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BUS - Random Thoughts Thread

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I've only seen it going to the city, people don't have enough on their cards and the B/O's are like whatever. 

Only because they don't want to get assaulted over $2.75

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Can someone explain to me why the southern terminal on the M7 ends on an avenue it never uses at any point during the route?

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Seriously? I have yet to see that.

  

Fare beating? Express bus? In the same sentence?

  

Si si the only place where I see fare beating on the Express bus.

  

I've only seen it going to the city, people don't have enough on their cards and the B/O's are like whatever.

 

The issue is more prevalent on the X10. It passes through or near some ghetto areas once on Staten Island. Park Hill comes to mind. It's around that area that I've seen farebeating.

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What they need to do is start having undercover cops ride the buses again.

I don't understand why they stopped.  I mean people WILL pay if you enforce the fare.   Look at a line like the Bx41 which goes through some pretty rough/poor areas.  You would rarely see people checking tickets, and once they started checking, all of a sudden people started paying.  I don't buy this idea that people can't afford the fare.  If you can't afford $2.75 then perhaps you shouldn't be living in NYC.  I mean everyone knows it's expensive to live here.  The same people that fare beat have expensive cell phones, sneakers and the like, so it's a question of what they prioritize more.

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Can someone explain to me why the southern terminal on the M7 ends on an avenue it never uses at any point during the route?

The last/first stop is on 6 Av and 14 St, behind the M5 stop. Going uptown, the M7 uses 6 Av all the way to 59 St/Central Park South.

So I happened to see a Next Gen (from Gun Hill) on the M103...

Loaners
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I don't understand why they stopped.  I mean people WILL pay if you enforce the fare.   Look at a line like the Bx41 which goes through some pretty rough/poor areas.  You would rarely see people checking tickets, and once they started checking, all of a sudden people started paying.  I don't buy this idea that people can't afford the fare.  If you can't afford $2.75 then perhaps you shouldn't be living in NYC.  I mean everyone knows it's expensive to live here.  The same people that fare beat have expensive cell phones, sneakers and the like, so it's a question of what they prioritize more.

It's kinda dicey for you to talk about money considering you have more of it than probably anyone on here and $2.75 doesn't affect you. In any case, some people have been living here their whole lives and the cost of living has gone up to a ridiculous rate, but that's a topic for another day on another website.

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It's kinda dicey for you to talk about money considering you have more of it than probably anyone on here and $2.75 doesn't affect you. In any case, some people have been living here their whole lives and the cost of living has gone up to a ridiculous rate, but that's a topic for another day on another website.

Just NO.

 

Stop with this excuse, and that's all it is, is the leading EXCUSE trotted out anytime this comes up.  If you don't have fare, then WALK.  Try that crap in a restaurant -- you get charged with defrauding an innkeeper, and get arrested.  Do it in a store, you get arrested for shoplifting.  Get a cab ride and try it there, you'll be taking another ride in a car with flashing lights on it.

 

Those farebeaters probably can scrounge up money for cigarettes, chips, Chinese-made celebrity shoes and all sorts of extraneous things and somehow can't use $2.75 for bus fare?

 

I see plenty of people who *could* be in such situations, especially those working multiple jobs and using the DDOT buses to get around, and EVERYONE who gets on the bus HAS TO FEED THE FAREBOX.  Why?  Because the operator will boot them back out the door.  And people KNOW that.  In fact, SMART drivers are more apt to fall for a "sympathy ride" request in suburbia than DDOT drivers in the city.

 

Just like Detroit car drivers KNOW that the DDOT buses own the road, riders KNOW they have to pay.  Also helps that anyone who is riding has somewhere where they want to get, and any delays caused by someone not wanting to pay increases the chances of a whole busload turning against them, and "helping" them off the bus.

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Seems like a few here actually believe the idea of poverty as pathology- which has been debunked 5,000 times already...

 

The numbers (and multiple studies on the subject) back up what lupojohn is saying so clearly it's not just an "excuse"

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It's kinda dicey for you to talk about money considering you have more of it than probably anyone on here and $2.75 doesn't affect you. In any case, some people have been living here their whole lives and the cost of living has gone up to a ridiculous rate, but that's a topic for another day on another website.

I invest considerably in my transportation sometimes spending as much as $400.00+ between the express bus and Metro-North since I commute a lot. I could certainly think of other luxuries to spend that on. Ultimately it seems unfair for those who pay to keep paying for those who aren't. A monthly pass gives you access to unlimited subway and local bus rides. Even though the subways and local buses stink you're still paying well under $2.75 per ride. What's troubling is that some in our society seem to think that they don't feel responsible for their own costs. Supplement food... Supplement transportation, housing, etc. It never ends. I take a lot of pride paying my own way and would take on however many jobs I had to before resorting to social welfare programs.

Seems like a few here actually believe the idea of poverty as pathology- which has been debunked 5,000 times already...

 

The numbers (and multiple studies on the subject) back up what lupojohn is saying so clearly it's not just an "excuse"

A large majority of New Yorkers live paycheck to paycheck. That doesn't justify people not paying the fare. You have to plan your expenses accordingly. I have always been a workaholic going back to my college days... Always wanted my own money and didn't want my parents constantly sending me money. Teaches you how to be independent. I guess that's why the idea of having someone else pay for me to get around seems bizarre.

Edited by Via Garibaldi 8
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Seems like a few here actually believe the idea of poverty as pathology- which has been debunked 5,000 times already...

 

The numbers (and multiple studies on the subject) back up what lupojohn is saying so clearly it's not just an "excuse"

Here's the problem. Not enough enforcement on (MTA) NYCTA buses vs the trains. Yes. For years it's been talked about the poverty levels of this city. You have the people who can afford the train and bus fare and simply just don't want to pay vs the people who can't get the proper fare to use the system.

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Seems like a few here actually believe the idea of poverty as pathology- which has been debunked 5,000 times already...

 

The numbers (and multiple studies on the subject) back up what lupojohn is saying so clearly it's not just an "excuse"

Look, I used to ride several DDOT routes back in the 1990s that went right by, or directly through, different housing projects.  The government placed people into those projects because of their income status.  I can count on ONE HAND the number of times a DDOT operator did NOT collect a fare in over 4 YEARS over those multiple routes serving "the poorest" citizens of their projects, and I'll name them:

--Route 46-Southfield: Went directly through the largest projects in the city, Herman Gardens;

--Route 14-Crosstown: Served the Connor-Waveny projects on the east side;

--Route 50-Warren East: Served the same Connor-Waveny projects;

--Route 24-Holbrook: Served the Charles Terrace projects bordering Hamtramck;

--Route 21-Grand River: Heavy corridor route, spitting distance to the Jeffries Projects, giving direct access to Downtown.

 

If people who the government has deemed to be in poverty, and living in their projects can afford to get onto a DDOT bus and, at the time, put $1.25 fare in, and more than likely an extra 25 cents for a transfer for another DDOT or SMART bus, then how is it that NYC -- with all of its "support" systems (many MUCH more generous than in other parts of the country) -- can't have their own citizens do the same?

 

Even today, those "in need" get passes for 2 rides + 2 transfers from Detroit and other social service agencies which can be used on both SMART and DDOT.

 

It STILL comes down to priorities in the end.  The cash in someone's pocket usually gets spent by the wearer's hand.  That hand is attached to a head that should know how to make proper choices.  Why should EVERYBODY ELSE have to deal with their wrong choices?

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Without question, there are definitely people who can afford the fare and don't feel like paying and they deserve to be caught and pay the fine.

 

But I think we're painting with a very broad brush here and assuming that EVERYONE who farebeats has malicious intent...

 

There is a private project that I support that takes donations of used MetroCards with odd amounts, say one with like 57 cents on it, and combines them into cards with 1 or 2 rides on them for lower income or homeless people to get to job interviews, etc.

 

I don't remember it's name off the top of my head, but can look it up again if anyone is interested.

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I invest considerably in my transportation sometimes spending as much as $400.00+ between the express bus and Metro-North since I commute a lot. I could certainly think of other luxuries to spend that on. Ultimately it seems unfair for those who pay to keep paying for those who aren't. A monthly pass gives you access to unlimited subway and local bus rides. Even though the subways and local buses stink you're still paying well under $2.75 per ride. What's troubling is that some in our society seem to think that they don't feel responsible for their own costs. Supplement food... Supplement transportation, housing, etc. It never ends. I take a lot of pride paying my own way and would take on however many jobs I had to before resorting to social welfare programs.

A large majority of New Yorkers live paycheck to paycheck. That doesn't justify people not paying the fare. You have to plan your expenses accordingly. I have always been a workaholic going back to my college days... Always wanted my own money and didn't want my parents constantly sending me money. Teaches you how to be independent. I guess that's why the idea of having someone else pay for me to get around seems bizarre.

You made my point for me on both responses.

 

Yes, you have your own money because you earned it. However, notice what you said:

 

"I invest considerably in my transportation sometimes spending as much as $400.00+ between the express bus and Metro-North since I commute a lot. I could certainly think of a lot of other luxuries to spend that on".

 

Exactly. You have a lot of money. No offense, but this sounds like someone who is a rich, elitist. 

 

"A monthly pass gives you access to unlimited subway and local bus rides. Even though the subways and local buses stink, you're still paying under $2.75 a ride".

 

Yeah, except not everyone can afford $31 a week or $116,50 a month. Luckily, I can on occasion, but the (MTA) has a hell of a nerve raising any fares. Perhaps they wouldn't be broke if they took a look at some within the agency who keep money (yes, that's a direct accusation) and did unnecessary projects. Point being, you don't ride local buses, so you don't know what it's like.

 

I do agree with this: "People are living paycheck to paycheck". Exactly the point the above poster who responded to my last comment. Some people who may be living here a long time may have seen a downturn in their finances and if you're living paycheck to paycheck, you can't spare ANY expense. Does that mean anyone should resort to farebeating? Of course not, but maybe that poster should be a little more sympathetic to the everyman instead of coming off as a cold snob.

Edited by lupojohn

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You made my point for me on both responses.

 

Yes, you have your own money because you earned it. However, notice what you said:

 

"I invest considerably in my transportation sometimes spending as much as $400.00+ between the express bus and Metro-North since I commute a lot. I could certainly think of a lot of other luxuries to spend that on".

 

Exactly. You have a lot of money. No offense, but this sounds like someone who is a rich, elitist. 

 

"A monthly pass gives you access to unlimited subway and local bus rides. Even though the subways and local buses stink, you're still paying under $2.75 a ride".

 

Yeah, except not everyone can afford $31 a week or $116,50 a month. Luckily, I can on occasion, but the (MTA) has a hell of a nerve raising any fares. Perhaps they wouldn't be broke if they took a look at some within the agency who keep money (yes, that's a direct accusation) and did unnecessary projects. Point being, you don't ride local buses, so you don't know what it's like.

 

I do agree with this: "People are living paycheck to paycheck". Exactly the point the above poster who responded to my last comment. Some people who may be living here a long time may have seen a downturn in their finances and if you're living paycheck to paycheck, you can't spare ANY expense. Does that mean anyone should resort to farebeating? Of course not, but maybe that poster should be a little more sympathetic to the everyman instead of coming off as a cold snob.

The fare is what it is.  Everything costs in the city.  I mean people have to eat, etc., so they have to pay.  They can't go to the market crying about the price of groceries.  Same thing with the fare.  It's funny that people like yourself have such complaints about the fares but likely do nothing about speaking out against them.  $31.00 a week spread across 7 days at 2 rides a day is.... $2.21 per ride assuming you only ride twice a day, with the price decreasing with each ride you take.  At $116.00 a month you pay about $1.16 a ride, assuming you only ride twice a day.  How much cheaper do you want it to be?? 

 

Oh and rich elitists don't ride public transportation.   :lol:

 

I should add though that if someone isn't working, well then of course they won't be able to afford the basics.  Additionally, it seems rather unrealistic to think somehow living in one of the most expensive cities around that you'll be able to survive here with no job and then complain about the cost of everything. 

Edited by Via Garibaldi 8

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 Moving on, it's amazing how poorly the M35 gets treated. They throw just about anything but an RTS on that line these days.

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Moving on, it's amazing how poorly the M35 gets treated. They throw just about anything but an RTS on that line these days.

Because Hale doesn't have any RTS...
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As I said, anything BUT an RTS. Trust me, I know the depots inside out.

You make special trips to those depots?  Mighty expensive for someone complaining about the fare. lol

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^^^ Lol @ this guy, he will always find the chance to get you no matter what.

 

As far as lupojohn's comment about the M35, well what do you expect when there is no RTS's at Hale in service. Also, I believe that, it's best to leave the better running buses off it.

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As I said, anything BUT an RTS. Trust me, I know the depots inside out.

That sounds a little stalker-ish

Besides, can MCH handle RTS?

 

They are just using NG and Artics for M35.

They can, any depot can handle the RTS. They literally throw whatever's lying around on that line.

 

^^^ Lol @ this guy, he will always find the chance to get you no matter what.

 

As far as lupojohn's comment about the M35, well what do you expect when there is no RTS's at Hale in service. Also, I believe that, it's best to leave the better running buses off it.

And that's exactly what they do lol. Rode that line for the first time the other night (I knew the operator, he picked it up for OT and I was already in the area), and he was telling me that they really don't care about that line. His bus had a busted artic joint (every time it bent a certain way, the sensor kicked in and thinks the bus is turning and cuts the throttle power), and the other bus had a busted sign.

 

Not like it matters out there, no one really pays lol.

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