End of Brighton Rehab = Large GO

[Nova RTS 9147]

And given that Sunday is the 10th Anniversary of 9/11. This is where if I were Bloomberg, I would look at ordering the to have NO G.O.'s that weekend as traveling in NYC is going to be a major hassle with that weekend being the 10th anniversary of 9/11, with any projects scheduled for that weekend pushed back one week.

 

Does he have that kind of power to order the to do something like that?

[YankeesPwnMets]

And given that Sunday is the 10th Anniversary of 9/11. This is where if I were Bloomberg, I would look at ordering the to have NO G.O.'s that weekend as traveling in NYC is going to be a major hassle with that weekend being the 10th anniversary of 9/11, with any projects scheduled for that weekend pushed back one week.

 

I don't want my train to derail over a switch because the MTA was not allowed to work on it. Better safe then sorry.

[TwoTimer]

I don't want my train to derail over a switch because the MTA was not allowed to work on it. Better safe then sorry.

 

Well it wasn't really that, he just thinks there shouldn't be any GOs when there's anything big going on in the city, whether it be a major parade, a holiday weekend, or more localized events like Yankees-Mets (in that case no GOs along the trunk line that serve whichever stadium they playing in that weekend), or in this case 9/11. If the work has to be done, then so be it. Other cities can shut it down overnight as part of regular service (think DC or Boston), this city cannot.

[Luis1985]

as far as i know, if it really ends on Sept 12, then thats good. however, is it too much to ask to have switches (local to express, express to local) be installed at the Church Av and Newkirk Av stations?

 

*in case of a G.O., the doesnt have to skip all those stops between Prospect Park and Kings Hwy.

[Mysterious2train]

however, is it too much to ask to have switches (local to express, express to local) be installed at the Church Av and Newkirk Av stations?

 

 

I would suppose so, seeing as how the passed up the chance to have switches installed between Cortelyou Road and Newkirk Avenue Southbound.

 

One thing that puzzles me...

 

- The Coney Island-bound platforms at Avenue H and Avenue M were, if I'm not mistaken, closed for 9 months (January 2010 to September 2010)

 

- The Manhattan-bound platforms are/were closed for 12 months (September 2010 to September 2011)

 

At Avenue H at least, a big new stationhouse for the Coney Island bound-side was built from scratch during the 9 month closure.

 

Meanwhile, it seems like the is just repairing the old stationhouse on the Manhattan-bound side, which apprearently requires a year to work on.

 

What gives?

 

Also, Flushing Express raised some good points about the Brighton Express. I'm probably a little biased due to the fact that my (-riding friends and I all use local stops, but I really wouldn't mind if the stayed local permanently after the end of this project.

 

[the fact that the Brighton Express is using 75-footers really isn't helping, either]

 

EDIT: 500th Post! W00t!

[2Line1291]

Brighton's ( can have the same setup has White Plains Rd trains. The can run local except AM/PM rush hours when it runs express in the peak direction... Just putting it out there

[dman1455]

It won't be the same without the slants...

[Wallyhorse]

I don't want my train to derail over a switch because the MTA was not allowed to work on it. Better safe then sorry.

 

Under normal circumstances, I would agree, however, this is not just any 9/11 anniversary we are talking about.

 

This is the 10th anniversary that is bringing in a lot of dignitaries, and that is going to tie up traffic in lower Manhattan (with a number of people already upset about not being allowed to be there on the actual anniversary that Sunday). There are going to be far more people than normal down there that entire weekend (in a lot of cases making sure the place is secure for the President and other dignitaries on Sunday), and it is one weekend I would want full subway service to be in effect even if it means having to re-schedule G.O. for either before or after.

 

While safety obviously is the #1 issue, that particular weekend is going to a very rough one for a lot of people in NYC. It needs to be remembered that there are some relatives of 9/11 victims who have never been able to move past that day at all and those like that probably never will, and having travel difficulties of any kind that weekend will have considerably more stress than it would otherwise, which is what any G.O. would bring for some. That's why I would insist on any G.O. scheduled for that weekend being postponed to the following weekend or worked around in another matter if the work is urgent enough that it can't be pushed back one week (even if it meant doing it over Labor Day weekend for instance, moving up such work instead of pushing it back one week). The last thing I would want to hear about is a family member of a 9/11 victim having difficulty getting around, especially to the memorial and any related event because of a subway G.O.

[geoking66]

Under normal circumstances, I would agree, however, this is not just any 9/11 anniversary we are talking about.

 

This is the 10th anniversary that is bringing in a lot of dignitaries, and that is going to tie up traffic in lower Manhattan (with a number of people already upset about not being allowed to be there on the actual anniversary that Sunday). There are going to be far more people than normal down there that entire weekend (in a lot of cases making sure the place is secure for the President and other dignitaries on Sunday), and it is one weekend I would want full subway service to be in effect even if it means having to re-schedule G.O. for either before or after.

 

While safety obviously is the #1 issue, that particular weekend is going to a very rough one for a lot of people in NYC. It needs to be remembered that there are some relatives of 9/11 victims who have never been able to move past that day at all and those like that probably never will, and having travel difficulties of any kind that weekend will have considerably more stress than it would otherwise, which is what any G.O. would bring for some. That's why I would insist on any G.O. scheduled for that weekend being postponed to the following weekend or worked around in another matter if the work is urgent enough that it can't be pushed back one week (even if it meant doing it over Labor Day weekend for instance, moving up such work instead of pushing it back one week). The last thing I would want to hear about is a family member of a 9/11 victim having difficulty getting around, especially to the memorial and any related event because of a subway G.O.

 

I know that this could sound patently offensive, but I'm willing to get a bit flamed for it. As hard as 9/11 may be and that there will be extra people in NYC, the MTA has an obligation to get these things done on a previously-determined schedule. It's a lose/lose; if they complete this on time and with the current GO scheduled, they're insensitive, but if they delay it, then it's seen as the agency being lazy and wasting tax money. Perhaps you might not view it like that, but that could easily get picked up and warped by the Post and the rest of the anti-MTA crowd. As much as I understand that it's a hard day, treating it like that is not progress at all.

 

On a more general note, it seems ridiculous that one group is getting such preferential treatment, ie victim's family members. What about the rest of us who are victims in some way? Anyone who was in NYC during 9/11 is scarred in some way or another. How about those who ran down the streets of Lower Manhattan in front of a pummelling dust cloud onto cramped ferries to get them across the Hudson or East River and to safety? How about those still suffering with medical problems? How about those who had to rescue those in rubble or, worse, have to inform that they found the deceased? They shouldn't have to deal with a GO either, but they will because it's a necessity. Part of using public transport is planning ahead; this goes for all days, no matter their solemnity. That mini-rant might seem off-topic, but as someone who almost lost a parent and saw the towers collapse, living with that memory for the rest of my life isn't easy at all, but I have to suck it up and move on, as do hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of others.

[TwoTimer]

Its like someone seems sour 9/11 wasn't declared a national holiday (and then work WOULDN'T proceed). So every anniversary going forward no GO's (25th, 50th, 100th, etc)?

 

On a unrelated note I know people loved slants (even employees loved operating them), but I wonder what would make people foam more any kind of 160 equipment on the ( or a return of a RFW (in this case only the 32 is left).

[Abba]

It won't be the same without the slants...

 

Keep in mind that the mind that the current ( trains have about 72 seats per car while the slants had about 44 or so...But I hear you...

[TwoTimer]

Keep in mind that the mind that the current ( trains have about 72 seats per car while the slants had about 44 or so...But I hear you...

 

Only 8 cars now, but 10 slants.

[Wallyhorse]

I know that this could sound patently offensive, but I'm willing to get a bit flamed for it. As hard as 9/11 may be and that there will be extra people in NYC, the MTA has an obligation to get these things done on a previously-determined schedule. It's a lose/lose; if they complete this on time and with the current GO scheduled, they're insensitive, but if they delay it, then it's seen as the agency being lazy and wasting tax money. Perhaps you might not view it like that, but that could easily get picked up and warped by the Post and the rest of the anti-MTA crowd. As much as I understand that it's a hard day, treating it like that is not progress at all.

 

On a more general note, it seems ridiculous that one group is getting such preferential treatment, ie victim's family members. What about the rest of us who are victims in some way? Anyone who was in NYC during 9/11 is scarred in some way or another. How about those who ran down the streets of Lower Manhattan in front of a pummelling dust cloud onto cramped ferries to get them across the Hudson or East River and to safety? How about those still suffering with medical problems? How about those who had to rescue those in rubble or, worse, have to inform that they found the deceased? They shouldn't have to deal with a GO either, but they will because it's a necessity. Part of using public transport is planning ahead; this goes for all days, no matter their solemnity. That mini-rant might seem off-topic, but as someone who almost lost a parent and saw the towers collapse, living with that memory for the rest of my life isn't easy at all, but I have to suck it up and move on, as do hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of others.

 

Like I said, this is not a normal 9/11 anniversary this year. As it is the 10th, there are going to be a lot more emotions than there have been in recent years. The problem I see is some family of a 9/11 victim having trouble making the ceremony and it being related to one of the G.O.'s raising a massive stink about it, and that winding up in the tabloids.

 

It's the classic case of a "dammed if you do, dammed if you don't" situation. I just know if it were me, I would have several months ago made it clear to all superintendents and others in charge that there were to be NO G.O.'s the weekend of 9/9-11 under any circumstances whatsoever, save for a dire emergency where work can't wait. The arguments in this case cut both ways, but I do know the last thing I would want to have to do is explain to a family of a 9/11 victim of any kind why there were service interruptions that weekend of any kind (other than those made necessary for security reasons), especially given how some family members of 9/11 victims and others who were traumatized by that day have never been able to fully move on from it.

 

It's not sour grapes. I'm simply looking at it from the perspective of what those who lost loved ones or may have been severely traumatized for whom the last thing they need to deal with is a G.O. making it difficult to get to either the ceremony or any related event that weekend. Next year, and for a few after that, it won't be the case as much, but this being the 10th anniversary is why I would have made it clear there were to be no G.O.'s other than for an emergency situation that weekend.

[TwoTimer]

Take a taxi or drive. Its a Sunday morning.

[cotb16]

You have to remember that the Brighton Line does not go to Lower Manhattan, whether if it's the ( or the .

[m7zanr160s]

No offense but, people just need to read and plan ahead. I actually like GO's because they're a change from the norm. When they happen I just plan accordingly. I'm tired of hearing complaining about this. It's like, mix in a map, a watch, and some sense.

[alejr88]

No offense but, people just need to read and plan ahead. I actually like GO's because they're a change from the norm. When they happen I just plan accordingly. I'm tired of hearing complaining about this. It's like, mix in a map, a watch, and some sense.

 

Thank you. The same can be said with those complainers living in Park Slope.

[FlushingExpress]

It won't be the same without the slants...

 

yep, even though the slants looked very ugly, had uncomfortable seats, puny cabs, and their car bodies were not in very good shape, they made the Brighton Express fun with its super speed, large railfan window, strong A/C, and great-looking interiors. The only car type currently in service that comes even remotely close to that is the R32. Though it is not likely going to happen, I pray for the ( to swap cars with the someday. It would be a huge upgrade for all three lines.

 

Its like someone seems sour 9/11 wasn't declared a national holiday (and then work WOULDN'T proceed). So every anniversary going forward no GO's (25th, 50th, 100th, etc)?

 

On a unrelated note I know people loved slants (even employees loved operating them), but I wonder what would make people foam more any kind of 160 equipment on the or a return of a RFW (in this case only the 32 is left).

 

Let's hope R32s go on the ( so that Brighton riders like me can enjoy the system's two best cars, the sleek and shiny R32s and red hot R160s. As for the first part of your post, I agree. We had G.O.s during other anniversaries of 9/11 (including the exact one for the last year) and that was not a big deal. We also had one in 2005 when the was rerouted to the in one direction and vice versa for the other, trains terminated at 14th Street, and the ran local to New Lots Avenue.

 

Speaking of 9/11, I cannot believe it has already been 10 years since that horrific day. I was a 12-year-old in 7th grade back then. Now I am 22 and studying theater and acting at Hunter College. Wow, time flies! This Thursday also marks 10 years since an R&B singer's skyrocketing career was tragically cut short due to her crew's impatience to return to the United States after finishing a video shot in the Bahamas.

 

No offense but, people just need to read and plan ahead. I actually like GO's because they're a change from the norm. When they happen I just plan accordingly. I'm tired of hearing complaining about this. It's like, mix in a map, a watch, and some sense.

 

Absolutely. That is why the MTA already have this G.O. on their website even though it is three weeks ago, so people can plan ahead and find alternative ways to reach their destination. They need to stop complaining that the MTA is not notifying them of upcoming service changes. They are posted everywhere, including station signs, announcements, and website. Stop being so lazy!

 

as far as i know, if it really ends on Sept 12, then thats good. however, is it too much to ask to have switches (local to express, express to local) be installed at the Church Av and Newkirk Av stations?

 

*in case of a G.O., the doesnt have to skip all those stops between Prospect Park and Kings Hwy.

 

That is honestly going a bit too far. We do not need switches at every express station on the Brighton Line. Installing them would require major modifications of switches and signals along the line and service shut downs like what happened in early 2008 on the when the switches on the Flushing Line were relocated from 61st Street-Woodside and 74th Street-Broadway. Express service was suspended for a month and there was no service at all from 61st Street to Main Street-Flushing for three weekends (it was originally planned for five, but cooperative weather helped the MTA complete this project quicker).

 

Also, having this type of track work on a weekday would cause irregular trains because you have the running on the express track all the way and the running local track, then switching to the express track for a short time, then back to the local track, and on the express again at Parkside Avenue. That is why switches north of Newkirk Avenue were not installed for the rehabilitation project even though none of those stations were being rebuilt. Having all trains run on the same track in both directions provided the best service for riders. That is why the train is still serving Neck Road and Avenue U even though both sides of both stations are completed.

 

This type of irregularity has been happening to the Broadway Line after last year's service cuts because you have the merging with the , then separating from it for a few stops, then merging back in both directions, the merging with the at Prince Street, and the merging with the at 34th Street-Herald Square. Makes me wonder what is the point of having the run express in Manhattan if it always get held at DeKalb Avenue, Prince Street, and 34th Street for 5+ minutes to let the or that it just bypassed go through first. The point of an express train is for it to run faster by skipping local trains, not skip a local train, then get held to let that same local train go through first. The needs to run express in Manhattan again on weekdays so that it would remain on the same tracks with the from Astoria to DeKalb Avenue, therefore keeping service consistent. The can handle the Broadway Local by itself as proven by people's obsession to always ride express trains even when they save no time.

 

I would suppose so, seeing as how the passed up the chance to have switches installed between Cortelyou Road and Newkirk Avenue Southbound.

 

One thing that puzzles me...

- The Coney Island-bound platforms at Avenue H and Avenue M were, if I'm not mistaken, closed for 9 months (January 2010 to September 2010)

 

- The Manhattan-bound platforms are/were closed for 12 months (September 2010 to September 2011)

 

At Avenue H at least, a big new stationhouse for the Coney Island bound-side was built from scratch during the 9 month closure.

 

Meanwhile, it seems like the MTA is just repairing the old stationhouse on the Manhattan-bound side, which apprearently requires a year to work on

 

What gives?

 

Also, Flushing Express raised some good points about the Brighton Express. I'm probably a little biased due to the fact that my B-riding friends and I all use local stops, but I really wouldn't mind if the B stayed local permanently after the end of this project.

 

[the fact that the Brighton Express is using 75-footers really isn't helping, either]

 

EDIT: 500th Post! W00t!

 

Actually, it was Manhattan-bound platforms of Avenue U and Neck Road that closed for just 9 months (January - October 2010). I think the repairs were completed ahead of time because those platforms had no new features that rest of the stations would get (i.e. the Coney Island-bound platforms of Avenues M, J, U, and Neck Road getting a work facility and the same side of Avenue H getting a new station house, and the Manhattan-bound side of Avenues M and J getting new staircases). Whatever the reason, it was for the better because residents along Avenue U hated having to go down to Sheepshead Bay and back up or using the B3K bus to get to Manhattan.

 

The Coney Island-bound platforms of Avenue M, J, and H also took one year (September 2009-September 2010) and they are not even finished yet, which is why for the past few weekends, Coney Island-bound trains have been bypassing Avenue M.

 

The Coney Island-bound side of Avenue U and Neck Road took the longest to reopen (December 2008-January 2010) because the MTA took their sweet time to work on them. I did not see dismantling of the windscreens and canopies until over a month after the closure started.

 

Yes I agree, those overweight R68/68As really screw up the Brighton Express because they took so long to accelerate that they cannot reach their top speed before having to slow down again at the next station. The R160s, on the other hand, take off like a race car.

[R32 3348]

The only thing that saved the ( from ranking worst in last year's State of the Subways Report Card was the fact that riders had the best chance of getting a seat on that line and this was a direct result of it running local in Brooklyn (I am betting my tuition that it will rank worst this year). I used to rank it as my second favorite line right behind the , but now put it was third worst with the only trains I hate more are the due to its lack of scheduled service, ghost-town stations, and almost entirely underground route and the due to its long scheduled waits, irregular service, slow and boring underground ride, and dirty, slow, and dull R46s.

 

 

Trust me, it is not going to be fun with those chubby chick R68/68As. They have been failing much more frequently than ever. Since May, I had been late to school nine times because the train in front of my broke down. The good news is if that happens when all four Brighton tracks are in service, it will not have as much of an impact to train service when only two were in operation, unless the break down occurs north of Parkside Avenue, since trains can be rerouted from the local to the express track or vice-versa.

 

From 2009-2010, the R68/68As performed well and I did not have a major problem with them. It was not until earlier this year that they started breaking down at a high rate. Wait until this year's report card, which should be released within the next two months, to see how well the fat girls performed in 2011.

http://www.straphangers.org/statesub11/State%20of%20the%20Subways%202011_sm.pdf

 

Scroll down to the . "The arrives with average regularity...and its cars break down less often than those on the average line." 183,181 compared to the average MDBF of 170,217. Sounds like you owe us a shit ton of money.

 

Like I said, this is not a normal 9/11 anniversary this year. As it is the 10th, there are going to be a lot more emotions than there have been in recent years. The problem I see is some family of a 9/11 victim having trouble making the ceremony and it being related to one of the G.O.'s raising a massive stink about it, and that winding up in the tabloids.

If people really have to get to Lower Manhattan then they'll just have to leave their house earlier and plan accordingly. Following a GO is not that hard. I'm sure the actual commute is nowhere near as stressful as the trauma caused after 9/11.

Yes I agree, those overweight R68/68As really screw up the Brighton Express because they took so long to accelerate that they cannot reach their top speed before having to slow down again at the next station. The R160s, on the other hand, take off like a race car.

I can count the areas in the system where trains actually reach their top speeds on one hand, and nowhere on the Brighton express makes it onto that (very short) list.

[sovetskii52]

I love weekends, because that is when all the good G.O.s happen. I love G.O.s because i get to see something unusual, or rare. And record it on video if i am in New York. Seeing the same train on the same line at the same time over and over is boring. I never complain when there are reroutes or other changes in the system. I love it. The more changes, the better. For the 9/11 date, there should not be any service changes, just additional service in and out of Manhattan on all lines.

[NYCtrainfan01]

No offense but, people just need to read and plan ahead. I actually like GO's because they're a change from the norm. When they happen I just plan accordingly. I'm tired of hearing complaining about this. It's like, mix in a map, a watch, and some sense.

 

I like G.O.'s too. with technology these days, some people mainly kids and teens do this:

 

for a map they use an app

for a watch they use their cell phone

some people do not have a lot common sense these days.....

 

makes me wonder what will happen to them if facebook and/or Twitter shut down for a day or two. some people can't live with out them. * nods head in disbelief *

 

on topic: can't wait till the ( is the Brighton express again! * sighs * I wish the slants were still here but it was their time to go.

[Amtrak7]

I like G.O.'s too. with technology these days, some people mainly kids and teens do this:

 

for a map they use an app

for a watch they use their cell phone

some people do not have a lot common sense these days.....

 

makes me wonder what will happen to them if facebook and/or Twitter shut down for a day or two. some people can't live with out them. * nods head in disbelief *

 

Agreed! I find it very difficult to give approximate locations/directions to my friends at school as they barely know anything about street names even in our neighborhood. All locations are given in terms of stores, which I don't know most of.

 

I think the GO may be postponed because of Irene, as there was an busing Lorimer-Bway Jct scheduled for today.

[R68 Subway Car]

 

Scroll down to the . "The arrives with average regularity...and its cars break down less often than those on the average line." 183,181 compared to the average MDBF of 170,217. Sounds like you owe us a shit ton of money.

I told you that the R68 and R68A got the job done! In addition to that, the R68-dominated (D)'s MDBF was higher than the system average.

[overclocked]

I don't believe the express service would be restored as soon as the stations open. The express tracks are in need of maintenance; some ties and rails need to be replaced, rails to be polished, signals to be checked, temporary stations to be removed and so on. It would be nice if they also weld back the portions of rail that were cut. I am assuming that the trash would be removed too. The main point is that there is so much need to be done to restore the express service, it just won't happen with a flick of the switch.

 

One weekend is not enough.

[Abba]

Is there any chance they are thinking of keeping the ( local permanently?