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East New York

M-9 Discussion

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7 hours ago, Fan Railer said:

Typically power transmission follows an AC-DC-AC path. This is true for diesel electric locomotives and units drawing AC overhead current. AC power is accepted from the overhead line or the main alternator, rectified to DC for the DC link, which then supplies both the traction inverters (which invert back to AC for the motors) and the HEP and aux inverters (which invert back to AC for those loads).

In the case of DC pickup (third rail or overhead), the power supply bypasses the rectifier and enters the DC link.

In the case where multiple AC sources (different voltage and frequencies) are to be used (like with the M8s and NEC electric locomotives, etc), a transformer is provided to take the input AC and output a standard AC setting to the rectifier for the DC link.

So basically, in the case of the M7 and M9, 750V DC power is sent to an inverter which converts it to AC use for a motor? Which creates the noises heard?

M8 being different, AC - DC - AC?

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1 hour ago, jamesman8 said:

So basically, in the case of the M7 and M9, 750V DC power is sent to an inverter which converts it to AC use for a motor? Which creates the noises heard?

M8 being different, AC - DC - AC?

The traction inverters are what you hear regardless of what the power transmission steps are. Any difference in sounds between car classes is always attributed to the "tuning" of the inverters. That being said, differences in the power source may slightly change how the traction inverters respond to requests for power. For instance, the new Eurostar Siemens HSR sets operating under AC power sound different than sets operating under DC power.

AC overhead departure:

 

DC overhead departure (skip to 3:49):

 

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5 hours ago, B35 via Church said:

Give me this influx of homeless people that are on the Metro-North, LIRR, or NJ Transit.... I'll wait.....

You think homeless people, en masse, give a shit about service frequency.....

You are the last mother***er I want to hear complaining about infrequent service on any mode of public transit - Including the (A) you suggest having extended to your house..... Have you tell it, whatever mode of mass transit that passes through "good" areas should be kept at subpar headways to keep, you know, the "low-lives and homeless people" from utilizing it - to keep the "good" areas "good"....

People are fed up w/ the declining state of public transit & here you are indirectly advocating for it - All for the sake of a freakin fallacy...

Unreal.

I'm not talking about headways (they should reduce headways on LIRR), i'm talking about if they reduce the fare on the LIRR then low-lives and bad people will start moving in to LIRR neighborhoods just like what happened to the Rockaways.

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29 minutes ago, Around the Horn said:

Is it just me or does that Eurostar in AC mode sound exactly like an ALP46?

nahh, not really.

ALP-46 (GTO inverter):

 

ALP-46A (IGBT Inverter):

 

Edited by Fan Railer
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1 hour ago, Fan Railer said:

The traction inverters are what you hear regardless of what the power transmission steps are. Any difference in sounds between car classes is always attributed to the "tuning" of the inverters. That being said, differences in the power source may slightly change how the traction inverters respond to requests for power. For instance, the new Eurostar Siemens HSR sets operating under AC power sound different than sets operating under DC power.

AC overhead departure:

 

DC overhead departure (skip to 3:49):

There are DC overhead power lines??? Never knew that.

 

 

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1.5 kV DC and 3 kV DC are commonly used overhead catenary ratings outside of the USA. Heck, even most light rail lines in the US use 750 VDC overhead line. Look it up lol.

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1 hour ago, Fan Railer said:

1.5 kV DC and 3 kV DC are commonly used overhead catenary ratings outside of the USA. Heck, even most light rail lines in the US use 750 VDC overhead line. Look it up lol.

Why is the NEC AC then? Just the way it was from the start?

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8 hours ago, jamesman8 said:

Why is the NEC AC then? Just the way it was from the start?

That's the way it was electrified from the start. Using DC power for long distances like that is not as efficient as AC power, ie, an electric train cannot generate as much tractive power under DC as it would under AC, requiring more time to reach top speed, etc.

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12 hours ago, EphraimB said:

I'm not talking about headways (they should reduce headways on LIRR), i'm talking about if they reduce the fare on the LIRR then low-lives and bad people will start moving in to LIRR neighborhoods just like what happened to the Rockaways.

What you're not talking about.... is anything sensible.

This fallacious narrative you're conveying on here doesn't hold water.... You say you're not talking about headways - but profess that they should reduce service levels on the LIRR.... It all ties in to this bullshit about vagabonds & miscreants making the "good neighborhoods" bad like the Rockaways (now all of a sudden, people of that ilk would start moving in.... you simply are a piece of work) by making those "good" areas (in your mind) more accessible..... Where the f*** has this happened at????? Homeless people & criminals don't strong-arm, or otherwise have a whole community of "good people" in "good neighborhoods" uproot & move elsewhere... That didn't happen in the Rockaways, "sir" - you know, where the "good" guys still reside (like you... wink wink)....

You have at least one guy on here relaying progressive thoughts (regarding the RR's) by making them more affordable & less infrequent - and here you are, being the very antithesis to that.... With nonsense, nonetheless.....

I hope for the sake of this forum that you're simply trolling & aren't really this brutish.....

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5 minutes ago, B35 via Church said:

What you're not talking about.... is anything sensible.

This fallacious narrative you're conveying on here doesn't hold water.... You say you're not talking about headways - but profess that they should reduce service levels on the LIRR.... It all ties in to this bullshit about vagabonds & miscreants making the "good neighborhoods" bad like the Rockaways (now all of a sudden, people of that ilk would start moving in.... you simply are a piece of work) by making those "good" areas (in your mind) more accessible..... Where the f*** has this happened at????? Homeless people & criminals don't strong-arm, or otherwise have a whole community of "good people" in "good neighborhoods" uproot & move elsewhere... That didn't happen in the Rockaways, "sir" - you know, where the "good" guys still reside (like you... wink wink)....

You have at least one guy on here relaying progressive thoughts (regarding the RR's) by making them more affordable & less infrequent - and here you are, being the very antithesis to that.... With nonsense, nonetheless.....

I hope for the sake of this forum that you're simply trolling & aren't really this brutish.....

All I'm talking about is that right now the LIRR is more safer than the subway and goes through better neighborhoods. Arverne used to be a resort and now it's not such a good neighborhood because of people being inspired by the subways. I do think that the LIRR should get better headways like the subway but lowering the fares will pretty much make it an extension of the subway. Cursing is rarely heard of on the LIRR but is heard often on the subways. Lowering the fares on the LIRR could give people an alternative to Far Rockaway for the same price as the subway and get the people who often curse into long Island. Then they might start removing bathrooms from the LIRR due to the low-lives moving into long Island doing vandalism. The LIRR needs to be kept as a luxurious option to the subway.

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30 minutes ago, EphraimB said:

All I'm talking about is that right now the LIRR is more safer than the subway and goes through better neighborhoods. Arverne used to be a resort and now it's not such a good neighborhood because of people being inspired by the subways. I do think that the LIRR should get better headways like the subway but lowering the fares will pretty much make it an extension of the subway. Cursing is rarely heard of on the LIRR but is heard often on the subways. Lowering the fares on the LIRR could give people an alternative to Far Rockaway for the same price as the subway and get the people who often curse into long Island. Then they might start removing bathrooms from the LIRR due to the low-lives moving into long Island doing vandalism. The LIRR needs to be kept as a luxurious option to the subway.

You and I both know these sentences are completely false...

Do you not remember the incident with a man shouting racial slurs at two black women on an LIRR train?

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4 minutes ago, Around the Horn said:

You and I both know these sentences are completely false...

Do you not remember the incident with a man shouting racial slurs at two black women on an LIRR train?

That's one of the rare times of cursing on the LIRR.

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LIRR gets pretty rowdy on Friday and Saturday nights with drunk people riding home. Cursing, fights, people throwing up, etc.

 

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5 minutes ago, trainfan22 said:

LIRR gets pretty rowdy on Friday and Saturday nights with drunk people riding home. Cursing, fights, people throwing up, etc.

 

It's not as bad as the subways where these things happen every day. Every day I go on the subway and I hear cursing everywhere.

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4 minutes ago, Around the Horn said:

Late night LIRR trains are definitely worse than the subway... There is no match for the last train of the day to Babylon, sorry.

What about during the day? Especially the Far Rockaway branch?

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5 minutes ago, EphraimB said:

What about during the day? Especially the Far Rockaway branch?

No idea since I'm not wasting $8.75 to go to Far Rockaway...

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15 minutes ago, Around the Horn said:

Late night LIRR trains are definitely worse than the subway... There is no match for the last train of the day to Babylon, sorry.

Ahhh man don't even get me started. Open containers, slurred speech. Even inbound coming into Rockville Center on a Friday is crazy. 

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5 minutes ago, Around the Horn said:

No idea since I'm not wasting $8.75 to go to Far Rockaway...

So this is basically what I was talking about. Since the LIRR from Far Rockaway to Manhattan/Brooklyn is pricey, you won't see any low-lives or homeless people on the LIRR Far Rockaway branch. My fear is if they reduce the fare for the LIRR, low-lives and homeless people will start using the Far Rockaway branch as an alternative to the (A) to Far Rockaway and the LIRR won't become a luxurious option anymore for people that don't want to hear cursing or deal with homeless people on their commute to Manhattan/Brooklyn.

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1 hour ago, EphraimB said:

All I'm talking about is that right now the LIRR is more safer than the subway and goes through better neighborhoods.

I've ridden the subways in the 80's and 90's bud..  Trust for the volume of people it carries daily it hasn't been safer in decades.

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1 hour ago, Around the Horn said:

Aaaand we're right back where we started :rolleyes: 

Go read @B35 via Church's posts again, because he already tore that argument apart...

Oh, I'm not done, bud'.....

 

2 hours ago, EphraimB said:

All I'm talking about is that right now the LIRR is more safer than the subway and goes through better neighborhoods. Arverne used to be a resort and now it's not such a good neighborhood because of people being inspired by the subways. I do think that the LIRR should get better headways like the subway but lowering the fares will pretty much make it an extension of the subway. Cursing is rarely heard of on the LIRR but is heard often on the subways. Lowering the fares on the LIRR could give people an alternative to Far Rockaway for the same price as the subway and get the people who often curse into long Island. Then they might start removing bathrooms from the LIRR due to the low-lives moving into long Island doing vandalism. The LIRR needs to be kept as a luxurious option to the subway.

JFC... Someone told you a good ole lie & you apparently bought into it, hook, line, and sinker...... Cursing being rarely heard on the LIRR, is flat out BULLSHIT... You apparently haven't been on any of the "drunk trains" (yes, that's an actual moniker for those early morning weekend LIRR trains) - but much like, life itself, pretty sure you're oblivious to that...  During other times of the day though, pfft, I overhear the conversations some of these people have on their cellphones or amongst peers/family whilst on the train itself - and it aint always about Molly's damn dance recital or Billy's soccer practice either.... Yeah, such civilized people Nassau & Suffolk patrons are.... Forks on the left, spoons on the right huh (or however the hell that crap goes)... FOH.....

.....Feet on the seat, staking out in the bathroom to avoid paying the fare, beer cans/bottles rolling along the floor as the train moves, dried up beer (and the cheap stuff at that) sticking to my Berluti's, stand clear of the smearing vomit..... Luxurious my left nut - the LIRR is a small step above the subway in terms of class, so try to run that short game on somebody else, because it isn't going to work on me, d00d..... Couldn't pay me to commute on the LIRR again, regardless of how high or low the fare is....

But this narrative you continue to want to defend, is still devoid of reality... So is your nice little portrayal of the suburbs (which is what you're really getting at with the whole subway vs LIRR bit).....

 

Edited by B35 via Church
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9 minutes ago, B35 via Church said:

Oh, I'm not done, bud'.....

 

JFC... Someone told you a good ole lie & you apparently bought into it, hook, line, and sinker...... Ccursing being rarely heard on the LIRR, is flat out BULLSHIT... You apparently haven't been on any of the "drunk trains" (yes, that's an actual moniker for those early morning weekend LIRR trains) - but much like, life itself, pretty sure you're oblivious to that... Yeah, such civilized people Nassau & Suffolk patrons are.... Forks on the left, spoons on the right huh (or however the hell that crap goes)... FOH.....

.....Feet on the seat, staking out in the bathroom to avoid paying the fare, beer cans/bottles rolling along the floor as the train moves, dried up beer sticking to my Berluti's, stand clear of the smearing vomit..... Luxurious my left nut - the LIRR is a small step above the subway in terms of class, so try to run that short game on somebody else, because it isn't going to work on me, d00d..... Couldn't pay me to commute on the LIRR again, regardless of how high or low the fare is....

But this narrative you continue to want to defend, is still devoid of reality... So is your nice little portrayal of the suburbs (which is what you're really getting at with the whole subway vs LIRR bit).....

 

I never had a problem those few times I took the LIRR on the Far Rockaway branch. The reason I always take the subway to work is because of cheaper fare, more frequency, can go pretty much anywhere in NYC for the same fare. Maybe the people on the Far Rockaway LIRR trains behave differently than the people on the other LIRR trains.

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1 minute ago, EphraimB said:

I never had a problem those few times I took the LIRR on the Far Rockaway branch. The reason I always take the subway to work is because of cheaper fare, more frequency, can go pretty much anywhere in NYC for the same fare. Maybe the people on the Far Rockaway LIRR trains behave differently than the people on the other LIRR trains.

What I'm conveying to you is irrespective of any individual branch.

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