cotb16 Posted July 11, 2011 Share #26 Posted July 11, 2011 on top of that the is LESS frequent than the However, full service (which runs every 8-10 minutes during the day) is more than the split service Lefferts riders get (which runs every 12-16 minutes during the day). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quill Depot Posted July 11, 2011 Share #27 Posted July 11, 2011 However, full service (which runs every 8-10 minutes during the day) is more than the split service Lefferts riders get (which runs every 12-16 minutes during the day). Your right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amtrak7 Posted July 11, 2011 Share #28 Posted July 11, 2011 to Lefferts will bring public opposition, but it's the easiest thing to do. How about this? RUSH HOURS: - to Howard Beach - to Far Rockaway/Lefferts Bl/Rockaway Park (Lefferts/Rockaway every 10-12 min, Rockaway Park 15-17 min) OTHER TIMES: - to Lefferts - to Far Rockaway/Rockaway Park (evenly split) NIGHTS: - to Far Rockaway -Shuttles to Lefferts Bl (change at Rockaway not Euclid) -Hourly Rockaway Park to Beach 67 St. The problem with splitting the into too many branches is less during rush hour, when airport travel is less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shortline Bus Posted July 12, 2011 Author Share #29 Posted July 12, 2011 Replies in red. to Lefferts will bring public opposition, but it's the easiest thing to do. How about this? RUSH HOURS: - to Howard Beach - to Far Rockaway/Lefferts Bl/Rockaway Park (Lefferts/Rockaway every 10-12 min, Rockaway Park 15-17 min) This is not a bad idea. With that said, I would rename the Lefferts branch the <A> and run it all day weekdays until around 8pm. That way Ozone park/Richmond Hill riders have all day 'express' service weekdays. Thus no need to run the to Howard Beach to avoid confusion. OTHER TIMES: - to Lefferts - to Far Rockaway/Rockaway Park (evenly split) Other than the summer, Rockaway Park does not need all that service. Thus 'short trip' would start/end at Howard Beach between appx. 8am-9pm weekends. During the summer between Memorial Day and Labor Day weekends a few 'short trip' or alternative could be extended to/from Rockaway Park hourly until 9pm. NIGHTS: - to Far Rockaway -Shuttles to Lefferts Bl (change at Rockaway not Euclid) -Hourly Rockaway Park to Beach 67 St. Instead of hourly to Beach 67 you could run the Rockaway Park to Euclid Ave. Rock Park riders would rather transfer and wait at Euclid for Manhattan Bound then at frigid Broad Channel during the winter. I also would keep the Lefferts shuttle between Euclid and Lefferts. The problem with splitting the into too many branches is less during rush hour, when airport travel is less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amtrak7 Posted July 12, 2011 Share #30 Posted July 12, 2011 Labeling the Lefferts the <A> isn't a good idea. If the <A> designation, it should be used for Rock Park trips. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadcruiser1 Posted July 12, 2011 Share #31 Posted July 12, 2011 Why are we using the diamond symbols? I have explained that diamond signs only designate express service for the same letter while the circle symbols designates local service for the same letter. There isn't any use or viability in using diamonds especially since the has been trying to rid the system of them since tourists that visits the city gets confused about what service is what. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grand Concourse Posted July 12, 2011 Share #32 Posted July 12, 2011 The is not going to Lefferts...at all. Ozone Park is a high NIMBY area. Its not as bad as other places *cough Springfield Gardens* but its still up there. Those people will fight tooth & nail to keep their 1 seat express ride to the city. As for the original question, there's no need for it. Every PM rush, there's only 3-5 trains that go to Rockaway Pk. As for the , its 8 cars on summer weekends just for the beach people (since that's when you have the most ridership at those near-abandoned stations) And I don't blame them, why would anyone want to give up a one seat express for a local? People that still thinks the should replace the to Lefferts must be smoking some really heavy sh-t. They will never get it... [everyone will be getting off at Rockaway Blvd and cram onto the leaving those trains empty to Euclid - it would be a major waste.] A similar example would be if someone were to replace the with the to 179th, people would scream like hell if that were to happen. Exactly, the 8-car trains are enough. at most, if there realy needs to be another train for the , then so be it. But I don't see the need for a special train all the way from 59th St. If it gets so bad, then have the go to Rockaway Park and have the to go to Far Rockaway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IRT Bronx Express Posted July 12, 2011 Share #33 Posted July 12, 2011 A similar example would be if someone were to replace the with the to 179th, people would scream like hell if that were to happen.Funny you mentioned that because the used to go there via local while the operated express past Forest Hills. btw, why was the cut back to Forest Hills? Was it due to low ridership? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grand Concourse Posted July 12, 2011 Share #34 Posted July 12, 2011 I would guess maybe. Most people just preferring to take the or transfering to it at the express stops rather than to take the all the way to 71st. That plus before the Parsons-Archer extension, the used to run express to 179th [i believe]. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoTimer Posted July 12, 2011 Share #35 Posted July 12, 2011 No, just put simply, no. Let the casino crowds actually arrive, then let management make a decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kacie Jane Posted July 12, 2011 Share #36 Posted July 12, 2011 I would guess maybe. Most people just preferring to take the or transfering to it at the express stops rather than to take the all the way to 71st. That plus before the Parsons-Archer extension, the used to run express to 179th [i believe]. Exactly. It didn't work for exactly the same reason the to Lefferts won't work. Prior to 1988, the ran Hillside express and the was local - but still express after Forest Hills - so Jamaica residents were "spoiled"... regardless of whether they were at a local or express stop, they could get a train that would be express at least most of the way to Manhattan. The extension to Jamaica only lasted 4 years, and should really be clear evidence that we can just nip "© to Lefferts" discussion in the bud. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadcruiser1 Posted July 12, 2011 Share #37 Posted July 12, 2011 Actually that would make my last post in the thread the most realistic, and that would be making the Aqueduct Racetrack Station into a permanent station where the train will be stopping at all times. The best thing would be to build a southbound platform, and to build a station house with a station agent, and Metrocard machines on the southbound side with a staircase connecting the southbound platform to the northbound platform. At the same time you can make the station ADA accessible. You can turn the northbound platform, and it's station house accessible to the street as well, and a way to enter the casino along with the racetrack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IRT Bronx Express Posted July 12, 2011 Share #38 Posted July 12, 2011 Why? Aqueduct Racetrack is the least utilized station. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadcruiser1 Posted July 12, 2011 Share #39 Posted July 12, 2011 That is why you would build a southbound platform with access to the street below. Therefore people in the nearby neighborhood would use this station. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grand Concourse Posted July 12, 2011 Share #40 Posted July 12, 2011 Exactly. It didn't work for exactly the same reason the to Lefferts won't work. Prior to 1988, the ran Hillside express and the was local - but still express after Forest Hills - so Jamaica residents were "spoiled"... regardless of whether they were at a local or express stop, they could get a train that would be express at least most of the way to Manhattan. The extension to Jamaica only lasted 4 years, and should really be clear evidence that we can just nip "© to Lefferts" discussion in the bud. Thank you! Wow, that long huh? Sadly some folks will still concider sending the to Lefferts. Thus making this arguement falling on deaf ears. I mean just because the map shows it's is only 3 stops doesn't mean they are lightly used. You can bundle most of the Rockaway branch stations [sans the major stops] and they would be about the same amount of riders as those 3 stops on Lefferts. So, I think the split service is more or less fair. The best way to end the confusion would be to rename one of those branches into either an or and the other left as the . No need to change anything, especially the Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadcruiser1 Posted July 12, 2011 Share #41 Posted July 12, 2011 LOL That's the Mr. Robert Moses attitude. Basically it goes like "Screw you I don't f**king care if you like it or not, but you are going to f**king sit there, and your are going to f**king like it, because I spent a lot of damn f**king money to get this built, and you and your damn children are going to like it and use it no matter what". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokkemon Posted July 12, 2011 Share #42 Posted July 12, 2011 That is why you would build a southbound platform with access to the street below. Therefore people in the nearby neighborhood would use this station. ... Have you ever been in that neighborhood, let alone lived there? Aqueduct-North Conduit is plenty good enough. Besides, N Conduit and Aqueduct Racetrack are so close together, it makes the southbound platform pointless. It was designed to specifically work for the Racetrack, just like Willets Pt was designed to specifically work for Flushing Meadows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadcruiser1 Posted July 12, 2011 Share #43 Posted July 12, 2011 I found out that North Conduit was connected to Aqueduct with a passageway just now so yeah forget about it. North Conduit should be enough. Should have done my homework first, but really though the other option would be to increase the amount of trains running on the Rockaway Line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoTimer Posted July 12, 2011 Share #44 Posted July 12, 2011 The racetrack is currently closed and the other side of it is people's backyards lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokkemon Posted July 12, 2011 Share #45 Posted July 12, 2011 There's no need to increase capacity down there. When the Rockaways have some of the lowest ridership in the system, even in Summer, I doubt the needs to bend over backwards to accommodate them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trainmaster5 Posted July 12, 2011 Share #46 Posted July 12, 2011 No, just put simply, no. Let the casino crowds actually arrive, then let management make a decision. I would guess that extra " casino" service will probably be a waste as far as the average person is concerned. That person will travel to/from Aqueduct by car or bus because it's inherently safer. Why would anyone knowingly paint a bullseye on their back by riding a subway from Aqueduct Casino ? That's why many riders stopped using the train to the racetrack in the first place. Just my opinion. Carry on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreatOne2k Posted July 12, 2011 Share #47 Posted July 12, 2011 I would guess that extra " casino" service will probably be a waste as far as the average person is concerned. That person will travel to/from Aqueduct by car or bus because it's inherently safer. Why would anyone knowingly paint a bullseye on their back by riding a subway from Aqueduct Casino ? That's why many riders stopped using the train to the racetrack in the first place. Just my opinion. Carry on. People ride the and the W20 to/from Yonkers Raceway, look at all of the extra service Bee Line had to add (most of it is now extended to Cross County during the daytime). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreatOne2k Posted July 12, 2011 Share #48 Posted July 12, 2011 Just run the at 8-10 minute headways on summer weekends and split the service up in 3. - Far Rockaway 24-30 minutes - Lefferts Boulevard 24-30 minutes - Rockaway Park 24-30 minutes 2 of the 3 branches already have 30 minute evening service so this shouldn't be an issue. Rockaway Park riders would also have a 10 car train. The Shuttle could even be suspended while the is running three branch service (saving the MTA some money). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trainmaster5 Posted July 12, 2011 Share #49 Posted July 12, 2011 People ride the and the W20 to/from Yonkers Raceway, look at all of the extra service Bee Line had to add (most of it is now extended to Cross County during the daytime). Trust me on this one. I have a lot of free time since my retirement so I get around to different places weekly. My in-laws are a 5 minute walk from Aqueduct. It's a 10 minute drive from my house to Aqueduct There's a difference in the neighborhoods involved. S Ozone Pk and environs (Aqueduct) is not Empire City. I frequent both areas and cars and buses are the safer mode of transport, especially in Queens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallyhorse Posted July 12, 2011 Share #50 Posted July 12, 2011 Why? Aqueduct Racetrack is the least utilized station. That's going to change with the casino opening at Aqueduct in two phases: Phase 1 opens in October. Phase 2 opens either at the end of this year or early next year. When fully operational, the casino at Aqueduct is going to be the largest on the east coast. As it also will be one of the few accessible by subway, I think that may force a change of the to Lefferts at all times (and possibly 24/7, eliminating the overnight ) while ALL trains are shifted to the Rockaway branch in order to serve the new casino. This also would eliminate the Rockaway Park (except overnights) since the would now be serving both Far Rockaway at all times and Rockaway Park except during the overnight hours. I do know the new casino owner is planning to have an enclosed entrance from the subway right to the casino, and I have also said if it were me running it, I would be perfectly willing to pay for two new platforms at the Aqueduct station: One on the southbound side and an island platform in the middle that can be used to short-turn trains along with re-building the "missing express" track in the middle of the station for that purpose. That can allow for some possible extra runs on the starting at Aqueduct in the late-night hours and at other peak periods for the casino as warranted. The Lefferts riders may not like losing the for the , but if it eliminates their two-seat ride in the overnight hours (Lefferts to the ) that they have with the being local while at the same time (because of the becoming a 24/7 line) allowing the to become an express at all times, I think they would accept it, especially if you have the being an express line 24/7 in Brooklyn and Manhattan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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