Overnight NYCT/MTA Bus service

[S78 via Hylan]

You also forgot the M14A. It runs to West 18 street to alternate with the M14D.

[checkmatechamp13]

I've been meaning to do this for a long time, but here's the list of routes that currently run over night:

Bronx

Bx6-As far west as Amsterdam Av-Of course Yes.

Bx9-Yes-Headways should be decreased to every 30-40 minutes.

Bx10-Yes

Bx12-Yes. Headways should be decreased to every 20-30 minutes.

Bx15-Yes. All trips overnight should run the full route between Harlem(12th Ave/125th) & Fordham every 20-30 minutes..

Bx19-As far west as Broadway-Yes.

Bx21-I have only been on this route a few times but yes.

Bx28-As far west as 205 St -Yes-Should have 30-minute headways.

Bx35-Not Sure as I riden it couple of times.

Bx36-Yes.

Bx40-Yes-Tremont Ave is one of the most important streets in Bronx. Thus a 24/7 bus line is needed.

Bx41-Yes. Should have 30-minute headways overnights.

 

Added to list for overnight service. Either BXM7 or BX23(only '1' service) for added service in Coop. Also the BX1.

 

Brooklyn

B1-Yes of Course. One of the busier routes in SW Brooklyn. Should have 30 minute headways overnights.

B3-Yes.

B6-Yes-Should have 30-minute headways.

B8-from 95 St to Brookdale Hospital-Yes.

B12-Yes.B14-Yes.B15-Yes.

B17-Yes.

B25- "No." If any needed cuts overnight service on this route needs to go. Not saying I want an end to owl (B25) but making a point. The and (B26) are alternative routes.B26

B35-Of Course Yes. It only all night bus line in parts of Coney Island, Brighton and Sheapshead Bay.

B36- Yes.

B38-Catalpa Av Branch-Yes.

B41-Yes-It could be argued that the B41, B44 and B46 should all have 30-40 minute headways overnights. However if any further cuts are needed, I would consider ending Bergen Beach service.

B42-Yes

B43-Not sure. It in the same category as the (B25). If any needed or doomsday II cuts occured, Overnight

B43 needs to go. Alternatives would be the train (B44) and (B62).

B44-Yes. Yes-It could be argued that the B41, B44 and B46 should all have 30-40 minute headways overnights.

B46-Yes.

B47-Yes.

B48-"No."The Franklin Ave shuttle, "B62" and (B44) are nearby..

B52-Yes..

B54-Yes

B60-Yes

B61-Yes. Only 24/7 bus route in most of the Red Hook/Carrol Gardens area.

B62-Yes. Also sometimes a speedy alternative to the train especially during G/O's..

B63-Yes. It could be argued that overnight headways should be 30 minutes since the is running only as a shuttle.

B68-Yes.

B82-Yes.

 

 

Brooklyn buses that should be added for hourly overnight service IMO. B45 B49 and B83.

 

Rest of my replies later.

 

The B45 had overnight service before June 2010. The B49 I disagree with, since the B44 and B68 are within walking distance. The B83 I agree with.

 

Also, the B36 is the one that serves Coney Island and Sheepshead Bay, not the B35.

 

For the ones where you mentioned decreasing the headways, you have to take into account the layover periods, which may be made too long if a certain headway is given (for example, the Bx12's layover period is perfect for 40 minute headways, so you shouldn't lower the headways to 30 minutes. You should either keep the headways at 40 minutes or lower them to 20 minutes)

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The B49 I disagree with, since the B44 and B68 are within walking distance.

 

 

Within walking distance??? I beg to differ. That is a decent little walk. I used to walk from Sheepshead Bay High School to my friend's house on Avenue X and E 16th St.

[checkmatechamp13]

Within walking distance??? I beg to differ. That is a decent little walk. I used to walk from Sheepshead Bay High School to my friend's house on Avenue X and E 16th St.

 

When I lived in Brighton Beach, the rule of thumb was 20 blocks equals a mile, so from where I lived, near Brighton 13th Street (which, for these purposes could be called East 13th Street) to West 8th Street was roughly a mile (13 + 8 = 21)

 

Ocean Avenue is the equivalent of East 20th Street, so walking to Coney Island Avenue is 10 blocks west (East 10th Street), and walking to Nostrand Avenue is 10 blocks east (East 30th Street). 10 blocks isn't that far to walk when you consider the fact that it is at night, so service is going to be more spread out.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

When I lived in Brighton Beach, the rule of thumb was 20 blocks equals a mile, so from where I lived, near Brighton 13th Street (which, for these purposes could be called East 13th Street) to West 8th Street was roughly a mile (13 + 8 = 21)

 

Ocean Avenue is the equivalent of East 20th Street, so walking to Coney Island Avenue is 10 blocks west (East 10th Street), and walking to Nostrand Avenue is 10 blocks east (East 30th Street). 10 blocks isn't that far to walk when you consider the fact that it is at night, so service is going to be more spread out.

 

Well yes of course it would be more spread out because you would slash all of it. B) LOL

[checkmatechamp13]

Well yes of course it would be more spread out because you would slash all of it. LOL

 

Of course I would. B)

 

Seriously, there are some points to consider:

 

1) The B49 already doesn't run at night (though there is only a 2-3 hour gap in service)

 

2) There are a whole bunch of lines that run frequently during the day, but stop running at midnight or 1AM.

[Shortline Bus]

When I lived in Brighton Beach, the rule of thumb was 20 blocks equals a mile, so from where I lived, near Brighton 13th Street (which, for these purposes could be called East 13th Street) to West 8th Street was roughly a mile (13 + 8 = 21)

 

Ocean Avenue is the equivalent of East 20th Street, so walking to Coney Island Avenue is 10 blocks west (East 10th Street), and walking to Nostrand Avenue is 10 blocks east (East 30th Street). 10 blocks isn't that far to walk when you consider the fact that it is at night, so service is going to be more spread out.

 

 

The (B49) already runs 22.5 hours a day from about 4am-2am daily. I suggested hourly overnight service since it runs that late into the night anyhow.

[checkmatechamp13]

True, but is service on the B49 even really needed that late at night? Most routes with comparable ridership (and alternatives within similar walking distance) run hours like 5AM-1AM.

[Shortline Bus]

Another route I wonder that even needs 24/7 service is the (B52). When you already have the (B38) (B26) and (B54) as nearby service between Downtown Brooklyn and Ridgewood.

[checkmatechamp13]

Another route I wonder that even needs 24/7 service is the (B52). When you already have the (B38) (B26) and (B54) as nearby service between Downtown Brooklyn and Ridgewood.

 

Good point. The ridership is over the 45 rider threshold, but there are a decent number of alternatives in the area.

[Forest Glen]

Another route I wonder that even needs 24/7 service is the (B52). When you already have the (B38) (B26) and (B54) as nearby service between Downtown Brooklyn and Ridgewood.

 

The (B26) is probably the least busiest out of the aforementioned routes.

[Q43LTD]

The B45 had overnight service before June 2010. The B49 I disagree with, since the B44 and B68 are within walking distance. The B83 I agree with.

 

Also, the B36 is the one that serves Coney Island and Sheepshead Bay, not the B35.

 

For the ones where you mentioned decreasing the headways, you have to take into account the layover periods, which may be made too long if a certain headway is given (for example, the Bx12's layover period is perfect for 40 minute headways, so you shouldn't lower the headways to 30 minutes. You should either keep the headways at 40 minutes or lower them to 20 minutes)

Not to nitpick, I listed the routes that currently have overnight service. Shortline Bus offered his opinions on who should/shouldn't have overnight service. Hence the replies in red are his

[GreatOne2k]

Bx39 also runs overnight between 241 St and Gun Hill Rd. Those runs need to be extended to Clason Point.

[cotb16]

Bx39 also runs overnight between 241 St and Gun Hill Rd. Those runs need to be extended to Clason Point.

 

I wouldn't be surprised that in the near future, the Bx39 would only run between Pelham Parkway and Clason's Point during late nights (and eventually to all hours) to encourage riders to transfer to the for upper WPR service.

[Q43LTD]

There we go again, the playing the duplicative card

[checkmatechamp13]

Not to nitpick, I listed the routes that currently have overnight service. Shortline Bus offered his opinions on who should/shouldn't have overnight service. Hence the replies in red are his

 

You're right. I should've changed it to say "Shortline Bus"

 

I wouldn't be surprised that in the near future, the Bx39 would only run between Pelham Parkway and Clason's Point during late nights (and eventually to all hours) to encourage riders to transfer to the for upper WPR service.

 

Makes sense.

 

There we go again, the playing the duplicative card

 

The MTA isn't suggesting it, but it still makes sense. It is better to run the service in an area with no alternatives than to run it in an area with an alternative.

[Q43LTD]

The MTA isn't suggesting it, but it still makes sense. It is better to run the service in an area with no alternatives than to run it in an area with an alternative.

Hopefully, they're not, but if this were to happen, what would be the fate of the BxM11?

[checkmatechamp13]

Hopefully, they're not, but if this were to happen, what would be the fate of the BxM11?

 

Generally, when that happens, it is between 2 services that are similar in price and quality. The Bx39 has a similar fare and quality of service as the , but the BxM11 has a higher fare and better quality than the .

 

If you want to make that case for the BxM11, you could pretty much make that case for most express routes, that there is technically an alternative route for most riders. Of course, like I said, they serve different markets with a higher price and quality of service.

[Shortline Bus]

Replies in red. Now for the rest of the city.

 

 

 

Manhattan

M2-Yes

M7-YesM14D-yes

M15-Of Course to one of America's busiest local bus lines..

M23-YesM42-YesM60-Yes.

M79-If any further cuts are needed then probably 'no.' I would use normal 40-foot size buses overnights for this & the "M23."

M86-Of course. It could argued headways should be every 20-30 minutes instead of current 40-minute owl period.

M96-Yes.

M101-Yes

M102-No. I think this line should have had overnight service cut. Having the (3)train and the M7 and this route run 24/7 along Lenox is too much service overnights.

M103-Yes

M104-Yes.

Nassau

N4-On the fence. If any further cuts are needed, then owl service on the N4 needs to go..

N6-No doubt yes.

 

 

 

Queens

Q1-to Jamaica via Queens Village LIRR-Yes..

Q2-Yes

Q3-Yes

Q4-Yes.

Q5-to Rosedale LIRR-Yes. I would actually extend to Green Acres 24/7.

Q6-Yes.

Q10-Of Course to one of NYC's busiest bus routes.

Q11-as far south as Pitkin-I would do a radical idea and run the (Q53) as a local overnights between Rockaway Park and Woodhaven/QB station instead.

Q12-Yes. I would consider extending it to Great Neck LIRR station overnights when the N20/21 are not running..

Q17-YesQ24-Yes.

Q25-Yes.

Q27-to Springfield/Horace Harding. Yes.It could argued the Q27 should have 30-minute headways overnights.

Q28-Yes.

Q33-yes. This line should have 30-minute headways overnights as well.

Q35-Yes

Q36-Yes.

Q39-Yes. Only 24/7 route in sections of Glendale, Maspeth, Middle Village and Ridgewood.

Q40

Q43-Yes.

Q44-Of Course Yes.

Q46-Yes. Maybe the headways here owl time should be 30-40 minutes instead.

Q54-Yes.

Q55-Yes.

Q56-Really No. If a few lines stations along Jamaica Ave could become ADA i.e 121, Woodhaven and Forest Parkway the need for overnight (Q56) is no longer needed.

Q58-Yes

Q59-Yes. I was suprised that this line did not have 24/7 service until 2-3 years ago. No doubt the population boom in Bushwick/Williamsburg played a huge role.

Q60-Yes.

Q65-Not sure since the Q25 is nearby..

Q66-Yes

Q83-to Queens Village LIRR-Yes.

Q85-to Rosedale-Yes

Q100-Yes

Q101-Yes

Q110-Why? The "N6" is nearby. I would consider extending the N6 overnights only to the Jamaica Center complex for access to the and . There also 24/7 bus service on nearby Archer and Hillside Ave as well.

Q111=Yes.

Q113-Yes. It amazing that this line only added owl service a few years back. This is the only 24/7 bus line in Far Rockaway area.

 

SI to be commented on later.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Replies in red. Now for the rest of the city.

 

 

 

Manhattan

M2-Yes

M7-YesM14D-yes

M15-Of Course to one of America's busiest local bus lines..

M23-YesM42-YesM60-Yes.

M79-If any further cuts are needed then probably 'no.' I would use normal 40-foot size buses overnights for this & the "M23."

M86-Of course. It could argued headways should be every 20-30 minutes instead of current 40-minute owl period.

M96-Yes.

M101-Yes

M102-No. I think this line should have had overnight service cut. Having the (3)train and the M7 and this route run 24/7 along Lenox is too much service overnights.

M103-Yes

M104-Yes.

Nassau

N4-On the fence. If any further cuts are needed, then owl service on the N4 needs to go..

N6-No doubt yes.

 

 

 

Queens

Q1-to Jamaica via Queens Village LIRR-Yes..

Q2-Yes

Q3-Yes

Q4-Yes.

Q5-to Rosedale LIRR-Yes. I would actually extend to Green Acres 24/7.

Q6-Yes.

Q10-Of Course to one of NYC's busiest bus routes.

Q11-as far south as Pitkin-I would do a radical idea and run the (Q53) as a local overnights between Rockaway Park and Woodhaven/QB station instead.

Q12-Yes. I would consider extending it to Great Neck LIRR station overnights when the N20/21 are not running..

Q17-YesQ24-Yes.

Q25-Yes.

Q27-to Springfield/Horace Harding. Yes.It could argued the Q27 should have 30-minute headways overnights.

Q28-Yes.

Q33-yes. This line should have 30-minute headways overnights as well.

Q35-Yes

Q36-Yes.

Q39-Yes. Only 24/7 route in sections of Glendale, Maspeth, Middle Village and Ridgewood.

Q40

Q43-Yes.

Q44-Of Course Yes.

Q46-Yes. Maybe the headways here owl time should be 30-40 minutes instead.

Q54-Yes.

Q55-Yes.

Q56-Really No. If a few lines stations along Jamaica Ave could become ADA i.e 121, Woodhaven and Forest Parkway the need for overnight (Q56) is no longer needed.

Q58-Yes

Q59-Yes. I was suprised that this line did not have 24/7 service until 2-3 years ago. No doubt the population boom in Bushwick/Williamsburg played a huge role.

Q60-Yes.

Q65-Not sure since the Q25 is nearby..

Q66-Yes

Q83-to Queens Village LIRR-Yes.

Q85-to Rosedale-Yes

Q100-Yes

Q101-Yes

Q110-Why? The "N6" is nearby. I would consider extending the N6 overnights only to the Jamaica Center complex for access to the and . There also 24/7 bus service on nearby Archer and Hillside Ave as well.

Q111=Yes.

Q113-Yes. It amazing that this line only added owl service a few years back. This is the only 24/7 bus line in Far Rockaway area.

 

SI to be commented on later.

 

 

I disagree about cutting bus lines overnight because subways are available. Those who are disabled or concerned for their safety generally rely on the bus, so I would be opposed to that. Now if there is another bus that can be used as an alternative then that's fine.

[checkmatechamp13]

 

 

 

 

I disagree about cutting bus lines overnight because subways are available. Those who are disabled or concerned for their safety generally rely on the bus, so I would be opposed to that. Now if there is another bus that can be used as an alternative then that's fine.

 

But how many disabled people realistically travel at that hour? If it is an emergency, they aren't going to be sitting around waiting for a bus, and otherwise, most elderly people are home at 3AM.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

But how many disabled people realistically travel at that hour? If it is an emergency, they aren't going to be sitting around waiting for a bus, and otherwise, most elderly people are home at 3AM.

 

Boy you really do like to exclude/ignore part of my comments don't you??

[checkmatechamp13]

What part did I ignore?

[Via Garibaldi 8]

What part did I ignore?

 

I was making a general statement, not just referring to disabled people. Some folks do not like riding the subways at night, especially women, and if you notice, women tend to make up most of the folks riding on the bus in most cases. Providing service can't just be based on service, but must also take other factors into account like safety and so forth.

[checkmatechamp13]

I was making a general statement, not just referring to disabled people. Some folks do not like riding the subways at night, especially women, and if you notice, women tend to make up most of the folks riding on the bus in most cases. Providing service can't just be based on service, but most also take other factors into place like safety and so forth.

 

You have a point there. The thing is that the subway runs more frequently than the buses (every 20 minutes vs. every 60 minutes), and the subways generally have more people on them. I would think the subway would be safer, but I guess everybody has their own preferences.

 

There really aren't that many bus lines left that parallel the subway that aren't fairly well-used at night. There are only a few such as the B25 that don't carry that many riders.