New Flyer C40LF Archive Thread

[SoSpectacular]

Oh, the V still exists...

[LRG]

Oh, the V still exists...

 

Yes there are parts still available for the Orion 5.

[East New York]

Wait so it's now the C40LFR or still the C40LF?

 

LF still from what I understand. Hopefully they come up with a solution, and get LFRs.

 

Structural reasons?.... need more info please.

 

 

Ha, I wouldnt called that since they obvious have expereince with New Flyer C40LF vechile.... Now, The Orion VII was the most problematic and wasteful extenstive testing programs in MTA history.

 

Most of the info is already on the paper in July books.

 

 

My concern is the 340 bus option order needs to be bump up more or get another new contract bid procument in time to replaced all 12+ year old CNG buses really soon including LIB by the time when the base order completes.

 

Structural reasons are what the TA and NF term it. I don't know exactly what it is.

 

The Orion VII was costly because it was a new platform, which automatically drives costs in several areas. The RTS was pretty much the same. It was a new bus, so people had to be trained, lessons had to be learned, and parts had to be stocked. The Orion VII fleet is more environmentally friendly, so in the long run it pays off. And the MDBF is still the best. Buses will always break down, or have other issues. It's how they are dealt with that counts.

 

And as far as LIB goes, they can get some OG's and a few V's (about 25 buses) until their next batch of VII's (highly likely) come in. The will be good till late 2011 at least.

[w8Hou]

Structural reasons are what the TA and NF term it. I don't know exactly what it is.

What structural reasons, thats the question... MTA didnt question the structural reasons in Orion VII platform change. I think it BS.

 

The Orion VII was costly because it was a new platform, which automatically drives costs in several areas.

 

The Orion VII fleet is more environmentally friendly, so in the long run it pays off. And the MDBF is still the best.

No, it is not the most environmental friendly.... The hybrids buses: Batteries need to replace periodically, and it is not cheap and it is a waste. Maintenance cost on the hybrids cost higher and emissions is about the same as clean diesel in the new EPA emission regulation. MTA some how admitted findings back in May board meeting. It is expensive because there are a lot hybrid crap put it on the bus.

 

The MDBF on Orion VII vehicles is ranging from everywhere depending on the age. The 2003 Orion VII CNG from JG's fleet is a laughing stock which New Flyer C40LF outperform them in MDBF ratings, yet C40LF's are older.

 

And as far as LIB goes, they can get some OG's and a few V's (about 25 buses) until their next batch of VII's (highly likely) come in. The will be good till late 2011 at least.

 

You have also to include Long Island Bus 107 buses in year 2000 need to be replace coming very soon. MTA is now in a 12 year life cycle replacement.

 

All of the New Flyer C40LF needs a replacement coming soon, even though they look ok. Even MTA Bus or ex-MTA Bus Orion V CNG fleet really need a replacement and it maybe turn it a war zone soon.

 

The New Flyer CNG option order could have replace year 1999-2000 CNG fleet together in which it will be better and save

[Joel Up Front]

LF still from what I understand. Hopefully they come up with a solution, and get LFRs.

 

 

 

Structural reasons are what the TA and NF term it. I don't know exactly what it is.

 

The Orion VII was costly because it was a new platform, which automatically drives costs in several areas. The RTS was pretty much the same. It was a new bus, so people had to be trained, lessons had to be learned, and parts had to be stocked. The Orion VII fleet is more environmentally friendly, so in the long run it pays off. And the MDBF is still the best. Buses will always break down, or have other issues. It's how they are dealt with that counts.

 

And as far as LIB goes, they can get some OG's and a few V's (about 25 buses) until their next batch of VII's (highly likely) come in. The will be good till late 2011 at least.

 

Our Vs are just fine, thank you. I've heard a few recordings from some of the more prolific fans here and even some of the 2002-03 O5s (mid-1500s to lower 1600s) might be on their way out (transmission problems, breakdowns...)

[East New York]

What structural reasons, thats the question... MTA didnt question the structural reasons in Orion VII platform change. I think it BS.

 

 

No, it is not the most environmental friendly.... The hybrids buses: Batteries need to replace periodically, and it is not cheap and it is a waste. Maintenance cost on the hybrids cost higher and emissions is about the same as clean diesel in the new EPA emission regulation. MTA some how admitted findings back in May board meeting. It is expensive because there are a lot hybrid crap put it on the bus.

 

The MDBF on Orion VII vehicles is ranging from everywhere depending on the age. The 2003 Orion VII CNG from JG's fleet is a laughing stock which New Flyer C40LF outperform them in MDBF ratings, yet C40LF's are older.

 

 

 

You have also to include Long Island Bus 107 buses in year 2000 need to be replace coming very soon. MTA is now in a 12 year life cycle replacement.

 

All of the New Flyer C40LF needs a replacement coming soon, even though they look ok. Even MTA Bus or ex-MTA Bus Orion V CNG fleet really need a replacement and it maybe turn it a war zone soon.

 

The New Flyer CNG option order could have replace year 1999-2000 CNG fleet together in which it will be better and save

 

*I just said I don't know what structural reasons. So BS or not, thats what their response is. And the TA did actually question the OVII structure. Thats why we saw 3 demos and a pilot which had to be reworked before it was approved.

 

*And the TA is not exactly in a "12 year life cycle replacement plan." 12 Years is just the minimum time a coach should be able to run in revenue service. They hardly ever retire a whole fleet after 12 years. Not only that, but lets say they do with the LIB O5s. They won't even have to place an order till 2011. But There are only 67 2000(year) units, and they will likely be around until at least 2013. Not only that, but the TA could easily send 55-60 OG CNG's to LIB when the New Flyers come in. No point in placing an order for them until at least 2012-2013. When they reduced the order to 475 from 610, I'm sure they factored all this in.

 

*As for the C40LF's, MTA will likely retire 800-856 starting December 2011, and will likely keep 857-989 around until late 2012, to mid 2013. The MTAB Orion V fleet will be replaced by the 202 New Flyers, so they are already taken care of.

 

* The hybrids ARE more environmentally friendly, yet obviously cost more. They use less fuel, and the MDBF is well over 10,000 Miles. Hell, the 2007 hybrids are still doing good at between 8,000-9,000 miles or so. I'm not sure about the numbers on the CNG's, but I can't imagine it's that bad.

[w8Hou]

*I just said I don't know what structural reasons. So BS or not, thats what their response is. And the TA did actually question the OVII structure. Thats why we saw 3 demos and a pilot which had to be reworked before it was approved.

It is still BS and I really want to know their findings are.

 

*And the TA is not exactly in a "12 year life cycle replacement plan." 12 Years is just the minimum time a coach should be able to run in revenue service. They hardly ever retire a whole fleet after 12 years. Not only that, but lets say they do with the LIB O5s. They won't even have to place an order till 2011. But There are only 67 2000(year) units, and they will likely be around until at least 2013. Not only that, but the TA could easily send 55-60 OG CNG's to LIB when the New Flyers come in. No point in placing an order for them until at least 2012-2013. When they reduced the order to 475 from 610, I'm sure they factored all this in.

MTA is in a 12 year replacement plan cycle right now, they already make the decision back in May because of the aging buses have crappy mdbf numbers and performed poor. MTA does not want to make that mistake when the 1990 RTS was still around for 19 years, missed the 15 year replacement cycle.

 

70 of the old New Flyer D60HF buses already replaced by Nova LFS Artics which they were replaced in or under 12 year range.

 

* The hybrids ARE more environmentally friendly, yet obviously cost more. They use less fuel, and the MDBF is well over 10,000 Miles. Hell, the 2007 hybrids are still doing good at between 8,000-9,000 miles or so. I'm not sure about the numbers on the CNG's, but I can't imagine it's that bad.

 

no, there not. They have to replace and dispose the batteries (lithion-ion and lead acid) which is waste in the environment. MTA should have use ultracapacitor on the hybrid which charge instant and last longer. MTA already tested back in Orion VI test bus.

 

Less fuel my ass. All of the buses fuel every day and put the same amount of diesel into the tank. The MPG when operating in the streets are the same without the hybrid crap.

 

Again, the cost is more because of the hybrid crap equip on the bus. Plus, you dont wanna forget tech support and special maintainers add additional cost.

 

You know why they gain 10,000 miles MDBF performance; because they are new and performed better then 12 year old buses. The numbers in Orion VII is really broad due to age of the fleet. Right now, the older Orion VII CNG rank with older RTS and older Orion V in 3,000-4,000 range yet outperformed by an older New Flyer C40LF fleet.

[Joel Up Front]

What happened in 2002-2003? I thought I read it somewhere on the forums, but then forgot...

[East New York]

What happened in 2002-2003? I thought I read it somewhere on the forums, but then forgot...

 

See response here.

[Joel Up Front]

Ah.

 

I know NYCB has given LIB hand-me-downs, basically, because LIB is that kid that went without gifts for years while NYC got nice toys at least every other year, until someone went, "Hey, what about LIB?"

 

I do want to see the back grille of an LI O5 painted black. It'd be cool.

 

Don't low floor buses have the inherent disadvantage of taking every bump hard as if it had no sort of suspension?

[East New York]

Don't low floor buses have the inherent disadvantage of taking every bump hard as if it had no sort of suspension?

 

That they do. And they are not favorite's in the winter either. The LFSA seems to absorb them a little better.

[St Louis Car 09]

 

That they do. And they are not favorite's in the winter either. The LFSA seems to absorb them a little better.

Very true.Given the thickness of the chassis and the ground clearance,our CT Transit New Flyer DLF40`S takes bumps with near high-floor finess.

[Infamous85]

Ah.

 

I know NYCB has given LIB hand-me-downs, basically, because LIB is that kid that went without gifts for years while NYC got nice toys at least every other year, until someone went, "Hey, what about LIB?"

 

I do want to see the back grille of an LI O5 painted black. It'd be cool.

 

Don't low floor buses have the inherent disadvantage of taking every bump hard as if it had no sort of suspension?

 

Not really, I mean its partially true but look at the size of LIB compared to NYCB, there were plenty of NYCB depots that didn't get anything new from years before LIB got their 2004 O5's until after LIB got there NG's. That's a very huge gap in which LIB got new buses more than once while some NYCB depots across the border got absolutely nothing.

[East New York]

Not really, I mean its partially true but look at the size of LIB compared to NYCB, there were plenty of NYCB depots that didn't get anything new from years before LIB got their 2004 O5's until after LIB got there NG's. That's a very huge gap in which LIB got new buses more than once while some NYCB depots across the border got absolutely nothing.

 

Right! Before the NG's came in, CAS, FLA, KB, and YUK had not received any new local buses in over a decade. And UP still hasn't gotten anything. They may as well get all 90 LFS'.

[Joel Up Front]

What's the oldest bus the MTA has bought or received used? I wouldn't be surprised if a few 1400s ended up in NYC.

[gtNovaBusRTS9369]

I don't know about the 12 yrs plan but would have enough money to purschase new buses in such time?

[East New York]

What's the oldest bus the MTA has bought or received used? I wouldn't be surprised if a few 1400s ended up in NYC.

 

The oldest that I know of are the ex-Bee Line Orions. The 1400's next and last stop is more than likely going to be Eastchester.

 

I don't know about the 12 yrs plan but would have enough money to purschase new buses in such time?

 

The TA has already earmarked funds for 2,375 new buses.

[SoSpectacular]

Our Vs are just fine, thank you. I've heard a few recordings from some of the more prolific fans here and even some of the 2002-03 O5s (mid-1500s to lower 1600s) might be on their way out (transmission problems, breakdowns...)

 

Slightly off-topic, but 1612 got fixed up since that day I recorded it, doesn't have that weird sound to it anymore, heh

[The Real]

So found out a few minutes ago, the order has a modification, the C40LF order is coming in as C40LFRs after all! New Flyer is pushing an extra cost for the old face and the MTA is not paying for the extra cost!

 

WHOOHOO!!!!!! New Flyer C40LFR CNG Low Floors!

[Dave160]

YES!

[Infamous85]

So found out a few minutes ago, the order has a modification, the C40LF order is coming in as C40LFRs after all! New Flyer is pushing an extra cost for the old face and the MTA is not paying for the extra cost!

 

WHOOHOO!!!!!! New Flyer C40LFR CNG Low Floors!

 

*Collapses* Yessssssssssssss!!!!!!!

 

The LFR's are very visually appealing and modern compared to the LF's.

 

I hope CP gets some.

[East New York]

So found out a few minutes ago, the order has a modification, the C40LF order is coming in as C40LFRs after all! New Flyer is pushing an extra cost for the old face and the MTA is not paying for the extra cost!

 

WHOOHOO!!!!!! New Flyer C40LFR CNG Low Floors!

 

 

 

 

 

 

YESSSSSSSSSS!!!!!! Thank you for that update!! I had a feeling New Flyer was going to push for the LFR!

 

Damn, I can't wait to see this bad boy in MTA livery! I can already feel the foam starting to form around the corners of my mouth!

Don't judge me!

[SevenEleven]

YESSSSSSSSSS!!!!!! Thank you for that update!! I had a feeling New Flyer was going to push for the LFR!

 

Damn, I can't wait to see this bad boy in MTA livery! I can already feel the foam starting to form around the corners of my mouth!

Don't judge me!

 

 

I'm excited about this order now.. April is right around the corner!

[SoSpectacular]

Hot damn, we're going to have some sexy buses soon

[R110B]

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WooHoo Great Choice MTA it should test on all CP Routes.