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Summer 2011 Fantasy Map - Initial Draft


Tokkemon

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Hi all! This is one of my summer projects for 2011. I made a Fantasy Map last summer and it was very fun. This time around, though, I'm being more thorough with it.

 

The following map is an initial draft without station names or fancy dots and other stuff; use your imagination! This map is exactly to scale traced from USGS maps, not to mention completely custom made; no crappy MS Paint maps here! Please note that this map has a drastically reduced resolution. The full map is upwards of 15,000 pixels wide.

 

FantasyMapinitialdraft.png

 

Things I'm unsure about:

 

  1. The indigo colored lines (V)(W). Not sure what to do with them. Is the Broadway (Queens) connection from the Queens Blvd line to 86th St in Manhattan really that valuable? Also where should I take the Myrtle Ave line?
  2. Crosstown (H) line. Would it be useful?
  3. (G) northern terminal. Should it terminate somewhere more useful?
  4. Line through Maspeth, (10). Should it be a purple line to cross at 42 St or something else?
  5. SI Subways. Too much?

 

 

Comments welcome!

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Well I'm looking forward to seeing this move onwards. I'm especially impressed you used real maps.

 

I'm still playing with my maps from last winter (using urbanrail.net with paint program).

 

All the best,

 

DK

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Oh boy this is definitely a fantasy map. A service guide would be nice here, but I can make out some really bad decisions.

 

 

  • Why is there a Y (assumably B division) along Lenox? (This is a recurring problem with many other lines in this map.)

 

 

 

  • There are way too many lines in the NE Bronx. The H, W (namely that line underneath 86th), 8 lines are unnecessary.

 

 

 

  • Don't convert the Airtrain into subway lines, they're pretty much incompatible plus it's not needed.

 

 

 

  • How are you going to build the 10 underneath the LIE?

 

 

 

  • It's not cost-effective to build the express tunnel underneath the Bay to Staten Island. What's puzzling is that the G train stops in Bay Ridge, when it can be extended to serve the Island for much less money.

 

 

On the other hand, I'm interested in how you made that map. I want to make one as well, using my ideas to expand NYC subway service without overdoing it.

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Not just that he has subway lines running through parks and cemeteries. What are you going to do move graveyards? For example the (H) cuts right through Calvary Cemetery. This is exactly why our former subway builders were smart they knew where the graveyards were.

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Not just that he has subway lines running through parks and cemeteries. What are you going to do move graveyards? For example the (H) cuts right through Calvary Cemetery. This is exactly why our former subway builders were smart they knew where the graveyards were.

 

It does not. It runs along Flushing Ave and Grand Aves until it hits Woodhaven Blvd., which is nowhere near Calvary. Trust me, every line there runs along a legitimate street that would be able to accommodate a proper subway, either tunnel or elevated depending on the situation. IIRC, I didn't cross any lines through *any* parks except for Central Park with the 86th St Crossover and the (Z) in Flushing Meadows briefly where it follows the LIE.

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Even if you feel sorry for Staten Island (and it looks like you do), Staten Island simply doesn't need that much subway service. The population density in most areas is far lower than the rest of the city. And unless you plan to dig tunnels under, there's no space on Forest Av and Victory Blvd. Aside from that, in general, you should think about making straighter, less circuitous routes. Routes that take people more directly to their most probable destination, their workplace.

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Staten Island isn't really that big. The only thing the island needs is a North Shore Line, a West Shore Line, and a line that follows the Staten Island Expressway. The current SIR sort of serves the South Shore. Also the Staten Island Expressway Line could be extended to the Staten Island Mall, and back to the SIR to create a massive subway grid. I have done the same concept with a light rail map of mines too.

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Aside from that, in general, you should think about making straighter, less circuitous routes. Routes that take people more directly to their most probable destination, their workplace.

 

Do you have a specific example?

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The (3) actually disappears somewhere in lower Manhattan presumably.

 

It goes into Brooklyn along the Eastern Parkway Line. There is no Northern Terminus picked yet.

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I personally think this map is a good start. Not extremely adventurous or creative - same as most fantasy maps - but the ideas are good. Those that mention that there is too much rapid transit for Staten Island seem to forget that New York grew as the new lines were added including building in sparsely populated areas at the time. Way to take preexisting ideas and lay them down. Looking forward to the rest.

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An actual direct rail connection at the existing St. George is pretty much impossible. It would have to be built super deep (like Lex-63rd or Whitehall St, more likely deeper than both) and be at a minimum as far inland as Bay St.

 

Any connection to the SIR would have to happen somewhere between Tompkinsville and Clifton.

 

These nexts words are a general statement so, OP... don't get butthurt.

 

Everyone gets carried away with these maps. Just throwing lines under and over streets, waters and existing structures without looking into how they would actually get built. A little engineering/architectural and construction knowledge is all you need to make these mas actually seem plausible.

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Your map is good for a start, Tokkeman. However, here are some things I would change:

 

1: Why do you hace the (G) and ( H ) criss-cross? Couldn't the (H) just share the tracks with the (G) in that area?

 

2: Make the ( M ) the (M) again, and have it along Myrtle Ave. once more. The (M) is extremely popular, why mess that up?

 

3: While I am all for subway service in Staten Island, there is simply too many lines. Just have the SIR, North Shore, and West shore. It is also impractical, if not downright impossible to build a line underneath NY Harbour.

 

4: You absolutely CANNOT have the (3) and the (Y) run together on 5th, nor the (10) on the Queens Blvd. line. A div vs. B div, remember?

 

5: I don't think that a 12th Ave Line could hold 4 lines :eek:

 

6: Abolish the (I) line altogether. It's completely unnecessary.

 

7: Have the ( K ) go along 4th Ave. I miss a brown line along 4th...

 

8: What would be the purpose of the <U>, and where does it and the (U) terminate in Brooklyn?

 

9: (2), (D), (T), (5), etc. go too far into the Bronx. Shorten them, please.

 

10: The ( V ), (8), (J), (K), etc. should not go into Nassau County. Again, shorten them.

 

11: I admire your creativity regarding this, but why is the (W) a circle?

 

12: The (2), (3), (4) and (5) were the way they were in Brooklyn for a reason. Don't go changing that.

 

13: Where is the Rockaway (S)? For that matter, where are any of the (S)'s?

 

14: There need not and can not be a (P), unless it goes along 4th Ave.

 

15: The (G) or (H) could go into the Bronx along 3rd Avenue, to give Bronxians direct access to Queens

 

I'm sorry if I ticked off anyone here, these are just my opinions.

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The only downside to your map is that there's no route serving parts of the Bronx south of Bruckner Expwy, like Soundview or Throggs Neck. I would have the (:( branch off the Concourse line at Yankee Stadium and have it run down 161st/163rd Sts and Lafayette Av to end in Throggs Neck, providing the South Bronx with a true crosstown route.

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Won't work the (D) runs express on the Concourse Line when the (:( is running. Instead they should create a line that would branch of the Pelham Line. Call it the 70(8) or something like that.

 

Or, better yet, make the ( H ) go along there, to give people in South Bronx not only service, but service to where they need to go.

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You don't need a stop on Riker's Island.

 

I think RC was referring to the fact that a tunnel would still likely go under Rikers', which would allow for some elaborate escape plan.

 

Anyways on the topic of the South Bronx service, I think a branch of the (6) after Longwood Av that turns onto Lafayette Av and goes down to E. Tremont Av or Throggs Neck Blvd would be nice.

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I think RC was referring to the fact that a tunnel would still likely go under Rikers', which would allow for some elaborate escape plan.

 

Anyways on the topic of the South Bronx service, I think a branch of the (6) after Longwood Av that turns onto Lafayette Av and goes down to E. Tremont Av or Throggs Neck Blvd would be nice.

 

First off, the escapees would likely get run over by an R68. Second, the Lexington line can't hold 4 trains, so a (6) branch will not work. Third, the (G) or (H) would be highly valued in South Bronx, since many people work in Queens.

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