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Question about Hudson Line/Amtrak Empire detours.


mark1447

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This is in regards to Amtrak/MNCRR only.

 

I've got a question...

 

Lets say there is a train with mechanical problems up at Spuyten Duyvil on the MNCRR Hudson or some 3rd rail fire around there and there is a Metro North Local or Express south or around Riverdale Station, would the (MTA) have to reroute the train via the Amtraks West Side Line to NYP?

 

And the opposite, if there was a problem on the Spuyten Duyvil Amtrak Bridge(Which is has only a single track) or somewhere along the West Side Line would the Empire/Maple Leaf trains have to head to GCT instead? Or put the train out of service? I doubt backing up the train, unless i'm wrong..

 

has anything like this ever happen?

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For the latter, yes most Amtrak trains are rerouted to GCT for terminus. In actuality, Amtrak prefers not to do that as they also need to pay GCT for providing them the tracks. During the last incident or construction, trains from Penn Station ran up the NY Connecting RR, down the NH, and up the Hudson.

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For the latter, yes most Amtrak trains are rerouted to GCT for terminus. In actuality, Amtrak prefers not to do that as they also need to pay GCT for providing them the tracks. During the last incident or construction, trains from Penn Station ran up the NY Connecting RR, down the NH, and up the Hudson.

 

Thanks, so the Amtrak has to pay the t/a for GCT access? Does it pay the t/a for Hudson and NH lines?

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They would send a diesel out to get it from sunnyside for amtk or croton harmon for (MTA) before anything was rerouted. Rerouting is only a last resort in this situation due to 3rd rail incompatibility. A few FL-9's had dual sided shoes and were easily diverted if they were of this type. but the P32DM only has one or the other. You'd get a GP15 or a BL20GH to move the train, service would terminate at the next previous station.

 

- A

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First Question: No. MNRR is not allowed nowhere near Penn Station since the Empire Connection is only electrified via over running third rail not under running like MNRR has now.

 

Second Question: Amtrak can use GCT, for a pretty penny. The last time GCT was used, Amtrak paid $13,000 that day to rent out some space in Grand Central. And that price tag also includes renting some MNRR locomotive to tug Amtrak in and out. P32DM were not built with dual sided shoes like the FL-9s (hence why NJT canceled their order of P32s for ALP-45DMs instead.) so a GCT P32 has to tow a Penn P32 dead-in-tow to about Yonkers.

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First Question: No. MNRR is not allowed nowhere near Penn Station since the Empire Connection is only electrified via over running third rail not under running like MNRR has now.

 

Second Question: Amtrak can use GCT, for a pretty penny. The last time GCT was used, Amtrak paid $13,000 that day to rent out some space in Grand Central. And that price tag also includes renting some MNRR locomotive to tug Amtrak in and out. P32DM were not built with dual sided shoes like the FL-9s (hence why NJT canceled their order of P32s for ALP-45DMs instead.) so a GCT P32 has to tow a Penn P32 dead-in-tow to about Yonkers.

 

Well maybe the Genesis would head via Penn? M7A or other EMUs can not of course..

 

Does Amfleet come with 3rd rail shoes?

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Well maybe the Genesis would head via Penn? M7A or other EMUs can not of course..

 

Does Amfleet come with 3rd rail shoes?

 

Amfleets are like regular rail cars, they are powerless. Though, NJ Transit made some of their Comets V and Amtrak's California Cars run on battery just incase the engine dies. That still doesn't mean they can move on their own.

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This is in regards to Amtrak/MNCRR only.

 

I've got a question...

 

Lets say there is a train with mechanical problems up at Spuyten Duyvil on the MNCRR Hudson or some 3rd rail fire around there and there is a Metro North Local or Express south or around Riverdale Station, would the (MTA) have to reroute the train via the Amtraks West Side Line to NYP?

 

They wouldn't do that but use buses instead to get people to Marble Hill or so but if they did...They'd have to use the GP35's or BL20GH's to bring the train into NYP, because of the different 3rd rail type, as others here have stated.

 

And the opposite, if there was a problem on the Spuyten Duyvil Amtrak Bridge(Which is has only a single track) or somewhere along the West Side Line would the Empire/Maple Leaf trains have to head to GCT instead? Or put the train out of service? I doubt backing up the train, unless i'm wrong..

 

has anything like this ever happen?

 

Yeah, last year there was switch work near Spuyten Duyvil so Amtrak Empire Service and LD trains were routed over MN trackage, some going to GCT via the wye at MO and others going around the horn from NYP -> HAROLD -> SHELL -> MO and then up the Hudson, and vice versa.

 

As you can imagine it was great for photo ops.

 

08+Lake+Shore+Limited+on+the+Hell+Gate.jpg

 

Lake Shore Ltd on the Hell Gate

 

19+MN+towing+Amtrak+and+beginning+an+unwanted+train+meet.jpg

 

South of MO, near 138th St in the Bronx

 

24+Amtrak+Train+238+passing+Marble+Hill+2.jpg

 

Marble Hill.

 

http://www.madre-de-dios.org/gallery2/v/movement/trains/fieldtrips/102608/

http://www.madre-de-dios.org/gallery2/v/movement/trains/fieldtrips/101908/

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@Fred G.

 

Those are great, great photos, man!

 

and my question here might be viewed as totally naive, (as I'm not well versed in modern railroading business ethics, etc) but in such a tight area where we have such a tight-knit area of track and space and such a density of passengers, and where the real mission is just to get people from origin to destination, the way all these railroads use contradicting methods of powering EMUs/locos and leasing space to one another for platforms should somehow be streamlined, as (on the surface, anyway) it seems like Amtrak is federally owned, and the MTA is owned by NYS. I've no idea about NJT off the top of my head.

 

Haha, I don't wanna open up a raging can of worms here, but it's just my opinion that rail services need to work more in unison, perhaps in the distant future... perhaps not on an equipment level, but on a fare-based level. (Like I could buy a joint-ticket from Long Island to Richmond, VA using both LIRR & Amtk)

 

Edit: Okay, thinking about it I can see how this would be a clerical nightmare.

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