Via Garibaldi 8 Posted June 9, 2011 Share #526 Posted June 9, 2011 I actually like the drivers area in the nova. The only hing is that the door is too close and its a pain in the ass sometmes to get at the farebox. As far as getting out, its not so bad. I wouldnt want to be the person in the way of that door should i have to jump out........ ouch thats gonna hurt. lol... Reminds me of the wheelchair ramp that are on the Madison/5th Ave lines. Some of them can be controled with a button or whatever and I see some people almost walk right into them trying to board before the B/O is done with the wheelchair. Luckily the B/Os have been alert enough to not move it while they're walking or that would be a funny spectacle to see. :eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cartmn1210 Posted June 9, 2011 Share #527 Posted June 9, 2011 lol... Reminds me of the wheelchair ramp that are on the Madison/5th Ave lines. Some of them can be controled with a button or whatever and I see some people almost walk right into them trying to board before the B/O is done with the wheelchair. Luckily the B/Os have been alert enough to not move it while they're walking or that would be a funny spectacle to see. :eek: Been there done that putting the lift out never in.... and yes its a funny spectacle!!! Proabably goin to hell for laughin so hard.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blitz Posted June 10, 2011 Share #528 Posted June 10, 2011 But don't they test these buses beforehand? Seems like the issues in question should've been obvious. I mean if regular folks can see this why can't they big wigs at the ? It's funny because you talk about folks not having a clue because they don't know the ins and outs of transit, but this door and space issue seems like a no brainer to me. :eek: I expect to be slammed in the next post from you, but that's fine, I can take it. lol They don't take a bus out of service or order a repair unless the doors are not working at all. The slow opening doors are probably written up when the bus comes in for inspection, but unless they stop working completely or pose a safety risk they are not gonna waste money to repair it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
East New York Posted June 10, 2011 Share #529 Posted June 10, 2011 Ok, you say I can't compare low/high floor buses( I can ) . How about the Nova versus an Orion VII? The ng has more room in the back than the Nova, more seats and more standing room. Point being no matter how you cut it the Nova is just too cramped. My opinion. You're comparing 2 low floors now! But yes the Nova is cramped. But don't they test these buses beforehand? Seems like the issues in question should've been obvious. I mean if regular folks can see this why can't they big wigs at the ? It's funny because you talk about folks not having a clue because they don't know the ins and outs of transit, but this door and space issue seems like a no brainer to me. :eek: I expect to be slammed in the next post from you, but that's fine, I can take it. lol NEWS FLASH!!!! THIS IS A TEST! The Nova's, New Flyer's and Orion's are Test Buses! The MTA is trying out all types of configurations and options. These things are normal for this program, which is an unprecedented one. They don't take a bus out of service or order a repair unless the doors are not working at all. The slow opening doors are probably written up when the bus comes in for inspection, but unless they stop working completely or pose a safety risk they are not gonna waste money to repair it... The New doors from Vapor can be adjusted accordingly. They can be sped up or slowed down. The TA is going to play with the configuration and specs of a lot of these buses over the next year or so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted June 10, 2011 Share #530 Posted June 10, 2011 NEWS FLASH!!!! THIS IS A TEST! The Nova's, New Flyer's and Orion's are Test Buses! The MTA is trying out all types of configurations and options. These things are normal for this program, which is an unprecedented one. I know it's a test, but some things should be rather evident. For example, regardless to how the door opens, if it takes forever to open, that is clearly a problem. The seating configuration should've been obvious also, especially in the back. I mean who do they think are riding the buses?? Are we all supposed to be 4'0" or something? Of course these are test buses, but what I meant was some things that they are testing should not even be considered because they should already know these things. P.S. I was expecting that reaction . lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Princelex Posted June 10, 2011 Share #531 Posted June 10, 2011 I know it's a test, but some things should be rather evident. For example, regardless to how the door opens, if it takes forever to open, that is clearly a problem. The seating configuration should've been obvious also, especially in the back. I mean who do they think are riding the buses?? Are we all supposed to be 4'0" or something? Of course these are test buses, but what I meant was some things that they are testing should not even be considered because they should already know these things. P.S. I was expecting that reaction . lol But if you go back to what ENY said, they can go back to the manufacturer and get things changed and it looks like changes will be happening. Hopefully the back door will get worked on because it is too slow to open, I can't disagree with you on that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted June 10, 2011 Share #532 Posted June 10, 2011 But if you go back to what ENY said, they can go back to the manufacturer and get things changed and it looks like changes will be happening. Hopefully the back door will get worked on because it is too slow to open, I can't disagree with you on that one. Yeah, I know. I'm just saying that these things should've been obvious. I guess not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cartmn1210 Posted June 11, 2011 Share #533 Posted June 11, 2011 Yeah, I know. I'm just saying that these things should've been obvious. I guess not. The Nova order was the first bus order the ta has done without a inspection at the plant. They always send a group to the factory in the beginning of an order. This time they just went off the lfsa order. Guess they're regreting it now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted June 11, 2011 Share #534 Posted June 11, 2011 The Nova order was the first bus order the ta has done without a inspection at the plant. They always send a group to the factory in the beginning of an order. This time they just went off the lfsa order. Guess they're regreting it now! That's ridiculous! Hundreds of thousands of dollars per bus and they don't send folks out to inspect them beforehand?!!? No wonder no one else noticed these obvious things that I pointed out. :mad: I mean yeah my clients have trust in me also to carry out projects to their liking, but the parameters are usually pretty clear. When you want things customized like the does, you can't rely on the supplier to know what your needs are. There is certainly a downside to this too. Those buses will have to taken out of service to have modifications done and in the meantime you'll have Castleton having to use its older fleet which is more prone to breakdowns and such. Meanwhile one depot is already short on buses due to breakdowns, so yeah I'd say it is one big crisis. Not smart thinking at all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexLy Posted June 11, 2011 Share #535 Posted June 11, 2011 The Nova order was the first bus order the ta has done without a inspection at the plant. They always send a group to the factory in the beginning of an order. This time they just went off the lfsa order. Guess they're regreting it now! Does that mean that there are no Test Drives before delivering to the TA? :eek: Because at the Saint-Eustache Nova Bus plant, they usually do a driving inspection for a while on the roads. We usually see a bus from another TA running around the plant or at some places in Greater Montreal Area and sometimes in Quebec City Area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtattrain Posted June 11, 2011 Share #536 Posted June 11, 2011 The Nova order was the first bus order the ta has done without a inspection at the plant. They always send a group to the factory in the beginning of an order. I guess that they assumed that the LFS wouldn't fail, just like their RTS-06s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaimlerBuses Posted June 11, 2011 Share #537 Posted June 11, 2011 Does that mean that there are no Test Drives before delivering to the TA? :eek: Because at the Saint-Eustache Nova Bus plant, they usually do a driving inspection for a while on the roads. We usually see a bus from another TA running around the plant or at some places in Greater Montreal Area and sometimes in Quebec City Area. The vehicles are test driven and they must record any issues during the road test, as per contract. However as said it is no good when nobody from the purchasing authority is there to inspect the buses themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Princelex Posted June 11, 2011 Share #538 Posted June 11, 2011 If I'm off, someone please correct me, but I thought I had read that the is having little, if any imput in the specification dept with these buses. They seem to be mostly manufacturers spec, which is a big part of what makes this test run of these buses unique. Besides, a lot of bus buffs seem to complain about the specs the puts on the buses running presently so it's interesting to see how these buses do without the hand in the specs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted June 11, 2011 Share #539 Posted June 11, 2011 If I'm off, someone please correct me, but I thought I had read that the is having little, if any imput in the specification dept with these buses. They seem to be mostly manufacturers spec, which is a big part of what makes this test run of these buses unique. Besides, a lot of bus buffs seem to complain about the specs the puts on the buses running presently so it's interesting to see how these buses do without the hand in the specs. Nothing wrong with that. Having little imput in the specification dept. and not inspecting the buses are two completely different things. Even if they have no imput, they should know what they are getting. I mean do you go out and buy shoes and not inspect them? The whole thing is ridiculous. These buses cost hundreds of thousands of dollars, some of which I'm sure is coming out our pockets and you mean to tell me that they are giving the manufacturer that much lead way? :eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Princelex Posted June 11, 2011 Share #540 Posted June 11, 2011 Nothing wrong with that. Having little imput in the specification dept. and not inspecting the buses are two completely different things. Even if they have no imput, they should know what they are getting. I mean do you go out and buy shoes and not inspect them? The whole thing is ridiculous. These buses cost hundreds of thousands of dollars, some of which I'm sure is coming out our pockets and you mean to tell me that they are giving the manufacturer that much lead way? :eek: That whole inspection thing is very suspect to me and I'm not going to be so quick to believe that. I've never heard of the not inspecting a bus before accepting it. Hell there were delays in getting the bus here so there had to be inspections just because of that. This is strange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted June 11, 2011 Share #541 Posted June 11, 2011 That whole inspection thing is very suspect to me and I'm not going to be so quick to believe that. I've never heard of the not inspecting a bus before accepting it. Hell there were delays in getting the bus here so there had to be inspections just because of that. This is strange. I would think info coming from a B/O would be reliable though... Having worked with the in the past, I wouldn't put it past them to be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Princelex Posted June 11, 2011 Share #542 Posted June 11, 2011 I would think info coming from a B/O would be reliable though... Having worked with the in the past, I wouldn't put it past them to be honest. I just re-read what cartmn1210 said and it still is strange to me that they would do that but what do I know. That might be a part of the test too, as silly as that sounds. Whatever the case, they are on the road and whatever changes that need to be made, hopefully they will be done and I think we can all agree on that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
East New York Posted June 11, 2011 Share #543 Posted June 11, 2011 The Nova order was the first bus order the ta has done without a inspection at the plant. They always send a group to the factory in the beginning of an order. This time they just went off the lfsa order. Guess they're regreting it now! The Nova was actually inspected by MTA personnel as all new buses are. The TA went to the plant, and buses 8000, and 8001 failed the audit inspection. Changes were worked into both of the models and delivery proceeded (late) with 8002. The buses were also driven on the road before deliveries commenced at Castleton. The specs are different than those of the LFSA as well. Most notably the seating arrangement. If I'm off, someone please correct me, but I thought I had read that the is having little, if any imput in the specification dept with these buses. They seem to be mostly manufacturers spec, which is a big part of what makes this test run of these buses unique. Besides, a lot of bus buffs seem to complain about the specs the puts on the buses running presently so it's interesting to see how these buses do without the hand in the specs. MTA does have the final say so in specs, and is currently playing with them on all the new buses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Princelex Posted June 12, 2011 Share #544 Posted June 12, 2011 The Nova was actually inspected by MTA personnel as all new buses are. The TA went to the plant, and buses 8000, and 8001 failed the audit inspection. Changes were worked into both of the models and delivery proceeded (late) with 8002. The buses were also driven on the road before deliveries commenced at Castleton. The specs are different than those of the LFSA as well. Most notably the seating arrangement. MTA does have the final say so in specs, and is currently playing with them on all the new buses. Thanks for the clarification ENY. :tup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
East New York Posted June 12, 2011 Share #545 Posted June 12, 2011 Thanks for the clarification ENY. :tup: Yeah there was some type of vendor issue. I can't remember exactly what it was. The TA demo'd the bus a few years ago, then accepted a "pilot/demo" built specifically for them. Both were different, and the final production version was slightly different as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cartmn1210 Posted June 14, 2011 Share #546 Posted June 14, 2011 I just re-read what cartmn1210 said and it still is strange to me that they would do that but what do I know. That might be a part of the test too, as silly as that sounds. Whatever the case, they are on the road and whatever changes that need to be made, hopefully they will be done and I think we can all agree on that one. That came dircetly from the AGM @cast. They went off teh LFSA inspections! Just passing the info along! Don't shoot the BO! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
East New York Posted June 14, 2011 Share #547 Posted June 14, 2011 That came dircetly from the AGM @cast. They went off teh LFSA inspections! Just passing the info along! Don't shoot the BO! All the guns are away! Seriously though, they had a couple inspections. That AGM may be talking about the pilot/demo, which went off the LFSA inspection. When the 8000's started rolling off the line, MTA was there inspecting as always. This was confirmed through an MTA exec, a Nova exec, and Novasupporter. They definitely had an audit inspection though. That's how I found out the delivery would be delayed the first time. That's also the reason the buses didn't start coming until April. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Princelex Posted June 14, 2011 Share #548 Posted June 14, 2011 That came dircetly from the AGM @cast. They went off teh LFSA inspections! Just passing the info along! Don't shoot the BO! I wasn't out to shoot ya man! I just thought the info sounded strange and totally unlike the . You weren't the problem at all. lol All the guns are away! Seriously though, they had a couple inspections. That AGM may be talking about the pilot/demo, which went off the LFSA inspection. When the 8000's started rolling off the line, MTA was there inspecting as always. This was confirmed through an MTA exec, a Nova exec, and Novasupporter. They definitely had an audit inspection though. That's how I found out the delivery would be delayed the first time. That's also the reason the buses didn't start coming until April. Is there any new info about when Nova will be done with the seat modifications so that we can see more LFS's on the road? Will they modify the seats on the other Nova's that have been delievered or will UP and Castleton be stuck with what they have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Novasupporter Posted June 15, 2011 Share #549 Posted June 15, 2011 I am hearing parts should be available late this week, possibly this weekend. Imagine they are planning to immediately start the modifications. I believe all 90 buses will be modified. Keep in mind this is not a seat configuration change but instead is to resolve a gap issue of some sort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
East New York Posted June 15, 2011 Share #550 Posted June 15, 2011 I am hearing parts should be available late this week, possibly this weekend. Imagine they are planning to immediately start the modifications. I believe all 90 buses will be modified. Keep in mind this is not a seat configuration change but instead is to resolve a gap issue of some sort. I heard they are moving one row of seating forward or back. I can't remember which on, but it's the seats that face each other. They are supposed to be making more leg room, and yes all 90 will receive the mod. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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