Kacie Jane's Fantasy Map

[Kacie Jane 7]

Bear with me, folks, as I throw my hat into the fantasy map ring. I call this my "Stage I" fantasy map beacuse it doesn't have any real extensions. What it does have is...:

1. The Montague Street tunnels are now 4-tracked with the new tracks connecting on the north end to the 8th Avenue local and on the south end to both the Culver line and the Fulton Street line. (As a result, the - now blue - doesn't connect to the Culver line, and runs to Manhattan instead.
   
2. There are new express tracks on 53rd Street. trains run express on 53rd, still having to stop at 50th Street lower level, but then skip all stops between there and Queens Plaza except Lexington.
   
3. The 2nd Avenue Line is complete from 63rd to 125th Street, served by the local and express.
   
4. The runs on the long-awaited super-express tracks on Queens Blvd, with the taking over its old service pattern.
   

 

 

207th St, Manhattan to Lefferts Blvd, Queens; 8th Avenue/Fulton express

Weekends: same / Late nights: express in Manhattan, local in Brooklyn

125th St, Manhattan to Brighton Beach, Brooklyn; 2nd Avenue/6th Avenue/Brighton express

Weekends/Late nights: no service

168th St, Manhattan to Euclid Avenue, Brooklyn; 8th Avenue/Fulton local (via Montague Street)

Weekends: same / Late nights: no service

- unchanged from current, except express service in Bronx can now run all day

Jamaica Center, Queens to Far Rockaway or Rockaway Park, Queens; Queens Blvd/53rd Street/8th Avenue/Fulton express

Weekends/late nights: local on 53rd Street only

179th Street, Queens to Coney Island, Brooklyn; Queens Blvd super-express via 63rd Street, 6th Avenue local, Culver express

Weekends/late nights: express 21st St-Queensbridge to 71st/Continental, local 71st/Continental to 179th St, local in Manhattan in Brooklyn (same as current)

(blue) Bedford Park Blvd, Bronx to 71st/Continental Avs, Queens; Concourse/8th Avenue/Crosstown/Queens local

Weekends: same / Late nights: runs to 168th Street in Manhattan instead

71st Continental, Queens to 9th Avenue, Brooklyn; Queens Blvd/8th Avenue/4th Avenue local

Weekends/late nights: no service

no changes (for now B) )

125th Street, Manhattan to Coney Island, Brooklyn; 2nd Avenue local, Broadway express via Bridge, 4th Avenue express via Sea Beach

Weekends: same / late nights: local in Manhattan and Brooklyn via Montague Street

Ditmars Blvd, Queens to Coney Island, Brooklyn: Broadway express via Bridge, Brighton local

Weekends/late nights: same

179th Street, Queens to 95th Street, Brooklyn; Queens Blvd express (Queens Plaza-71st/Continental), Broadway/4th Avenue local

Weekends: Queens Blvd local to 71st/Continental only / Late nights: 36th Street to 95th Street shuttle

Ditmars Blvd, Queens to Church Avenue, Brooklyn; Broadway/Culver local

Weekends / Late nights: no service

 

I haven't made any changes to the IRT lines (again, yet) -- the elimination of the to 238th Street is mostly just an oversight. Also, I eliminated the bullets for the shuttles because eventually I'm going to have a separate S train.

 

All questions/comments/suggestions greatly appreciated!

[CTK246 152]

Cool map, I like it, but the doesnt seem necessary. The is basically the same thing but goes farther.

[Gorgor 733]

Why is the map so small? Try the full size map, it's easier. (Unless photobucket is automatically resizing it, then just use imageshack)

 

It looks like a good map, but there's some stuff to blurry to make out :S

[Alargule 6]

Looks nice; actually it looks more realistic than most other fantasy maps around here and deals with some capacity constraints in the current network.

Just wondering: does the SAS on your map have 2 or 4 tracks?

[Roadcruiser1 286]

I hoped you made some tunnel widening or another tunnel underneath the locations with more then 2 services for 2 tracks because in reality in won't happen because when 2 services share the same track there are going to be delays.

[NX Express 292]

As someone already said, the is not really needed, as the 8 Av Line would be over-capacity.

The and , both with high frequencies, would simply not fit in the Cranberry Street Tunnels without delays.

Extend the to Kings Plaza.

Extend the farther into Queens.

[Roadcruiser1 286]

Also what happened to the rest of Second Avenue. Don't forget the . It might not happen but it's a fantasy map after all.

[BJSm 2]

The is unnecessary, as others have said, and your 8th Ave Line and QBL Line are too crowded for it anyway.

 

Also, I would switch the and the , sending the to Harlem and the to Astoria, simply because the has always gone to Astoria, while the is a recent arrival there.

 

I agree with others that the should be added, although IMO the 125th St Line should be a higher priority, extending the and to Broadway-125th St.

 

Other stuff... consider a 10th Ave extension of the , a line along the LIE, more service in outer Queens, the to 11th/34th and maybe further, etc.

[R160 35]

You need something on 2nd Av like others have said.

in Brooklyn needs to go out farther and so does the and maybe the in queens.

 

21st Queensbridge to Continental is a pretty big jump. I would at least try to make a connection to the either at Woodside or 69th.

 

Extend the or (or both) and send one of them down next to the piers.

 

I would also prefer the in Astoria and not the .

 

Having the is an overload. There would be too many delays.

[Kamen Rider 2,270]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[Kacie Jane 7]

Wow, wasn't expecting so many responses so quickly! The small, blurry version was a photobucket problem, so I moved it to imageshack and edited the first post. So if you had trouble reading it, try it again now.

 

Now onto the responses...

 

Like I said, this is Stage I, sort of setting it up for the extensions I have in mind later. I've got 3 stages in mind, but I haven't decided yet whether I'm going to keep Stages II and III separate when I make the next map. (Stage II is basically the full 2nd Avenue subway, the to Chelsea Piers, and some other IRT magic, and Stage III is Eastern Queens extensions, etc.) So most of the ideas you guys mentioned is stuff I'm already working on/thinking about, they're just not on the map yet.

 

The reason I have the and switched is partially nostalgia-based (as backwards as that sounds). It's also in preparation for either Stage II or III when I pull the Q off of the Astoria line and send it via 63rd Street and Queens Blvd as a second super-express. Basically, I grew up in the 90s with the (Q6Av), so I've always associated the Q with Queens, and more specifically 21st-Queensbridge, so I'd like to send it there. Since the Broadway train to 2nd Avenue has to be an express, the N went there.

 

Regarding capacity, there are only three places I have 3 trains on a pair of tracks: on 60th Street, on 8th Avenue, and on Queens Blvd. The first one, like I said above, is temporary; eventually the Q will run via 63rd. With the other two, I imagine the G, H, and M - and to a lesser extent the C - as sort of "lesser" lines, meaning that even though there are three trains running there, they'd have the combined frequency of only two trains.

 

(I don't see a problem with the Cranberry Street tunnels; if the 4 and 5 can manage it through Joralemon Street, or the E and F on Queens Blvd, I'm sure this would be okay. It's a fantasy map, so if the tunnel needs to be upgraded, so be it.)

 

Anything else you see where I have more than two trains running on a line, there are four tracks: 53rd Street, Montague Street (including the "new" Court Street station at the transit museum), etc. The 2nd Avenue line is also 4 tracks.

 

Finally, regarding the , here's the story behind it. Basically, when I decided to make the express, I figured I needed to come up with a new 8th Avenue local to replace it. I came up with two ideas - the two you see - and couldn't decide which one to keep, so I kept them both. I see what you mean when you say the is unnecessary, but it's there to serve two roles. First, it's an additional 4th Avenue local. This could be remedied with just increased headways on the , but since the has to share track space in Manhattan with the , I'm not sure how much you could increase them.

 

More importantly, since the runs express in Queens now, the fills that gap. The fills the gap as well, but while it runs to Manhattan now, it still has to wind through Brooklyn first, so it's not as adequate a replacement.

 

One solution I came up with after reading the responses to get rid of the is to run the to Queens instead. The G would be cut back to Court Square, but still serve Manhattan - in place of the C on CPW. Then we'd go back to 2 locals on Queens Blvd, the C and M, and 2 on Eighth Avenue, the C and G. Plus it would indirectly solve the congestion at 60th Street - I could return the to CPW, and send the up Second Avenue instead of Astoria. Astoria riders probably wouldn't be too happy being shafted with just the , but such is life in fantasy land... (If that's too hard to visualize, I'll probably knock out this version of the map in a day or two.)

[GojiMet86 4,967]

That's a nice map you have there.

[Broadway Local 482]

Why extend the to the Rockaways? That will be too many stations for .

I counted the stations and there are 57 Stations. Is that too many, but not to be mean?

[E Local 0]

Why extend the to the Rockaways? That will be too many stations for .

I counted the stations and there are 57 Stations. Is that too many, but not to be mean?

 

Yeah, but the now has 65 stations, so I don't think there's a Problem.

 

But still, I love the map so much. good work

[cotb16 61]

I like the fact that the is on 2nd Avenue instead of the . You would have a pure express ride from Midtown to Coney Island, running express in Manhattan and Brooklyn over the Bridge.

[Kacie Jane 7]

Thanks again for all the responses!

 

The has run to the Rockaways before, but you're right, it's a long route. The only reason I have it running to the Rockaways instead of Lefferts is because I knew I was going to have it be the 24/7 express train. Keep in mind that it's running express in all 3 boroughs, so it's only actually stopping at 30 of those stations between Jamaica center and Broad Channel, plus either 4 to Rockaway Park or 6 to Far Rockaway.

 

And actually, my G train by my count hits 59 stations, and stops at all of them 24/7. (The map below fixes that problem a tiny bit.)

 

 

Here's a new alternate version. No train, no overcrowded 8th Avenue and Queens Blvd lines. Here's what's different...

 

( goes back to its current service pattern, except extended to the Bronx all day.

runs from 71st/Continental to Euclid Avenue all times except late nights.

runs from 168th Street to Court Square 24/7.

runs from 125th Street to Coney Island all times except late nights. Late nights runs to Astoria instead of the .

nothing changes, except it runs on its weekend route (same as its current real-life route) late nights as well.

nothing changes, but runs weekends as well. Late nights as mentioned, it's still replaced by the .

[Ftrainfan 13]

Nice map. I'm loving it.

[R160 35]

It's taking a while to get used to that blue G

 

the astoria line needs 2 trains. the can't hold by itself.

[CenSin 3,408]

Thanks again for all the responses!

 

The has run to the Rockaways before, but you're right, it's a long route. The only reason I have it running to the Rockaways instead of Lefferts is because I knew I was going to have it be the 24/7 express train. Keep in mind that it's running express in all 3 boroughs, so it's only actually stopping at 30 of those stations between Jamaica center and Broad Channel, plus either 4 to Rockaway Park or 6 to Far Rockaway.

 

And actually, my G train by my count hits 59 stations, and stops at all of them 24/7. (The map below fixes that problem a tiny bit.)

 

 

Here's a new alternate version. No train, no overcrowded 8th Avenue and Queens Blvd lines. Here's what's different...

 

( goes back to its current service pattern, except extended to the Bronx all day.

runs from 71st/Continental to Euclid Avenue all times except late nights.

runs from 168th Street to Court Square 24/7.

runs from 125th Street to Coney Island all times except late nights. Late nights runs to Astoria instead of the .

nothing changes, except it runs on its weekend route (same as its current real-life route) late nights as well.

nothing changes, but runs weekends as well. Late nights as mentioned, it's still replaced by the .

Why is the local along Second Avenue while the is express but in Brooklyn, the is express while the is local?

[Kacie Jane 7]

It's taking a while to get used to that blue G

 

the astoria line needs 2 trains. the can't hold by itself.

 

The trouble is there are only so many trains on Broadway to send up there, and any plan involving sending two trains to Astoria would crowd the 60th St tunnel since the has to use it to get to Queens Blvd...unless of course I send it via 63rd, which I'd imagine wouldn't make Queens Plaza customers too happy.

 

I could cancel the and send the to Astoria instead (except I want to save the Q to send a second Broadway train to Queens Blvd when I start extending lines east), which would open up room in the Montague St tunnel for the to run into Brooklyn (where it would take over the Culver local).

 

But again, I need the to have some flexibility for my "future plans". I don't know, I'll have to give it some thought.

 

Why is the local along Second Avenue while the is express but in Brooklyn, the is express while the is local?

 

Oversight on my part. It's left over from when I had the ( express on 2nd Avenue since it was a part time line. So I just replaced the B with the Q without thinking about their routes in Brooklyn.

[T to Dyre Avenue 1,446]

I like your map, Kacie! I like that you have the as the Queens Super Express train, which would help relieve pressure on the Queens Boulevard express tracks. I also like that you have the running express in Queens. By having fewer stops in Queens, it may help the run more reliably.

[T to Dyre Avenue 1,446]

Also, I would switch the and the , sending the to Harlem and the to Astoria, simply because the has always gone to Astoria, while the is a recent arrival there.

 

The hasn't always gone to Astoria. It's only been going there since 1987. Before that, the 70(RR)/® train went there. Also, the 70(QB), now called the , ran to Astoria from 1961 to 1967. The weekday running to Astoria today is a sort of homecoming. I think the running up 2nd Avenue would be just fine.

[Kacie Jane 7]

I like your map, Kacie! I like that you have the as the Queens Super Express train, which would help relieve pressure on the Queens Boulevard express tracks. I also like that you have the running express in Queens. By having fewer stops in Queens, it may help the run more reliably.

 

Thanks! The idea was to restore the old service pattern with both the and going to 179th, only this way the will get the ridership it needs to make it worth it by going express.

 

And I knew the R used to go to Astoria instead of the N, but I didn't know the QB had gone there as well. That's pretty cool.

 

Speaking of which, I realized that on my Stage II/III maps, I am going to have the track space (and a spare letter) to send a second train up to Astoria to help out the . So maybe in the meantime I'd send the up there like I had originally, and leave just the on 2nd Avenue for now. (Makes sense... that way I could go back to having the be weekday-only, and the would have to go there late nights anyway.) If it works in real life now, it can work in fantasy land. The only problem is I couldn't use 57th Street to short-turn trains. Ah well...

[BJSm 2]

One thought... maybe you should run the as the super-express and the as the regular QBL express. Right now, there's no way to get from, say, Jackson Heights to Queensbridge. The would still have transfers to other lines at Queens Plaza, and there would be service on the from Jackson Heights to Queensbridge.

[CenSin 3,408]

One thought... maybe you should run the as the super-express and the as the regular QBL express. Right now, there's no way to get from, say, Jackson Heights to Queensbridge. The would still have transfers to other lines at Queens Plaza, and there would be service on the from Jackson Heights to Queensbridge.

The super-express bypasses Queens Plaza and stops at Queensbridge–21 Street—always. Running the super-express also means it becomes the Broadway express.