R44 5278 Posted September 19, 2009 Share #76 Posted September 19, 2009 Guys, just give the R160s a chance. Like I said before, the NYC subway is simply old and when new trains come in, always assume that they will have problems adapting. Alstom in fact makes very durable rapid transit trains for the RATP and other French systems. Believe me, those trains in the Paris metro are even more "beaten up" than those here in that they are still not entirely stainless steel and have too much scratchitti. In spite of those, they run without any major breakdowns 18hrs a day and 7 days a week. I can definitely see the R160As lasting past 50 years old. R44s are not lemons. They are just as good if not better than the R46s MDBF-wise, and this is info coming from the Pitkin Yard Dispatcher on Subchat... The people who do scratchitti are not actually artists. These people don't know what real art is. So I agree with you. The R44s should not be compared with the R160s as they are completely different stories; the R44s came ahead of their time, while the R160s are delivered after the deliveries other successful NTTs. Scratchitti will not stop as long as there are people that thinks it's funny to vandalize. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R32 3838 Posted September 19, 2009 Share #77 Posted September 19, 2009 The R44's can be reliable but their bodies are in VERY bad shape and no the R44's are not as the same as R46's, The R46's break-down more than the R44's but as they are getting their SMS they have performing better than before, as for the R160's they will have problems. And Like I said before as well as TA workers The R44's need to go also, It will be a big waste of money to SMS Rusting subway cars. The TA can simply order 300-320 More R160's to replace those R44's, That would Make more sense and It may cost alittle more but It would be cheeper and Better when it comes to maintence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R32 3838 Posted September 19, 2009 Share #78 Posted September 19, 2009 R44s are not lemons. They are just as good if not better than the R46s MDBF-wise, and this is info coming from the Pitkin Yard Dispatcher on Subchat... The R44's WERE Lemons until they got their SMS in 2003-2004. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R44 5278 Posted September 19, 2009 Share #79 Posted September 19, 2009 The R44's can be reliable but their bodies are in VERY bad shape and no the R44's are not as the same as R46's, The R46's break-down more than the R44's but as they are getting their SMS they have performing better than before, as for the R160's they will have problems. And Like I said before as well as TA workers The R44's need to go also, It will be a big waste of money to SMS Rusting subway cars. The TA can simply order 300-320 More R160's to replace those R44's, That would Make more sense and It may cost alittle more but It would be cheeper and Better when it comes to maintence. The R179 order had been increased to 300 something 60 ft trains. When their time comes, they'll go as you repeatedly wished. The R160As will end up as fine as the R68s once they truly adapt to the system. I have doubts about the R160Bs as Japanese Rapid Transit systems tend to replace their fleets every 25 years or so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R32 3838 Posted September 19, 2009 Share #80 Posted September 19, 2009 The R179 order had been increased to 300 something 60 ft trains. When their time comes, they'll go as you repeatedly wished. The R160As will end up as fine as the R68s once they truly adapt to the system. I have doubts about the R160Bs as Japanese Rapid Transit systems tend to replace their fleets every 25 years or so. The R179 is not Offical yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rr4567 Posted September 20, 2009 Share #81 Posted September 20, 2009 Here: Trains are machines Machines need breaks NYC Subway trains do not get breaks They will fail All trains have problems Deal with it Ride it Enjoy it You did pay $2.25 to do it didn't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Urbanfortitude Posted September 20, 2009 Share #82 Posted September 20, 2009 Alright, my bad. If I offended you I apologize. I refer to 'public school kids' because they don't wear uniforms and just typical 'street clothes'. I went to a catholic high school sir and I can definitely say the public school kids aren't the only ones to act stupid on public transportation. They're just less likely to because the uniform is a dead give away as to what school they're from and someone could put in a complaint. Still there are definitely parochial/private school kids that act the same way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grand Concourse Posted September 20, 2009 Share #83 Posted September 20, 2009 I won't deny that. The uniform with the school logo would be a dead giveaway and thus why they would not act out as much. But yes, I don't mean to imply catholic school kids are any better. I should've made that clear in the first post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2Julio Posted September 20, 2009 Share #84 Posted September 20, 2009 I'm still upstate with my aunt & uncle so I don't have the time to read all the pages but from the quick skim, all I have to say is that equipment only lasts as long as people treat it right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nel070 Posted September 20, 2009 Share #85 Posted September 20, 2009 Please. Listen. You're dictating to everyone and taking a sanctimonious "I know all about trains, you don't" attitude which is not becoming. He clearly said "sometimes" described as Redbirds. And if you look at R32s they share a lot with redbirds. Brightliners have to do with debuting on the Brighton line. They are like a stainless steel redbird, possibly, along with the R38s, the last and most refined redbird. The R40 slant went in another direction and started a new design trend for the B division rolling stock. R32s are durable, strong cars and the stainless steel construction has proven itself. They weren't the first, the experimental R11, also built by Budd, but only something like 10 cars, were the first R cars, but there were some experimental stainless steel cars built before that. The R160 isn't revolutionary either, it's a refinement of the R143 which is based off of the NTT R110s that were tested very well. R160s have performed WAY better than other new tech cars of their time, such as the R44s and other newbuilds such as the R68s. Cosmetically, having BEEN a rider of the cars since the 1960s, the condition of the R160s, though not the best, certainly isn't that bad and it is worse on the ENY trains, NOT the Jamaica trains. The worse time for the subways was the 1970s, deferred maintenance, where most of the cars looked and ran horribly. And all of the cars, with GOHs, went through that period and ran years later. The R160s are fairly new, have very few "teething pains" and we DO NOT KNOW how they will perform over time. We'll know more in 20 years and anyone who says they are junk and crap are just giving their personal biases and speculation. Time marches on. I say thank you for providing updated rolling stock on the subways and LIRR. Also thanks (NJT) for providing fairly current and nicely refurbished equipment as well. amen mr smith thank you give them a chance the 160s and stop knocking them the and riders are very happy with the 160s and in my opinion the 160s one truly problem were the finds and each day im seeing jamaica has corrected the problems of the finds because all of the cars i have been on in the past 3 weeks all the finds have worked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rr4567 Posted September 20, 2009 Share #86 Posted September 20, 2009 amen mr smith thank you give them a chance the 160s and stop knocking them the and riders are very happy with the 160s and in my opinion the 160s one truly problem were the finds and each day im seeing jamaica has corrected the problems of the finds because all of the cars i have been on in the past 3 weeks all the finds have worked Everybody please take a note of this. EVERYTHING has bugs. No such thing as perfect you know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R44 5278 Posted September 20, 2009 Share #87 Posted September 20, 2009 Only the R160As have FIND problems. Keep in mind that this technology was first used here in NYC as introduced with the R160 fleet and will continue to gradually adapt to the old system. Give new technology a chance as they were only invented to help us travel. I'm sure that Alstom's later designs would be flawless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trainfan22 Posted September 20, 2009 Share #88 Posted September 20, 2009 Alright, my bad. If I offended you I apologize. I refer to 'public school kids' because they don't wear uniforms and just typical 'street clothes'. That's what I mean by when I see kids acting up on the trains. I don't mean just them and lumping you unjustifiably in that statement. I'm stating from what I've seen. So again sorry. Not my intent to offend, but point still stands no groups of kids should be more than like 6-7 per group. There's no need for a damn mob of kids running amock on the trains [whatever school they are from]. And crazy kids are likely the ones vandalizing the trains so in a '6 degrees' way it is related. Actually Grady High school in BK is a public school and they have to wear uniforms... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grand Concourse Posted September 20, 2009 Share #89 Posted September 20, 2009 True, I've heard of some public schools mandating uniforms only. So now it isn't quite as clear how to tell one type of school from another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
error46146 Posted September 20, 2009 Share #90 Posted September 20, 2009 Like other subway cars didn't have problems in the early runs. Anything that replaces the R32 should be as good if not better then it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LRG Posted September 20, 2009 Share #91 Posted September 20, 2009 True, I've heard of some public schools mandating uniforms only. So now it isn't quite as clear how to tell one type of school from another. They'll have their emblems on the uniform. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R32 3348 Posted September 20, 2009 Share #92 Posted September 20, 2009 How could you be so biased? I go to a public high school in Brooklyn, commuting all the way from the Bronx, and I am NOTHING LIKE THAT. The public school kids that you have in mind DO NOT represent the majority of public school kids. They represent the group that only seems numerous because of their behavior and actions. You should think carefully about what you say before SAYING IT. Also, is this thread supposed to be about annoying kids in the subway, public schools vs. private schools, and other random junk? Let's try to get back on topic. And if we can't do THAT, then a mod should lock this thread.:mad::tdown: Bias? The majority of kids who use the subway are public school kids. The majority of ANY school kids are public school kids. Pointing out 90% of the school kid population is not bias...I know what he said could be interpreted as generalizing but he didn't say anything along the lines of "ALL PUBLIC SCHOOL KIDS SUCK" or anything like that. The R179 order had been increased to 300 something 60 ft trains. When their time comes, they'll go as you repeatedly wished. The R160As will end up as fine as the R68s once they truly adapt to the system. I have doubts about the R160Bs as Japanese Rapid Transit systems tend to replace their fleets every 25 years or so. R160As and R160Bs have almost the exact same specs. If they are spec'd for the NYC Subway then that means they will stay for 35-40 years, because that's what the outlined in the contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nature Posted September 20, 2009 Share #93 Posted September 20, 2009 Cause ENY is ghetto and looks run down and looks poor so its common for any type of train car to get beaten quicker in ENY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cait Sith Posted September 20, 2009 Share #94 Posted September 20, 2009 Anything that replaces the R32 should be as good if not better then it... Something should replace you instead, something of more higher knowledge/intelligence and less foam over a single car..... Being on topic, from what I understood, ENY was filled with too many cars to begin with. They do maintain their cars but they sure do get a beating, as does Jamaica's cars. The next batch of R160s is supposed to knock off the R42s from ENY, with a few extra R160s coming into ENY, which will kill the capacity of the yard and be like Jamaica Yard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion Posted September 20, 2009 Share #95 Posted September 20, 2009 Something should replace you instead, something of more higher knowledge/intelligence and less foam over a single car...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmouse Posted September 20, 2009 Author Share #96 Posted September 20, 2009 Something should replace you instead, something of more higher knowledge/intelligence and less foam over a single car..... Being on topic, from what I understood, ENY was filled with too many cars to begin with. They do maintain their cars but they sure do get a beating, as does Jamaica's cars. The next batch of R160s is supposed to knock off the R42s from ENY, with a few extra R160s coming into ENY, which will kill the capacity of the yard and be like Jamaica Yard. I think theres something like 4-5 R42 sets still at ENY. I'm not sure. And so that's why they store R42s on the El in the mornings... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sea Beach Posted September 20, 2009 Share #97 Posted September 20, 2009 are they rusting,or is it steel dust? its confusing,lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RTOMan Posted September 20, 2009 Share #98 Posted September 20, 2009 I think theres something like 4-5 R42 sets still at ENY. I'm not sure.And so that's why they store R42s on the El in the mornings... No they actually have Six of them total.. A few times due to the Upgrades of the 8300 series of the R160's for CBTC and ATO they have used all six of time in service at some times during the last few months.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubwayGuy Posted September 20, 2009 Share #99 Posted September 20, 2009 What He is saying Is completely Right, Some T/O's Like to Brake real Hard, So don't get on his case because He know what he's Talking about. Right and you're saying those T/O's only work those lines? Oh excuse me all to hell. The second they operate "Any" other equipment than an NTT their operation is perfect. Sure, blame a whole bunch of operators you know nothing about based on "railfan perception". That's real smart. That just proves you don't know what you're talking about. What he has said is wrong and I have corrected it repeatedly, even going so far as to detail the entire system of SMEE vs NTT braking, and how they work in response to his question about dynamic and regenerative braking. The brakes work FINE on those cars, so now he blames the operators? Makes no sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubwayGuy Posted September 20, 2009 Share #100 Posted September 20, 2009 Oooh I see, body-wise you know every single part. Then certainly someone of your pedigree is more qualified to give an accurate description of the R-32 than myself. Well apparently he has studied the car data sheets to the point of complete memorization on nycsubway.org. Excuse me all to hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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