What happened to the Artics in the other 3 boroughs?

[engineerboy6561]

I don't think I've ever heard of an articulated over the road bus...I know there were MCI Classic Articulateds but the MTA and the private bus lines never ran those.

 

Actually, NJT has suburban-style articulated Neoplan buses with lowered aisles, high-backed seats, luggage racks, etc. I rode one once on the 159 and they ride just as well if not slightly better than the Bee-line Neoplans. Nova also makes single-door suburban LFSs; maybe could talk them into building a batch of two-door suburban-style LFSAs for routes like the X1 (5-6 minute headways during rush and there's still some poor guy riding in the stairwell) assuming they replace MCIs at a 1:1 ratio.

[LRG]

While I like that idea it's something that I just don't see happening due to politics. Over the years there have been RTS' and Orion 5s on the express lines until 1998 when we started getting MCIs, and since then it's been nothing but MCIs for express routes taking over. People would think that a suburban LFS/A would be a downgrade to the over-the-road buses, even if they have the same amenities like our MCIs do, but they still won't buy into it.

[Grand Concourse]

People are spoiled. That is why I felt the suburban RTSs should've gone to SC, JFK, FR, and/or LGA for their lower used lines. At least they could've used those buses for the time being for express service and then eventually transition those buses back to local service [and reseating them]. The OGs could've been given to NYCT to use to replace the RTSs sent out.

 

Those PBL lines seemed to have been fine with O5s for express bus service. why give them MCIs other than the MTA buying a bunch of them in bulk for a discount?

Those new MCIs should've gone to NYCT in the first place so they could displace their older MCI buses.

 

Some of the older RTSs were retired too early like the 8600s, there are still O5s at JFK that are probably in worse shape and should go ASAP.

 

As for the ex-PBLs, since they would've gotten 2nd hand buses from the start, they should've been given the NGs first to fill the need for their local services.

Actually, NJT has suburban-style articulated Neoplan buses with lowered aisles, high-backed seats, luggage racks, etc. I rode one once on the 159 and they ride just as well if not slightly better than the Bee-line Neoplans. Nova also makes single-door suburban LFSs; maybe could talk them into building a batch of two-door suburban-style LFSAs for routes like the X1 (5-6 minute headways during rush and there's still some poor guy riding in the stairwell) assuming they replace MCIs at a 1:1 ratio.

 

What I don't get is, you have routes like the X1 that's beyond packed, yet there are other lesser used routes that are barely filled. Why can't the MTA just cut runs from those lesser used lines and give the X1 some extra buses?

[LRG]

Simple...it makes too much sense for the MTA to implement an idea like that!

[Grand Concourse]

Yup, you'd have people b--ching about cuts to their service. But let's face it, if there are other routes that needs more buses and the lines look like they can afford a reduction, then it should be done.

imo, if the bus isn't at least 75% full [and for the distance it travels] then it is a total waste.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Simple...it makes too much sense for the MTA to implement an idea like that!

 

What I don't get is, you have routes like the X1 that's beyond packed, yet there are other lesser used routes that are barely filled. Why can't the MTA just cut runs from those lesser used lines and give the X1 some extra buses?

 

It's about costs. The X1 is a very long route, in fact probably the longest in the express bus system and as such it is apparently costly, despite it having the highest ridership in the system. That's why they slashed the X1 back to push people to other lines that cost less to operate.

[checkmatechamp13]

Well yeah, that would make sense. Aside from that I don't see the point of ending buses so early anyway. It's just another thing that kills routes.

 

How about reducing the frequency from 30 minutes to 60 minutes? I doubt that would kill the S57.

 

I see your not very bright nor can u read so sad. I'm very aware from what I wrote Yonkers is a Garage & the X17J is a SI Xpress route...lol

 

And the X17J is based out of Charleston (or is it Yukon?). In any case, it goes nowhere near Yonkers.

 

People are spoiled. That is why I felt the suburban RTSs should've gone to SC, JFK, FR, and/or LGA for their lower used lines. At least they could've used those buses for the time being for express service and then eventually transition those buses back to local service [and reseating them]. The OGs could've been given to NYCT to use to replace the RTSs sent out.

 

 

Agreed.

 

It's about costs. The X1 is a very long route, in fact probably the longest in the express bus system and as such it is apparently costly, despite it having the highest ridership in the system. That's why they slashed the X1 back to push people to other lines that cost less to operate.

 

Yes and no. The other routes weren't really any cheaper to operate than the X1 (since they were technically variants of the X1). The thing is that there were people who would take the first bus that came, since there are areas where several buses serve the same part of Manhattan, and the X1 was pretty much the most expensive of the group: It took the slowest route to Midtown (which costs more money than using West Street or the FDR).

 

They figured that Lower Manhattan riders would use the X3/X4 (which I believe had spare capacity. I don't think they were as crowded as the Midtown routes), and Midtown riders would use the faster (and cheaper) X7. After the hearing, they probably realized that there was no way that the X7 could handle Midtown by itself, so they had the compromise of keeping the X9, and keeping the X1 south of 23rd Street (since the X7 and X9 would probably have very few seats by the time they reached 23rd Street, and they would want to keep some seats open for West Street riders).

 

I think a similar goal could've been accomplished by eliminating the X1 completely during rush hours and adding some X7/X9 short-turns. That way, riders from 23rd Street to Houston Street have a faster ride (though it may cost more money than the current plan, which is also fairly effective)

[Acela Express]

How'd this thread turn completely off-topic from it's original approach?

 

[mods: anyway to split off the off-topic posts into it's own discussion?]

[Kanarsie Guy]

This broad is full of divas who call thereselves men. Most have no life to stick around this forum all day try to push they opion on people. Fact & Opions are not the same most people on here don't understand that. I made a error on my post how did it get to I don't know about the MTA. I know around the same if not more then some of the people on this broad and not just SI..lol

[Forest Glen]

...except the X64 doesn't run out of a CNG depot.

 

On another note, where the hell has this thread gone to? We have people who type run-on sentences with bad spelling and grammar and don't even know where buses go...Since when did the X17 go to YONKERS???!!!

 

I was referring to a hypothetical scenario

[Forest Glen]

While I like that idea it's something that I just don't see happening due to politics. Over the years there have been RTS' and Orion 5s on the express lines until 1998 when we started getting MCIs, and since then it's been nothing but MCIs for express routes taking over. People would think that a suburban LFS/A would be a downgrade to the over-the-road buses, even if they have the same amenities like our MCIs do, but they still won't buy into it.

 

Truth be told, as long as the express bus had cushioned seats and was not a low floor model, I wouldn't mind any type of bus that ran on an express route.

[Grand Concourse]

A bus is a bus, so long as it handles the road the same, then why should it matter if it is a LF or HF bus? For lower used lines, a LF would be better suited for that, freeing up the HF buses for the heavier used ones.

[via White Plains Road]

For lower used lines, a LF would be better suited for that, freeing up the HF buses for the heavier used ones.

 

Can you tell that to person who runs Casey Stengal for the Q44 and East New York for the B15 b/c they are not obviously not getting the pic?

[Grand Concourse]

:Shrugs: But lately the few times i've been in the Flushing area I've been seeing a bit more O7s [either version] on the Q44 as opposed to the O5s. Obviously it seems management at CS doesn't see a problem with running LF buses on lines like the Q44.

 

*Note, not saying I agree with this, I find it very strange that they would do this. The only other reason is if maybe they bumped up service along those lines with more O7s.

 

As for express buses, they at most run 1 or 2 times per direction a day. IMO, those buses should be filled to nearly full capacity or they may as well cut some runs till the bus is totally full. Local buses are pick and drop constantly in both directions.

[via White Plains Road]

:Shrugs: But lately the few times i've been in the Flushing area I've been seeing a bit more O7s [either version] on the Q44 as opposed to the O5s. Obviously it seems management at CS doesn't see a problem with running LF buses on lines like the Q44.

 

Note, not saying I agree with this, I find it very strange that they would do this.

 

They are going to have a problem when they bottom out....Q44 is one of the busier lines out of CS and it should be using HF's b/c it more seating and roomier IMO!

[Grand Concourse]

And I see what you mean, and I would agree to giving the Q44 artics.

[via White Plains Road]

And I see what you mean, and I would agree to giving the Q44 artics.

 

They should had been gotten Artics!

[Q43LTD]

They should had been gotten Artics!

Can Stengel handle artics?

[Nova RTS 9147]

Can Stengel handle artics?

 

I can't speak for the building itself, but the parking lot may have to be modified a little.

 

Push comes to shove the TA can explore the potentially controversial idea of moving the Q44 to West Farms.

[East New York]

A bus is a bus, so long as it handles the road the same, then why should it matter if it is a LF or HF bus? For lower used lines, a LF would be better suited for that, freeing up the HF buses for the heavier used ones.

 

But a bus isn't just a bus, and they don't all handle the same.

 

I think the X1 could use some 2 door New Flyer artics refitted fo express service. I would keep the LF's with 3 doors on the local lines though. The lower used lines could use new 1 door RTS suburbans. Cheaper, and just as comfy. These newer seats are much better than the old ones.

[LRG]

They are going to have a problem when they bottom out....Q44 is one of the busier lines out of CS and it should be using HF's b/c it more seating and roomier IMO!

 

The same problem lies with Castleton Depot as all they run for the majority of the day are NG and LFS as opposed to O5s, whereas Yukon tends to use their O5s more than their NGs. I see more O5s on the S79 as opposed to the S53 yet the S53 is SI's busiest route with the S79 coming in at a very close second!

[Kanarsie Guy]

But a bus isn't just a bus, and they don't all handle the same.

 

I think the X1 could use some 2 door New Flyer artics refitted fo express service. I would keep the LF's with 3 doors on the local lines though. The lower used lines could use new 1 door RTS suburbans. Cheaper, and just as comfy. These newer seats are much better than the old ones.

 

I have rode different systems with the same models as NYCT you can see a lot. That one of the reason I think MCI are a waste of money in NYC and are not really made to handle NYC. 60FT would do perfect and fit the same amout of people so really where is the problem.

[via White Plains Road]

The same problem lies with Castleton Depot as all they run for the majority of the day are NG and LFS as opposed to O5s, whereas Yukon tends to use their O5s more than their NGs. I see more O5s on the S79 as opposed to the S53 yet the S53 is SI's busiest route with the S79 coming in at a very close second!

 

Yeah I don't get that either....use the V's for the busy or busier routes and use the LF's for the less busier routes!

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The same problem lies with Castleton Depot as all they run for the majority of the day are NG and LFS as opposed to O5s, whereas Yukon tends to use their O5s more than their NGs. I see more O5s on the S79 as opposed to the S53 yet the S53 is SI's busiest route with the S79 coming in at a very close second!

 

I think there are several reasons why they are correct in what they are doing. #1 The NGs and LFSs are newer thus fewer breakdowns, cleaner and are just more pleasant to ride on in general. #2 they are both low floor buses, which help make boarding quicker and #3 those buses accelerate faster and are especially good with dealing with all of the slopes and hills on Staten Island. That's one reason why I think local bus service isn't as bad as it was when all we had were Orions. I

 

haven't used the local buses in a while on Staten Island (aside from last Wednesday evening when I hopped on an S48 for two stops because I was too lazy to walk from the X14 and saw one coming ), as now that it is hot I just take car service to and from the express bus during late nights and weekends, but every time I see an Orion on SI I cringe. I can't wait for those things to be retired. Now I rode on one a while back on the Q32 on 5th Avenue and that one had clearly been cleaned up. New seats and they were in much better shape than the ones on SI. If all of the Orions were like that one I would be more inclined to have them stay around.

 

Getting back to the Orions, Yukon doesn't have that many NGs so they have to run more Orions. They don't have many local bus lines anyway, esp. when you compare them to Castleton.

[JubaionBx12+SBS]

For the future artics should run on the most highly used routes regardless of borough. I would set the threshold at 20,000 weekday riders. If a route gets over that total it will run artics on weekdays. If it maintains that total on weekends then the route will use them full time. For all other routes artics serve as an excuse to reduce service. The lingo at most bus depots in the Bronx and Manhattan is that 4 artics=5 40ft buses. If a route is not suffering horribly from overcrowding I and many others would rather see more 40 foot buses show up over having to wait longer for an artic. If a Manhattan crosstown like the M34 were to get Select Bus Service I would support artics going there as well. It may not meet the 20,000 weekday trips threshold but for a route with it's length it gets quite a few.