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Petition started to restore lost bus service in Mid and Southern Brooklyn


Via Garibaldi 8

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Youre right. Run the B100 at night, since the two lines run a block from each other until Flatbush Avenue. There you have your viable alternative.

 

Yeah, or stop the B100 and extend the B2 to Mill Basin.

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With the B31 however, there is nothing, someone really needs the B31, they are sh*t out of luck.

 

Unfortunately that's the way it works sometimes. The B31 used to see hardly any ridership at all over night. 10 people don't really justify a run.

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Unfortunately that's the way it works sometimes. The B31 used to see hardly any ridership at all over night. 10 people don't really justify a run.

 

Yes, it is a slippery slope but a dangerous one IMO. There is nothing stopping them from slashing further.

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After writing to several representatives last month about the loss of local and express bus service across the city, I finally heard back from one of them. Senator Golden's office wrote to me this morning about the petition that has been started to fully restore weekend service to the X27 and X28.

 

Restoration of lost service to the B2 and B31 is currently being looked into as well. I wrote back to the Director of Community Affairs who works in Senator Golden's office, inquiring about the need to fully restore the lost B4 service as well, which has had a severe impact on the economy of Sheepshead Bay IMO and has forced me to significantly change my travel patterns when visiting friends back in my old neighbourhood or running my normal errands that I do down there. I know I certainly do not spend as much money down there as I used to because of the lack of bus service in the area. Before the cuts, I would run my errands and then go and relax at a restaurant somewhere and have drinks or whatever, but now I just run my errands and jump back on the BM3. If we can successfully restore some of this lost service to Mid and Southern Brooklyn, I will then push to have other service restored as well, but for now my focus has been on the X27, X28, B2, B4 and B31.

 

In the meantime, she sent me a petition to sign for the X27 and X28. If anyone is interested in signing it, please feel free to PM me. Thanks. :cool:

 

The B2 is less than a 5 minute walk from the B100, so it is unnecessary to restore it on weekends (though a slight increase in the headways of the B100 would be nice, since Sunday service on the B100 is much less than the Sunday service the B2 used to have)

 

Not to beat a dead horse but in case of compromise for restoring here what should happen since I used to live in SW Brooklyn.

 

1)Restore Saturday service on the X27/28 running every hour appx. 7am-11pm.

 

2)B31 does not need overnight service IMO. The (B31) was a ghost town on runs between 1-5am even with 30-60 minute headways. With gas prices going up the (MTA)can't afford to cut back on buses with *zero* ridership.

 

3)restore full time 7-day (B2) including weekends. Weekdays the (B2) should run 530am-1am. Saturdays 6am-Midnight and Sundays 8am-11pm.

 

4)Maybe the most dumb service cut of the doomsday June 2010 service was with the (B4). As I said before the B4 should run at all times between Narrows/78th in Bay Ridge and the Sheapshead Bay station. Extend it to Knapp Street Weekdays-Saturdays until Midnight and Sunday Nights until about 10pm.

 

Just my takes.

 

The B31 ran every 40 minutes at night.

 

See the B2 comment above.

 

I agree with the B4 comment.

 

Just to be clear, the goal of X27/X28 riders is to restore full weekend service to what we had before the cuts. I don't know if 30 minute headways are necessary, but I do think that Saturday and Sunday service is needed for both lines, so this petition is for nothing less than that.

 

As far the B31 goes, the (MTA) has provided NO alternative for over night service, and there is nothing serving Gerritsen Beach over night. They wouldn't even consider re-routing the B3. You cannot leave a community with no transportation at all in the entire neighbourhood. I can personally vouch for how long of a walk it is for folks in Gerritsen Beach with no B31 service, as I have friends who live near Lois Ave, which is at the end of Gerritsen Beach.

 

The B2 should also be fully restored. IMO, Mid and Southern Brooklyn are always short ended when it comes to public transportation as it is and transportation is generally more spread out in those areas, so I have to disagree with you on most fronts. These local buses serve folks who don't have any subway service within walking distance, nor any other real alternatives and nothing less than headways of 30 minutes should be restored. If the (MTA) has money to waste on real estate deals, etc. then they can find the money to restore service to communities that have no other alternatives. That is what their primary function is supposed to be and if they need to make cuts, make it in the overbloated staff that they have, not on the backs of communities that need the service. Cuts to service should always be the last thing on the table.

 

Riders in northern Gerritsen Beach have the B3, and there simply weren't enough riders along Gerritsen Avenue to justify running the service.

 

You can call it stubborn if you like, but the restoration of service would benefit me personally. Not only that, but this issue with the (MTA) goes further than that for me. They've always got money to burn on wasteful projects, but when it comes to providing service to the more suburban parts of the city they're quick to cut the service. To be honest with you, my goal is also to push for Sunday service for the BM1 and BM3 and BM4 as well with Mr. Golden, since he represents those areas of South Brooklyn too, so don't be surprised if there is a ruckus started for that either. However, Rome wasn't built in a day, so I'm going little by little and focusing on the most pressing issues one at a time. As much as you may disagree with the full restoration of the X27 and X28, the fact of the matter is it has a chance to be pushed through mainly because of folks like me and the residents in those areas who are determined to get it back. :tup:

 

I too believe that the X17 should run on Sundays and it should be extended to run past 20:30 on Saturday evenings.

 

Just because the service would benefit you doesn't mean that it is worth saving. Remember: The rest of us pay taxes too.

 

LOL... Yeah, well it would be one of the FEW times that suburban areas in the city were actually given an abundance of service by the (MTA). I don't see anyone complaining about the abundance in staff though. That's rarely seen as a problem. Let's instead attack the suburban communities and rob them of their basic transportation services, instead of cutting the fat of the high ups. As for the X29, I think the BM3 serves as a sufficent alternative. If anything it could be extended to the former X29 terminus via Neptune Avenue.

 

 

 

You're right, there's always alternatives. The problem is that the (MTA) provides none. LOL

 

No community was really robbed of "basic" transportation services: Every community still has a bus (and not every bus needs to be 24/7)

 

The B64 flip flop was completely ridiculous and yes, it should be restored fully. :tup: Like I said, I'm doing a little at a time, so we have to wait and see how this X27/X28 thing goes first as that has some steam behind it. The B2 and B31 restoration is just talk.

 

Truncating the B64 was ridiculous, but flip-flopping the B1 and B64 actually made sense.

 

Because there are no nearby alternatives. I think the B2 does have the B100 nearby, but I don't how long that runs. With the B31 however, there is nothing, if someone really needs the B31, they are sh*t out of luck.

 

B2 riders also have the B82 on Kings Highway.

 

Why not just re-route it (the B37) north of Bay Ridge Avenue to an area where it would be used more?

 

That was what they did when they rerouted the B70: It goes to 8th Avenue rather than traveling under the BQE.

 

You can argue low ridership overnight for many local bus lines, but the question is do you slash all of them and leave communities with no alternatives in a city where people are dependent overall on public transportation?? I personally don't think so. Now I had said that B9 didn't warrant overnight service, but I think there are other alternatives nearby like the B6 and such. I guess I question how much should be cut and where does it stop. People do have to get around. We also can't forget that people do work at night and I'm sure that some of the eliminated overnight service has caused hardship for many riders in general. I think that in order to justify eliminating service, reasonable alternatives should be given.

 

 

 

 

This is exactly my gripe with the (MTA). Their attitude seems to be that more affluent middle class areas like Gerritsen Beach can afford to lose service because folks can afford a cab, even if that cab is causing families economic hardship. It is economic politics at its finest and that is why I am pushing to get service restored in areas such as Gerritsen Beach and Sheepshead Bay. The (MTA) can't tell folks what they can't and cannot afford just because of where they live. They shouldn't be making cuts based on that, but that seems to be the case. Meanwhile, folks like me who have an unlimited Metrocard are being forced to not be able to go certain places because there is no service to those areas. Of course I can afford car service, but why should I have to pay for car service when there is public transportation that goes to these places? In sum I am paying more for less.

 

If a community (not a particular person) is dependant on public transportation, then by definition, they will use the public transportation in their area at all times.

 

And they aren't cutting the service based solely on people being able to afford cabs: They are cutting it based on which routes fall below a threshold of 45 riders per night.

 

Yeah, or stop the B100 and extend the B2 to Mill Basin.

 

What difference does it make? They're one block apart until Flatbush Avenue anyway.

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The B2 is less than a 5 minute walk from the B100, so it is unnecessary to restore it on weekends (though a slight increase in the headways of the B100 would be nice, since Sunday service on the B100 is much less than the Sunday service the B2 used to have)

 

 

 

The B31 ran every 40 minutes at night.

 

See the B2 comment above.

 

I agree with the B4 comment.

 

 

 

Riders in northern Gerritsen Beach have the B3, and there simply weren't enough riders along Gerritsen Avenue to justify running the service.

 

 

 

Just because the service would benefit you doesn't mean that it is worth saving. Remember: The rest of us pay taxes too.

 

 

 

No community was really robbed of "basic" transportation services: Every community still has a bus (and not every bus needs to be 24/7)

 

 

 

Truncating the B64 was ridiculous, but flip-flopping the B1 and B64 actually made sense.

 

 

 

B2 riders also have the B82 on Kings Highway.

 

 

 

That was what they did when they rerouted the B70: It goes to 8th Avenue rather than traveling under the BQE.

 

 

 

If a community (not a particular person) is dependant on public transportation, then by definition, they will use the public transportation in their area at all times.

 

And they aren't cutting the service based solely on people being able to afford cabs: They are cutting it based on which routes fall below a threshold of 45 riders per night.

 

 

 

What difference does it make? They're one block apart until Flatbush Avenue anyway.

 

You just said yourself that the B2 ran more frequently than the B100 on Sundays so that already makes a difference. Aside from that, the B82 is less of an alternative seeing where the B2 and B82 go.

 

 

With regards to the cutting service comment, I'm sure they are and that's exactly why eliminating the B4 from Sheepshead Bay (another relatively affluent middle class area) was justified too right? :(

 

 

I'm dependent on the service that I use too and just because I don't use it 24/7 doesn't mean that it should be cut. The same thing goes for Bay Ridge, Dyker Heights, Bath Beach and Bensonhurst riders. Why don't we cut service on Richmond Avenue since it isn't that well utilized? I mean it's ridiculous. I have once to hear to hear you complain about the overhead at the (MTA) but you constantly advocate for service to be axed for the very people that need it. At the rate the (MTA) is going maybe they should just let someone else come in and run things since they seem to have forgotten that the majority of New Yorkers need public transportation to get around. Meanwhile there is rampid waste at the (MTA) that very few folks speak of except for folks like BrooklynBus and a few others.

 

And how can flip flopping the B1 and B64 make sense when both now serve fewer communities in Southern Brooklyn?? :confused:

 

 

Regarding the B70, yes I know that, but that still has nothing to do with re-routing the B37 north of Bay Ridge Avenue to get more ridership if it were restored.

 

Regarding Gerritsen Beach, yeah, nice try, but the entire community of Gerritsen Beach still has no overnight service and no alternatives to boot.

 

Try telling folks that used the B4 that they weren't robbed of their service. And for that matter we can discuss the B23 as well. It is very easy for you to make a comment like that when you have 4 local bus lines in your neck of the woods.

 

Oh and while we're the topic of taxes, it's funny how the more affluent middle class areas, which probably pull more load in terms of taxes, get less service. In sum, taxation without representation, so yeah, we pay taxes too, probably more than some areas that still have their service with similar ridership. Very interesting, no? :( A perfect example would be West Brighton vs Mariners Harbor. I'm sure that we have higher incomes overall in West Brighton and pay far more in taxes (excluding those projects which are supposedly a part of West Brighton :(), yet Mariners Harbor keeps their X12 and X30, yet we lose our X16.

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The B64 wasn't really needed south of Harway since the B82 is a block over on Cropsey Av

 

During my very brief stay in Gerritsen Beach, I found out that you can walk to where you needed to go at nights before the bus even came. Besides, there was next to no one on the bus which made it more pointless (probably more roaches than people lol)

 

The X29 isn't needed at all. The (F) to Church Av (now that it has elevators) to the B68 works fine

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The B64 wasn't really needed south of Harway wasn't really needed since the B82 is a block over on Cropsey Av

 

During my very brief stay in Gerritsen Beach, I found out that you can walk to where you needed to go at nights before the bus even came. Besides, there was next to no one on the bus which made it more pointless (probably more roaches than people lol)

 

The X29 isn't needed at all. The (F) to Church Av (now that it has elevators) to the B68 works fine

 

Yeah, that's the key thing... Very brief stay. I would say that too, but living somewhere and having to commute like that everyday is far different than a short bus fanning trip.

 

I also disagree about the whole elevators comment. You make it sound as if the elevators are kept in fine shape. Most of the time the elevators and escalators are broken.

 

I also disagree with your B82 comment. Just about everyone on here has agreed that the B64 cut back was ridiculous. If you lived in that area you would understand better why the B64 is needed.

 

In sum, I am very reluctant to call for cuts when an agency like the (MTA) is so inefficient with the services that they do provide.

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Yeah, that's they key thing... Very brief stay. I would say that too, but living somewhere and having to commute like that everyday is far different than a short bus fanning trip.

 

I lived on Gerritsen Av for about 3 months. After about 1 a.m, you would be better off walking...or taking a cab

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Just to be clear, the goal of X27/X28 riders is to restore full weekend service to what we had before the cuts. I don't know if 30 minute headways are necessary, but I do think that Saturday and Sunday service is needed for both lines....

 

 

"Needed" by whom? The people who didn't ride it but still want it there "just in case" they feel like riding at some point in the future?

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"Needed" by whom? The people who didn't ride it but still want it there "just in case" they feel like riding at some point in the future?

 

By the entire communities who used the X27 and X28. That would include me as well since I did use both of them on the weekends. I know I know, we don't need our service, but we're still going to fight to get it back just because we like having service that we don't use for the hell of it. Everyone has to do what is in their best interests and that is what we are doing here. The (MTA) thinks they are so slick. They were just looking for any reason to axe the service to begin with and the recession just gave them an excuse, but that smokescreen isn't going to fly with us.

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The B64 wasn't really needed south of Harway since the B82 is a block over on Cropsey Av

 

During my very brief stay in Gerritsen Beach, I found out that you can walk to where you needed to go at nights before the bus even came. Besides, there was next to no one on the bus which made it more pointless (probably more roaches than people lol)

 

The X29 isn't needed at all. The (F) to Church Av (now that it has elevators) to the B68 works fine

 

 

All i can say is someone who used to live for majority of my life in SW Brooklyn, where B64 to Stillwell was canned, please if you have a weekend to busfan in that area. Then come back and tell us if the (MTA) really needed to cut that service?

Dare I start with students to John Dewey High school? Or those from Bensonhurst/Bath Ave and Coney Island, traveling to points *west* of Bay Parkway?*

 

If anything in worst case scnerio only overnight B64(it was an 24/7 route prior to June '10)should been cut.

 

Hey Garbaldi add in requesting the (B64) running to Coney Island as well?

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All i can say is someone who used to live for majority of my life in SW Brooklyn, where B64 to Stillwell was canned, please if you have a weekend to busfan in that area. Then come back and tell us if the (MTA) really needed to cut that service?

Dare I start with students to John Dewey High school? Or those from Bensonhurst/Bath Ave and Coney Island, traveling to points *west* of Bay Parkway?*

 

If anything in worst case scnerio only overnight B64(it was an 24/7 route prior to June '10)should been cut.

 

Hey Garbaldi add in requesting the (B64) running to Coney Island as well?

 

lol... One thing at a time guy. I stated earlier that I thought the B64 should be fully restored to Coney Island.

 

That just shows how hard South Brooklyn was hit. Cut back the B64, cut back the B4, cuts on the B2 and B31, elimination of the B37, weekend service slashed on the X27 and X28, a re-route of the B1, and a cut back on the frequencies of the B36 to boot. Oh yeah and a cut back on service on the BM1 and BM3 on Saturdays. :mad:

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All i can say is someone who used to live for majority of my life in SW Brooklyn, where B64 to Stillwell was canned, please if you have a weekend to busfan in that area. Then come back and tell us if the (MTA) really needed to cut that service?

Dare I start with students to John Dewey High school? Or those from Bensonhurst/Bath Ave and Coney Island, traveling to points *west* of Bay Parkway?*

 

If anything in worst case scnerio only overnight B64(it was an 24/7 route prior to June '10)should been cut.

 

Hey Garbaldi add in requesting the (B64) running to Coney Island as well?

 

I'm in that area at least once a week. Dewey High School is right by the (D) at Bay 50 St so that's not a problem right there. As for the other part, the B82 is right there on Cropsey Av, as I said earlier. Plus the B64 & B82 meet right there on Bath Av & Bay Pkwy

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None of these petitions ever work out for the better, so I wouldn't waste my time....

 

As far as the commentary in this thread so far, I wouldn't go crazy restoring overnight service on routes where virtually (or literally) no one rode them during those hours....

 

the x27 & x28 riders, they're gonna complain regardless... I'm sure they don't need my signature/e-signature to get something accomplished...

 

the B2/B31/B100 thing, I'm not gonna go into anymore.. gotten into way too many (moot) arguments over rerouting/canning/combining which-with/without-what....

 

the B37, good riddance to bad rubbish... you would have had to been a fool to actually rely on the B37, over the B63 (or the train) if you lived in down in that part of the borough.... and don't give me the elderly argument either, b/c you saw (and still see) PLENTY of them on the 63... the 70 re-route along the commercial part of 3rd av, was nothin more than a wash; it didn't better or worsen things....

 

 

The B64 wasn't really needed south of Harway since the B82 is a block over on Cropsey Av

I don't agree... for the simple fact that (the difference b/w) ridership on the (old) 64, and the B82, had nothin to do with each other (regardless of their relative proximity to each other).... You'd see more people using the B82/B68 interchangably than you'd see ppl. using the B64/82 interchangably....

 

Riders in northern Gerritsen Beach have the B3, and there simply weren't enough riders along Gerritsen Avenue to justify running the service.

What the heck is "northern Gerritsen Beach".... The area north of Gerritsen is Marine Park.

 

....and if you think Gerritsen Beach residents ever wanted (or cared for) av u service, you're mistaken....

 

Just because the service would benefit you doesn't mean that it is worth saving. Remember: The rest of us pay taxes too.

lol @ this, on both fronts :tup:

 

 

Truncating the B64 was ridiculous, but flip-flopping the B1 and B64 actually made sense.

Not for w/e reason(s) you may be thinkin of, though....

 

do you know how long the MTA wanted to create a "B86"....

 

 

B2 riders also have the B82 on Kings Highway.

...and go where with it?

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None of these petitions ever work out for the better, so I wouldn't waste my time....

The x27 & x28 riders, they're gonna complain regardless... I'm sure they don't need my signature/e-signature to get something accomplished...

 

 

And how exactly was the X37/X38 restored??? :confused: In any event, only those who use the line would have an interest in signing the petition anyway, so I wouldn't expect you to have any interest in signing it either way. I just put it out there in case anyone is interested. Believe me, there is enough interest from folks like myself and others in the communities that the X27/X28 serve that we aren't desperate for signatures. lol You and I have our own way of doing things, so while I respect your opinion, I will be proceeding accordingly.

 

What the heck is "northern Gerritsen Beach".... The area north of Gerritsen is Marine Park.

 

If anything maybe what he is referring to is the "old" and "new" parts of Gerritsen Beach. The "newer" part would be going north on Gerritsen Avenue.

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And how exactly was the X37/X38 restored??? :confused: In any event, only those who use the line would have an interest in signing the petition anyway, so I wouldn't expect you to have any interest in signing it either way. I just put it out there in case anyone is interested. Believe me, there is enough interest from folks like myself and others in the communities that the X27/X28 serve that we aren't desperate for signatures. lol You and I have our own way of doing things, so while I respect your opinion, I will be proceeding accordingly.

 

The x37 and x38 were restored because there were still problems with the x27B and x28B. In the committee meeting materials under the possible alternatives, it was stated that "NYC Transit will likely continue to spend money to address this problem". Basically, there was no way out.

 

If you can get service restored at no extra cost to the MTA (like the M50), the MTA will do it.

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The x37 and x38 were restored because there were still problems with the x27B and x28B. In the committee meeting materials under the possible alternatives, it was stated that "NYC Transit will likely continue to spend money to address this problem". Basically, there was no way out.

 

If you can get service restored at no extra cost to the MTA (like the M50), the MTA will do it.

 

Yeah, and how do you think they found out that the X27B/X28B wasn't working??? Commuters complained like crazy to their representatives, so yes petitioning does work. The (MTA) did not want to restore the service originally and only did so because of the pressure put on to do so, in addition to the threats of a lawsuit. The cost factor was an issue too, but had no one petitioned, nothing would've changed. The point is if you want things to change you have to stand up and fight for those things and you can't worry about what others think or whether they like it or not because everyone has their own needs and when it comes time for their needs to be met, you better believe that they're going to look out for themselves and their communities, and they rightfully should. Even though I don't live in Southern Brooklyn anymore, I go there frequently and still have strong ties to those communities naturally because I grew up there and all of these changes affect me.

 

As far as the M50 goes, there was a price to pay. It isn't like the full service was restored. Service was back cut from the U.N. to get that service restored.

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After writing to several representatives last month about the loss of local and express bus service across the city, I finally heard back from one of them. Senator Golden's office wrote to me this morning about the petition that has been started to fully restore weekend service to the X27 and X28.

 

Restoration of lost service to the B2 and B31 is currently being looked into as well. I wrote back to the Director of Community Affairs who works in Senator Golden's office, inquiring about the need to fully restore the lost B4 service as well, which has had a severe impact on the economy of Sheepshead Bay IMO and has forced me to significantly change my travel patterns when visiting friends back in my old neighbourhood or running my normal errands that I do down there. I know I certainly do not spend as much money down there as I used to because of the lack of bus service in the area. Before the cuts, I would run my errands and then go and relax at a restaurant somewhere and have drinks or whatever, but now I just run my errands and jump back on the BM3. If we can successfully restore some of this lost service to Mid and Southern Brooklyn, I will then push to have other service restored as well, but for now my focus has been on the X27, X28, B2, B4 and B31.

 

In the meantime, she sent me a petition to sign for the X27 and X28. If anyone is interested in signing it, please feel free to PM me. Thanks. :cool:

 

UGH try looking at the outlay of brooklyn bus routes you may find creative ways to restore service.

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UGH try looking at the outlay of brooklyn bus routes you may find creative ways to restore service.

Question: were you affected by the cuts last June?

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From Senator Golden's website:

 

"Senator Marty Golden stated [that X27/X28] weekend express bus service is a necessary means of transportation for many residents of South Brooklyn who are seniors, who are disabled, and who work weekends. Furthermore, many local residents travel to Manhattan for entertainment, recreation and to accomplish other personal business items. For our quality of life, immediate restoration is so important.”

 

Golden continued, “I helped to get weekend express buses rolling in 2002 because transportation alternatives in this community were far from adequate. One message I have repeatedly heard since we lost the weekend express bus in June is that we can not be without it. Many have brought to my attention that when express bus service is operating on a holiday or weekend schedule on a week day, there is no express bus service, because we don't have weekend service. This petition drive will send a message to the Metropolitan Transit Authority and we need them to listen to us."

 

 

The petition drive, organized by Senator Golden, is seeking the help of commuters, civic and community organizations to obtain a large number of signatures opposing the elimination of this service. The petition will be distributed at express bus stops, at community meetings and will be available to residents via the internet at www.golden.nysenate.gov." :tup:

 

Senator Golden brings up a very good point. Many folks work on holidays and need express bus service to get to work. Not having it can be extremely stressful. I know this first hand.

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Question: were you affected by the cuts last June?

 

let me answer that I travel through eastern queens and southern BK fine I will lay out some info and tell u what I am thinking The B74 could be extended to kings plaza replacing B2 on weekends travelling via ocean parkway and kings hwy creating a diagonal quick route for southern brooklyn however B4 was no excuse and should be restored days after the cuts I saw literally 40 plus people waiting for the B4 to take them to sheepshead bay catch the bus was not going to show up they did not know that till I revealed the bad news to them their reaction was real rage and they were beyond pissed that they got burned hard. I was like wow what were board members on when they did this one?? Heck if MTA really wanted to save money why not interline B44 limiteds with B4 on select runs??? They would be able to keep service without escalating cost.

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You just said yourself that the B2 ran more frequently than the B100 on Sundays so that already makes a difference. Aside from that, the B82 is less of an alternative seeing where the B2 and B82 go.

 

 

With regards to the cutting service comment, I'm sure they are and that's exactly why eliminating the B4 from Sheepshead Bay (another relatively affluent middle class area) was justified too right? :(

 

 

I'm dependent on the service that I use too and just because I don't use it 24/7 doesn't mean that it should be cut. The same thing goes for Bay Ridge, Dyker Heights, Bath Beach and Bensonhurst riders. Why don't we cut service on Richmond Avenue since it isn't that well utilized? I mean it's ridiculous. I have once to hear to hear you complain about the overhead at the (MTA) but you constantly advocate for service to be axed for the very people that need it. At the rate the (MTA) is going maybe they should just let someone else come in and run things since they seem to have forgotten that the majority of New Yorkers need public transportation to get around. Meanwhile there is rampid waste at the (MTA) that very few folks speak of except for folks like BrooklynBus and a few others.

 

And how can flip flopping the B1 and B64 make sense when both now serve fewer communities in Southern Brooklyn?? :confused:

 

 

Regarding the B70, yes I know that, but that still has nothing to do with re-routing the B37 north of Bay Ridge Avenue to get more ridership if it were restored.

 

Regarding Gerritsen Beach, yeah, nice try, but the entire community of Gerritsen Beach still has no overnight service and no alternatives to boot.

 

Try telling folks that used the B4 that they weren't robbed of their service. And for that matter we can discuss the B23 as well. It is very easy for you to make a comment like that when you have 4 local bus lines in your neck of the woods.

 

Oh and while we're the topic of taxes, it's funny how the more affluent middle class areas, which probably pull more load in terms of taxes, get less service. In sum, taxation without representation, so yeah, we pay taxes too, probably more than some areas that still have their service with similar ridership. Very interesting, no? :( A perfect example would be West Brighton vs Mariners Harbor. I'm sure that we have higher incomes overall in West Brighton and pay far more in taxes (excluding those projects which are supposedly a part of West Brighton :(), yet Mariners Harbor keeps their X12 and X30, yet we lose our X16.

 

There is a difference between eliminating a route at all times except rush hours (the B4) and eliminating a route at night when it doesn't meet specified (and publicized) guidelines (B31 at night)

 

And Sheepshead Bay isn't "affluent". The average household there makes about $50,000 per year, which is definitely middle class, but not "affluent" (not to mention that a neighborhood can't be middle class and affluent at the same time). Maybe you mean upper-middle class, but even then it doesn't fall into that category.

 

Yes, why don't we cut service along Richmond Avenue?

 

What am I supposed to say? It goes without saying that the internal waste should be cut.

 

What are you talking about with the B1 and B64? They still serve the same communities.

 

And where would you reroute the B37 to, wise-guy?

 

And they are basically unaffected considering a driver on these forums spoke about the ridership patterns of the B31 at night (everybody was off by Avenue U)

 

You have a frequent north-south line and a frequent east-west line within 1/4 mile. All I have is a frequent north-south line and it is close to 1/2 mile away (the S62 doesn't count as frequent)

 

Because the X12 serves Westerleigh and the X30 serves the "affluent" parts of West Brighton you keep on referring to. What would you do with the X30? Have it bypass Mariners' Harbor and give up the opportunity to collect extra revenue? Not to mention the fact that you still have the X14 and X30.

 

The B64 wasn't really needed south of Harway since the B82 is a block over on Cropsey Av

 

During my very brief stay in Gerritsen Beach, I found out that you can walk to where you needed to go at nights before the bus even came. Besides, there was next to no one on the bus which made it more pointless (probably more roaches than people lol)

 

The X29 isn't needed at all. The (F) to Church Av (now that it has elevators) to the B68 works fine

 

It wasn't really an issue of network coverage: It was the fact that those people now have to transfer to access a major hub (Coney Island)

 

By the entire communities who used the X27 and X28. That would include me as well since I did use both of them on the weekends. I know I know, we don't need our service, but we're still going to fight to get it back just because we like having service that we don't use for the hell of it. Everyone has to do what is in their best interests and that is what we are doing here. The (MTA) thinks they are so slick. They were just looking for any reason to axe the service to begin with and the recession just gave them an excuse, but that smokescreen isn't going to fly with us.

 

If the entire community used those buses and depended on them so much, why was ridership so low?

 

lol... One thing at a time guy. I stated earlier that I thought the B64 should be fully restored to Coney Island.

 

That just shows how hard South Brooklyn was hit. Cut back the B64, cut back the B4, cuts on the B2 and B31, elimination of the B37, weekend service slashed on the X27 and X28, a re-route of the B1, and a cut back on the frequencies of the B36 to boot. Oh yeah and a cut back on service on the BM1 and BM3 on Saturdays. :mad:

 

The B36 and BM1/BM3 cuts were made after June 27th.

 

None of these petitions ever work out for the better, so I wouldn't waste my time....

 

As far as the commentary in this thread so far, I wouldn't go crazy restoring overnight service on routes where virtually (or literally) no one rode them during those hours....

 

the x27 & x28 riders, they're gonna complain regardless... I'm sure they don't need my signature/e-signature to get something accomplished...

 

the B2/B31/B100 thing, I'm not gonna go into anymore.. gotten into way too many (moot) arguments over rerouting/canning/combining which-with/without-what....

 

the B37, good riddance to bad rubbish... you would have had to been a fool to actually rely on the B37, over the B63 (or the train) if you lived in down in that part of the borough.... and don't give me the elderly argument either, b/c you saw (and still see) PLENTY of them on the 63... the 70 re-route along the commercial part of 3rd av, was nothin more than a wash; it didn't better or worsen things....

 

 

 

I don't agree... for the simple fact that (the difference b/w) ridership on the (old) 64, and the B82, had nothin to do with each other (regardless of their relative proximity to each other).... You'd see more people using the B82/B68 interchangably than you'd see ppl. using the B64/82 interchangably....

 

 

What the heck is "northern Gerritsen Beach".... The area north of Gerritsen is Marine Park.

 

....and if you think Gerritsen Beach residents ever wanted (or cared for) av u service, you're mistaken....

 

 

lol @ this, on both fronts :tup:

 

 

 

Not for w/e reason(s) you may be thinkin of, though....

 

do you know how long the MTA wanted to create a "B86"....

 

 

 

...and go where with it?

 

If Gerritsen Beach is everything south of Avenue U, I said that "northern Gerritsen Beach" is everything within walking distance of Avenue U.

 

And I was saying that it is an alternative for that section of Gerritsen Beach: They may prefer to transfer at Kings Highway than Avenue U, but it is still an alternative.

 

And I was just saying that, for overnight service, most B2 customers are close to the B82.

 

And how exactly was the X37/X38 restored??? :confused: In any event, only those who use the line would have an interest in signing the petition anyway, so I wouldn't expect you to have any interest in signing it either way. I just put it out there in case anyone is interested. Believe me, there is enough interest from folks like myself and others in the communities that the X27/X28 serve that we aren't desperate for signatures. lol You and I have our own way of doing things, so while I respect your opinion, I will be proceeding accordingly.

 

 

 

If anything maybe what he is referring to is the "old" and "new" parts of Gerritsen Beach. The "newer" part would be going north on Gerritsen Avenue.

 

That too, but I was mostly referring to the northern and southern sections of Gerritsen Beach (for example, "northern West Brighton" would be by Richmond Terrace, and "southern West Brighton" would be by Forest Avenue)

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By the entire communities who used the X27 and X28. That would include me as well since I did use both of them on the weekends. I know I know, we don't need our service, but we're still going to fight to get it back just because we like having service that we don't use for the hell of it. Everyone has to do what is in their best interests and that is what we are doing here. The (MTA) thinks they are so slick. They were just looking for any reason to axe the service to begin with and the recession just gave them an excuse, but that smokescreen isn't going to fly with us.

 

you answere the reason why weekend servis is not needed if you kno u dont need it dont waste mta money and time for service you know is unneeded. that doesnt justify it as I know how deserted that bus gets on weekends. If anything Id rather see off peak weekday service improved before weekend service returning. Try other means. X27 yes X28 not so much aas 27 is reachable by subway or other buses more easily a re routing of off peak 27 to at least link 59th station but off peak only no rush hour. Or just learn how to time connections better

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let me answer that I travel through eastern queens and southern BK fine I will lay out some info and tell u what I am thinking The B74 could be extended to kings plaza replacing B2 on weekends travelling via ocean parkway and kings hwy creating a diagonal quick route for southern brooklyn however B4 was no excuse and should be restored days after the cuts I saw literally 40 plus people waiting for the B4 to take them to sheepshead bay catch the bus was not going to show up they did not know that till I revealed the bad news to them their reaction was real rage and they were beyond pissed that they got burned hard. I was like wow what were board members on when they did this one?? Heck if MTA really wanted to save money why not interline B44 limiteds with B4 on select runs??? They would be able to keep service without escalating cost.

The (B74) should stay as is, as well as the (B44)

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There is a difference between eliminating a route at all times except rush hours (the B4) and eliminating a route at night when it doesn't meet specified (and publicized) guidelines (B31 at night)

 

And Sheepshead Bay isn't "affluent". The average household there makes about $50,000 per year, which is definitely middle class, but not "affluent" (not to mention that a neighborhood can't be middle class and affluent at the same time). Maybe you mean upper-middle class, but even then it doesn't fall into that category.

 

Yes, why don't we cut service along Richmond Avenue?

 

What am I supposed to say? It goes without saying that the internal waste should be cut.

 

What are you talking about with the B1 and B64? They still serve the same communities.

 

And where would you reroute the B37 to, wise-guy?

 

And they are basically unaffected considering a driver on these forums spoke about the ridership patterns of the B31 at night (everybody was off by Avenue U)

 

You have a frequent north-south line and a frequent east-west line within 1/4 mile. All I have is a frequent north-south line and it is close to 1/2 mile away (the S62 doesn't count as frequent)

 

Because the X12 serves Westerleigh and the X30 serves the "affluent" parts of West Brighton you keep on referring to. What would you do with the X30? Have it bypass Mariners' Harbor and give up the opportunity to collect extra revenue? Not to mention the fact that you still have the X14 and X30.

 

 

 

It wasn't really an issue of network coverage: It was the fact that those people now have to transfer to access a major hub (Coney Island)

 

 

 

If the entire community used those buses and depended on them so much, why was ridership so low?

 

 

 

The B36 and BM1/BM3 cuts were made after June 27th.

 

 

 

If Gerritsen Beach is everything south of Avenue U, I said that "northern Gerritsen Beach" is everything within walking distance of Avenue U.

 

And I was saying that it is an alternative for that section of Gerritsen Beach: They may prefer to transfer at Kings Highway than Avenue U, but it is still an alternative.

 

And I was just saying that, for overnight service, most B2 customers are close to the B82.

 

 

 

That too, but I was mostly referring to the northern and southern sections of Gerritsen Beach (for example, "northern West Brighton" would be by Richmond Terrace, and "southern West Brighton" would be by Forest Avenue)

 

word of the wise

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