X22 to the Outerbridge Park and Ride Review

[FamousNYLover]

Only thing X22 doesn't replace AE-7 portion on Hylan Blvd between Page Av & Seguine Av.

[qjtransitmaster]

But now, Park-and-Ride riders still have to sit through all of the stops along Bloomingdale Road, which is a deterrant to ridership (also, it's more expensive, which you know is something I would say. ).

 

Plus, if the park-and-ride ever sees significant usage, Bloomingdale Road riders may have a hard time getting on the buses.

 

I don't see how it would make the X1 itself more cost-efficient, but I could see how overall, service would be more efficient down there (Rather than having to run more X1s through all of the stops on Hylan Blvd, they would be able to turn some X1 trips into faster (and cheaper) X22 trips.

 

But then again, there might not be the demand for off-peak X22 service if the ferry is only 45 minutes from Midtown at a comparable fare.

true ppl will NOT pay more for a slower service. In the world of transit only the fastest and most efficient routes should survive.

 

That's exactly the point. You run fewer X1s and more X22s and it may be more cost effective that way.

 

Oh and big deal. The X1 riders sit through a sh*t load of stops as well. No biggie. They just take a nap or read or whatever. Still beats making a million transfers.

 

problem if the ferry is completed then the x22 is as good as dead unless they route it through holland tunnel with a few NJ stops. Hay checkmate will the highspeed ferry serve downtown or only midtown??

[via White Plains Road]

Yeah, that's possible because not all X22s stop at the park and ride. Some just go to Tottenville like before.

 

Ok...sorry no pic b/c I spotted the X22 too late. The one I seen today along Madison Avenue said "Tottenville via Park-Ride via Amboy Rd. I guess that's the new sign or one of the new signs!

[checkmatechamp13]

true ppl will NOT pay more for a slower service. In the world of transit only the fastest and most efficient routes should survive.

 

problem if the ferry is completed then the x22 is as good as dead unless they route it through holland tunnel with a few NJ stops. Hay checkmate will the highspeed ferry serve downtown or only midtown??

 

I have no idea which one it will serve.

[qjtransitmaster]

Only thing X22 doesn't replace AE-7 portion on Hylan Blvd between Page Av & Seguine Av.

 

again it doesn't need to thanks to S59 and S78

[Via Garibaldi 8]

problem if the ferry is completed then the x22 is as good as dead unless they route it through holland tunnel with a few NJ stops. Hay checkmate will the highspeed ferry serve downtown or only midtown??

 

The X22 will not be as good as dead because the ferry ride will require a transfer once you get into Manhattan and the X22 offers a one seat ride. Also fast ferry service doesn't come cheap, so it will certainly be just about as expensive as the express bus. Most fast ferries cost a good $4 - $5 each way minimum and when it is cold out I doubt many folks will want to deal with the ferry, be it a fast ferry or not. Even if it is still cheaper than the express bus if one plans on using the subway or bus in Manhattan that will be $2.25 each way or more or they'll have to buy an Unlimited Metrocard. Now I do know that some folks take a bus on 42nd st and I believe that it may be free to get over to the ferry, but those buses will not serve everyone's needs coming to or from the fast ferry.

 

As far as where it will stop, it will make stops in Midtown for sure. Downtown I am not sure about, but since it will make a few stops there may be a Downtown stop or stops along the way.

 

Ok...sorry no pic b/c I spotted the X22 too late. The one I seen today along Madison Avenue said "Tottenville via Park-Ride via Amboy Rd. I guess that's the new sign or one of the new signs!

 

Yeah, there are a few new destination signs for the X22 now because some hav their last stop as the park-and-ride and some go directly to Tottenville, bypassing the park-and-ride and some stop at the park-and-ride and continue on to Tottenville. This week I've been sort of lazy getting out so I've been leaving later and taking car service to other express bus lines. On Monday I took the X17J to work after a stop along Richmond Avenue. I took the X12 home to car service. Tuesday I took car service over to the X12 in and the X42 home to car service and today I took car service to the X12 in and the X30 home.

 

I was tempted to go over to the X17J or the X2 yesterday morning and this morning, but I was afraid car service wouldn't make it in time and I would have to stop at the bank before getting to the express bus. The cost for the X17J and X2 is the same car service wise ($12.00) and I may just go over to the X22 for the hell of it when I get up later to see what the ride is like since those lines run service later than my usual express bus lines. The X31 is another one I may consider since it isn't too far from where I catch the X10 on the weekends or where I get off at during late night nights. :cool:

[via White Plains Road]

The X22 will not be as good as dead because the ferry ride will require a transfer once you get into Manhattan and the X22 offers a one seat ride. Also fast ferry service doesn't come cheap, so it will certainly be just about as expensive as the express bus. Most fast ferries cost a good $4 - $5 each way minimum and when it is cold out I doubt many folks will want to deal with the ferry, be it a fast ferry or not. Even if it is still cheaper than the express bus if one plans on using the subway or bus in Manhattan that will be $2.25 each way or more or they'll have to buy an Unlimited Metrocard.

 

As far as where it will stop, it will make stops in Midtown for sure. Downtown I am not sure about, but since it will make a few stops there may be a Downtown stop or stops along the way.

 

 

 

Yeah, there are a few new destination signs for the X22 now because some hav their last stop as the park-and-ride and some go directly to Tottenville, bypassing the park-and-ride and some stop at the park-and-ride and continue on to Tottenville. This week I've been sort of lazy getting out so I've been leaving later and taking car service to other express bus lines. On Monday I took the X17J to work after a stop along Richmond Avenue. I took the X12 home to car service. Tuesday I took car service over to the X12 in and the X42 home to car service and today I took car service to the X12 in and the X30 home.

 

I was tempted to go over to the X17J or the X2 yesterday morning and this morning, but I was afraid car service wouldn't make it in time and I would have to stop at the bank before getting to the express bus. The cost for the X17J and X2 is the same car service wise ($12.00) and I may just go over to the X22 for the hell of it when I get up later to see what the ride is like since those lines run service later than my usual express bus lines. The X31 is another one I may consider since it isn't too far from where I catch the X10 on the weekends or where I get off at during late night nights. :cool:

 

I got to try that X22 out one day but idk if I feel like dealing with the S78 on the way back to the City. Also I got a new bus sign to make for the X22 !

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I got to try that X22 out one day but idk if I feel like dealing with the S78 on the way back to the City. Also I got a new bus sign to make for the X22 !

 

 

Well what you could do is call for car service and take it over to the Eltingville Transit Center and get either the X1 or the X17C back to the city. I use Clove Lake Cars so much that they know my voice by now and have a car waiting for me once I'm off of the express bus unless they're really busy. Sometimes they'll send a Lincoln car too which is nice. Their office is over on Victory not too far from me, but they go all over the island and have reasonable rates. One guy I deal with is a snake (he'll try to overcharge if you aren't careful) so just call them up and ask for the price ahead of time. The females and the other males I deal with there are cool though and you can usually get a cab in 10-15 minutes, but if you call ahead you'll have one waiting for you. :cool:

 

Yesterday was funny though. I got one of my regulars and she was busting my chops about how cranky I get if I have to wait and how I keep calling demanding to know where my car is. LOL

[qjtransitmaster]

Well what you could do is call for car service and take it over to the Eltingville Transit Center and get either the X1 or the X17C back to the city. I use Clove Lake Cars so much that they know my voice by now and have a car waiting for me once I'm off of the express bus unless they're really busy. Sometimes they'll send a Lincoln car too which is nice. Their office is over on Victory not too far from me, but they go all over the island and have reasonable rates. One guy I deal with is a snake (he'll try to overcharge if you aren't careful) so just call them up and ask for the price ahead of time. The females and the other males I deal with there are cool though and you can usually get a cab in 10-15 minutes, but if you call ahead you'll have one waiting for you. :cool:

 

Yesterday was funny though. I got one of my regulars and she was busting my chops about how cranky I get if I have to wait and how I keep calling demanding to know where my car is. LOL

 

I would use 78 to X1 or SIR to estingville

[via White Plains Road]

Well what you could do is call for car service and take it over to the Eltingville Transit Center and get either the X1 or the X17C back to the city. I use Clove Lake Cars so much that they know my voice by now and have a car waiting for me once I'm off of the express bus unless they're really busy. Sometimes they'll send a Lincoln car too which is nice. Their office is over on Victory not too far from me, but they go all over the island and have reasonable rates. One guy I deal with is a snake (he'll try to overcharge if you aren't careful) so just call them up and ask for the price ahead of time. The females and the other males I deal with there are cool though and you can usually get a cab in 10-15 minutes, but if you call ahead you'll have one waiting for you. :cool:

 

Yesterday was funny though. I got one of my regulars and she was busting my chops about how cranky I get if I have to wait and how I keep calling demanding to know where my car is. LOL

 

That would be nice....I could use a car service lololol :

 

I would use 78 to X1 or SIR to estingville

 

Ah its spelled Eltingville

[checkmatechamp13]

The X22 will not be as good as dead because the ferry ride will require a transfer once you get into Manhattan and the X22 offers a one seat ride. Also fast ferry service doesn't come cheap, so it will certainly be just about as expensive as the express bus. Most fast ferries cost a good $4 - $5 each way minimum and when it is cold out I doubt many folks will want to deal with the ferry, be it a fast ferry or not. Even if it is still cheaper than the express bus if one plans on using the subway or bus in Manhattan that will be $2.25 each way or more or they'll have to buy an Unlimited Metrocard. Now I do know that some folks take a bus on 42nd st and I believe that it may be free to get over to the ferry, but those buses will not serve everyone's needs coming to or from the fast ferry.

 

As far as where it will stop, it will make stops in Midtown for sure. Downtown I am not sure about, but since it will make a few stops there may be a Downtown stop or stops along the way.

 

I was tempted to go over to the X17J or the X2 yesterday morning and this morning, but I was afraid car service wouldn't make it in time and I would have to stop at the bank before getting to the express bus. The cost for the X17J and X2 is the same car service wise ($12.00) and I may just go over to the X22 for the hell of it when I get up later to see what the ride is like since those lines run service later than my usual express bus lines. The X31 is another one I may consider since it isn't too far from where I catch the X10 on the weekends or where I get off at during late night nights. :cool:

 

1) You also have to consider that, even though a lot of people in the South Shore drive to the express bus, there are plenty of people who value having the express bus within walking distance. That way, you don't have to get in the car and drive (even if it's a fairly short distance) after a long day at work.

 

2) So where would you go for the X22? Travis? If that's the case, you might as well just go for the X17J.

 

According to Google Transit, the last X22 of the morning reaches Travis at 09:38, and the last X17J reaches Richmond Avenue/Christopher Lane at 09:51, and it takes longer for the car service to reach Travis.

 

I would use 78 to X1 or SIR to estingville

 

He could take the SIR to Old Town for the X1 rather than Eltingville. He'd probably catch one that he would've otherwise missed (and in the afternoon, X1s run every hour, so he'd really save himself some time)

 

Or, of course, he could take the SIR all the way to St. George.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

1) You also have to consider that, even though a lot of people in the South Shore drive to the express bus, there are plenty of people who value having the express bus within walking distance. That way, you don't have to get in the car and drive (even if it's a fairly short distance) after a long day at work.

 

2) So where would you go for the X22? Travis? If that's the case, you might as well just go for the X17J.

 

According to Google Transit, the last X22 of the morning reaches Travis at 09:38, and the last X17J reaches Richmond Avenue/Christopher Lane at 09:51, and it takes longer for the car service to reach Travis.

 

I'm confused about the part in bold as to how it applies to this conversation?? :confused:

 

As for where I would get the X22, I haven't thought that far, but a quick hop on the SIE wouldn't take long to get to it. However, yes, the X17J is easier to get to, but if done right the X22 could be used as well.

[checkmatechamp13]

I'm confused about the part in bold as to how it applies to this conversation?? :confused:

 

As for where I would get the X22, I haven't thought that far, but a quick hop on the SIE wouldn't take long to get to it. However, yes, the X17J is easier to get to, but if done right the X22 could be used as well.

 

He's saying that the X22 would be dead if the ferry came along, but I'm saying that it would still see ridership from people who don't want to drive over to the ferry. There are a lot of people who live within a few blocks of the X22 (especially in the Rossville area), and those people are likely to be more open to walking to transit rather than driving.

[qjtransitmaster]

That would be nice....I could use a car service lololol :

 

 

 

Ah its spelled Eltingville

 

I am sorry but my keyboard sometimes doesn't work well when I type fast

[qjtransitmaster]

He's saying that the X22 would be dead if the ferry came along, but I'm saying that it would still see ridership from people who don't want to drive over to the ferry. There are a lot of people who live within a few blocks of the X22 (especially in the Rossville area), and those people are likely to be more open to walking to transit rather than driving.

 

one problem several local routes connect to SIR which will link to this high-speed ferry heck they have S74 again that would kill the whole drive vs walk argument dead rendering X22 useless at least during off-peak times.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

one problem several local routes connect to SIR which will link to this high-speed ferry heck they have S74 again that would kill the whole drive vs walk argument dead rendering X22 useless at least during off-peak times.

 

Oh please. Express bus riders on Staten Island are not going to switch over to the local buses or SIR. Not happening.

 

I am sorry but my keyboard sometimes doesn't work well when I type fast

 

 

LMAO... Is that right???

[qjtransitmaster]

Oh please. Express bus riders on Staten Island are not going to switch over to the local buses or SIR. Not happening.

 

 

 

 

LMAO... Is that right???[/QUOTE]unfortunately yes!!!!!! I don't have a good keyboard on my PC.

 

True not happening if the express bus remains faster and more direct. But if other methods beat it in travel time ppl have little patience they will use the fastest transport mode available to them that offers a balance in cost and speed.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

True not happening if the express bus remains faster and more direct. But if other methods beat it in travel time ppl have little patience they will use the fastest transport mode available to them that offers a balance in cost and speed.

 

 

Not necessarily. There are plenty of express bus riders like myself that will use the express bus in lieu of the local bus on Staten Island or the SIR because the express bus offers a one seat ride and is more comfortable and there is no riff raff for the most part and it's much cleaner overall as well. Many express bus riders on Staten Island will NOT use the subway regardless of the traffic backup when we're in the city going towards Midtown, so this situation would be no different. Express bus riders esp. on the South Shore are less likely to use the subway. I think part of it is that they don't want to switch, but also the subway is rather looked down upon, although some folks won't come out and say so, but the classic example of the husband and wife that sat in front of me where the husband flat out refused to take the subway and get off the express bus and actually became angry and irritated that his wife kept suggesting the idea is a perfect example. The express bus is seen as safer because it costs more and the general perception is that there will be less riff raff because folks that ride the express bus tend to be more affluent, thus classier. :cool:

 

I see it all the time on Staten Island where parents drive their teenagers to the express bus and see that they get on, but there's this vibe that they'll be safe on the express bus as opposed to the SIR or the local bus where kids have been robbed or beaten up on Staten Island.

[Gorgor]

True not happening if the express bus remains faster and more direct. But if other methods beat it in travel time ppl have little patience they will use the fastest transport mode available to them that offers a balance in cost and speed.

 

No, people will use the most convenient form of transportation as long as it isn't extremely slow such as taking twice as long as the alternates. Not only is transferring annoying as hell, but dealing with the constant stops on the local bus/subway as well as having to stand sometimes is just not worth saving $3.25.

 

For the case in question, which one is the logical choice:

1. Express Bus

2. SIR -> Ferry -> Subway

 

Is comfort and convenience worth $3.25?

 

For me, I can get my commute down to about 35 minutes if I rush, but that requires me taking the crosstown bus -> subway -> walk half a mile as opposed to the 45 minutes on the express before. So while i end up saving just a few bucks I run into a massive headache just trying to squeeze into the train which already has about 200 other passengers in it. Oh and forget trying to get some extra sleep or trying to do something productive like read over my notes on the crosstown or train.

 

You need to understand that not all riders care about getting there in the fastest amount of time possible, but more so a mixture of that with comfort and convenience, and there is nothing more comfortable and convenient than an express bus in terms of public transportation.

[checkmatechamp13]

Oh please. Express bus riders on Staten Island are not going to switch over to the local buses or SIR. Not happening.

 

LMAO... Is that right???

 

You have to consider that because Staten Island is express bus-centric (as far as getting to Manhattan goes), there are a lot of people who would be willing to transfer to reach the express bus. I mean, the SIR does see decent ridership in the South Shore from the residents there, so not all of them see the local bus/SIR as "beneath them"

 

Are there plenty of people who wouldn't be caught dead on the subway or local bus? Yes.

 

Are there people who don't want to drive and are willing to take the local bus for 10-15 minutes? Yes.

 

For me, I can get my commute down to about 35 minutes if I rush, but that requires me taking the crosstown bus -> subway -> walk half a mile as opposed to the 45 minutes on the express before. So while i end up saving just a few bucks I run into a massive headache just trying to squeeze into the train which already has about 200 other passengers in it. Oh and forget trying to get some extra sleep or trying to do something productive like read over my notes on the crosstown or train.

 

 

There are a lot more than 200 riders on the train. The average train carries something like 1,500 riders per train.

[Gorgor]

You have to consider that because Staten Island is express bus-centric (as far as getting to Manhattan goes), there are a lot of people who would be willing to transfer to reach the express bus. I mean, the SIR does see decent ridership in the South Shore from the residents there, so not all of them see the local bus/SIR as "beneath them"

 

Are there plenty of people who wouldn't be caught dead on the subway or local bus? Yes.

 

Are there people who don't want to drive and are willing to take the local bus for 10-15 minutes? Yes.

 

 

 

There are a lot more than 200 riders on the train. The average train carries something like 1,500 riders per train.

 

Oops, I meant trying to squeeze into a car where there's at least 200 other people in it.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

You have to consider that because Staten Island is express bus-centric (as far as getting to Manhattan goes), there are a lot of people who would be willing to transfer to reach the express bus. I mean, the SIR does see decent ridership in the South Shore from the residents there, so not all of them see the local bus/SIR as "beneath them"

 

Are there plenty of people who wouldn't be caught dead on the subway or local bus? Yes.

 

Are there people who don't want to drive and are willing to take the local bus for 10-15 minutes? Yes.

 

I'm not sure I get your point. I think you're thinking along the lines of Richmond Avenue, but Richmond Avenue is the exception and not really the norm and that's probably because the buses along Richmond Avenue run with such frequency. When I took that S59 on Richmond over by Forest Avenue to get over to get the X17J on Monday, a few people got on and they stayed right in the front where I was. None of us sat down and there was certainly this air of local bus riders vs express bus riders going on. Express bus riders, the true express bus riders will generally not transfer to a local bus unless it is convenient, safe and not packed and I know for a fact that some of them won't be caught dead on a local bus.

 

I hear folks all the time calling their relatives to pick them up when they could certainly take the local bus, but as far as they are concerned, the local bus isn't an option and so they have to be picked up. Local buses are looked down upon for the most part on Staten Island because the idea is that the poor folks use them. It is okay to use it once in a while for short distances to the express bus if you're going to or from work, but to use it as a primary means of transportation... :tdown: :tdown: :tdown: I mean using the local bus in the other boroughs like Manhattan doesn't carry any stigma, but in Staten Island it does. You'd be surprised at how many people use car service as their personal chofer. They'll go from their house and go just a few blocks and call car service to go to and from the house instead of walking.

 

I remember once a regular and I had missed the last X16 so we had to take the S53 (B/O came early (:mad:) and it got so crowded and I got so irritated with all of those people near me, that me and the young lady that I was with that started berating the local riders indirectly. I mean I felt like I was in a jungle and basically said so and while I got a few looks of disbelief, no one had the balls to say anything, probably because they knew it was true. LOL I would've put them in check if they did say anything since I was speaking the truth. We both took the S53 down to Hylan and she got the X1 and my X2 came right away. :cool: I would've taken car service, but by the time a car would've come I would've missed that X2 and would've been late and in her case, her husband would've taken too long to come and pick her up to drive her to the X15 or in this case the X1.

 

There are a lot more than 200 riders on the train. The average train carries something like 1,500 riders per train.

 

He's talking about per subway car, not the actual entire train...

[FamousNYLover]

I agree with via.

Before the MTA Fare Hike, I took last 8:30 Atlantic Express X23 out of Huguenot-Drumgoogle Rd, At last pickup at Arthur Kill Rd/Route 440, bus was crowded and some riders properly switch to wait for X24 bus.

 

When I took X23 to SIR, none of X23 passengers did not switch to SIR/Local bus.

[checkmatechamp13]

1) I'm not sure I get your point. I think you're thinking along the lines of Richmond Avenue, but Richmond Avenue is the exception and not really the norm and that's probably because the buses along Richmond Avenue run with such frequency. When I took that S59 on Richmond over by Forest Avenue to get over to get the X17J on Monday, a few people got on and they stayed right in the front where I was. None of us sat down and there was certainly this air of local bus riders vs express bus riders going on. Express bus riders, the true express bus riders will generally not transfer to a local bus unless it is convenient, safe and not packed and I know for a fact that some of them won't be caught dead on a local bus.

 

I hear folks all the time calling their relatives to pick them up when they could certainly take the local bus, but as far as they are concerned, the local bus isn't an option and so they have to be picked up. Local buses are looked down upon for the most part on Staten Island because the idea is that the poor folks use them. It is okay to use it once in a while for short distances to the express bus if you're going to or from work, but to use it as a primary means of transportation... :tdown: :tdown: :tdown: I mean using the local bus in the other boroughs like Manhattan doesn't carry any stigma, but in Staten Island it does. You'd be surprised at how many people use car service as their personal chofer. They'll go from their house and go just a few blocks and call car service to go to and from the house instead of walking.

 

2) He's talking about per subway car, not the actual entire train...

 

1) So how many people were on the S59, and out of those, how many transferred to the X17?

 

And like I said, there aren't as many people who actually look down on the local bus as you think. Considering how well-covered most areas are in terms of express buses, it isn't surprising that most people don't transfer.

 

Plus, there are plenty of people wearing suits and ties on the S48 during rush hour (as well as the other lines that don't run near the SIR), so there are plenty of non-poor people who take them.

 

2) Yeah, he clarified himself.

 

I agree with via.

Before the MTA Fare Hike, I took last 8:30 Atlantic Express X23 out of Huguenot-Drumgoogle Rd, At last pickup at Arthur Kill Rd/Route 440, bus was crowded and some riders properly switch to wait for X24 bus.

 

When I took X23 to SIR, none of X23 passengers did not switch to SIR/Local bus.

 

Well, during rush hour, that's the be expected, especially on the South Shore. You have to consider that pretty much every neighborhood has access to an express bus, so there is no point in transferring: You might as well wait for the bus you want (I can't think of why somebody would want to transfer between the X23 and X24)

 

Plus, the local bus service isn't really good. The only corridor that has really good local service (and no express service) is Hylan Blvd, with the S59 and S78.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

1) So how many people were on the S59, and out of those, how many transferred to the X17?

 

Three when you include me and they wanted to get off just as bad as I did in terms of speed, and not because we were in such a hurry either. lol It was pretty funny thinking back on it and the local bus riders were all gawking at us as they usually do when they see the express buses pass by. Sometimes when I'm on the X30 and we're passing through Port Richmond and Mariners' Harbor and I look at how those local bus riders look at the express bus folks, they have such resentment and anger in their facial expressions that they look like they want to rob them or something. The next time you ride and express on Staten Island, just observe how the local riders act when they see an express bus passing by in certain areas. B) LOL

 

I have it West Brighton, but not to the same degree because there aren't many local bus riders at my stops when I get off or on. Then again West Brighton is more upscale than Mariners' Harbor or parts of Port Richmond, so that makes sense. :cool:

 

And like I said, there aren't as many people who actually look down on the local bus as you think. Considering how well-covered most areas are in terms of express buses, it isn't surprising that most people don't transfer.

 

That is certainly not true. Plenty of folks transfer between express buses and in fact they could very well use the local buses to do so which in some cases make the exact same stop, but they refuse to do so. :cool:

 

Plus, there are plenty of people wearing suits and ties on the S48 during rush hour (as well as the other lines that don't run near the SIR), so there are plenty of non-poor people who take them.

 

During the rush hour yeah, you'll see some in parts of West Brighton esp. at Bard Avenue, but overall that is not the case. More affluent folks on Staten Island tend to use the express buses. It would be interesting to measure the income levels of the local bus riders to that of the express bus riders. Can you find any stats on that?