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Bx1/Bx2/Bx13 options to Gateway Mall (and E 153 St MNR Station)


GreatOne2k

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This topic has been discussed before.

 

 

 

BX19 to end there, I wouldn't do that due to lots of rider going to / from Manhattan.

 

The Bx13 is better off going over there. or even the Bx2.

 

 

 

A lot of them walk over the 145th Street Bridge to get to / from the mall.

 

No Mark. I was suggesting that the "BX19" gets a limited stop or creates 'short turns' buses not going to Manhattan could terminate at Gateway Mall. BX19 going to Riverbank Park would never go inside Gateway.

Only 'short turn' or maybe if limited is created 'local' BX19's. That what i say.

 

I still say the BX13 and maybe a short turn "BX19' makes the most sense to serve BX. Gateway.

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No Mark. I was suggesting that the "BX19" gets a limited stop or creates 'short turns' buses not going to Manhattan could terminate at Gateway Mall. BX19 going to Riverbank Park would never go inside Gateway.

Only 'short turn' or maybe if limited is created 'local' BX19's. That what i say.

 

I still say the BX13 and maybe a short turn "BX19' makes the most sense to serve BX. Gateway.

No one mentioned havin the 19 serve Gateway & Riverbank.....

 

Mark got your point....

 

He's sayin that there's a lot of usage in both directions to/from Manhattan to not consider short turning buses..... His point is valid, and I agree w/ it 100%.... I never liked the idea of short turning 19's & havin them run w/i the Bronx.... it's not like short turning the Q66, where the potential ridership loss (west of 51st) iddn't drastic.....

 

If you have every other Bx19 picking up the slack (so to speak) heading out to riverbank, to account for the short turned buses that would start at gateway, buses leaving riverbank would be absolutely crushloaded before they enter the bronx.... Bx19's (esp. on the weekends) are like that now w/ the current setup, with how they fill up after leaving manhattan....

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Its strange that the MTA hasnt done anything to serve the mall the way it does with other developments throughout the city.

It seems the bulk of the non drivers I've observed walk from the (4)(D)(;) Bx6 and Bx13 161 Street River Ave. Station and the rest are from the (2)(4)(5) Bx1/2 at 149th Street & Grand Concourse Station.

 

So the best solutions I've heard so far are

1)Extend the Bx13 although turning on to River Ave from 161 Street will be tricky.

 

2)Divert the Bx2 to the mall but I suggest terminating it at 149 St.-3 Ave.so the route isnt so long. The rest of the route is covered by the Bx21.

 

 

 

 

3)Divert the Bx19 the mall. Possibly create a short turn Bx19 Between The Botanical Gardens/Fordham Rd.and the Gateway Mall.

This option will be very tricky for the Bx19 to/from Riverbank to serve the mall. but I'm sure it would beneficial to have the Bx19 serve the mall from Manhattan.

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Its strange that the MTA hasnt done anything to serve the mall the way it does with other developments throughout the city.

It seems the bulk of the non drivers I've observed walk from the (4)(D)(;) Bx6 and Bx13 161 Street River Ave. Station and the rest are from the (2)(4)(5) Bx1/2 at 149th Street & Grand Concourse Station.

 

So the best solutions I've heard so far are

1)Extend the Bx13 although turning on to River Ave from 161 Street will be tricky.

 

2)Divert the Bx2 to the mall but I suggest terminating it at 149 St.-3 Ave.so the route isnt so long. The rest of the route is covered by the Bx21.

 

 

 

 

3)Divert the Bx19 the mall. Possibly create a short turn Bx19 Between The Botanical Gardens/Fordham Rd.and the Gateway Mall.

This option will be very tricky for the Bx19 to/from Riverbank to serve the mall. but I'm sure it would beneficial to have the Bx19 serve the mall from Manhattan.

 

My guess to the reason why the MTA hasn't provided extra service to the Bronx Gateway Mall is because there are trains and buses already nearby.

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Yes! Why extend any buses if you already have the Bx1/Bx2/Bx6/Bx13/Bx19 circling the area.. Even MNCR Hudson and the IRT (2)(4)(5) / IND (;)(D) [A bit of a walk, not to far]. Manhattaners... Use the 145th or 155th Street Bridge

 

The one in east harlem, i cant say anything, because the M116 is passing the Gateway, even before it opened.

 

-Bx19 is a big NO. That route is used by a lot of people.. And im sure I and others wouldnt wanna wait extra time for short turning Bx19 instead of getting on a regular Bx19 heading to Manhattan.

 

Theres already a short turn at Tremont Avenue, but ridership up there ain't that high.

 

-Bx2 could, but may not please local riders on Concourse. Since the Bx1 is LTD. Plus, how would it get back on Concourse on 161st Street? There is no Left turning allowed (i think)

 

-Bx6, similar to the Bx19, i wouldn't bother

 

-Bx13, yeah maybe thats better, tho the (MTA) would have to also eliminate the special runs to 163rd / 3rd Avenue that runs.

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-Bx2 could, but may not please local riders on Concourse. Since the Bx1 is LTD. Plus, how would it get back on Concourse on 161st Street? There is no Left turning allowed (i think)

 

instead of using 161 i figure why not use 151 Street.

 

 

-Bx13, yeah maybe thats better, tho the (MTA) would have to also eliminate the special runs to 163rd / 3rd Avenue that runs.

 

The MTA woundnt have to eliminate those runs. They only operate in the morning until 8:30AM i believe. The mall doesnt open that early anyway so I dont think it would be a big beal to keep the 3rd Ave runs. and if not they really dont have high ridership anyway.

But still teturn is a problem.

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instead of using 161 i figure why not use 151 Street.

 

 

 

 

The MTA woundnt have to eliminate those runs. They only operate in the morning until 8:30AM i believe. The mall doesnt open that early anyway so I dont think it would be a big beal to keep the 3rd Ave runs. and if not they really dont have high ridership anyway.

But still teturn is a problem.

 

 

FYI. Most Target stores around the country open at either 7-8am(6am during the X-Mas Holidays)so there could a few riders who work at Target need to be at their store by 6-7am.

 

The other stores open by 9-10am.

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instead of using 161 i figure why not use 151 Street.

 

 

 

 

The MTA woundnt have to eliminate those runs. They only operate in the morning until 8:30AM i believe. The mall doesnt open that early anyway so I dont think it would be a big beal to keep the 3rd Ave runs. and if not they really dont have high ridership anyway.

But still teturn is a problem.

 

I wouldn't underestimate those Bx13 3rd Av runs. Sometimes, when the Bx6 is delayed, the Bx13 does wonders for riders (especially in the westbound direction) as it provides more room (since the Bx6 is usually packed to the gills from Southern Blvd to the Stadium).

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Yes! Why extend any buses if you already have the Bx1/Bx2/Bx6/Bx13/Bx19 circling the area.. Even MNCR Hudson and the IRT (2)(4)(5) / IND (;)(D) [A bit of a walk, not to far]. Manhattaners... Use the 145th or 155th Street Bridge

 

 

 

-Bx2 could, but may not please local riders on Concourse. Since the Bx1 is LTD. Plus, how would it get back on Concourse on 161st Street? There is no Left turning allowed (i think)

 

 

In really hot or cold weather the walks seem even longer (not that short to begin with). MNCR is the closest, and yet the most expensive for most people it doesn't count. The buses aren't much better than the trains (Bx19 saves about 2 short blocks in walking from the (2)(4)(5)), but compared to the rest of the walk that is nothing.

 

Some places like Applebees and Subway are on Exterior St / Gateway Center Blvd which is even worse in terms of accessibility than River Avenue.

Another entrance to the mall is on Exterior St as well.

 

Bx2 would turn on E 165 St, not E 161 St. Bx1 would make local stops to E 165 St.

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In really hot or cold weather the walks seem even longer (not that short to begin with). MNCR is the closest, and yet the most expensive for most people it doesn't count. The buses aren't much better than the trains (Bx19 saves about 2 short blocks in walking from the (2)(4)(5)), but compared to the rest of the walk that is nothing.

 

Some places like Applebees and Subway are on Exterior St / Gateway Center Blvd which is even worse in terms of accessibility than River Avenue.

Another entrance to the mall is on Exterior St as well.

 

Bx2 would turn on E 165 St, not E 161 St. Bx1 would make local stops to E 165 St.

 

Ive walked from 149th / Concourse to the Gateway Center on River Avenue and its not like a really long walk, its like 5-10min of walking.

 

If the Bx2 were to be sent there i could imagine this:

 

 

http://maps.google.com/maps?saddr=Lincoln+Ave&daddr=40.8142936,-73.9209876+to:40.8154,-73.91826+to:40.8195,-73.93001+to:40.831836,-73.923674+to:E+165th+St&hl=en&ll=40.816732,-73.918676&spn=0.012488,0.01929&sll=40.819006,-73.919363&sspn=0.024975,0.038581&geocode=FXq6bgIdivaX-w%3BFdXGbgIdJQ6Y-ymzREeZxfXCiTG5UbougEEz0A%3BFSjLbgIdzBiY-ymhzXBVz_XCiTH0r7GB-z10ow%3BFSzbbgId5uqX-ylVkLwr0fXCiTFQihMKRy3VKQ%3BFVwLbwIdpgOY-ykbDG7jMfTCiTGkYC1bfPKypg%3BFdIHbwId7g-Y-w&gl=us&mra=mrv&via=1,2,3,4&z=16

 

(Ignore the error of Bx2 via 145th/Willis Avenue, couldnt figure to get it right)

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Hmm didnt even think about turning the Bx2 on E165 Street. That's a great Idea. But 151 isnt* that bad I see trucks heading up and down there all the time. E165 does make a lot of sense though. You may not need to extend the Bx13 although It should be.

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Hmm didnt even think about turning the Bx2 on E165 Street. That's a great Idea. But 151 isnt* that bad I see trucks heading up and down there all the time. E165 does make a lot of sense though. You may not need to extend the Bx13 although It should be.

 

As much as the Bx2 could pull off this reroute, I'm on the fence about it since 165th St and River Av are both narrow. It will be pretty difficult for the Bx2 to make the turn (especially from 165th onto River) with all of the car traffic in the local area. It would be even worse when the Yankees play since River Av is often closed off for security reasons.

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As much as the Bx2 could pull off this reroute, I'm on the fence about it since 165th St and River Av are both narrow. It will be pretty difficult for the Bx2 to make the turn (especially from 165th onto River) with all of the car traffic in the local area. It would be even worse when the Yankees play since River Av is often closed off for security reasons.

 

So you think the 18 is a better choice than the 2 or the 13 b/c of one turn ?

 

Am I understanding you correctly, or is there some other reason for the suggestion you haven't disclosed yet......

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So you think the 18 is a better choice than the 2 or the 13 b/c of one turn ?

 

Am I understanding you correctly, or is there some other reason for the suggestion you haven't disclosed yet......

 

these two reasons

 

By the way, the Bx13 extension to Hunts Point could also help in forms of interlining (with the Bx6) as well as relieving overcrowding on a corridor where most of the new housing in the South Bronx is getting built (specifically between Courtlandt and 3rd Avs in Melrose/Morrisania).

 

As for the Bx18 to Gateway, I chose it as a candidate in order to give more life to that route. This way, it would be tougher to cut that route in the future.

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I think the Bx2 is good idea I'm sold. All of the turns are do-able, its frequent enough, Its diversion isnt a major one and it serves very populated areas of the Bronx so mall ridership will high and consistent.

 

Bx13's terminal is only blocks away so it the best choice to extend but i dont see a good place to turn it around near the mall.

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So you think the 18 is a better choice than the 2 or the 13 b/c of one turn ?

 

Am I understanding you correctly, or is there some other reason for the suggestion you haven't disclosed yet......

 

I'm just saying that the Bx2 could pull it off. But I am worried that the turn that wide artic would have to do from 165th onto River since 165th St is pretty narrow (with both sides filled with parked cars).

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I'm just saying that the Bx2 could pull it off. But I am worried that the turn that wide artic would have to do from 165th onto River since 165th St is pretty narrow (with both sides filled with parked cars).

 

its not that bad at all i know that area very well a bus will have no problem under the El. As for game days I guess they'll do what they do with the Bx6 and 13. move the barriers or maybe divert the bus temporarily.

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its not that bad at all i know that area very well a bus will have no problem under the El. As for game days I guess they'll do what they do with the Bx6 and 13. move the barriers or maybe divert the bus temporarily.

 

I'm sure the NYPD would allow the Bx2 to run through River Av.

 

Even though I already mentioned this, I want to take the time to appreciate the sole fact that the Gateway Mall is somewhat accessible, as opposed to those in other parts of the city. It is this access that keeps many customers heading to Gateway since drivers have to pay for parking to park inside the mall. This turn-off results in drivers heading elsewhere in The Bronx or outside of it for shopping.

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