Petition started to restore lost bus service in Mid and Southern Brooklyn

[Shortline Bus]

That's all fine and well, but the X27/X28 serves areas of Southern Brooklyn that are more isolated and thus need the service because the alternatives are extremely slow, not ADA accessible nor safe for seniors and simply not reliable. How you could call for the restoration of the B51 is beyond me when there are far more alternatives for the B51. Anywho, we're continuing with our petition to get the service back fully restored. Those of you who asked to have the petition sent to you, please get it back to me completed ASAP and let anyone else who wants to sign it do so as well and then I can sign it and get it back to Senator Golden's office. Thanks again! :cool:

 

 

Not meant to be rude but sound like in your comments/chat about the express buses that they are your personal car or taxi service. Including those in other topic about using the BXM4 to go to Yankee Stadium.

Even another Express Bus Supporter Forest Glen would compromise. The purpose of outerboro bus service from my experience should be to transport resident in the '4' outerboros directly to Manhattan that live far from a subway.

 

I was not saying the B51 should be a 7-day service. I was suggesting that the monies the would waste on Sunday service on X27/28 would be better spent on say restoring at least B51 and B39 Weekday service.

 

Yet Garibaldi do you care (would you probably don't) if the X27/28 did return and on Sundays most trips had zero riders on it? On Sundays many of those Bay Ridge/Bensonhurst and Dyker Heights are using their cars instead.

 

It happened to me a few times when I rode the X28 from Coney Island-42nd and Madison to board Metro North to travel upstate Poughkeepsie as late as Last Spring right before the cuts. Most recent was around Easter Sunday 2010.

Again before the cuts I would occasional use the X28 to travel to see old friends in Coney Island from Manhattan.

 

On Saturdays however riding the X28 it always had at least 10 riders on it. That why I am strongly support having the X27/28 run on Saturdays Only. That right you mind is made up. You being stubborn. The others who oppopsed it have a voice too since the gas prices are now a huge issue.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Not meant to be rude but sound like in your comments/chat about the express buses that they are your personal car or taxi service. Including those in other topic about using the BXM4 to go to Yankee Stadium.

Even another Express Bus Supporter Forest Glen would compromise. The purpose of outerboro bus service from my experience should be to transport resident in the '4' outerboros directly to Manhattan that live far from a subway.

 

I was not saying the B51 should be a 7-day service. I was suggesting that the monies the would waste on Sunday service on X27/28 would be better spent on say restoring at least B51 and B39 Weekday service.

 

Yet Garibaldi do you care (would you probably don't) if the X27/28 did return and on Sundays most trips had zero riders on it? On Sundays many of those Bay Ridge/Bensonhurst and Dyker Heights are using their cars instead.

 

It happened to me a few times when I rode the X28 from Coney Island-42nd and Madison to board Metro North to travel upstate Poughkeepsie as late as Last Spring right before the cuts. Most recent was around Easter Sunday 2010.

Again before the cuts I would occasional use the X28 to travel to see old friends in Coney Island from Manhattan.

 

On Saturdays however riding the X28 it always had at least 10 riders on it. That why I am strongly support having the X27/28 run on Sundays. That right you mind is made up. You being stubborn. The others who oppopsed it have a voice too since the gas prices are now a huge issue.

 

Folks using their cars or not, 7 day service is needed for those who don't and for those like myself who did use the X27/X28 on Saturdays and Sundays. They'll cut the service, but still charge me and everyone else who buys a 7 day Unlimited Express Bus Plus card $50.00 a week for express bus service 7 days a week, when there is no longer any express bus service in Southern Brooklyn on Sunday. So we who do use the service is not only supposed to be inconvenienced with no express bus service, but also pay more for subway and local bus service because we can afford it? I think not. Now that's completely irrational and ridiculous. This whole fiasco screws up my weekend plans and everyone else who used the X27/X28, not to mention that I paying far more now since I can't complete certain tasks that I used to do on the express bus since there is no service. :mad: And like I said before, the buys its gas in bulk anyway, so they get it for a deal and their buses are very fuel efficient. The only compromise I would make is reducing the frequencies to once every hour on Sundays, but other than that, that's about it.

[Gotham Bus Co.]

No, we need full restoration of the X27 and X28.

 

Okay, now tell us...

 

Whose service should be cut to pay for that? Please identify a specific route (or set of routes) which should be reduced or eliminated to pay for restoring weekend X27 and X28 service.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Okay, now tell us...

 

Whose service should be cut to pay for that? Please identify a specific route (or set of routes) which should be reduced or eliminated to pay for restoring weekend X27 and X28 service.

 

Someone asked me to give a proposal for restoring the X16 and I came up with this below:

 

http://www.nyctransitforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=424340&postcount=63

 

My plan would involve no loss of bus service.

[Shortline Bus]

Someone asked me to give a proposal for restoring the X16 and I came up with this below:

 

http://www.nyctransitforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=424340&postcount=63

 

My plan would involve no loss of bus service.

 

 

Then ultra liberals like Rev Al will scream bloody murder if the student metrocards was totally gone.

 

Yes there abuse but instead I always felt a partial solution should be the family income for fares. It would be similar like student aide is determined by college or getting reduced or free lunch.

 

However what it comes down to, funding from Albany and DC needs to be increased for any more service increases to occur. Also the downsize of unneeded staff at upper management at the .

 

And also consider laying off a few station agents at low usage subway stations.

 

All of these proposals are controversial. Until something is done, service cuts will continue every time a national recession occurs.

[qjtransitmaster]

Okay, now tell us...

 

Whose service should be cut to pay for that? Please identify a specific route (or set of routes) which should be reduced or eliminated to pay for restoring weekend X27 and X28 service.

 

QM3,Half of BXM4 weekend service and QM18 should get axed completely. Those lines carry air can em

[Shortline Bus]

QM3,Half of BXM4 weekend service and QM18 should get axed completely. Those lines carry air can em

 

 

You mean BM4 Gerristean Beach Saturday service right? That line has no business having any Saturday service.

At least the BXM4 although 'lower' than the other Bronx express buses does get some ridership.

[qjtransitmaster]

You mean BM4 Gerristean Beach Saturday service right? That line has no business having any Saturday service.

At least the BXM4 although 'lower' than the other Bronx express buses does get some ridership.

 

BXM4 gets lower cause IT HAS THE MOST ALTERNATIVES!!!!!! Many other BXM lines have none or slower options. and yes BM4 saturday service too. But the BXM4 is DISGRACE!!!!!! At rush hr one time I saw a northbound BXM4 run with only 5 ppl in it at it's last pickup. no one even got on. The some ridership doesnt justify the line running at every 30 mins.

[checkmatechamp13]

I totally disagree, especially since I've used that set up to get from Bay Ridge. The B16 does not run with the and the does not run with the . That B16 can take a good 20 minutes to get to 86th and 4th depending on how long you have wait for it and then the trip to the station. Then the wait for the can be a good 15 minutes or more and then you have to transfer to the , so it is still a pretty long wait and that's assuming that no other connections are needed.

 

Maybe as a compromise, the B9 could be extended down the full length of Shore Road (since it runs more frequently than the B16, and connects directly with the ), and the some B16 service could be truncated to 86th Street/4th Avenue.

 

But I'm saying that it is still nowhere near as much of a necessity as on Staten Island. Even if a person just rode the right into Lower Manhattan, it wouldn't take as long as taking the bus->ferry->subway (for the average SI express bus rider vs. the average Bay Ridge express bus rider).

 

That's all fine and well, but the X27/X28 serves areas of Southern Brooklyn that are more isolated and thus need the service because the alternatives are extremely slow, not ADA accessible nor safe for seniors and simply not reliable. How you could call for the restoration of the B51 is beyond me when there are far more alternatives for the B51. Anywho, we're continuing with our petition to get the service back fully restored. Those of you who asked to have the petition sent to you, please get it back to me completed ASAP and let anyone else who wants to sign it do so as well and then I can sign it and get it back to Senator Golden's office. Thanks again! :cool:

 

I'll agree that the B51 doesn't need to come back.

 

Not meant to be rude but sound like in your comments/chat about the express buses that they are your personal car or taxi service. Including those in other topic about using the BXM4 to go to Yankee Stadium.

Even another Express Bus Supporter Forest Glen would compromise. The purpose of outerboro bus service from my experience should be to transport resident in the '4' outerboros directly to Manhattan that live far from a subway.

 

I was not saying the B51 should be a 7-day service. I was suggesting that the monies the would waste on Sunday service on X27/28 would be better spent on say restoring at least B51 and B39 Weekday service.

 

Yet Garibaldi do you care (would you probably don't) if the X27/28 did return and on Sundays most trips had zero riders on it? On Sundays many of those Bay Ridge/Bensonhurst and Dyker Heights are using their cars instead.

 

It happened to me a few times when I rode the X28 from Coney Island-42nd and Madison to board Metro North to travel upstate Poughkeepsie as late as Last Spring right before the cuts. Most recent was around Easter Sunday 2010.

Again before the cuts I would occasional use the X28 to travel to see old friends in Coney Island from Manhattan.

 

On Saturdays however riding the X28 it always had at least 10 riders on it. That why I am strongly support having the X27/28 run on Saturdays Only. That right you mind is made up. You being stubborn. The others who oppopsed it have a voice too since the gas prices are now a huge issue.

 

The cost of gas is nothing compared to the cost of labor (and maintainance) in running any bus service.

 

Folks using their cars or not, 7 day service is needed for those who don't and for those like myself who did use the X27/X28 on Saturdays and Sundays. They'll cut the service, but still charge me and everyone else who buys a 7 day Unlimited Express Bus Plus card $50.00 a week for express bus service 7 days a week, when there is no longer any express bus service in Southern Brooklyn on Sunday. So we who do use the service is not only supposed to be inconvenienced with no express bus service, but also pay more for subway and local bus service because we can afford it? I think not. Now that's completely irrational and ridiculous. This whole fiasco screws up my weekend plans and everyone else who used the X27/X28, not to mention that I paying far more now since I can't complete certain tasks that I used to do on the express bus since there is no service. :mad: And like I said before, the buys its gas in bulk anyway, so they get it for a deal and their buses are very fuel efficient. The only compromise I would make is reducing the frequencies to once every hour on Sundays, but other than that, that's about it. B)

 

It is up to the user of the Express Bus Plus MetroCard to determine if it is worth the $50. You said yourself that you already come out ahead by using it: You use it 5 days per week to get to/from work, plus you also use it on the subway and local bus to get around Manhattan.

 

Plus, for $50 per week, you should be allowed a comfortable ride, but not in what is basically a personal limo: It defeats the point of mass transit (and I don't care how much money you pay in taxes)

 

Then ultra liberals like Rev Al will scream bloody murder if the student metrocards was totally gone.

 

Yes there abuse but instead I always felt a partial solution should be the family income for fares. It would be similar like student aide is determined by college or getting reduced or free lunch.

 

However what it comes down to, funding from Albany and DC needs to be increased for any more service increases to occur. Also the downsize of unneeded staff at upper management at the .

 

And also consider laying off a few station agents at low usage subway stations.

 

All of these proposals are controversial. Until something is done, service cuts will continue every time a national recession occurs.

 

That would be a compromise (basing Student MetroCards on income), but I think that, if the city and state are paying for free school bus service for other districts (which is much more expensive per-person to provide than Student MetroCards), they should give all students in NYC Student MetroCards to get to school.

 

I agree that, ultimately, the only real solution will be to get extra funding from NYC, Albany, and Washington (the latter 2 especially)

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Plus, for $50 per week, you should be allowed a comfortable ride, but not in what is basically a personal limo: It defeats the point of mass transit (and I don't care how much money you pay in taxes)

 

Yeah, well we who use the X27/X28 care and we certainly don't consider it a personal limo, but a necessity. The S54 at times can be a personal limo and weekday service has been cut accordingly. Like I said, under your plan those who pay the most in taxes would get the least service so that those who pay the least taxes can get more service. Talk about socialist policies. :eek:

[checkmatechamp13]

Yeah, well we who use the X27/X28 care and we certainly don't consider it a personal limo, but a necessity. The S54 at times can be a personal limo and weekday service has been cut accordingly. Like I said, under your plan those who pay the most in taxes would get the least service so that those who pay the least taxes can get more service. Talk about socialist policies. :eek:

 

First of all, who said anything about increasing service on other routes?

 

Second of all, 1% of households in NYC pay about 43% of the taxes. The UES and UWS (where a lot of those households live) have very frequent service, and it isn't even that heavily subsidized.

 

And there are plenty of areas where there are middle class people with a lot of service (that isn't that heavily subsidized). Look at Midwood, Gravesend and Bensonhurst. The point of mass transit is to move as many people as possible using as few resources as possible, regardless of class.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

First of all, who said anything about increasing service on other routes?

 

Second of all, 1% of households in NYC pay about 43% of the taxes. The UES and UWS (where a lot of those households live) have very frequent service, and it isn't even that heavily subsidized.

 

And there are plenty of areas where there are middle class people with a lot of service (that isn't that heavily subsidized). Look at Midwood, Gravesend and Bensonhurst. The point of mass transit is to move as many people as possible using as few resources as possible, regardless of class.

 

Your proposals generally involve slashing express bus service so that more local service can be provided as an "alternative". That's exactly what your B9 proposal is. You'd rather extend the B9, which is long enough as it is than provide express bus service to those along Shore Road who benefit greatly from the X27.

 

Me on the other hand, I advocate slashing where slashing should be done, by getting tough on fare beating, making those who should pay for Student MetroCards pay for them and slashing waste at the in terms of overhead. Passengers (express and local) alike pay for service and that's what they should get and not be expected to penny pinch, while the wastes millions in other areas and claims poverty.

[checkmatechamp13]

Your proposals generally involve slashing express bus service so that more local service can be provided as an "alternative". That's exactly what your B9 proposal is. You'd rather extend the B9, which is long enough as it is than provide express bus service to those along Shore Road who benefit greatly from the X27.

 

Me on the other hand, I advocate slashing where slashing should be done, by getting tough on fare beating, making those who should pay for Student MetroCards pay for them and slashing waste at the in terms of overhead. Passengers (express and local) alike pay for service and that's what they should get and not be expected to penny pinch, while the wastes millions in other areas.

 

How do they benefit from weekend service if they're not using it? And also, there are people who would benefit from the B9: The people who live on Shore Road that are traveling within Brooklyn (I doubt that every person there owns a car: You were considering moving there and don't have a car).

 

And, like I said, the goal of mass transit is to move as many people as possible using as few resources as possible. A B9 extension would do just that: Rather than running a whole bus all the way to Manhattan, those few people can share a bus with people going to destinations within Brooklyn.

 

And I don't consider it penny-pinching to get rid of routes that are only carrying a couple of people.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

How do they benefit from weekend service if they're not using it? And also, there are people who would benefit from the B9: The people who live on Shore Road that are traveling within Brooklyn (I doubt that every person there owns a car: You were considering moving there and don't have a car).

 

And, like I said, the goal of mass transit is to move as many people as possible using as few resources as possible. A B9 extension would do just that: Rather than running a whole bus all the way to Manhattan, those few people can share a bus with people going to destinations within Brooklyn.

 

And I don't consider it penny-pinching to get rid of routes that are only carrying a couple of people.

 

Yes, I know you don't but when you get rid of routes serving entire neighbourhoods, it is penny pinching. Quite frankly the B64 would be a better extension that the B9 seeing how short the B64 currently is.

[qjtransitmaster]

Yes, I know you don't but when you get rid of routes serving entire neighbourhoods, it is penny pinching. Quite frankly the B64 would be a better extension that the B9 seeing how short the B64 currently is.

 

WHY WONT BXM4 GET KILLED!!!! ya wanna cut waste streamline the line or kill the line it duplicates!!!! ppl on it hate it its slow no manhattanbound bus belongs on grand concourse. BXM4 to yonkers via grand concourse = EPIC FAIL OF THE YEAR AWARD!!!!! BXM4 bypassing grand concourse = EPIC WIN

[Via Garibaldi 8]

WHY WONT BXM4 GET KILLED!!!! ya wanna cut waste streamline the line or kill the line it duplicates!!!! ppl on it hate it its slow no manhattanbound bus belongs on grand concourse. BXM4 to yonkers via grand concourse = EPIC FAIL OF THE YEAR AWARD!!!!! BXM4 bypassing grand concourse = EPIC WIN

 

 

Simple, because it is needed. Cut waste by cutting out farebeating, cutting out needless positions in the offices in the and making those who should pay for Student Metrocards pay for them. Don't cut service for those subsidizing the system, especially express bus riders!!! :tdown: We need to restore local and express service wherever NOT cut it. I vehemently oppose any further service cuts!!

[checkmatechamp13]

Even if those cuts benefit riders (and increase ridership) by speeding up the trip times of riders furthert north?

 

As for the other comment, the B64 would probably be a better choice.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Even if those cuts benefit riders (and increase ridership) by speeding up the trip times of riders furthert north?

 

As for the other comment, the B64 would probably be a better choice.

 

I do not support slashing any service without providing an equal alternative. Folks along the Grand Concourse should continue to have access to the express bus and should not be punished to give preferential treatment to those who live further North. A compromise could be to simply allow select express buses to make skip stops, but even that should be done with discrection and only where practical.

[checkmatechamp13]

But the Woodlawn and Norwood riders far outnumber the riders on the southern section of the Grand Concourse (again, the point of mass transit is to move as many people as possible, as quickly as possible, using as few resources as possible)

[Via Garibaldi 8]

But the Woodlawn and Norwood riders far outnumber the riders on the southern section of the Grand Concourse (again, the point of mass transit is to move as many people as possible, as quickly as possible, using as few resources as possible)

 

That's all fine and good and that's why I said that as a compromise select BMX4s could bypass that area, but to slash their service outright is ridiculous and not at all practical. What you're suggesting is exactly what I was suggesting for the X30. The difference is the X30 riders in Mariners Harbor would still have the X12 and the X17 nearby, but BXM4 riders would have no other express bus.

[qjtransitmaster]

That's all fine and good and that's why I said that as a compromise select BMX4s could bypass that area, but to slash their service outright is ridiculous and not at all practical. What you're suggesting is exactly what I was suggesting for the X30. The difference is the X30 riders in Mariners Harbor would still have the X12 and the X17 nearby, but BXM4 riders would have no other express bus.

 

BULL IT should be select BXM4s that actually serve grand concourse all others and all weekend and off peak trips bypass that area as checkmate said and I said NO ONE IS INTERESTED IN USING BXM4 TO GRAND CONCOURSE!!!!!!!! what point of BX1 limited do you not understand!!!!!!! It's like running QM2 with local stops on northern and calling it express seriously read the bronx bus map and stop the benefits to my plan FAR OUTWEIGH the cuts period!!!!! as a compromise select trips serve the area on grand concourse like 4 trips heck it should be 2 each way cause so few ppl even use that part of BXM4 make the bus faster and stop pissing ppl off with slow service

[qjtransitmaster]

Simple, because it is needed. Cut waste by cutting out farebeating, cutting out needless positions in the offices in the and making those who should pay for Student Metrocards pay for them. Don't cut service for those subsidizing the system, especially express bus riders!!! :tdown: We need to restore local and express service wherever NOT cut it. I vehemently oppose any further service cuts!!

 

err NOT have u even used it to know that??? NO you have not!!!! If you have you would know that moree ppl want the bus to bypass grand concourse than keep it. seriously sometimes AT RUSH HR its empty what point of FAIL do u not get:tdown::tdown::tdown::tdown::tdown::tdown: It's like running the QM3 all day no one's interested. what point of limited stop do u not get did u even anaylze the system clearly you have not!!!! as compromise use select extended BX1 LIMITED NOT LOCAL LIMITED stop trips to run over BXM4 manhattan rting upto 125th. seriously try using the 4 and u will know what I mean. The D is faster!!!! EXPRESS BUS ON GRAND CONCOURSE= FAILURE SO EPIC IS LEAVES PPL WONDERING WTF WERE THEY SMOKIN???? FAIL.

BXM4 is like having BM2 stop in downtown brooklyn and calling it express and expecting ppl to buy in to that good luck!!!

[Via Garibaldi 8]

BULL IT should be select BXM4s that actually serve grand concourse all others and all weekend and off peak trips bypass that area as checkmate said and I said NO ONE IS INTERESTED IN USING BXM4 TO GRAND CONCOURSE!!!!!!!! what point of BX1 limited do you not understand!!!!!!! It's like running QM2 with local stops on northern and calling it express seriously read the bronx bus map and stop the benefits to my plan FAR OUTWEIGH the cuts period!!!!! as a compromise select trips serve the area on grand concourse like 4 trips heck it should be 2 each way cause so few ppl even use that part of BXM4 make the bus faster and stop pissing ppl off with slow service

 

I think the question is do you know how to read??? I just stated in my post that a compromise would be to have SELECT BXM4s stop along the Grand Concourse. This is why I can't have a conversation with you. You just rant and rave and don't even read the damn posts! Now that's an epic fail!! :tdown:

 

err NOT have u even used it to know that??? NO you have not!!!! If you have you would know that moree ppl want the bus to bypass grand concourse than keep it. seriously sometimes AT RUSH HR its empty what point of FAIL do u not get:tdown::tdown::tdown::tdown::tdown::tdown: It's like running the QM3 all day no one's interested. what point of limited stop do u not get did u even anaylze the system clearly you have not!!!! as compromise use select extended BX1 LIMITED NOT LOCAL LIMITED stop trips to run over BXM4 manhattan rting upto 125th. seriously try using the 4 and u will know what I mean. The D is faster!!!! EXPRESS BUS ON GRAND CONCOURSE= FAILURE SO EPIC IS LEAVES PPL WONDERING WTF WERE THEY SMOKIN???? FAIL.

BXM4 is like having BM2 stop in downtown brooklyn and calling it express and expecting ppl to buy in to that good luck!!!

 

How many posts do you need to make about the same friggin' topic? I got your point the first time. Doesn't mean I have to agree with it.

[checkmatechamp13]

That's all fine and good and that's why I said that as a compromise select BMX4s could bypass that area, but to slash their service outright is ridiculous and not at all practical. What you're suggesting is exactly what I was suggesting for the X30. The difference is the X30 riders in Mariners Harbor would still have the X12 and the X17 nearby, but BXM4 riders would have no other express bus.

 

There are several differences between X30 riders and BxM4 riders:

 

The areas along the Grand Concourse are much poorer than Mariners' Harbor and Graniteville (I can find stats to back it up, but think about it: A lot of the buildings near the Grand Concourse are tenements, whereas Mariners' Harbor and Graniteville have townhouses).

 

There is nowhere to reroute the X30 to: You can try sending it down the MLK and SIE, but that wouldn't really save any time over going down Forest Avenue.

 

The alternative X17 would become overcrowded: People by South Avenue already have to let a couple of X17s go by (unless they decide that they want to stand), and this would make it much worse: Eliminating the X30 from that area could cause it to actually be crowded like the local buses in the area)

 

Finally, the key is that there is demand for X30 service along Forest Avenue, due to the lack of real alternatives (alternatuives that are comparable in travel time): The X12 goes through Lower Manhattan, and the X42 runs infrequently. For the few BxM4 passesegers, they can take the ( into Manhattan: They may be crowded, but they are faster than the BxM4)

 

Simply put, the areas around the Grand Concourse don't have the ridership to support an express bus. It is different from, say the BxM11, which parallels the because of the lower ridership). It sucks for the couple of people who depend on it, but it is for the overall good of BxM4 riders.

 

By the way, if they don't want to take the subway, they still have a couple of alternatives: Some of them can take a crosstown bus to the Harlem line at East Tremont or Melrose, or to the Hudson Line at East 153rd Street/Yankee Stadium. Either that, or if the first stop on the BxM4 is Fordham Road, they can go there and backtrack on the Bx1 or Bx2.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

There are several differences between X30 riders and BxM4 riders:

 

The areas along the Grand Concourse are much poorer than Mariners' Harbor and Graniteville (I can find stats to back it up, but think about it: A lot of the buildings near the Grand Concourse are tenements, whereas Mariners' Harbor and Graniteville have townhouses).

 

There is nowhere to reroute the X30 to: You can try sending it down the MLK and SIE, but that wouldn't really save any time over going down Forest Avenue.

 

The alternative X17 would become overcrowded: People by South Avenue already have to let a couple of X17s go by (unless they decide that they want to stand), and this would make it much worse: Eliminating the X30 from that area could cause it to actually be crowded like the local buses in the area)

 

Finally, the key is that there is demand for X30 service along Forest Avenue, due to the lack of real alternatives (alternatuives that are comparable in travel time): The X12 goes through Lower Manhattan, and the X42 runs infrequently. For the few BxM4 passesegers, they can take the into Manhattan: They may be crowded, but they are faster than the BxM4)

 

Simply put, the areas around the Grand Concourse don't have the ridership to support an express bus. It is different from, say the BxM11, which parallels the because of the lower ridership). It sucks for the couple of people who depend on it, but it is for the overall good of BxM4 riders.

 

By the way, if they don't want to take the subway, they still have a couple of alternatives: Some of them can take a crosstown bus to the Harlem line at East Tremont or Melrose, or to the Hudson Line at East 153rd Street/Yankee Stadium. Either that, or if the first stop on the BxM4 is Fordham Road, they can go there and backtrack on the Bx1 or Bx2.

 

So they could run more X17s and I would have to think that the X17 is pretty cost effective, seeing that it is one of the top five busiest express buses in the syste,. The X30 could actually be re-routed to go over the Bayonne Bridge after say Decker Avenue. More X42s could be run too since those fill up pretty fast and fewer of them run because the X30 is there. And did you forget about the projects and run down areas in Mariners Harbor???

In sum, I see no need to axe the BXM4 along the Grand Concourse. Even if it is 10 people, that still adds up and helps the numbers on that line overall.

 

 

I could argue that my commute to West Brighton, along with my fellow commuters' commute in the neighbourhood adjacent to mine in the affluent Randall Manor would be faster if we didn't have to go through the poorer Mariners Harbor and Graniteville, so I don't see the difference.