BUS - Random Thoughts Thread

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

3 hours ago, Kriston Lewis said:

No decisions yet...

 

Some of the overnight service has caught on. The Q53 overnight service I would say is one. You have multiple buses with anywhere from 14-20 throughout the night. I mean with respect to artic's, it's low...but service operates every 20 minutes...and that's with the Q11 operating on top of it. I caught the Q11 a few weeks ago one night, and I was the only person that got on from Hoffman Drive. Personally at this point, if by any chance the Q53 gets to keep the additional overnight service (even if it's operating every 30 minutes) they might as well just can the Q11. The Q53 can run in it's place making all local stops (whether it also serves Lindenwood via the Q21 during overnight hours, IDK). 

Edited May 6, 2021 by BM5 via Woodhaven

[Santana04]

2 minutes ago, BM5 via Woodhaven said:

Some of the overnight service has caught on. The Q53 overnight service I would say is one. You have multiple buses with anywhere from 14-20 throughout the night. I mean with respect to artic's, it's low...but service operates every 20 minutes...and that's with the Q11 operating on top of it. I caught the Q11 a few weeks ago one night, and I was the only person that got on from Hoffman Drive. Personally at this point, if by any chance the Q53 gets to keep the additional overnight service (even if it's operating every 30 minutes) they might as well just can the Q11. The Q53 can run in it's place (whether it also serves Lindenwood via the Q21 during overnight hours, IDK). 

This won't  happen their don't want the artics in those streets the q21 runs in lindenwood they very hesitant on any detours in the q53 

[Lil 57]

2 hours ago, BM5 via Woodhaven said:

The Q53 can run in it's place making all local stops (whether it also serves Lindenwood via the Q21 during overnight hours, IDK). 

 

1 hour ago, Santana04 said:

This won't  happen their don't want the artics in those streets the q21 runs in lindenwood they very hesitant on any detours in the q53 

Also since the q53 is sbs, there can be confusion since the q53 is only ment to stop at sbs stops with the ticket machines due to the fare box being blocked and replaced by a proof of payment system.

what can happen is the reverse, making the q11 every 20-30 minutes overnight and extending it to rockaway park and canning the q53 overnight since the locals aren’t as slow overnight due to lower ridership.

Edited May 6, 2021 by Lil 57

[NewFlyer 230]

19 minutes ago, Lil 57 said:

 

Also since the q53 is sbs, there can be confusion since the q53 is only ment to stop at sbs stops with the ticket machines due to the fare box being blocked and replaced by a proof of payment system.

what can happen is the reverse, making the q11 every 20-30 minutes overnight and extending it to rockaway park and canning the q53 overnight since the locals aren’t as slow overnight due to lower ridership.

I can’t see them doing what you suggest either, because then the Q11 would also have to be extended to Jackson Heights or Woodside since that portion of the Q53 route would lose overnight service. 
 

They could have the Q53 run every 30 minutes overnight and have the Q11 stay at 60 minutes. The Q53 is way more popular than the Q11 so it shouldn’t be reduced in favor of adding more Q11 service. The Q11/Q21 is an afterthought to most along Woodhaven/Cross Bay Blvd especially after all the improves made to the Q53 and the addition of the Q52. 

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

5 hours ago, Lil 57 said:

 

Also since the q53 is sbs, there can be confusion since the q53 is only ment to stop at sbs stops with the ticket machines due to the fare box being blocked and replaced by a proof of payment system.

what can happen is the reverse, making the q11 every 20-30 minutes overnight and extending it to rockaway park and canning the q53 overnight since the locals aren’t as slow overnight due to lower ridership.

There's quite a good chunk of overnight ridership coming from the Broadway stops, so you'll have to extend it northward as well (and it's basically the current Q53, but local). 

4 hours ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

I can’t see them doing what you suggest either, because then the Q11 would also have to be extended to Jackson Heights or Woodside since that portion of the Q53 route would lose overnight service. 
 

They could have the Q53 run every 30 minutes overnight and have the Q11 stay at 60 minutes. The Q53 is way more popular than the Q11 so it shouldn’t be reduced in favor of adding more Q11 service. The Q11/Q21 is an afterthought to most along Woodhaven/Cross Bay Blvd especially after all the improves made to the Q53 and the addition of the Q52. 

At that time, making all stops shouldn't increase runtimes too much, and the Q11 only runs to Pitkin. Even though the Q11 doesn't get too many riders, I wouldn't eliminate overnight local service on Woodhaven Boulevard at all. Personally I lean more towards providing more convenience during late night hours, since runtimes typically aren't affected too much (and they wouldn't be in this case). Even if it helps out just a few people using local stops, having 30 minute service (and to more destinations) is much better than 60 minute service. Some of those stops also aren't exactly close to each other. During the daytime, yeah, keep them separate and as is.

[danielhg121]

Any reason why the D4500 CT's are retiring so quickly? I thought they were gonna stick around for a little longer. Are these buses considered lemons?

[MysteriousBtrain]

3 minutes ago, danielhg121 said:

Any reason why the D4500 CT's are retiring so quickly? I thought they were gonna stick around for a little longer. Are these buses considered lemons?

 I know early on during delivery there was problems and the order was reduced from 126 to 59 then to 41.

Of the 18 units sold to NJT I believe one of them had a malfunctioning engine that lead to early retirement.

Edited May 6, 2021 by MysteriousBtrain

[Future ENY OP]

11 minutes ago, MysteriousBtrain said:

 I know early on during delivery there was problems and the order was reduced from 126 to 59 then to 41.

Of the 18 units sold to NJT I believe one of them had a malfunctioning engine that lead to early retirement.

Only the 2008’s are being retired correct.  No issues with the 2013’s? 

[MysteriousBtrain]

8 minutes ago, Future ENY OP said:

Only the 2008’s are being retired correct.  No issues with the 2013’s? 

The 2013s are built with better specs so they'll probably be out around when the first X3-45s begin to retire.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The shields have finally started going up on the express buses... 

 

[trainfan22]

Wow at the 4300s outlasting the 2008 MCIs.... assuming 2008 are scrap and not going to MTA Bus.

[danielhg121]

1 hour ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

The shields have finally started going up on the express buses... 

That's really neat that they built them for dual-functionality. After the pick-up portion, the operator can have a little more breathing room and open up the shield. Basically turning his half-cab into a full-cab and gate to block off passengers. 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

25 minutes ago, danielhg121 said:

That's really neat that they built them for dual-functionality. After the pick-up portion, the operator can have a little more breathing room and open up the shield. Basically turning his half-cab into a full-cab and gate to block off passengers. 

It looks cool, but I'm not sure it's practical, since there is a gap that doesn't shield the driver in the second option, and if there's an issue with it opening, the passengers are basically locked in. Apparently, these are prototypes for now. Installation would be months from now. Another shot below...

Edited May 6, 2021 by Via Garibaldi 8

[Deucey]

2 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

The shields have finally started going up on the express buses... 

 

Why do that instead of a shield similar to the locals - like Greyhound and BoltBus have on their MCIs and Prevosts?

This is fairly useless for all the relative frequent stopping unless that shield opens and closes along with the door.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

4 minutes ago, Deucey said:

Why do that instead of a shield similar to the locals - like Greyhound and BoltBus have on their MCIs and Prevosts?

This is fairly useless for all the relative frequent stopping unless that shield opens and closes along with the door.

The idea would be that the shield would be closed as shown in the 1st picture. When the pick-up is done, the driver would have the option to have it as shown in the second photo where it blocks the aisle. When the drop-off segment starts, they would put it back the way they have it in the first photo. Supposedly, the shield may block the driver's view, hence the option as shown in the second picture.

I guess we will find out in due time, as these are supposedly prototypes for now.

Edited May 6, 2021 by Via Garibaldi 8

[danielhg121]

43 minutes ago, R32 3838 said:

for those who want to know why those 2200's are going, look at what they are powered by. same goes for the mta bus MCI's. plus they are 13 years old.

That doesn't really explain anything, the next generation of D4500's is leaving before the prior ones. Also, I might add that the Prevost order will not replace all of the D4500CL's so some of them will still be around after the Prevosts are fully delivered. Instead, I've heard that the 2008 D4500CT's have overheating issues. 13 years isn't really much for an express bus, especially when you consider the fact that some D4500's have made it to 20 years. If anything, that shows a downgrade in quality. 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

2 minutes ago, danielhg121 said:

That doesn't really explain anything, the next generation of D4500's is leaving before the prior ones. Also, I might add that the Prevost order will not replace all of the D4500CL's so some of them will still be around after the Prevosts are fully delivered. Instead, I've heard that the 2008 D4500CT's have overheating issues. 13 years isn't really much for an express bus, especially when you consider the fact that some D4500's have made it to 20 years. If anything, that shows a downgrade in quality. 

It explains plenty. The 2008 Staten Island express buses are used a lot and they tend to eat up a ton of mileage. You can't compare them to other depots. Spring Creek is another one, but they don't have service on Sundays, and limited service on Saturdays. Staten Island has 24/7 express bus service, so their buses will need to be replaced more often. Most buses are retired when they are 13 years old. It's just that some depots have gotten more use out of their buses than others, in part because of mileage use, etc.

[Lil 57]

Just a random question, since the Staten Island Ferry operates once an hour overnight now, why didn't the  revert the staten island buses that meet the ferry back to hourly headways overnight since most of the ridership is to/from the ferry at that hour. I remember when the  tried to do that a couple years ago and it failed, but that was when the ferry was running every 30 minutes overnight. And they did revert the SIR to hourly overnight as well.

Edited May 7, 2021 by Lil 57

[Via Garibaldi 8]

9 minutes ago, Lil 57 said:

Just a random question, since the Staten Island Ferry operates once an hour overnight now, why didn't the  revert the staten island buses that meet the ferry back to hourly headways overnight since most of the ridership is to/from the ferry at that hour. I remember when the  tried to do that a couple years ago and it failed, but that was when the ferry was running every 30 minutes overnight. And they did revert the SIR to hourly overnight as well.

Why should Staten Island have less service for people NOT taking the ferry? That was one of my biggest issues living on the island. If you needed the local bus and weren't going to or from the ferry, God help you if you misses a bus. That is why so many drive on Staten Island because service on the island service is poor.

[Deucey]

59 minutes ago, Lil 57 said:

Just a random question, since the Staten Island Ferry operates once an hour overnight now, why didn't the  revert the staten island buses that meet the ferry back to hourly headways overnight since most of the ridership is to/from the ferry at that hour. I remember when the  tried to do that a couple years ago and it failed, but that was when the ferry was running every 30 minutes overnight. And they did revert the SIR to hourly overnight as well.

Because not everyone riding the bus is going to/from the ferry.

Because we're supposed to get our 30 minute headways back when the "emergency" is over.

[B35 via Church]

19 hours ago, BM5 via Woodhaven said:

Some of the overnight service has caught on. The Q53 overnight service I would say is one. You have multiple buses with anywhere from 14-20 throughout the night. I mean with respect to artic's, it's low...but service operates every 20 minutes...and that's with the Q11 operating on top of it. I caught the Q11 a few weeks ago one night, and I was the only person that got on from Hoffman Drive. Personally at this point, if by any chance the Q53 gets to keep the additional overnight service (even if it's operating every 30 minutes) they might as well just can the Q11. The Q53 can run in it's place making all local stops (whether it also serves Lindenwood via the Q21 during overnight hours, IDK). 

Which is exactly what I would do - discontinue the overnight Q11 & keep that additional overnight service on the Q53 (only difference is, I wouldn't make the compromise you're making - to have the overnight Q53 run local)... While I certainly get not running service into Old Howard or Hamilton Beaches during those hours, still though - deading any type of service at Pitkin/Cross Bay during those hours is an absolute dead draw.... Part of the riders that take the Q53 into the Rockaways, are of Brooklynites that "backdoor" their way into the borough (via it & the Q35)....

The Q53 to Lindenwood bit (despite being overkill with running the thing locally), I don't see those residents going for it at all.... Likely get shot down instantly.

17 hours ago, Lil 57 said:

Also since the q53 is sbs, there can be confusion since the q53 is only ment to stop at sbs stops with the ticket machines due to the fare box being blocked and replaced by a proof of payment system.

what can happen is the reverse, making the q11 every 20-30 minutes overnight and extending it to rockaway park and canning the q53 overnight since the locals aren’t as slow overnight due to lower ridership.

Don't remotely see it occurring.... The MTA's been bolstering/force-feeding SBS service along Woodhaven/Cross Bay blvd's riders' throats for years now.... I mean, they're not going to bust a 180' (Lol) with that mission just because service is being ran in a juncture where the darkness of night takes over the light.... They really want to do away with local service during the daytime along that corridor...

16 hours ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

I can’t see them doing what you suggest either, because then the Q11 would also have to be extended to Jackson Heights or Woodside since that portion of the Q53 route would lose overnight service. 
 

They could have the Q53 run every 30 minutes overnight and have the Q11 stay at 60 minutes. The Q53 is way more popular than the Q11 so it shouldn’t be reduced in favor of adding more Q11 service. The Q11/Q21 is an afterthought to most along Woodhaven/Cross Bay Blvd especially after all the improves made to the Q53 and the addition of the Q52. 

So, merely status quo, pre-covid?

For the supporting arguments you've made, I expected a suggestion/conclusion involving more being done with the overnight Q53 frequency wise... 

14 hours ago, BM5 via Woodhaven said:

At that time, making all stops shouldn't increase runtimes too much, and the Q11 only runs to Pitkin. Even though the Q11 doesn't get too many riders, I wouldn't eliminate overnight local service on Woodhaven Boulevard at all. Personally I lean more towards providing more convenience during late night hours, since runtimes typically aren't affected too much (and they wouldn't be in this case). Even if it helps out just a few people using local stops, having 30 minute service (and to more destinations) is much better than 60 minute service. Some of those stops also aren't exactly close to each other. During the daytime, yeah, keep them separate and as is.

IDK, that strikes me as being said because it's the "right" thing to say, moreso than I believe people actually agree with the sentiment.... Then again, convenience isn't solely a unilateral concept & can definitely be multifaceted... As in, convenience can mean speed (of the route) & proximity (to the route) to one person, and simply mean proximity to the next person (not really caring how many stops the thing makes along the way)....

Anyway, even when the Q11 was the main show (so to speak) decades ago along the corridor, overnight patronage in particular was horrid.... By how you're conveying it, I don't necessarily agree that having Q53's run local overnights would basically result in an insignificant (or whatever you deem the opposite of "too much" to be in this case) change to its runtime... There would be quite the noticeable increase in patronage (of course, nothing like that of being remotely close to daytime levels, but still), have word get out there that you could embark/disembark at any (local and/or SBS) stop along the corridor & be able to ride out to the Rockaways or ride out to the infamous, notorious ....

[NBTA]

Sad to see the 2008 CTs go, the days where I constantly see 2247/2248 when I am on a different line, or already home, will sadly come to an end.

[Lil 57]

Just now, NBTA said:

Sad to see the 2008 CTs go, the days where I constantly see 2247/2248 when I am on a different line, or already home, will sadly come to an end.

I agree, they tended to be more comfortable and more spacious than the provosts here on Staten Island. Especially the seats near the accessible entrance, those seats had a ton of legroom.

[Future ENY OP]

17 minutes ago, NBTA said:

Sad to see the 2008 CTs go, the days where I constantly see 2247/2248 when I am on a different line, or already home, will sadly come to an end.

I'll say this if those buses didn't come with so many defects the MTA would of had a nice fleet of D4500CT's instead of going the prevost route..  However, the prevosts don't look bad at all. It would be nice if the MTA could get a stab on those 2022/23 MCI's.. Maybe some for MTA bus, and some for NYCT- Queens Village and possibly Ulmer Park.

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

This is the third night in recent days (might be more if it happened a few days I didn't check recently) that all overnight M101 bus departures were suspended:

 

Delays  Posted:  05/07/2021 12:11 AM

The following M101 trips will not run tonight: 

Northbound: 1:01AM, 1:21AM, 1:32AM, 2:32AM, 3:32AM, 4:47AM and 5:18AM

Southbound: 12:53AM, 1:26AM, 2:26AM, 3:26AM, 3:46AM, 4:26AM, 5:26AM and 5:40AM

We are running as much service as we can with the bus operators we have available. Check for updates before traveling.

Edited May 7, 2021 by BM5 via Woodhaven