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SUBWAY - Random Thoughts Topic

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1 hour ago, Around the Horn said:

One of the statements that constantly get repeated around here is the idea that "The old (brownM) was empty" (and/or useless or whatever description you choose).

So since I found an old (brownM) schedule of mine this afternoon, I decided to look up the (J)(Z) schedule from the same time period in the Wayback machine, and I found that might have been partially by design.

I'll explain:

The (J)(brownM) and (Z) all ran every ten minutes or 6 TPH each, coming out to a combined 18 TPH during the morning and evening peaks (8 to 9 AM and 5 to 6 PM). Now obviously that doesn't divide evenly. 60/18= 3 and a third. So how do you insert that third service in between the (J) or (Z) coming every five minutes?

Looking at the (brownM) schedule, downtown trains arrived at Essex Street on the 3's (so that's 8:13, 8:23, 8:33, etc). (J) trains arrived on the 7's (8:17, 8:27, 8:37, etc) and (Z) trains arrived on the 2's (8:12, 8:22, 8:32, etc)

 Going back uptown in the evening, (J) trains left Broad Street on the 0's (5:00, 5:10, 5:20, etc) and (Z) trains left on the 5's (5:05, 5:15, 5:25, etc) and (brownM) trains arrived at Broad Street on the 6's (5:06, 5:16, 5:26, etc).

 Now what looks off there?  That's right. The (brownM) was always scheduled to be only one minute behind a (Z) !

 This means in a ten minute period you had headways of 5, 1 and 4 minutes. No wonder the (brownM) was so "empty", the (Z) directly in front was taking on 5 minutes worth of passengers and the (brownM) was directly behind it, not picking up much and then the (J) would be 4 minutes behind that (brownM)

I'd also imagine that would kill reliability on the (brownM) to be scheduled directly behind a (Z) train especially going Downtown when it would be fumigating at Broad Street.

It's worth noting here that the big scheduling stick point on the Myrtle/Jamaica lines is Myrtle Junction; if I had to guess, those weird headways worked out to (theoretically) conflict free junction operation on that end...that said, given the number of people who (even to this day) jump ahead on the (J) from Essex, having the (brownM) take a little delay at Myrtle may not be the worst thing. 

The other big issues w/ (brownM) were service hours, frequency and route. After the bridge reopened, the (brownM) was a rush-only affair (and only 7:00-9:45 AM + 3:30-7:00 PM at Broad at that), meaning that the subway's increasingly off-peak centric rider demographic could not use it, or could not rely on it to get them to work during rush hour and then get them back after some business dinner. The (brownM) moreover only hit the low(er) ridership portion of the 4th local corridor and had to merge with the (D) or (R) on top of all the Lower Manhattan shenanigans, which introduced even more unattractiveness into its profile. Add to that the fact that the (brownM) ran 10 min headways through that entire span, and there was frankly little reason to rely on it rather than planning around (D) or (R) to (4)(5).

To be clear, I don't think that the (brownM) is a service pattern that's worth resuscitating outside of some really radical deinterlining plan, but I do think that in conversations about a Nassau-Bay Ridge service, these are points worth keeping in mind. 

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46 minutes ago, RR503 said:

To be clear, I don't think that the (brownM) is a service pattern that's worth resuscitating outside of some really radical deinterlining plan, but I do think that in conversations about a Nassau-Bay Ridge service, these are points worth keeping in mind. 

It is a good point to remember (and your points about service hours is also well noted).

It's funny because when I was working on the Nassau (R) as part of that deinterlining exercise for the proposals thread a few months ago, I was thinking that I'd have to insert a buffer of at least two minutes between an (R) and a (J) or (Z) for it to work right, because I thought there was no way that they'd schedule trains one minute apart like that, and lo and behold, they actually did.

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Posted (edited)

Subwaytime is showing some (B) trains  out.Anyone know what that’s about?  

 

There are now 3 (B) trains downtown and appareatly one just left Brighton beach. Going to Bedford park.

Edited by Abba

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file?downloadToken=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhb

I’ve got questions myself...why are there (B) trains [supposedly] operating at all (much less to the Bronx this late into the evening rush) on a day like today?

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This seems to be a bunch of Yankees trains returning north in service.

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6 hours ago, Axis said:

file?downloadToken=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhb

I’ve got questions myself...why are there (B) trains [supposedly] operating at all (much less to the Bronx this late into the evening rush) on a day like today?

If you mean going to the Bronx, without passengers: they're baseball special trains going back to the yard. 

 

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Posted (edited)

They’re finally getting around to Deep cleaning Jamaica’s R160’s. R160’s 9778-9782/9498-9502 is the first set I’ve seen deep cleaned pulling put of CI yard this afternoon. 

Edited by VIP
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6 hours ago, VIP said:

They’re finally getting around to Deep cleaning Jamaica’s R160’s. R160’s 9778-9782/9498-9502 is the first set I’ve seen deep cleaned pulling put of CI yard this afternoon. 

They should send the R143s for a deep cleaning too. Those things look beat.

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Posted (edited)

Those Cuomo 160s may be getting the clean treatment as well. However, 1/2 cuomo is mostly what you see now (the full train broke up). 

(Ex. 9128-9132/9513-8517

Edited by Calvin

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On 5/27/2019 at 8:27 PM, BrightlinerNewFlyer said:

Will the 7 train ever actually be extended to NJ?

No and it would be dumb as hell if they did

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R160’s 9767-9763 & 9303-9307/9362-9358 have been deep cleaned. (For anyone looking to capture these sets for before/after comparison to the worn out Jamaica sets).

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On 5/28/2019 at 1:16 AM, Calvin said:

If you mean going to the Bronx, without passengers: they're baseball special trains going back to the yard. 

 

One (B) apparently went back in service 

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The (E) train I’m on left Jamaica Center at 905 PM and has been going sooooooooooooooooo painfully slow for the entire time it’s on QBL. Like...it REALLY does not need to take an hour to get from Jamaica Center to Port Authority.

 

And there REALLY REALLY is no need for an (E) train to take much longer than an (R) train leaving Forest Hills at the same time to reach Queens Plaza. i.e.; I should’ve just transferred to the (R) at Forest Hills.

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They owe me 30 minutes of time now. Time I shouldacouldawoulda spent sleeping at home.

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Rode this exact same trip not even two weeks ago. Left Jamaica at 9:10, arrived at Port Authority at 9:43. No excuses for incompetence.

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6 hours ago, Abba said:

One (B) apparently went back in service 

All of the (B) Trains went back in service.

 

The reason why it went back in service Uptown rather than deadheading back to Concourse Yard was due to beach crowds leaving Brighton Beach. 

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On 5/26/2019 at 7:41 PM, Around the Horn said:

One of the statements that constantly get repeated around here is the idea that "The old (brownM) was empty" (and/or useless or whatever description you choose).

It is because West End customers want Chinatown/Midtown Manhattan service rather than Downtown Manhattan service. Same with Sea Beach. That is why the (brownM) was not well used. During the AM Rush, keep in mind it was pretty crowded heading from Northern Brooklyn to Manhattan (like it still is today) because it is the only line serving Flushing, Lorimer, and Hewes on that stretch while the (J) / (Z) skip them during this time.

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53 minutes ago, Axis said:

Rode this exact same trip not even two weeks ago. Left Jamaica at 9:10, arrived at Port Authority at 9:43. No excuses for incompetence.

Sounds like your (E) was going slow due to a lot of slow zones due to track workers.. Where's their probably wasn't any track workers doing what they do on your trip two weeks ago.

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16 hours ago, Axis said:

The (E) train I’m on left Jamaica Center at 905 PM and has been going sooooooooooooooooo painfully slow for the entire time it’s on QBL. Like...it REALLY does not need to take an hour to get from Jamaica Center to Port Authority.

 

And there REALLY REALLY is no need for an (E) train to take much longer than an (R) train leaving Forest Hills at the same time to reach Queens Plaza. i.e.; I should’ve just transferred to the (R) at Forest Hills.

It's really frustrating, I avoid the QBL as much as I can.

14 hours ago, trainfan22 said:

Sounds like your (E) was going slow due to a lot of slow zones due to track workers.. Where's their probably wasn't any track workers doing what they do on your trip two weeks ago.

But the problem is, the site will say "Good Service". That is certainly NOT good service.

2 hours ago, Elmhurst said:

Clearly a case of fare evasion.

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