R179 Discussion Thread

[Lawrence St]

1 hour ago, Union Tpke said:

https://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/ny-subway-cars-r179s-decoupled-mta-20200603-qg7epr6xxvatrlwti2jmza72xe-story.html

The breakup occurred because a pin was missing from a metal bar that holds the cars together, said a source with knowledge of the incident.

I really do not believe that. If that pin was missing, this would've happened as soon as the train left the yard.

[Lance]

6 hours ago, R32 3838 said:

This is why the JACKASSES Should have never retired a single R32 yet. I knew this would happen. They kept covering up the problems and this happens.

Here's the thing though: how long should the 32s and 42s be retained just in case something like this happens? Six months? A year? Longer? The MTA cannot afford to keep around 300 cars from the 1960s while at the same time storing and maintaining their supposed replacements. At some point, the 179s need to become a reliable fleet that can remain in service long-term. Either that or Bombardier needs to be held accountable for delivering faulty trains.

27 minutes ago, R10 2952 said:

I have a very hard time believing that.  Could Cuomo possibly be pulling strings behind the scenes already?

3 minutes ago, MHV9218 said:

Eh, hard to think he cares about car equipment with the city on fire. I also do not believe her, unless she's specifically referring to this week. Next week it's simply impossible. There are not enough available 8-car units if you remove the ENY 179 fleet and all 32s and 42s at once and expect to run anything near full service. I mean, we needed 42s to cover for the 179 removal back when 32s were still in service! Daily News already reporting that 32s will be used. Will not trust them until confirmation though.

It's possible if the spare factor on the other classes is completely obliterated. There are just enough spare 46s and five-car 160s scattered around to meet service requirements on the A and C lines. However, I don't see that happening though as the MTA will probably just take the path of least resistance by placing the 32s back into service for the duration of this situation, rather than risk a potential car shortage by not having enough trains on a particular line.

[aemoreira81]

How does a drawbar break like that? This will really require bringing back the R32s again, as next week, the cars will be needed. These cars may well be needed until the R211s are finally in service, but these cars were supposed to be gone about 20 years ago.

[subwaycommuter1983]

It's all over the media.

https://www.amny.com/transportation/subway-lemons-strike-again-mta-pulls-new-r179-cars-again-after-manhattan-uncoupling/

[Bill from Maspeth]

2 hours ago, R10 2952 said:

I have a very hard time believing that.  Could Cuomo possibly be pulling strings behind the scenes already?

She's talking about TODAY, not MONDAY.

[Collin]

3 hours ago, Union Tpke said:

 

 

Well it looks hilarious.

[happy283]

Witu full service resuming Monday, they almost certainly will be reactivating all the R32s to run on the  and . As far as the  and  go, they could probably borrow any unused R143s from the  and up the amount of R160s on the line. This is exactly  why the MTA should not have retired hundreds of cars just days after the R179s return in January. With a car like the R179, this was inevitable.

[Collin]

The R179's were supposed to replace all remaining R32s and R42s.  That is why they were retired.  The MTA is not just going to keep hundreds of ancient retired cars from the 60's maintained and ready for service for if another fleet fails.  I'm not sure their retirement has anything to do with Cuomo either.  They had enough cars to run all service without them.

[happy283]

1 minute ago, Collin said:

The R179's were supposed to replace all remaining R32s and R42s.  That is why they were retired.  The MTA is not just going to keep hundreds of ancient retired cars from the 60's maintained and ready for service for if another fleet fails.  I'm not sure their retirement has anything to do with Cuomo either.  They had enough cars to run all service without them.

It certainly had to do with Albany. 100 R32s were set to remain in service until the R211s arrived to provide a decent spare fleet. Albany didnt like the age of the cars and wanted them all sidelined despite the fact they were needed. I could see another R179 issue from a mile away, thats why rushing to retire cars wasnt a good idea. They honestly need to be returned at this point and replaced with an option for extra R211s.

[R32 3838]

14 minutes ago, happy283 said:

Witu full service resuming Monday, they almost certainly will be reactivating all the R32s to run on the  and . As far as the  and  go, they could probably borrow any unused R143s from the  and up the amount of R160s on the line. This is exactly  why the MTA should not have retired hundreds of cars just days after the R179s return in January. With a car like the R179, this was inevitable.

 

ENY would still need some cars, I think 36-48 R32's would go to ENY unless they reactivate the R42's as well which would be a big oof because they did their last run.

 

I think what they'll do since the weather is getting hot is do the the R32/160 swap. have the have half the R32 fleet and the rest goes to the while the is R46/160. that makes the most sense.

[happy283]

2 minutes ago, R32 3838 said:

 

ENY would still need some cars, I think 36-48 R32's would go to ENY unless they reactivate the R42's as well which would be a big oof because they did their last run.

 

I think what they'll do since the weather is getting hot is do the the R32/160 swap. have the have half the R32 fleet and the rest goes to the while the is R46/160. that makes the most sense.

What about the R143s? About 5 sets of R143s operated the  in January. Only 32 cars of R42s were operating at the highest demand times and those 4 rums could be covered by other trains. They could also make the  full R46 and have the  be R32/R46. The R42s are most likely done and I dont think they want to do fleet swaps at this time.

[trainfan22]

13 minutes ago, Collin said:

The R179's were supposed to replace all remaining R32s and R42s.  That is why they were retired.  The MTA is not just going to keep hundreds of ancient retired cars from the 60's maintained and ready for service for if another fleet fails.  I'm not sure their retirement has anything to do with Cuomo either.  They had enough cars to run all service without them.

I agree with this entire post. With Covid and protest's and riots going on, I'm sure the last thing on Cuomo's mind is some old subway cars.

 

I honestly think this whole "Cuomo hates the R32s and wants them gone" is just some imaginary railfan tales. Nobody ever posts an article or source of Cuomo saying such things.

[happy283]

1 minute ago, trainfan22 said:

I agree with this entire post. With Covid and protest's and riots going on, I'm sure the last thing on Cuomo's mind is some old subway cars.

 

I honestly think this whole "Cuomo hates the R32s and wants them gone" is just some imaginary railfan tales. Nobody ever posts an article or source of Cuomo saying such things.

It did raise questions when the MTA suddenly decided to move their retirement up 2 years. They will be needed on Monday if the MTA wants any chance at social distance on the trains.

[JeremiahC99]

8 minutes ago, happy283 said:

What about the R143s? About 5 sets of R143s operated the  in January. Only 32 cars of R42s were operating at the highest demand times and those 4 rums could be covered by other trains. They could also make the  full R46 and have the  be R32/R46. The R42s are most likely done and I dont think they want to do fleet swaps at this time.

So what you are saying is 144 R46 cars on the  route, and 100 R32s alongside 210 R46 cars on the ? Will that be enough for both the A and Rockaway Park Shuttle?

[happy283]

1 minute ago, JeremiahC99 said:

So what you are saying is 144 R46 cars on the  route, and 100 R32s alongside 210 R46 cars on the ? Will that be enough for both the A and Rockaway Park Shuttle?

Couldnt they reactivate 222 R32s?

[JeremiahC99]

Just now, happy283 said:

Couldnt they reactivate 222 R32s?

Weren’t some cars put in work service after retirement? And are you suggesting taking them out of work service and putting them back in passenger service? (Apologies for the extra questions).

I was only concerned with the  and  train assignments, since  and  service is what concerns me. If they were to put the R32s back in service, how many would you suggest be on the ?

[R32 3838]

21 minutes ago, happy283 said:

What about the R143s? About 5 sets of R143s operated the  in January. Only 32 cars of R42s were operating at the highest demand times and those 4 rums could be covered by other trains. They could also make the  full R46 and have the  be R32/R46. The R42s are most likely done and I dont think they want to do fleet swaps at this time.

I don't think making the half R32's is a good idea, the needs to have a more reliable fleet. if 198-200 R32's are available, they will need to have atleast 70 cars in service if the fleet were to be split. remember the lost 50 R42's so its surplus was lowered by 6 trains. now with the R179's OOS. they will need something to cover for that and the R143's aren't enough. When they first took the R179's OOS and brought back the R42's, the was crush loaded and the had to be cut that day. this time it'll be different since the ridership is lowred but they'll still need some cars to help out

 

19 minutes ago, trainfan22 said:

I agree with this entire post. With Covid and protest's and riots going on, I'm sure the last thing on Cuomo's mind is some old subway cars.

 

I honestly think this whole "Cuomo hates the R32s and wants them gone" is just some imaginary railfan tales. Nobody ever posts an article or source of Cuomo saying such things.

 

It's Documented that 110 R32's were to remain until Q3 2021 with the remaining going in Q1 2022, The Cars were needed to keep a healthy spare factor until Albany requested the to retire both the R32's and R42's early due to their age. TA spent a good chunk of money fixing up those 110 cars to keep em going until 2021-22. Half the R32/ all of the R42 fleet were always planned to be replaced by the R179's.

when the R42's retired, ENY lost 6 train surplus out of 11, so now they have or now had a 4 train surplus of cars.

70 out of 110 R32's were supposed to be used for or service until retirement so the R46's spare factor wouldn't be lowered. If anything by them doing this, the got screwed because between 2016-present day it has lost over 5 trainsets to CI yard to keep their spare factor healthy. when the Jamaica - CI swap took place, CI took a hit due to fleet age, now you got R46's running on 4 24/7 routes instead of 1 full 24/7 route. Since the R46's run alot more now, they would need a higher spare factor. By putting R46's on the   the Spare factor dropped to 5 trains which isn't enough for both the / combined.

 

 

ALSO all 222 R32's aren't coming back, a small portion were already stripped for parts. So I would say 180-200 cars at best.

Edited June 4, 2020 by R32 3838

[happy283]

2 minutes ago, JeremiahC99 said:

Weren’t some cars put in work service after retirement? And are you suggesting taking them out of work service and putting them back in passenger service? (Apologies for the extra questions).

I was only concerned with the  and  train assignments, since  and  service is what concerns me. If they were to put the R32s back in service, how many would you suggest be on the ?

A total of 22 R32s are in work service increased from the original 10 which leaves 200 cars left to reactivating. Also, 4-5 R160s could be sent in from Jamaica if needed. I know a Jamaica R46 was on the  in January back when Jamaica still operated the R46.

[happy283]

3 minutes ago, R32 3838 said:

I don't think making the half R32's is a good idea, the needs to have a more reliable fleet. if 198-200 R32's are available, they will need to have atleast 70 cars in service if the fleet were to be split. remember the lost 50 R42's so its surplus was lowered by 6 trains. now with the R179's OOS. they will need something to cover for that and the R143's aren't enough. When they first took the R179's OOS and brought back the R42's, the was crush loaded and the had to be cut that day. this time it'll be different since the ridership is lowred but they'll still need some cars to help out.

The  was only cut the first morning until they could get the older cars out of storage. Service was normal by that evening. There really isnt any way to add cars to ENY because the only other yard with trains to accomodate 8 car sets is 207/Pitkin which is also strapped for cars with the R179 removal. They will either have to delay the restoration of the  and run the  every 7-8 mins during peak or cut 2  and  runs to free up more equipment. As far as the R32 on the , they are more reliable on outdoor portions of the route which would make that better than running them on the . This change may probably only be a matter of weeks anyway.

[Collin]

If you read the post above, only 110 R32's were planned to be run until 2021-2022.  They definitely won't be bringing back all 222.

I had speculated that Coney Island has some extra R68(A)s due to the suspension of the .  It wouldn't surprise me if some of those show up on the  for the time being.  Or some R46s could be loaned since they already run on those lines.  If the removal of the R179s is going to last a long time, then it would make more sense to reactivate some R32s, but if it's only for a few weeks, I doubt it's worth the effort.  Hopefully they are preparing for that possibility.

[VIP]

9 minutes ago, happy283 said:

A total of 22 R32s are in work service increased from the original 10 which leaves 200 cars left to reactivating. Also, 4-5 R160s could be sent in from Jamaica if needed. I know a Jamaica R46 was on the  in January back when Jamaica still operated the R46.

Jamaica Can’t afford to send their cars elsewhere at the moment. The 32’s will likely cover  train service and the  being all R46 again. 32’s won’t see  service. They’ll use the spare R143’s and since the  doesn’t go to 96-2av it freed up a few R160 sets. 

[happy283]

1 minute ago, Collin said:

If you read the post above, only 110 R32's were planned to be run until 2021-2022.  They definitely won't be bringing back all 222.

I had speculated that Coney Island has some extra R68(A)s due to the suspension of the .  It wouldn't surprise me if some of those show up on the  for the time being.  Or some R46s could be loaned since they already run on those lines.  If the removal of the R179s is going to last a long time, then it would make more sense to reactivate some R32s, but if it's only for a few weeks, I doubt it's worth the effort.  Hopefully they are preparing for that possibility.

The plan of keeping only 110 did not account for another R179 removal. If they need 222, it wouldnt suprise me if they reactivated all of them. On June 8, regular service is resuming which I assume includes the restoration of the . Is there any timeline on when the R179s will return?

[happy283]

3 minutes ago, VIP said:

Jamaica Can’t afford to send their cars elsewhere at the moment. The 32’s will likely cover  train service and the  being all R46 again. 32’s won’t see  service. They’ll use the spare R143’s and since the  doesn’t go to 96-2av it freed up a few R160 sets. 

I know the  got R32s at one point because they were more reliable outside and with warmer weather they may decide that. The  on regular service runs to Forest Hills which will require more cars. 5-6 R143s will probably run the  and the rest will be R160.  will be R32/R46 and  will be full R46.

[R32 3838]

15 minutes ago, VIP said:

Jamaica Can’t afford to send their cars elsewhere at the moment. The 32’s will likely cover  train service and the  being all R46 again. 32’s won’t see  service. They’ll use the spare R143’s and since the  doesn’t go to 96-2av it freed up a few R160 sets. 

 

Remember, It's hot out, Making the 100% R32's would be a very bad idea knowing the the HVAC issues of the past

 

[happy283]

6 minutes ago, R32 3838 said:

 

Remember, It's hot out, Making the 100% R32's would be a very bad idea knowing the the HVAC issues of the past

 

They May make them run on the  alongside the R46.