2Line1291 Posted August 16, 2009 Author Share #26 Posted August 16, 2009 So its not possible to have both an WPR Bronx Local train and WPR Bronx Express train outside of rush hours when the runs express peak direction Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shortline Bus Posted August 16, 2009 Share #27 Posted August 16, 2009 So its not possible to have both an WPR Bronx Local train and WPR Bronx Express train outside of rush hours when the runs express peak direction Nope. This is an example where the White Plains Rd/Dyre line should have had 4 tracks bulit at least between 180th and 149th. Ditto for the Flushing line. Then a plan you mentioned could have worked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1447 Posted August 16, 2009 Share #28 Posted August 16, 2009 Two quick points for the OP. The line was the Dyre line in the late '50s-early '60s era and the Lexington Ave was the WPR line. The residents of Eastchester and Co-op City protested. The residents wanted Lexington Ave service, not 7th Ave service and they had the clout to get it. Therefore the service was swapped. To appease the WPR riders am and pm Lex service was kept from 241st. You have to remember that they always had East Side service from 241st from the 3rd Avenue el service and then from the opening of the subway. When the el was truncated to Bronx only service there was no way those riders were going to give up East side access. Therefore the thru express, which originally ran from 241st stopping at Gun Hill Road, East 180st, and on to 149th St-3rd Ave. Point #2. A few years ago there was a plan to have the Dyre Ave trains run local in the Bronx while WPR and trains would run express between 149th st-3rd Ave and East 180th st during rush hours. That plan was nuked by the affected neighborhoods and politicians. The residents of the southern Bronx area wanted the to continue stopping there. They pointed out what we train crews already knew. There was no way to put these riders on an already packed train at Grand Concourse or 3rd Ave or East 180th st in the rush hours. The safety factor and dwell time could not be justified. Knowing the TA though they will try to pull it off again and give it some bogus "improvement"spin. Isnt the problem with via WPR Exp and via WPR Local back a few yrs ago during PM Hrs also due to switching between and and E180th St? When the needs to head East to Dyre Ave north of 180th to Dyre and west to WPR-241st? Since the would have to wait at E180th for the to pass same for waiting for . Which today it would be hold the at E177th and Tremont or north of it and let go by same opposite? If u know what i mean.. Of course this wouldnt affect the Via WPR Exp on WPR(Above 180th) since it can just switch north of E180th while holds or go Exp to Williamsbridge/Gun Hill Road Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreatOne2k Posted August 16, 2009 Share #29 Posted August 16, 2009 Two quick points for the OP. The line was the Dyre line in the late '50s-early '60s era and the Lexington Ave was the WPR line. The residents of Eastchester and Co-op City protested. The residents wanted Lexington Ave service, not 7th Ave service and they had the clout to get it. Therefore the service was swapped. To appease the WPR riders am and pm Lex service was kept from 241st. You have to remember that they always had East Side service from 241st from the 3rd Avenue el service and then from the opening of the subway. When the el was truncated to Bronx only service there was no way those riders were going to give up East side access. Therefore the thru express, which originally ran from 241st stopping at Gun Hill Road, East 180st, and on to 149th St-3rd Ave. Point #2. A few years ago there was a plan to have the Dyre Ave trains run local in the Bronx while WPR and trains would run express between 149th st-3rd Ave and East 180th st during rush hours. That plan was nuked by the affected neighborhoods and politicians. The residents of the southern Bronx area wanted the to continue stopping there. They pointed out what we train crews already knew. There was no way to put these riders on an already packed train at Grand Concourse or 3rd Ave or East 180th st in the rush hours. The safety factor and dwell time could not be justified. Knowing the TA though they will try to pull it off again and give it some bogus "improvement"spin. Now 241st has no regular east side service... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shortline Bus Posted August 16, 2009 Share #30 Posted August 16, 2009 Now 241st has no regular east side service... Actually WP Road riders btween 241st and Pelham Parkway still has a transit option for an 1-seat ride to/from East Midtown and East Side. Its called Express Bus BXM11.:eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Line1291 Posted August 17, 2009 Author Share #31 Posted August 17, 2009 If the sometimes go to 241st St, there is no reason that the should go to Dyre Ave especially in cases like this. http://advisory.mtanyct.info/pdf_files/25Aug21242009.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1447 Posted August 17, 2009 Share #32 Posted August 17, 2009 If the sometimes go to 241st St, there is no reason that the should go to Dyre Ave especially in cases like this.http://advisory.mtanyct.info/pdf_files/25Aug21242009.pdf Ummm?? where did u get that the goes to 241st St? It never goes there, Only via G/Os. The last time a regular service went to 241st was cut in 1994 to 238th St. That G/o u r showing me is not having the go to 241st.. I think we should just leave things as is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Line1291 Posted August 17, 2009 Author Share #33 Posted August 17, 2009 So that was a G.O. going on the White Plains Line around the end of 2008 when the was going to 241st St. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1447 Posted August 17, 2009 Share #34 Posted August 17, 2009 So that was a G.O. going on the White Plains Line around the end of 2008 when the was going to 241st St. Yup, but that was becuz the ended service at 96th St. Cuz of track work around Lenox, while no running was splited into to 2: During the Day and Eve from 241st to Bowling Green During the Night from 241st to Mott Avenue The ran from Dyre to E180th All day/night There was one train that ran into Mott Avenue and ended there but turned into a automatically at Jackson Avenue. There was a huge amount of people at Mott who needed service after the shuttle bus it was packed, took too long to get in and out.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Line1291 Posted August 17, 2009 Author Share #35 Posted August 17, 2009 Yeah I remembered that and it was hell for me tryna get to the city for the new years ball from Mount Vernon. I know its easier for the MTA to have the and work together but for one weekend or a month I would love to see them do something different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LRG Posted August 17, 2009 Share #36 Posted August 17, 2009 I wonder how it would have worked if trains ran local from Third Avenue to East 180th Street and then via express, with WPR trains operating express to East 180th Street then via local; Dyre trains would become local in the Bronx at all times, although a few put-ins to allow for Dyre Express service. I'd figure that since Lexington Avenue riders still want WPR service then they can skip all the stations south of East 180th and operate local north of that point. I wonder how switching would work out though at East 180th, that's my main concern. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1447 Posted August 17, 2009 Share #37 Posted August 17, 2009 Yeah I remembered that and it was hell for me tryna get to the city for the new years ball from Mount Vernon. I know its easier for the MTA to have the and work together but for one weekend or a month I would love to see them do something different. U live next door i see, Do u live near the WPR Line? I wonder how a (2)/(5) Skip stop would do lol? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreatOne2k Posted August 17, 2009 Share #38 Posted August 17, 2009 Ummm?? where did u get that the goes to 241st St? It never goes there, Only via G/Os. The last time a regular service went to 241st was cut in 1994 to 238th St. That G/o u r showing me is not having the go to 241st.. I think we should just leave things as is... went to 241 St until 1995 Some trains also go there when there is a disruption in service (weekdays). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreatOne2k Posted August 17, 2009 Share #39 Posted August 17, 2009 Yup, but that was becuz the ended service at 96th St. Cuz of track work around Lenox, while no running was splited into to 2: During the Day and Eve from 241st to Bowling Green During the Night from 241st to Mott Avenue The ran from Dyre to E180th All day/night There was one train that ran into Mott Avenue and ended there but turned into a automatically at Jackson Avenue. There was a huge amount of people at Mott who needed service after the shuttle bus it was packed, took too long to get in and out.. correct late night signage 5 via LCL 5 149 ST-CONCOURSE 5 via LCL 5 WAKEFIELD-241 ST incorrect late night signage 5 LEXINGTON AV EXP 5 BRONX LCL 5 WAKEFIELD-241 ST Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Line1291 Posted August 17, 2009 Author Share #40 Posted August 17, 2009 When I posted this topic all I thought about was taking pressure of the in The Bronx and balancing the both and like this.... Eastchester-Dyre Ave to Brooklyn College-Flatbush Ave *Bronx LCL - 7th Ave EXP - Brooklyn Local Wakefield-241st St to Brooklyn College-Flatbush Ave *White Plains LCL - Bronx EXP peak direction - Lexington EXP - Brooklyn EXP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoodciti Posted August 17, 2009 Share #41 Posted August 17, 2009 Hey sounds good except the ridership on the WPR Line is way higher than the Dyer Ave. Line. and despite how painfully local the is, it fits. I would have liked to see the be the Bronx Thru Express and the becoming the local with some additional WPR service also running express. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1447 Posted August 17, 2009 Share #42 Posted August 17, 2009 Or maybe have the 238th to Manhtattan Express on the WPR northern zone to 149th Sts and then people can transfe to the there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Line1291 Posted August 17, 2009 Author Share #43 Posted August 17, 2009 When I posted this topic all I thought about was taking pressure of the in The Bronx and balancing the both and like this.... Eastchester-Dyre Ave to Brooklyn College-Flatbush Ave *Bronx LCL - 7th Ave EXP - Brooklyn Local Wakefield-241st St to Brooklyn College-Flatbush Ave *White Plains LCL - Bronx EXP peak direction - Lexington EXP - Brooklyn EXP A lot more people lives in the South Bronx than along White Plains Rd. White Plains Rd riders would be lucky to have White Plains LCL and White Plains EXP - either way it would run southbound express in the AM and northbound express in the PM south of East 180th and they would transfer at 149th St-Grand Concourse to catch the if they want to go to Central Harlem and Westside Manhattan and Dyre Ave riders would transfer at East 180th if they want to catch the for a express ride to Eastside Manhattan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1447 Posted August 18, 2009 Share #44 Posted August 18, 2009 A lot more people lives in the South Bronx than along White Plains Rd. White Plains Rd riders would be lucky to have White Plains LCL and White Plains EXP - either way it would run southbound express in the AM and northbound express in the PM south of East 180th and they would transfer at 149th St-Grand Concourse to catch the if they want to go to Central Harlem and Westside Manhattan and Dyre Ave riders would transfer at East 180th if they want to catch the for a express ride to Eastside Manhattan But do u rly think its worth doing all this? I my self live south of E180th Station and when I get on an AM Rush WPR Local it gets packed by Simpson St and the Prospect Ave when it hits 149th-3rd Ave and Mott Ave it stays packed with the same people heading via Lenox Ave Local and West Side Exp. The demond for Broadway-7th Ave Service on the WPR Lines South Bronx service is high compared to Lexington Ave access Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Line1291 Posted August 18, 2009 Author Share #45 Posted August 18, 2009 When I said White Plains LCL i meant from 241st to East 180th St. I know the is best running local in the South Bronx (South of East 180th). I was saying this.... Bronx LCL (Dyre Ave to Grand Concourse) White Plains LCL and Bronx EXP White Plains EXP and Bronx EXP Manhattan bound trains run express in the AM in South Bronx and Wakefield bound trains runs express in the PM in South Bronx. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trainmaster5 Posted August 18, 2009 Share #46 Posted August 18, 2009 But do u rly think its worth doing all this? I my self live south of E180th Station and when I get on an AM Rush WPR Local it gets packed by Simpson St and the Prospect Ave when it hits 149th-3rd Ave and Mott Ave it stays packed with the same people heading via Lenox Ave Local and West Side Exp. The demond for Broadway-7th Ave Service on the WPR Lines South Bronx service is high compared to Lexington Ave access Thank you very much. You nailed my point on the head 100 %. Couple that with the limited and time consuming switching options at the East 180th St complex and you see why the and service should remain unchanged. For those who think the ATS and new signal system can speed up the operation my own observation is that the computerized switching is actually slower than the manual system now in use. Every survey of the actual ridership wants the present system to stay in place. Give the people the service they want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Line1291 Posted August 18, 2009 Author Share #47 Posted August 18, 2009 Thank you very much. You nailed my point on the head 100 %. Couple that with the limited and time consuming switching options at the East 180th St complex and you see why the and service should remain unchanged. For those who think the ATS and new signal system can speed up the operation my own observation is that the computerized switching is actually slower than the manual system now in use. Every survey of the actual ridership wants the present system to stay in place. Give the people the service they want. Now I think about it I agree 100%. Don't fix nothin if it isnt broke. If it was a problem people would have complained like they did w/ the <2> Bronx Express. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1447 Posted August 18, 2009 Share #48 Posted August 18, 2009 Thank you very much. You nailed my point on the head 100 %. Couple that with the limited and time consuming switching options at the East 180th St complex and you see why the and service should remain unchanged. For those who think the ATS and new signal system can speed up the operation my own observation is that the computerized switching is actually slower than the manual system now in use. Every survey of the actual ridership wants the present system to stay in place. Give the people the service they want. damn I wish harry can give me a Thanks Button lol Too bad how ever at Simpson Street there isnt a 2 island Station, That would rly benifit tho i dunno how crowded the will get. I mean even people around Simpson St cant even walk a few blocks to reach the Pelham Line at Hunts Point Avenue! That place has both Pelham Local and Pelham Exp. So if u r so eager to get to Lex Line but cant get on at Simpson St to Mott and The Hub, you just get the Pelham Exp to 125th and get on the ! Simple as that!:cool: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Line1291 Posted August 18, 2009 Author Share #49 Posted August 18, 2009 I wanted to say earlier but didnt know how to put it in words, if the was local in the Bronx and the was express there would be too much Lexington service in the Bronx and not enough Westside Manhattan service so the is the way it is. The is down the block from where the and is so there you have it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1447 Posted August 18, 2009 Share #50 Posted August 18, 2009 I wanted to say earlier but didnt know how to put it in words, if the was local in the Bronx and the was express there would be too much Lexington service in the Bronx and not enough Westside Manhattan service so the is the way it is. The is down the block from where the and is so there you have it. I dont think thats true. It has to do with the amount of cars each has. They not gonna transfer more R142s from the to , even tho the Swap at Flatbush during Rush hr/Middays Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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