BUS - Random Thoughts Thread

[East New York]

It's now 10 prototypes (5 BAE, 5 Allison) and 275 production models

 

285 if you include the XDE60's. And those are actually 10 official Pilots each. They will likely be split between ENY and MHV for test and evaluation. Now don't forget for all that don't know, and I'm not sure If I ever posted this, but if Nova lowers the price on their hybrids they could get in the game too.

 

I doubted because Manhattanville are supposed to get all 75 orders of XDE40's if Im correct. Plus 10 more I think.

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Well according to the converted order from diesel to hybrid, and what I know about Planning Ops, I can see MV now getting about 120 now, and the other 155 end up at Quill, Hale, East New York, Flatbush, and Ulmer Park.

 

If Nova gets in on it, I see QV and Gun Hill for the pilot, and of course Bronx and SI if there was an order placed.

 

But until further notice, the 285 total hybrids will be Xcelsiors. The BYD 60 Foot electric pilot will likely go to Quill as well unless they decide on somewhere in the Bronx to spread things out. However with a new technology such as that, I personally don't see 60 Foot electric buses going anywhere other than Quill, Grand or possibly East New York.

 

Then there is still the Question on where the XDE60's will go. I don't even have a clue on that one, and until I example the optimal routes I won't even speculate. I am being told MTA already has an idea of where they want them though.

[Fresh Pond]

I've seen artics go through there tho? Aren't they the same height?

 

 

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The 65 St transverse has a height limit of about 9' 6" if you hug the curb, but anywhere from 11' 4" to 12' feet if you ride near the centerline.

 

Going by the spec sheets of whatever we have running, our buses height ranges:

 

XD40: 10' 6"

XN40: 11' 1"

C40LF: barely touching 11'

LFS/A: 10' 6"

RTS: somewhere in the 9' 6" range

MCI: about 11'5 or so, give or take

Prevost: just a tad bit shorter than the MCI

[danielhg121]

I saw a Orion Vii on the M72 yesterday.

 

 

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[engineerboy6561]

Does anyone know why the Q111 has two trips to Rockaway Blvd/Peninsula Blvd (one in the morning, one in the afternoon) and then two trips the other way in the afternoon?

[paulrivera]

I've been on Greyhound and Academy buses through each of the Central Park transverses. Trust me, the transverses can technically fit up to and including MCI and Prevost cruisers (about 11'5" iinm; some Prevosts are slightly taller)

 

I say technically because you do need to drive the bus as close to the center as possible.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Buses can fit in there guys. It's politics. Quill doesn't wanna get rid of the RTS until it retires, and that's why along with East New York they have notoriously has the best RTS fleets since the 80's. A piece of history will be gone, so a long time ago someone floated the rumor online that other buses can't go through there. It's true the RTS is the lowest and for safety reasons especially when I comes to inexperienced drivers, MTA has granted Quill's request and keep them all RTS runs. That day however is coming to an end in 2019 and completely in 2020. Unless MTA overhauled some buses that era is coming to an end. The only buses that we have are hybrids, the LFS and the XD40. Something will going on those lines.

 

East New York cried like babies when they brought the LFS in and took the RTS. Now EN went from having 0 to having more that 50 of the best buses in the city. Quill drivers would probably call in sick if they did it there! Lol Hell, EC drivers sure did and demanded they keep a few RTS or they weren't coming in to work..... People don't play about these buses have have lied or made up rumors just to get them....

 

Quill was supposed to be RTS free almost 4 years ago. Then again, the only buses that are supposed to still be here are 4900-5249, but we still have 21 years old buses running out of Queens. MTA told them you can get new buses or keep these and have been really against sending any 94/95/9600 series buses. They said fine... We will keep the old stuff then. A veteran driver at JK always keeps an RTS out late and they are not even wantwd on the streets after rush. They aren't even needed at EN, Quill or Ulmer at night, but whoever wants them can usually get them...

 

This is the most iconic bus ever, even more so than the Fishbowl at this point and MTA has has tried to keep them as long as possible and will now go down in history as the best maintainer of the RTS AND the Detroit Diesel ever.

 

I'm gonna miss that damn bus in recenue...... But it's ok, I've consulted with TMC, and Nova and worked as a contractor for Millennium. I've had one of my own and I'm getting another one so I will be A-OK! #DreamsFulfilled

I'm sure the passengers won't miss them. Every now and then I'll take the M57 or M31 down 57th when I don't feel like walking, and it's nice to get one of the newer buses. I remember when those Fishbowls? were around.  I didn't miss those either.  Every time it rained, seats were wet which meant you had to stand if you didn't have anything to clean it with.  

Edited June 22, 2017 by Via Garibaldi 8

[Around the Horn]

The 65 St transverse has a height limit of about 9' 6" if you hug the curb, but anywhere from 11' 4" to 12' feet if you ride near the centerline.

 

Going by the spec sheets of whatever we have running, our buses height ranges:

 

XD40: 10' 6"

XN40: 11' 1"

C40LF: barely touching 11'

LFS/A: 10' 6"

RTS: somewhere in the 9' 6" range

MCI: about 11'5 or so, give or take

Prevost: just a tad bit shorter than the MCI

Is there a difference in height between the XD40 and an XDE40?

[XcelsiorBoii4888]

Is there a difference in height between the XD40 and an XDE40?

Nahh, the XDE40 is basically an XD40 with a full roof top piece. The batteries don't pass the height of the roof caps.

 

 

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[Far Rock Depot]

Does anyone know why the Q111 has two trips to Rockaway Blvd/Peninsula Blvd (one in the morning, one in the afternoon) and then two trips the other way in the afternoon?

Because there's consistent ridership for those trips dating back to the PBL days under Jamaica Buses.

 

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[Fresh Pond]

Is there a difference in height between the XD40 and an XDE40?

Nahh, the XDE40 is basically an XD40 with a full roof top piece. The batteries don't pass the height of the roof caps.

 

 

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The XDE40 is actually 4 inches taller than the XD40 at 10' 10"

[Hound]

The 65 St transverse has a height limit of about 9' 6" if you hug the curb, but anywhere from 11' 4" to 12' feet if you ride near the centerline.

 

Going by the spec sheets of whatever we have running, our buses height ranges:

 

XD40: 10' 6"

XN40: 11' 1"

C40LF: barely touching 11'

LFS/A: 10' 6"

RTS: somewhere in the 9' 6" range

MCI: about 11'5 or so, give or take

Prevost: just a tad bit shorter than the MCI

I've driven Prevost H3-45's through there many times & they're 12'4"

[XcelsiorBoii4888]

At the end of the day, any bus in the MTA fleet can go through those Central Park transverses.

 

 

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[MHV9218]

Going by the spec sheets of whatever we have running, our buses height ranges:

 

XD40: 10' 6"

XN40: 11' 1"

C40LF: barely touching 11'

LFS/A: 10' 6"

RTS: somewhere in the 9' 6" range

MCI: about 11'5 or so, give or take

Prevost: just a tad bit shorter than the MCI

 

The MTA used to quote RTSes at 10 feet, D60HFs at 11 feet, and MCIs at 11 ft 5 in, from what I've seen.

[Fresh Pond]

I've driven Prevost H3-45's through there many times & they're 12'4"

The H series is a little taller than the X series

The MTA used to quote RTSes at 10 feet, D60HFs at 11 feet, and MCIs at 11 ft 5 in, from what I've seen.

I got the measurements for the MCI and the Prevost directly off of their respective websites.

[Q43LTD]

That moment when a BO asks does anybody know this route

[Via Garibaldi 8]

That moment when a BO asks does anybody know this route

You had that recently? 

[Future ENY OP]

That moment when a BO asks does anybody know this route

 

LMFAO ????????????????????????????????????????.

The Irony of not knowing your route. That's definitely bad.

[XcelsiorBoii4888]

That moment when a BO asks does anybody know this route

Bro thats sad that they don't give those drivers time to learn routes. They should have the option for a veteran B/O to do overtime by letting him/her ride with a newbie along for their shift, until they become familiar with the route.

 

I was on an X1 going home one day, the 2:30am bus from the city. Guy left at 2:47am. Bus before that was the 1:30am to Staten Island. I got on at 5th and 41st, guy almost missed the stop and stopped just short of 40th street. Literally did not know the stops, said he was on the "extra list" and they gave him that run. So I sat in the front and guided him throughout the city. He couldn't turn onto Park Ave from 23rd street, so I had to get off and back him up(mind you the bus is starting to get packed (people were complaining but were sympathetic). So we got to Broadway and Park Place, and the bus was SRO with I think 2-3 people at the time. He said theres no more seats so I can just bypass the rest of the stops. I said NO NO people are trying to get home, the bus runs every hour they would report you for bypassing them. I explained they're not gonna care that there's no seats. By time we got to the last stop in the city. There was about 11-12 people at the stop. Only about 6 got on, and the rest said they'll wait for the next one, its 15mins away. Yeah, we were supposed to be in lower Manhattan at 3am, didn't get there till near 4am. Going through the tunnel, my gosh, 7-10mph, with constant breaking. Bus is SRO to the front. Took about 15mins to get through the tunnel, felt like we were in traffic. People were honking behind us but he was so scared to go any faster (seemed claustrophobic or something). On the Gowanus, he was going about 35mph. On the bridge, same thing. Guess what, we see another X1 pass us! EVERYONE on the bus started cursing and flipping out, and demanded he'd hurry up or they'd report him. Got to Fingerboard Rd, and people told him to honk down the other bus, the bus waited, everyone ran off and got on that bus, and I guess they explained the scenario to the other B/O because he let them all on. Our bus went from SRO to having about 11 people on board. That other X1 was SRO to the very front. I was helping him out so I didn't want to just ditch him. I got off at Hylan and Cromwell, and I was his last passenger as people who stayed on were getting off the next few stops. I told him the bus is empty, you got lucky, now you can just drive down to Richmond Ave, turn right, head to the transit center and you're done. He said "thanks for all your help and sorry about the delays" and I parted my way. I checked bustime, the other bus was SRO and still made it to New Dorp when I got off at Cromwell.

 

This is why bus service has problems. You got all these newbies that don't know where they are going, so they mess the schedule up and that produces bunching. Then some don't know how to maneuver around in traffic. The fact that they get paid to be late; you got the guys who are money hungry and will just run late all day. Dispatchers not doing their jobs during rush hour of putting buses in place(this is the best time since buses run frequent).

 

Bus service will never be near perfect. Even if there wasn't any traffic (explains why buses bunch at 2am).

 

 

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[Via Garibaldi 8]

Bro thats sad that they don't give those drivers time to learn routes. They should have the option for a veteran B/O to do overtime by letting him/her ride with a newbie along for their shift, until they become familiar with the route.

 

I was on an X1 going home one day, the 2:30am bus from the city. Guy left at 2:47am. Bus before that was the 1:30am to Staten Island. I got on at 5th and 41st, guy almost missed the stop and stopped just short of 40th street. Literally did not know the stops, said he was on the "extra list" and they gave him that run. So I sat in the front and guided him throughout the city. He couldn't turn onto Park Ave from 23rd street, so I had to get off and back him up(mind you the bus is starting to get packed (people were complaining but were sympathetic). So we got to Broadway and Park Place, and the bus was SRO with I think 2-3 people at the time. He said theres no more seats so I can just bypass the rest of the stops. I said NO NO people are trying to get home, the bus runs every hour they would report you for bypassing them. I explained they're not gonna care that there's no seats. By time we got to the last stop in the city. There was about 11-12 people at the stop. Only about 6 got on, and the rest said they'll wait for the next one, its 15mins away. Yeah, we were supposed to be in lower Manhattan at 3am, didn't get there till near 4am. Going through the tunnel, my gosh, 7-10mph, with constant breaking. Bus is SRO to the front. Took about 15mins to get through the tunnel, felt like we were in traffic. People were honking behind us but he was so scared to go any faster (seemed claustrophobic or something). On the Gowanus, he was going about 35mph. On the bridge, same thing. Guess what, we see another X1 pass us! EVERYONE on the bus started cursing and flipping out, and demanded he'd hurry up or they'd report him. Got to Fingerboard Rd, and people told him to honk down the other bus, the bus waited, everyone ran off and got on that bus, and I guess they explained the scenario to the other B/O because he let them all on. Our bus went from SRO to having about 11 people on board. That other X1 was SRO to the very front. I was helping him out so I didn't want to just ditch him. I got off at Hylan and Cromwell, and I was his last passenger as people who stayed on were getting off the next few stops. I told him the bus is empty, you got lucky, now you can just drive down to Richmond Ave, turn right, head to the transit center and you're done. He said "thanks for all your help and sorry about the delays" and I parted my way. I checked bustime, the other bus was SRO and still made it to New Dorp when I got off at Cromwell.

 

This is why bus service has problems. You got all these newbies that don't know where they are going, so they mess the schedule up and that produces bunching. Then some don't know how to maneuver around in traffic. The fact that they get paid to be late; you got the guys who are money hungry and will just run late all day. Dispatchers not doing their jobs during rush hour of putting buses in place(this is the best time since buses run frequent).

 

Bus service will never be near perfect. Even if there wasn't any traffic (explains why buses bunch at 2am).

 

 

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I've heard about this before... These extra guys... If they don't have the route down, they should go out and learn it on their own. Aside from that they really do think it's okay to blow by stops.  I had an X12 driver skip ALL of Downtown.  He was the last X12 bus to Staten Island for the night. He turns on 23rd as normal and then continues onto the FDR as if he's an X42.  I said to myself what in the hell is this guy doing?  We made no more stops until I rang to get off at Slosson and Victory.  When I did, I told him about all of the stops he skipped.  He just looked at me like I had two heads. Smh

 

I had a similar situation with a BxM4 newbie. I come down from Westchester, and am dropped off right by the Yonkers/City border near Katonah and 242nd.  20:50 bus (at the time) MIA... I wait and wait. No bus.  I file a complaint online, then call the depot to see what's going on.  The guy was lost after doing the BxM11 and couldn't figure out how to get over to Woodlawn.  By the time he did, the next bus due was there, and he honks at me heading north on Katonah because he knew I had made a stink to the depot about the missing bus in addition to filing the complaint.  I finally am able to get on (calls me over) and we come back around the loop to head south on Katonah. He eventually follows the other guy and I helped him as well.  I don't think he ever got back on schedule, so he was basically an hour late for the rest of his trips.  He tells me he didn't remember the route, and I suggested that he go out and drive around on his free time to get it down.  I mean really, that's what people do in the professional world.  You don't know something at work, you learn it on your own time. Just unbelievable.  

Edited June 23, 2017 by Via Garibaldi 8

[danielhg121]

One time I was on a Q34, the bus was heading northbd from Jamaica. The bus op was supposed to do another Q25 back but the dispatcher gave him the Q34 cause there was a delay in 34's. He got to Main St because well the 25 basically covers it. But he forgot everything after the right turn from linden place. I basically directed him to 26th ave and everybody was already off and I believe he was gonna deadhead back to the depot. I told him the directions and said bye. He was a newbie but I kinda scratched me head at his situation because a lot of CP driver routes interline and how would you not remember the 25/34, they share the same timetable too. I think he was a newbie and I think a lot of newbies train on the 34(well, maybe the flushing to whitestone shuttle), so how did he not know the route?

 

 

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[BM5 via Woodhaven]

This is why bus service has problems. You got all these newbies that don't know where they are going, so they mess the schedule up and that produces bunching. Then some don't know how to maneuver around in traffic. The fact that they get paid to be late; you got the guys who are money hungry and will just run late all day. Dispatchers not doing their jobs during rush hour of putting buses in place(this is the best time since buses run frequent).

 

Bus service will never be near perfect. Even if there wasn't any traffic (explains why buses bunch at 2am).

 

 

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One thing I hate is how some dispatchers are not aware of some (notable) ridership patterns, and then mess up the scheduling. i don't expect the dispatcher to know every single route and ridership patterns, but should be aware of ridership patterns of routes within same area or same depot. 

 

I was waiting for a B16 bus on Caton & Coney Island Avenue a while. On bustime, two buses come down, each with the Bay Ridge sign. I was so glad because I have been getting very agitated (and then I see all the buses sent up to Lefferts Gardens without short-turning them). However, one of them gets ahead of the other, and the one behind lags. I thought nothing of it, until the B/O arrives with the sign set to "60 ST". Now, I wasn't too pleased for three reasons:

 

1. Ridership north of 60 Street is light compared to south (the section between the and the second it turns off Fort Hamilton Parkway holds the route down for the most part in terms of its ridership). 

2. The bus continued going down Fort Hamilton Parkway, not in service, past 60 St 

3. I had to get to 86 Street & 4 Avenue

 

Either way, the second bus takes forever to get to Coney Island Avenue, but eventually passes the first one. Since this was during the rush hour, there's more ridership on that section in Lefferts Gardens/Flatbush/Kensington, but still, more people got south of 60 Street, and it was doing the work of 2 buses. I see three B16s going to Lefferts Gardens all empty, and I'm just like WTF is going on? Maybe the runs eventually interline with the B43 or DH back to JG, but I've never seen buses short-turned from the south at 60 Street in order to maintain an even headway.

[XcelsiorBoii4888]

I've heard about this before... These extra guys... If they don't have the route down, they should go out and learn it on their own. Aside from that they really do think it's okay to blow by stops. I had an X12 driver skip ALL of Downtown. He was the last X12 bus to Staten Island for the night. He turns on 23rd as normal and then continues onto the FDR as if he's an X42. I said to myself what in the hell is this guy doing? We made no more stops until I rang to get off at Slosson and Victory. When I did, I told him about all of the stops he skipped. He just looked at me like I had two heads. Smh

 

I had a similar situation with a BxM4 newbie. I come down from Westchester, and am dropped off right by the Yonkers/City border near Katonah and 242nd. 20:50 bus (at the time) MIA... I wait and wait. No bus. I file a complaint online, then call the depot to see what's going on. The guy was lost after doing the BxM11 and couldn't figure out how to get over to Woodlawn. By the time he did, the next bus due was there, and he honks at me heading north on Katonah because he knew I had made a stink to the depot about the missing bus in addition to filing the complaint. I finally am able to get on (calls me over) and we come back around the loop to head south on Katonah. He eventually follows the other guy and I helped him as well. I don't think he ever got back on schedule, so he was basically an hour late for the rest of his trips. He tells me he didn't remember the route, and I suggested that he go out and drive around on his free time to get it down. I mean really, that's what people do in the professional world. You don't know something at work, you learn it on your own time. Just unbelievable.

Yeah those extra list guys, you can have a newbie in the middle of rush hour not knowing what he's doing. My thing with learning on your own, I agree 100% you should want to learn all the routes in your depot, just in case you're assigned something. But I know a lot of B/Os don't have cars so they cant drive around, which is why they should be assisted for like a week until they learn everything.

 

The X12 driver that was just ignorant, his excuse would be "I thought my paddle said X42". I hope people reported him, too many drivers playing around, now those X12 riders probably had to take the train, to the ferry, to the bus, SMH.

 

I actually didn't know you could call depots and complain about service on the spot. I thought everything was through the MTA site.

 

 

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[XcelsiorBoii4888]

One time I was on a Q34, the bus was heading northbd from Jamaica. The bus op was supposed to do another Q25 back but the dispatcher gave him the Q34 cause there was a delay in 34's. He got to Main St because well the 25 basically covers it. But he forgot everything after the right turn from linden place. I basically directed him to 26th ave and everybody was already off and I believe he was gonna deadhead back to the depot. I told him the directions and said bye. He was a newbie but I kinda scratched me head at his situation because a lot of CP driver routes interline and how would you not remember the 25/34, they share the same timetable too. I think he was a newbie and I think a lot of newbies train on the 34(well, maybe the flushing to whitestone shuttle), so how did he not know the route?

 

 

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I doubt a newbie would understand how the timetables and interlines work. Another thing with the MTA, the information they give them (the B/Os) with stops and directions sometimes do not link up with the DOTs current info. Bus stops on their sheets can say one street, but the DOT has the stop somewhere else. Same thing applies for some turns, if a bus has been rerouted a few years ago until now, 8/10 times the depot has the routing from like 10 years ago. (This was the case with a Castleton Route).

 

 

 

 

 

 

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One thing I hate is how some dispatchers are not aware of some (notable) ridership patterns, and then mess up the scheduling. i don't expect the dispatcher to know every single route and ridership patterns, but should be aware of ridership patterns of routes within same area or same depot.

 

I was waiting for a B16 bus on Caton & Coney Island Avenue a while. On bustime, two buses come down, each with the Bay Ridge sign. I was so glad because I have been getting very agitated (and then I see all the buses sent up to Lefferts Gardens without short-turning them). However, one of them gets ahead of the other, and the one behind lags. I thought nothing of it, until the B/O arrives with the sign set to "60 ST". Now, I wasn't too pleased for three reasons:

 

1. Ridership north of 60 Street is light compared to south (the section between the and the second it turns off Fort Hamilton Parkway holds the route down for the most part in terms of its ridership).

2. The bus continued going down Fort Hamilton Parkway, not in service, past 60 St

3. I had to get to 86 Street & 4 Avenue

 

Either way, the second bus takes forever to get to Coney Island Avenue, but eventually passes the first one. Since this was during the rush hour, there's more ridership on that section in Lefferts Gardens/Flatbush/Kensington, but still, more people got south of 60 Street, and it was doing the work of 2 buses. I see three B16s going to Lefferts Gardens all empty, and I'm just like WTF is going on? Maybe the runs eventually interline with the B43 or DH back to JG, but I've never seen buses short-turned from the south at 60 Street in order to maintain an even headway.

That happens every day with the B1. They have all these short turns to Ocean Pkwy, Stillwell Ave, and 13th ave (why is this a short turn?!)

 

Around 4-6pm, try catching a B1 towards Manhattan Beach from these stops 86th-5th ave to 86th-12th ave. These stops get flagged because theres always a big gapp in service, and they fill up at 4th ave and run until someone pulls the stop cord.

 

 

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[Via Garibaldi 8]

Yeah those extra list guys, you can have a newbie in the middle of rush hour not knowing what he's doing. My thing with learning on your own, I agree 100% you should want to learn all the routes in your depot, just in case you're assigned something. But I know a lot of B/Os don't have cars so they cant drive around, which is why they should be assisted for like a week until they learn everything.

The X12 driver that was just ignorant, his excuse would be "I thought my paddle said X42". I hope people reported him, too many drivers playing around, now those X12 riders probably had to take the train, to the ferry, to the bus, SMH.

I actually didn't know you could call depots and complain about service on the spot. I thought everything was through the MTA site.

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Technically no, and at most depots you can't, as you'll just get a general greeting and no one will pick up (i.e. Spring Creek), but some may be small enough where you can call and get a dispatcher on the line. Some are cool about it and some will tell you to call the , but it wasn't that long ago that people would call the depots regularly to find out where a bus was, etc. They often times can call the B/O to see what's going on. I once had a BxM1 break down at the first stop. We're all along Henry Hudson Parkway tracking the bus on BusTime. Had I not called the depot, I wouldn't have known​, and I also found out that they weren't sending a replacement, so four of us took a cab together to the Upper East Side and split the fare and I guess the other people did their thing or took the BxM2. Worked out pretty well since I still made my connection to the BxM4. They obviously don't have anything showing when a bus breaks down (they should). Edited June 24, 2017 by Via Garibaldi 8

[checkmatechamp13]

One thing I hate is how some dispatchers are not aware of some (notable) ridership patterns, and then mess up the scheduling. i don't expect the dispatcher to know every single route and ridership patterns, but should be aware of ridership patterns of routes within same area or same depot. 

 

I was waiting for a B16 bus on Caton & Coney Island Avenue a while. On bustime, two buses come down, each with the Bay Ridge sign. I was so glad because I have been getting very agitated (and then I see all the buses sent up to Lefferts Gardens without short-turning them). However, one of them gets ahead of the other, and the one behind lags. I thought nothing of it, until the B/O arrives with the sign set to "60 ST". Now, I wasn't too pleased for three reasons:

 

1. Ridership north of 60 Street is light compared to south (the section between the and the second it turns off Fort Hamilton Parkway holds the route down for the most part in terms of its ridership). 

2. The bus continued going down Fort Hamilton Parkway, not in service, past 60 St 

3. I had to get to 86 Street & 4 Avenue

 

Either way, the second bus takes forever to get to Coney Island Avenue, but eventually passes the first one. Since this was during the rush hour, there's more ridership on that section in Lefferts Gardens/Flatbush/Kensington, but still, more people got south of 60 Street, and it was doing the work of 2 buses. I see three B16s going to Lefferts Gardens all empty, and I'm just like WTF is going on? Maybe the runs eventually interline with the B43 or DH back to JG, but I've never seen buses short-turned from the south at 60 Street in order to maintain an even headway.

 

So let me get this straight: You were tracking the bus on BusTime, and eventually see two Bay Ridge-bound buses heading your way, but the first one to show up actually was signed as heading to 60th Street (in which case, BusTime should've made that distinction, unless that decision was made at the last minute)? So I guess that explains how it got ahead (since people heading south of 60th just waved it off). 

 

I do agree that buses should be short-turned according to ridership patterns.

 

Yeah those extra list guys, you can have a newbie in the middle of rush hour not knowing what he's doing. My thing with learning on your own, I agree 100% you should want to learn all the routes in your depot, just in case you're assigned something. But I know a lot of B/Os don't have cars so they cant drive around, which is why they should be assisted for like a week until they learn everything.

 

The X12 driver that was just ignorant, his excuse would be "I thought my paddle said X42". I hope people reported him, too many drivers playing around, now those X12 riders probably had to take the train, to the ferry, to the bus, SMH.

 

Well, some of those X12 riders could've done something with the X10 (X10 to the S48, X10 to the S57, or just walk from the X10), but I agree that it's wrong for them to have to resort to that just because of the B/O's laziness (also, the extra time that it took for them to realize that the bus skipped their stop). Also, it's not fair for the X10 B/Os and passengers to have to deal with extra riders that should've been on a different bus.

 

I doubt a newbie would understand how the timetables and interlines work. Another thing with the MTA, the information they give them (the B/Os) with stops and directions sometimes do not link up with the DOTs current info. Bus stops on their sheets can say one street, but the DOT has the stop somewhere else. Same thing applies for some turns, if a bus has been rerouted a few years ago until now, 8/10 times the depot has the routing from like 10 years ago. (This was the case with a Castleton Route).

 

That happens every day with the B1. They have all these short turns to Ocean Pkwy, Stillwell Ave, and 13th ave (why is this a short turn?!)

 

Around 4-6pm, try catching a B1 towards Manhattan Beach from these stops 86th-5th ave to 86th-12th ave. These stops get flagged because theres always a big gapp in service, and they fill up at 4th ave and run until someone pulls the stop cord.

 

Ocean Parkway is for the KCC students, and Stillwell Avenue is for buses going back to Ulmer Park. 13th Avenue I assume is a holdover from the days when the B1 ran up to Bay Ridge Avenue and the B64 ran to 86th & 4th (so they figured passengers could at least get to their B64 connection). But maybe the solution is to just rewrite the schedules so you have a few more trips that run 4th Avenue-25th Avenue (as opposed to the 25th Avenue short-turns all coming from KCC). Of course, this would have to be done in a way that doesn't screw over KCC students.