Center Mall (though I don't really know how much time that would ultimately save) versus just going through the lower level and then going through the non-HOV westbound tube.

 

The biggest problem is that you really save time with the HOV lane at the westbound AM tunnel approach because it gets backed up when the 3 lanes converge to 2, also I take the bus early and am in the city before 8 AM, so I have no idea how much worse the LIE gets around peak AM rush time.

 

It may be ideal for Maspeth to run toward the 59th Street bridge via Queens Blvd in the morning and then run down 5th Avenue to wherever, though I admittedly have no idea if that would be any better or worse in the morning.

The traffic on the LIE you described is just as bad or worse between 8 and 830 am. Ridership would be anemic if any buses ran on the non HOV portion in the morning, traffic heading the QMT sometimes backs up from just after exit 15.

 

At least in the afternoon the service road is somewhat a decent alternative.

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I would personally have the QM10 run down 69th and then Eliot to get up towards LeFrak and then have the QM24 run down Fresh Pond Road to get to Glendale quicker.

 

Also, doesn't the HOV lane start at 58th Street? I think there's enough space for buses to get over to the left lane in the AM rush. 

That requires more QM10 service, and reductions to QM24 service. LeFrak doesn't need all that service, and service on the QM24 is still pretty fast regardless of the routing (when compared to the QM10. Additionally, for many, the QM10 would be slower over the current QM24 (on Eliot Avenue). Although Glendale and Ridgewood contribute to the QM24/QM25/QM34 ridership, Eliot Avenue (more specifically, Eliot Avenue east of 74 Street) is where a large concentration of the ridership goes to/comes from. This is especially true in the PM rush, which is why I'm skeptical of any such change.

 

The QM10 needs a wider catchment area. It may have been ideal when the route first began, but times have changed, and the route is a shadow of itself. But I don't believe Eliot Avenue is the right avenue for it (the QM24 should stay serving Eliot Avenue as it is). 

I think Maspeth would be well-suited for an express bus if the demand is there.  Residential parts of Maspeth are at least a good 15-20 minutes away from a subway by bus.  The biggest problem I can think of is getting to the HOV express lane in the morning.  The way the LIE is configured, you can't access the HOV lane unless you get on at Rego Park exit 19. 

 

The most obvious LIE access merge in Maspeth going westbound is at Maurice Avenue, it's a direct merge onto the lower level of the LIE where two lanes go toward the BQE and another merging with the LIE up around Greenpoint Avenue.  The lower level is most certainly less than ideal because the BQE traffic always backs up the entire lower level as you have people trying to go up the left LIE lane until the very last second to cut everyone else in line.  It's also less than ideal to take the lower level LIE lane and come up by Greenpoint avenue as you usually have two lanes of bumper to bumper lines waiting to get off for the Queensboro Bridge. 

 

The only thing I can think of is perhaps in the morning making the last pickup somewhere by Grand and 69th and then running express down Eliot to get to the LIE by the Queens Center Mall (though I don't really know how much time that would ultimately save) versus just going through the lower level and then going through the non-HOV westbound tube. 

 

The biggest problem is that you really save time with the HOV lane at the westbound AM tunnel approach because it gets backed up when the 3 lanes converge to 2, also I take the bus early and am in the city before 8 AM, so I have no idea how much worse the LIE gets around peak AM rush time.

 

It may be ideal for Maspeth to run toward the 59th Street bridge via Queens Blvd in the morning and then run down 5th Avenue to wherever, though I admittedly have no idea if that would be any better or worse in the morning. 

IDK about going down 5th Avenue, it just is too congested.

 

For the routing, Borden Avenue, to 58 Street, to Laurel Hill Boulevard, to Borden Avenue, to the LIE Entrance then exit, and consequent loop into the tunnel entrance is probably the best you're going to get with the AM routing. The only potential problem would be the area around Greenpoint Avenue, but besides that, it would still be faster than waiting for the Q67 to (7) , and without a doubt faster than the Q58/Q59 to the (R), or the Q18 to the (7) (the latter is not far in terms of distance to the subway, but it meanders around Maspeth first). The only other option would be to go via Review Avenue (avoids Greenpoint Avenue and Van Dam Street, and is more free-flowing, but has slightly more turns than the other routing)

 

Like I previously mentioned, I would have the QM10 serve Maspeth instead of creating a new route. Such a move would increase travel time on the current QM10 (and the MTA would likely say something regarding that). However, the entire route should be restructured. Beside adding Maspeth stops, I would eliminate service in Rego Park, it is not needed. 

 

With regards to AM service, the QM12 is much faster, more frequent, and a block north. The QM12 also serves Hoffman Drive, so that stop isn't needed on the QM10. That virtually leaves the LeFrak City stops. The QM10 via Maspeth would still be faster though and just about the same to operate. DH is lessened since buses would originate at Van Doren Street after coming off the GCP. Runtime is increased on the route because of the added stops. Runtime between Van Doren Street and 63 Street/LIE would be around 20-23 minutes. The travel time from there to the tunnel would be 15 minutes, and it takes 4-6 minutes from there to 34 Street & 3 Avenue (or 5-6 to 3 Avenue & 38 Street). Essentially, it would take 40-44 minutes to 34 Street (or 38 Street), 54 minutes to 55 Street, and 64-67 minutes to 57 Street. Most get off before 57 Street anyways, so the times savings is more still compared to the subway, and the increase in travel time isn't too drastic.

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That requires more QM10 service, and reductions to QM24 service. LeFrak doesn't need all that service, and service on the QM24 is still pretty fast regardless of the routing (when compared to the QM10. Additionally, for many, the QM10 would be slower over the current QM24 (on Eliot Avenue). Although Glendale and Ridgewood contribute to the QM24/QM25/QM34 ridership, Eliot Avenue (more specifically, Eliot Avenue east of 74 Street) is where a large concentration of the ridership goes to/comes from. This is especially true in the PM rush, which is why I'm skeptical of any such change.

This is why I suggested extending the QM24, and perhaps picking up the end of the QM12, between Woodhaven and Queens Blvd. (So the route would be a little more direct for that section as well. This whole system, like the subways, was set up around the whole "cemetery belt" as the great divide [between the "cities/towns" of Brooklyn and Queens, originally] where everything ends on one side or the other).

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This is why I suggested extending the QM24, and perhaps picking up the end of the QM12, between Woodhaven and Queens Blvd. (So the route would be a little more direct for that section as well. This whole system, like the subways, was set up around the whole "cemetery belt" as the great divide [between the "cities/towns" of Brooklyn and Queens, originally] where everything ends on one side or the other).

While that would be faster over the current QM12, the current QM12 stop is a 6 minute walk (according to Google Maps) from the Woodhaven Boulevard & 81 Road stop on the QM15. The QM15 operates more frequently than the QM12 or QM24, so it wouldn't really matter for 6 Avenue services.

 

*Maybe* it can work for 3 Avenue service, but IDK how many 3 Avenue riders actually use the Crescent Apartments stop in the morning (in the evening, it's close to nothing). Either way, the Crescent Apartments, Glendale, and Ridgewood ridership will not be enough. Sure, Maspeth can be a nice addition to existing ridership, but having it run along Eliot Avenue would be the only way the service would stay with the same frequencies (otherwise, it would be a cut to the current frequencies). 

 

IMO, splitting service up like that would create longer waits for almost everyone (except Maspeth, which doesn't current have any express bus line), all to serve one stop which doesn't serve too many people. 

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I don't know which apartment complex that is, but wouldn't the whole Yellowstone strip from Woodhaven to Queens Blvd have at least as many riders as Eliot? Eliot is actually very suburban-like, while the area on the other side of Woodhaven seems denser. How does Eliot end up having so many people in comparison? 

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I don't know which apartment complex that is, but wouldn't the whole Yellowstone strip from Woodhaven to Queens Blvd have at least as many riders as Eliot? Eliot is actually very suburban-like, while the area on the other side of Woodhaven seems denser. How does Eliot end up having so many people in comparison? 

Suburban doesn't mean less per se.  Eliot Avenue has more ridership because Middle Village is tonier than Glendale.  I've always liked Middle Village much more than Glendale. It looks better kept, the houses are much nicer and generally aren't packed on top of each other, and the residents there are more monied than in most of Glendale.  Only upper Glendale can compare to Middle Village.  I'm not sure why you're so shocked.  Most of Middle Village is further away from the subway. That and the Q38 runs like crap.  Glendale has more in common with Ridgewood and is uglier quite frankly.  Narrow streets, ugly houses packed on top of each other.  Dare I say ghetto looking in parts.  The parts along Eliot have household incomes close to $90,000, so those people can afford the express bus and will use it.  Glendale while not poor is not in the same boat.  It's solid middle class, but most of it isn't upper middle class.

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I at this point wasn't comparing Middle Village to Glendale, because Yellowstone (which is where I was talking about extending to) isn't Glendale. It seems to be the border between Rego Park and Forest Hills (though it is obviously closer to the subway, don't know if that would make the area have less riders).

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I at this point wasn't comparing Middle Village to Glendale, because Yellowstone (which is where I was talking about extending to) isn't Glendale. It seems to be the border between Rego Park and Forest Hills (though it is obviously closer to the subway, don't know if that would make the area have less riders).

What would be the point though? The QM12 and QM42 already serve Yellowstone and already have to compete with the subway and the LIRR.  Forest Hills is like Riverdale.  Subway riders, your express bus riders and your LIRR riders.  Rego Park already has the QM15 and BM5 along Woodhaven Blvd.  I think the best solution would be some sort of change to the QM24/QM34/QM25 service.  You do surveys to see what residents want and need the most and understand travel patterns, then see what is most efficient to serve Glendale/Ridgewood, Middle Village and Maspeth, and quite frankly, any bus not running down Eliot won't do too well IMO. You need a steady ridership base/an anchor somewhere, and just about every express bus that is holding up ok has that, and Eliot Avenue is it for that area.

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The point was, if cutting Eliot out of the QM24 (and 25, and 34) would eliminate too many riders, then you can replace them by extending it somewhere, and I suggested part of the Yellowstone end of the QM12 (and 42), because that is the closest to there the QM24 ends now. (If it could be extended anywhere else, then just as well).

 

The biggest change I see that is needed is eliminating the far out of the way routing (And which would also potentially bring service to Maspeth); what else other change would it need?

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The point was, if cutting Eliot out of the QM24 (and 25, and 34) would eliminate too many riders, then you can replace them by extending it somewhere, and I suggested part of the Yellowstone end of the QM12 (and 42), because that is the closest to there the QM24 ends now. (If it could be extended anywhere else, then just as well).

 

The biggest change I see that is needed is eliminating the far out of the way routing (And which would also potentially bring service to Maspeth); what else other change would it need?

You can't do much until it's clear how much ridership could be obtained from Maspeth and how many stops would be made. You would at least 3-4 stops within Maspeth in my opinion unless you have some sort of park-and-ride.
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