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BUS - Random Thoughts Thread

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New wrap alert: Manhattan Division, Staten Island Division, Ulmer Park   HBO Series: The Outsider. 1/12/20 premier. Campaign until Feb 2020 via Outfront Media. (MTA) long term advertiser.

Too bad the rest of Brooklyn Division can’t get HBO wraps. 

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3 hours ago, B35 via Church said:

I find those automated announcements absurdingly annoying anyway, from the misinformation down to the inflection & "speech" pattern.....

I would honesty volunteer to fix all the incorrect or unrealistic transfers, stop locations on BusTime, along with the pronunciation of certain streets. I honestly don't understand who controls that or why its so hard to fix....

It might seem like a small thing...NO ITS NOT....its about to be 2020 and we can't even get fully accurate automated announcements on buses? The subway had it since the 1990s. 

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8 hours ago, XcelsiorBoii4888 said:

I would honesty volunteer to fix all the incorrect or unrealistic transfers, stop locations on BusTime, along with the pronunciation of certain streets. I honestly don't understand who controls that or why its so hard to fix....

It might seem like a small thing...NO ITS NOT....its about to be 2020 and we can't even get fully accurate automated announcements on buses? The subway had it since the 1990s. 

The subways were recorded by real people, big difference.

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2 hours ago, Cait Sith said:

The subways were recorded by real people, big difference.

If Siri can pronounce most words reasonably well, the MTA can do better. Even in the subway station announcements, where they splice together individual words/phrases, it sounds a lot better than the buses. Some of the errors are likely easily fixed with minor changes, like the Q46 to "LEEEJJ hospital" probably just needs to be programmed as L. I. J. rather than LIJ so the system announces them as individual letters rather than a single word

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I don't think 7320's front display is supposed to be solid red...

(Don't ask for a picture. I had a bag on each arm.)

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5 minutes ago, Lex said:

I don't think 7320's front display is supposed to be solid red...

(Don't ask for a picture. I had a bag on each arm.)

Omg I’ve seen that one a few times!!! Yes, it has a blood red destination sign.

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13 minutes ago, QM1to6Ave said:

If Siri can pronounce most words reasonably well, the MTA can do better. Even in the subway station announcements, where they splice together individual words/phrases, it sounds a lot better than the buses. Some of the errors are likely easily fixed with minor changes, like the Q46 to "LEEEJJ hospital" probably just needs to be programmed as L. I. J. rather than LIJ so the system announces them as individual letters rather than a single word

Siri is very, very, very different from what the mta has. On top you’re talking about Apple vs a transit company. It’s like comparing apples to oranges.

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13 minutes ago, QM1to6Ave said:

Anyone know what exactly they do with this bus? I haven't seen any posts about it

 

I thought someone posted about this in my group. I’m guessing they do Santa things with it.

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3 hours ago, Lex said:

I don't think 7320's front display is supposed to be solid red...

(Don't ask for a picture. I had a bag on each arm.)

 

It isn't, but the sign is garbage and is glitched to red.

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1 hour ago, paulrivera said:

This is Bx3 to Riverdale Bway 238th Street.

Not “Broadway”. The announcement system literally reads it as “Bway”

”This is B38 to Downtown BKLYN Tillary Street” Same deal with your “BWAY” announcement.

“This is B62 to L I City Queens Plaza” Announcement says pronounces it “lee city...”

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2 hours ago, 67thAve said:

Inspired by what the MTA did in regards to Queens, as well as by a university project I worked on this semester, I decided to come up with my own (probably shoddy) redesign for the Manhattan bus network.

Feel free to roast me.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1cnrGwH4jgXU9KeiFLqCTcyXatcMTfq7y&usp=sharing

The M100 and M125 were included in the Bronx Redesign plan as the are in a Bronx depot.

Only differences are that the M100 stays on Broadway and terminates at Amsterdam Ave/125 St instead of looping around by the M104 terminal, and that the M125 continues to the 3 Ave-149 St (2)(5) station to cover the former Bx15 route.

I kind of feel that the M100 (in the MTA’s Bronx Plan) should either turn onto 125 St and terminate where the Bx15 does at 12 Ave, or should you around via LaSalle St and Broadway because the buses will need to turn around to head back to Inwood anyway, so why not directly connect to the (1) train at the end.

Also you have quite a few routes doing the M104 loop at 129 St. 

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3 hours ago, 67thAve said:

Inspired by what the MTA did in regards to Queens, as well as by a university project I worked on this semester, I decided to come up with my own (probably shoddy) redesign for the Manhattan bus network.

Feel free to roast me.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1cnrGwH4jgXU9KeiFLqCTcyXatcMTfq7y&usp=sharing

1. You can't have local service make stops along West Street southbound, that entire section is a greenway and a bike path.

2. Making the M103 the only bus on Lexington is a bad, bad idea.

3. I don't really see a need to send the M7 down to South Ferry, ridership south of 42nd already seems to be lacking in some aspect.

 

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27 minutes ago, Cait Sith said:

1. You can't have local service make stops along West Street southbound, that entire section is a greenway and a bike path.

2. Making the M103 the only bus on Lexington is a bad, bad idea.

3. I don't really see a need to send the M7 down to South Ferry, ridership south of 42nd already seems to be lacking in some aspect.

 

1) Per your suggestion, I decided to realign much of the southbound M20 routing along West Street onto Greenwich. Service will still be eliminated into Battery Park City due to service redundancy, as the Downtown Connector already serves those areas (though I would increase service hours on the Downtown Connector to make up for this via city subsidy).

2) The M103 would see service levels increase to that of the current combined M101/M102/M103 trunk along its existing route. The M101 has to go, since the route effectively serves both as a crosstown along 125th and two separate north-south services (Amsterdam north of 125th and Lexington/3rd south of 125th), making it three routes bundled into one in its current form. The M102 is rendered redundant by the existence of a realigned M3 providing bus service along Lenox Avenue, while also providing service to East Midtown, albeit via 5th/Madison instead of Lexington/3rd.

3) M7 service to South Ferry is designed to replace the existing southbound alignment of the M20 and the northbound alignment of the M55.

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1 hour ago, jaf0519 said:

The M100 and M125 were included in the Bronx Redesign plan as the are in a Bronx depot.

Only differences are that the M100 stays on Broadway and terminates at Amsterdam Ave/125 St instead of looping around by the M104 terminal, and that the M125 continues to the 3 Ave-149 St (2)(5) station to cover the former Bx15 route.

I kind of feel that the M100 (in the MTA’s Bronx Plan) should either turn onto 125 St and terminate where the Bx15 does at 12 Ave, or should you around via LaSalle St and Broadway because the buses will need to turn around to head back to Inwood anyway, so why not directly connect to the (1) train at the end.

Also you have quite a few routes doing the M104 loop at 129 St. 

I chose that as a place for a terminal since it's an existing layover point. May not be the best option, though feel free to suggest others.

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3 hours ago, 67thAve said:

Inspired by what the MTA did in regards to Queens, as well as by a university project I worked on this semester, I decided to come up with my own (probably shoddy) redesign for the Manhattan bus network.

Feel free to roast me.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1cnrGwH4jgXU9KeiFLqCTcyXatcMTfq7y&usp=sharing

I don't find this to be "roast" worthy, per se.... Pretty dope that you get to have this for a college project though.... In any event:

M4/"M105": Doesn't need to run south of W. 135th st, if it's only going to run to the old Amsterdam depot site.... Both of these should be branches of one route, not 2 separate routes.....

M5: Looks like you're trying to cater this to a demographic, while having Riverbank serve as nothing more than a convenient terminal.... Coverage route, at best....

M7: More or less how I'd restructure the M55

M9: Running this past Park Row to South Ferry is a waste of time & mileage.... You already have the M7 running along Broadway/Trinity for coverage anyway...

M11: Good grief, What is it with having all these routes ending at the old Amsterdam depot site (M4, M11, M100, M101, M104, "M105")?
Anyway, If you want to cut it back to 125th, all you really have to do it end it somewhere along the Grant houses (either along 125th or along Broadway)....

M14A/D: Unreasonable to have all M14 service end at Abingdon Sq.... There's no space for that.

M15: Forget about ending all M15 service at the Rutgers houses.... That's an immense amount of service for those folks, south of Madison....

M20: Yeah, but a bus running non-stop from Battery Pl. to BMCC isn't worth leaving the southern section of Battery Park City with nothing (you're also taking the M9 away from that part of BPC).... You're making the thing too useless south of Canal; what riderbase are you attempting to make it faster to get to South Ferry for...... May as well end this at Chambers st, if it's not going to serve BPC...

M22: So is the only terminal of the route in BPC?

M31/M57: Probably one of the better plans I've seen that involves these two routes....

M34: Where is it serving Bellevue at?

M98: If you're going to stop it dead at 125th, you may as well run it all the way up to Inwood.... Give it more of a riderbase.

M103: IDC how much extra service you give it, the problem with that is that the M15 moves at a better rate than the M103 south of Houston.... MUCH better.... Nothing serving Bowery needs to run down to South Ferry.

"M110": I don't see this panning out/being too successful.... I'd take the E.106 portion & have it cut through Harlem via Lenox, A.C. Powell, or Fred. Douglass....

"M111": Don't really see this as being all that necessary.

M116: Nah, the M116 is as good as it's going to get on that end.... Running it along W. 106th serves the people on that side of the route better than it running via W. 110th would - even if it doesn't directly serve the (1)....

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8 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

I thought someone posted about this in my group. I’m guessing they do Santa things with it.

 

8 hours ago, QM1to6Ave said:

Anyone know what exactly they do with this bus? I haven't seen any posts about it

 

The Santa Express is a yearly delivery of donated toys collected at the four SI depots to the Kids Against Cancer charity. The union together with KAC, drive the bus around to various hospitals, shelters, etc, giving out the toys to kids in need.

The bus went out last Thursday for this year's delivery:

https://www.silive.com/news/g66l-2019/12/b39829f21d6633/santas-express-mta-teams-up-with-kids-against-cancer-to-deliver-holiday-gifts-.html

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1 hour ago, B35 via Church said:

I don't find this to be "roast" worthy, per se.... Pretty dope that you get to have this for a college project though.... In any event:

M4/"M105": Doesn't need to run south of W. 135th st, if it's only going to run to the old Amsterdam depot site.... Both of these should be branches of one route, not 2 separate routes.....

M5: Looks like you're trying to cater this to a demographic, while having Riverbank serve as nothing more than a convenient terminal.... Coverage route, at best....

M7: More or less how I'd restructure the M55

M9: Running this past Park Row to South Ferry is a waste of time & mileage.... You already have the M7 running along Broadway/Trinity for coverage anyway...

M11: Good grief, What is it with having all these routes ending at the old Amsterdam depot site (M4, M11, M100, M101, M104, "M105")?
Anyway, If you want to cut it back to 125th, all you really have to do it end it somewhere along the Grant houses (either along 125th or along Broadway)....

M14A/D: Unreasonable to have all M14 service end at Abingdon Sq.... There's no space for that.

M15: Forget about ending all M15 service at the Rutgers houses.... That's an immense amount of service for those folks, south of Madison....

M20: Yeah, but a bus running non-stop from Battery Pl. to BMCC isn't worth leaving the southern section of Battery Park City with nothing (you're also taking the M9 away from that part of BPC).... You're making the thing too useless south of Canal; what riderbase are you attempting to make it faster to get to South Ferry for...... May as well end this at Chambers st, if it's not going to serve BPC...

M22: So is the only terminal of the route in BPC?

M31/M57: Probably one of the better plans I've seen that involves these two routes....

M34: Where is it serving Bellevue at?

M98: If you're going to stop it dead at 125th, you may as well run it all the way up to Inwood.... Give it more of a riderbase.

M103: IDC how much extra service you give it, the problem with that is that the M15 moves at a better rate than the M103 south of Houston.... MUCH better.... Nothing serving Bowery needs to run down to South Ferry.

"M110": I don't see this panning out/being too successful.... I'd take the E.106 portion & have it cut through Harlem via Lenox, A.C. Powell, or Fred. Douglass....

"M111": Don't really see this as being all that necessary.

M116: Nah, the M116 is as good as it's going to get on that end.... Running it along W. 106th serves the people on that side of the route better than it running via W. 110th would - even if it doesn't directly serve the (1)....

To clarify, the map itself was not for a university project, per se... it's the outgrowth of a 24-page group paper I (mostly) wrote.

The M4 and M105 run south to 125th Street to provide connectivity to the IND at 125th Street.

Yes, the M5 is explicitly designed as a coverage route. It's also designed to replace the current north-south portion of the M57 along West End Avenue.

I took in your suggestion for the M9 and cut it back to Fulton/Broadway, and also adjusted the M11 to terminate on the south side of 125th instead of by Amsterdam Depot.

The city could always make more layover space for the M14A/D with some "political maneuvering" (i.e, removal of parking spaces).

The M15 was cut back to the foot of Allen Street because Water and Pearl Streets because the M103 is better-aligned to serve those portions in terms of street patterns and traffic patterns.

As a concession to demand, I have decided to reinstate M20 service through the southern portion of Battery Park City... but only for the southbound direction. Waiting to turn left out of BPC onto West can take a while, so northbound service via West is retained.

The M34 serving Bellevue was apparently a mistake. It doesn't. Might want to get my eyes checked...

The new M98 is designed to provide a frequent and direct to Lex/125 from the north-south routes in the Heights. The service was designed explicitly with transferring in mind (if this network was implemented in reality, one trip would give you unlimited transfers in a 90 minute period).

For the reason the M103 was extended south, see what I wrote up about the M15.

I wouldn't have the M110 run north-south through Harlem, since that makes the route fight two different traffic flows (north-south and east-west). You'll notice that almost all routes in this new network are almost entirely north-south or east-west, with the exceptions being the M14A and M14D.

The M111 is a coverage route and effectively a partial replacement of the M55. It's also designed with tourists in mind to an extent, hence why it terminates at the Met.

With the M116, I felt that serving the subway at 110th was an improvement over running it down 106th. It also makes the route faster through increased directness.

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2 hours ago, 67thAve said:

...The city could always make more layover space for the M14A/D with some "political maneuvering" (i.e, removal of parking spaces).

...The M15 was cut back to the foot of Allen Street because Water and Pearl Streets because the M103 is better-aligned to serve those portions in terms of street patterns and traffic patterns.

...The new M98 is designed to provide a frequent and direct to Lex/125 from the north-south routes in the Heights. The service was designed explicitly with transferring in mind (if this network was implemented in reality, one trip would give you unlimited transfers in a 90 minute period).

...I wouldn't have the M110 run north-south through Harlem, since that makes the route fight two different traffic flows (north-south and east-west). You'll notice that almost all routes in this new network are almost entirely north-south or east-west, with the exceptions being the M14A and M14D.

...The M111 is a coverage route and effectively a partial replacement of the M55. It's also designed with tourists in mind to an extent, hence why it terminates at the Met.

The question is, should they? I mean, unless the plan entails cutting some M14 service from both branches, it isn't worth having every single trip on both branches terminating at Abingdon.... It's overkill - even if you resort to eradicating a bunch of parking spots down there to support it....

I get your rationale behind the whole M15/M103 bit, I'm not getting the practicality of it.... Make the M103 straighter, to have it be that much more unreliable - to scale back the M15, to make it less desirable on that end? Take note where most of those working professionals south of Fulton St. are even taking NB M15's to (hint: it isn't largely to Chinatown).... There isn't any real good reason to have every single trip of the M103 mimic the pre-1995 rendition of the M101 south of 125th.... At minimum, being the sole 3rd/Lex route, that route's going to need short turns at Cooper Union....

That sounds nice in theory, but relegating the M98 to that extent would be a waste of resources..... If the sole purpose of a fixed route bus service is to have it be wholly dependent on transfers, that's not a good thing at all......

I don't know what fighting "two different traffic flows" is supposed to mean in the real world; such a statement makes it sound like traffic lights doesn't exist or something..... Anyway, you don't have to have it necessarily cutting through Harlem - but at the same time, there's a reason why they got the M106 paired up with the M96.... If there was that strong a demand for W. 110th, quite sure the MTA wouldn't have M106's supplementing M96's on the western end of the route....

Let those double-decker buses take care of the tourists... Having a 5th/Madison fixed route public transit service from points south, stop dead at the Met. Museum of Art like that, is a stub..... You already have the M1, M2, and M3 continuing to cover 5th/Madison (even if NB buses don't turn off to directly serve some attraction along 5th, along Central Park)... Your M7 takes care of 6th.... You're good on that note.... The M55 OTOH was (part of) the result of the MTA's half-hearted attempt at splitting a route that should've never been combined in the first place... There's no need to try to maintain every semblance of that route... That's why I say your M111 isn't all that necessary.

 

Lastly, I'll rephrase my M22 question...... You mention uni-directional looping in the Lower East side, so Is the only terminal of the route in Battery Park City? That much is not clear....

Edited by B35 via Church

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27 minutes ago, B35 via Church said:

Lastly, I'll rephrase my M22 question...... You mention uni-directional looping in the Lower East side, so Is the only terminal of the route in Battery Park City? That much is not clear....

There would be a terminus somewhere north of Delancey Street for laying over. As for where, I am not certain.

The reason for the use of the term "unidirectional loop" has to do with the length of the one-way portion.

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8 hours ago, jaf0519 said:

The M100 and M125 were included in the Bronx Redesign plan as the are in a Bronx depot.

Only differences are that the M100 stays on Broadway and terminates at Amsterdam Ave/125 St instead of looping around by the M104 terminal, and that the M125 continues to the 3 Ave-149 St (2)(5) station to cover the former Bx15 route.

I kind of feel that the M100 (in the MTA’s Bronx Plan) should either turn onto 125 St and terminate where the Bx15 does at 12 Ave, or should you around via LaSalle St and Broadway because the buses will need to turn around to head back to Inwood anyway, so why not directly connect to the (1) train at the end.

Also you have quite a few routes doing the M104 loop at 129 St. 

The MTA isn't terminating the M100 at 125th & Amsterdam. Many people at the public meetings/community board meetings (myself included) said it would be stupid to terminate at that intersection itself, and it should either be further east (e.g. Morningside Avenue) or further west (likely the Bx15 terminal or maybe loop around via LaSalle Street). The consensus seems to be to have it run west rather than east so the Bx15 (or M125) terminal is likely where it will end (the MTA officials said they heard us loud and clear on that)

Edited by checkmatechamp13

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49264808576_0b1b98f73b_c.jpg

Last wrap for 2019: Manhattan Division, Ulmer Park Express, and Staten Island Express bus Divisions. See you in 2020. 
 

(MTA) did very good this year incorporating The Brooklyn Division on several wrap campaigns. Looking forward to seeing more wraps for the rest of the division in 2020. 

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Those XE60 All-Electric Xcelsiors look nice and all on the M14A/D, I'm really waiting for one of those buses to run on the Q44. That'll be the REAL test. Heavy passenger loads, high speed, steep inclines, potholes, heavy foot B/Os. 

If it can survive the Q44 SBS, it can survive NYC. 

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