Will Smart Cards Mean the End of Student Discounts?

[BrooklynBus]

Great Historical Synopsis of Student Half Fare Program

 

http://john-rozankowski.suite101.com/new-york-city-students-derail-the-mta-a394665

[MHV9218]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[B35 via Church]

How would they....

[qjtransitmaster]

special smartcards for students only

[checkmatechamp13]

Well, it better not mean the end. I'll be the first one they'll be hearing from if that's the case.

 

I can't see it really being a problem. They would (probably) still be able to issue Senior/Disabled MetroCards, Employee MetroCards, etc. I can't see it costing too much to add Student MetroCards to the software. I could see them bluffing and using the SmartCards as a threat to cut Student MetroCards (unlike last time when they didn't have that weapon), but I can't see them going through with it.

[qjtransitmaster]

Well, it better not mean the end. I'll be the first one they'll be hearing from if that's the case.

 

I can't see it really being a problem. They would (probably) still be able to issue Senior/Disabled MetroCards, Employee MetroCards, etc. I can't see it costing too much to add Student MetroCards to the software. I could see them bluffing and using the SmartCards as a threat to cut Student MetroCards (unlike last time when they didn't have that weapon), but I can't see them going through with it.

 

calmdown it will never happen hell will freeze over before student metrocards are killed.

[Noflexdont]

LIke stated before it used for the politics. I can see them putting the RF chip in student ID's and it being done that way.

[B35 via Church]

calmdown it will never happen hell will freeze over before student metrocards are killed.

 

While I don't see them "bluffing" to use smartcards to eradicate the student MC's or w/e....

Regardless, there's nothin for him to "calm down" about....

 

 

 

The cancellation of student MetroCards has been nothing more than a political ploy for decades and it will remain that way for the future too

this, pretty much....

[LRG]

Lol B35...I like what you did with the quote thingie there, ha ha!

 

My input: the school would just as responsible for issuing Student smart cards, the same as they are now with student plastic cards. I don't see why they wouldn't carry on with the new practice.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Well, it better not mean the end. I'll be the first one they'll be hearing from if that's the case.

 

I can't see it really being a problem. They would (probably) still be able to issue Senior/Disabled MetroCards, Employee MetroCards, etc. I can't see it costing too much to add Student MetroCards to the software. I could see them bluffing and using the SmartCards as a threat to cut Student MetroCards (unlike last time when they didn't have that weapon), but I can't see them going through with it.

 

Rubs hands together with an evil laugh...

[mark1447]

Why was this posted twice?

 

http://www.nyctransitforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32852

[BrooklynBus]

Why was this posted twice?

 

http://www.nyctransitforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32852

 

 

Because it applies to both forums and not everyone who goes to the subway side also visits the bus side.

[checkmatechamp13]

Rubs hands together with an evil laugh...

 

Good thing you're not in charge of the MTA. I shudder to think what type of system we'd have. No Student MetroCards, empty express routes all over the place, and worst of all higher fares. :eek:

 

I mean, we'd have cleaner buses and trains but I could care less about those. B)

[IRT Bronx Express]

Good thing you're not in charge of the MTA. I shudder to think what type of system we'd have. :eek:

Knowing him, he'd convert this city into an express bus paradise. :eek:

 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Good thing you're not in charge of the MTA. I shudder to think what type of system we'd have. No Student MetroCards, empty express routes all over the place, and worst of all higher fares. :eek:

 

I mean, we'd have cleaner buses and trains but I could care less about those.

 

They wouldn't be empty because for starters they would be better advertised towards those who can afford them and some routes would be re-routed to better serve communities who use them.

 

As for your other comment, you're starting to make me wonder what you do when riding on the buses... Maybe you're a litterbug after all... :eek:

[checkmatechamp13]

They wouldn't be empty because for starters they would be better advertised towards those who can afford them and some routes would be re-routed to better serve communities who use them.

 

As for your other comment, you're starting to make me wonder what you do when riding on the buses... Maybe you're a litterbug after all... :eek:

 

Yeah, but even so, there are some routes where you're realistically not going to get any riders. I mean you could advertise the hell out of the BM4, but I doubt ridership would go up.

 

But as I've demonstrated, there really aren't a whole lot of express bus routes that get that low ridership, at least to the point where they are beyond saving. Maybe a few routes could be consolidated (like the QM21/X63), and a few could be cut off-peak, but that's about it. (I was mostly joking around with that comment, since I know how you oppose basically any express bus cut)

 

And no, I'm definitely not a litterbug. I'm the type to hold my trash until I get off the bus (not that I really eat or carry anything to throw out)

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Yeah, but even so, there are some routes where you're realistically not going to get any riders. I mean you could advertise the hell out of the BM4, but I doubt ridership would go up.

 

But as I've demonstrated, there really aren't a whole lot of express bus routes that get that low ridership, at least to the point where they are beyond saving. Maybe a few routes could be consolidated (like the QM21/X63), and a few could be cut off-peak, but that's about it. (I was mostly joking around with that comment, since I know how you oppose basically any express bus cut)

 

And no, I'm definitely not a litterbug. I'm the type to hold my trash until I get off the bus (not that I really eat or carry anything to throw out)

 

Well as far as any further cuts go, there really isn't much more to cut unless you're going to start getting rid of routes entirely. They already cut a bunch of express bus routes and have been cutting service where necessary. What people either fail to realize or admit is that they review all of the express bus routes about every 3 months or so to adjust service where needed, since they're well aware of their expense, so if the route is still around or hasn't been cut then clearly there's a reason and one of the things that I can easily think of is that once the route is cut, it more than likely is not coming back, so why not try to keep the route if it's possible rather than axing service? I make that statement not just about express bus service but service in general. You don't encourage people to use public transportation if you continue to cut and in many cases when people are forced to use alternatives, they stick with them.

[checkmatechamp13]

Well as far as any further cuts go, there really isn't much more to cut unless you're going to start getting rid of routes entirely. They already cut a bunch of express bus routes and have been cutting service where necessary. What people either fail to realize or admit is that they review all of the express bus routes about every 3 months or so to adjust service where needed, since they're well aware of their expense, so if the route is still around or hasn't been cut then clearly there's a reason and one of the things that I can easily think of is that once the route is cut, it more than likely is not coming back, so why not try to keep the route if it's possible rather than axing service? I make that statement not just about express bus service but service in general. You don't encourage people to use public transportation if you continue to cut and in many cases when people are forced to use alternatives, they stick with them.

 

Except that the only reason they're still around is because the city subsidizes them. Had they been operated by NYCT, the routes that I'm referring to (and again, there are a decent number of routes that get decent ridership so I'm not talking about those) would've had the service reduced a long time ago. Call me naive, but I still believe that with the right cost-cutting measures they can delay the next fare hike.

 

And getting rid of off-peak service on the BM4, QM4 and the few other routes where the ridership is abysmal isn't going to result in peak service being cut, so you don't have to worry about them being cut entirely. Most of the routes in the system are just fine as rush hour-only routes.

 

But as far as advertising them, I think you should bring that up at the next meeting you attend (don't bring up the S83/S93 proposal until I can think of what to do). I'm sure there are people who live in the neighborhood who would use the express bus if they knew they existed, which could establish a stronger ridership base and maybe even get an increase in service for them.

 

I mean, those times when they have bustitutions on parts of the , they could mention the BxM2 as an alternative, which will hopefully increase ridership (Of course, you'd like that since you're moving to Riverdale. ). The same for the BM3, BxM11 and a few other routes that parallel the subway to a certain extent.

[mark1447]

Because it applies to both forums and not everyone who goes to the subway side also visits the bus side.

 

But thats considered duplicating.

 

Even if people dont go into the Bus Forum (Which people does), that doesn't mean you should dupt.

 

Its like posting a news article about the MTA Subway & bus fares. People would use ether the Subway or Bus forum. Even tho I do wish there was a MTA General forum.

 

But it don't bother me, was just pointing a flaw against the forum rules.

 

Carry on.

[KeystoneRegional]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Except that the only reason they're still around is because the city subsidizes them. Had they been operated by NYCT, the routes that I'm referring to (and again, there are a decent number of routes that get decent ridership so I'm not talking about those) would've had the service reduced a long time ago. Call me naive, but I still believe that with the right cost-cutting measures they can delay the next fare hike.

 

And getting rid of off-peak service on the BM4, QM4 and the few other routes where the ridership is abysmal isn't going to result in peak service being cut, so you don't have to worry about them being cut entirely. Most of the routes in the system are just fine as rush hour-only routes.

 

But as far as advertising them, I think you should bring that up at the next meeting you attend (don't bring up the S83/S93 proposal until I can think of what to do). I'm sure there are people who live in the neighborhood who would use the express bus if they knew they existed, which could establish a stronger ridership base and maybe even get an increase in service for them.

 

I mean, those times when they have bustitutions on parts of the , they could mention the BxM2 as an alternative, which will hopefully increase ridership (Of course, you'd like that since you're moving to Riverdale. ). The same for the BM3, BxM11 and a few other routes that parallel the subway to a certain extent.

 

 

That's a good point... They mentioned renaming the BxM7A to the BxM8 to better advertise it, but they didn't say what else they did to further promote the route and ridership. :confused: I would say overall that they don't really promote the express buses. I mean the only reason I started using the X16 was because I was fed up with having to get up earlier and earlier to get to work using the unreliable S98. The thing is the idea of using it never crossed my mind until then. Before it was like I would see it stop and pickup a few folks, but I almost felt as if I couldn't get on or something. lol Hell at least now the put timetables and a map. Before they didn't even have them at many stops when I first started taking the X16 back in 2006.

[checkmatechamp13]

That's a good point... They mentioned renaming the BxM7A to the BxM8 to better advertise it, but they didn't say what else they did to further promote the route and ridership. :confused: I would say overall that they don't really promote the express buses. I mean the only reason I started using the X16 was because I was fed up with having to get up earlier and earlier to get to work using the unreliable S98. The thing is the idea of using it never crossed my mind until then. Before it was like I would see it stop and pickup a few folks, but I almost felt as if I couldn't get on or something. lol Hell at least now the put timetables and a map. Before they didn't even have them at many stops when I first started taking the X16 back in 2006.

 

The thing is that out here in SI, there isn't much you can do to promote the express buses. I mean, the sign is on the pole, the route is on the map, it has MTA buses running on the route, and people are getting on right in front of you. I mean, what else can you do?

 

I guess maybe you could have posters on the parallel local routes saying that there's an alternative.

 

It would be easier to advertise if it was a private company. For instance, they could say something like "Tired for the bus arriving a minute before the ferry leaves? Then take the ___ route and get a comfortable seat all the way to Manhattan". I doubt the MTA would put that up for themselves.

 

I mean, that's why realistically the only lines with a lot of potential are the ones near subway lines. If you're already taking the bus to the subway, chances are you've seen the express bus and the sign on the pole. The only thing they can really do is put the schedule on the pole if they haven't already done so.

 

But definitely bring it up. I mean, you give them the idea, so it's up to them to figure out the best way to do it. You're not even getting paid so don't go crazy trying to figure out the best way.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The thing is that out here in SI, there isn't much you can do to promote the express buses. I mean, the sign is on the pole, the route is on the map, it has MTA buses running on the route, and people are getting on right in front of you. I mean, what else can you do?

 

I guess maybe you could have posters on the parallel local routes saying that there's an alternative.

 

It would be easier to advertise if it was a private company. For instance, they could say something like "Tired for the bus arriving a minute before the ferry leaves? Then take the ___ route and get a comfortable seat all the way to Manhattan". I doubt the MTA would put that up for themselves.

 

I mean, that's why realistically the only lines with a lot of potential are the ones near subway lines. If you're already taking the bus to the subway, chances are you've seen the express bus and the sign on the pole. The only thing they can really do is put the schedule on the pole if they haven't already done so.

 

But definitely bring it up. I mean, you give them the idea, so it's up to them to figure out the best way to do it. You're not even getting paid so don't go crazy trying to figure out the best way.

 

 

Believe it or not I still hear people saying "Where does that bus go?" from time to time if I get off of the X30 on SI at night and the S48 hasn't picked up or something. Most people do know of them but can't afford them, but others aren't quite sure if they can use them or not. Part of it has to do with the fact that it is Drop-Off only coming home, so that could throw some people off. You even admitted that you were a bit confused when you saw them in Brooklyn and it was the same thing with me when I saw them. The X30 had only recently started up (though the route had been run privately before then) and the X16 was not all that old either, so express bus service in some parts of the island being run by the is still a rather "new concept". Before then like I said, they didn't even have timetables up, so you may have seen them but you didn't know when they came unless you checked the website.

 

I think that some routes have become more visible like the Bus express bus routes, because the BM3 with the newer MCIs stands out a lot more than those crappy Orions did when Command ran the route. :cool: I used the X16 for a while and then it took me a while to learn other express bus routes because I realized that it was way more convenient for me traveling wise and less stressful. The problem was I needed to start working later in the office, so that meant that I couldn't catch the X16 Downtown by 18:00 (I was working in Chelsea over on 5th & 18th at the time), so I experimented for the first time with the X10. Mannnn was that a ride!! LOL! I got on by 23rd and Broadway at the time and that bus was SRO. I had never seen an express bus that packed before and this was maybe around 19:00 or so and I was thinking **** this may not be the best thing if the later express buses are packed like this. Turns out that that was just a one time situation because apparently the X10 was backed up for some reason or another (what's new? ), but I also wanted to not have to deal with the local bus once I got onto the island, so I took the X10 all the way to Forest and Willowbrook and walked from there to West Brighton.

 

That was really the first time that I had ventured into Port Richmond, and I got a weird vibe at the time, like the area wasn't as affluent as West Brighton, so I scrapped that idea moreso because of the long walk more than anything and it took a while as well to get to Forest. I eventually kept studying the map and venturing to other express bus routes until I found a few routes that I liked and then used car service a few times when the bus wasn't an option and now with car service it doesn't matter what I take. Today though I was really puzzled. I had to make a stop at Staples over on Forest to ship some things via UPS and took car service and just took a slow walk over to the X10 from there. I waited for an hour for that bus and yet as we get down past the SIE on Richmond Avenue, there were still folks waiting for the X10 when they have the X17C across the street. :confused:

 

I'm like Jesus... Is the X17C ******* up as well or what? I mean they both go the exact same way and anytime that I've gone over by Richmond near the SIE on the weekend, I've always used the X17C. Seems like the obvious option, but I guess not.

 

 

Yeah well I'm still interested in knowing how they called themselves advertising the BxM8 more aside from the signage change? They never went into details of how they did that other than that change. I think that they're under the impression that those who need to know about them will because I notice while looking at co-ops online Thursday evening up in Riverdale that just about all of the ads that I read mentioned all of the express buses and Metro North of course. They really prop up their great transportation up there, but then again if you're in certain areas, like I've said in the past, areas like Shore Rd, if you're looking for an apartment there (lots of folks like to buy high end condos over there, the express bus is going to mentioned all of the time because it's a selling point). Same thing in Riverdale and perhaps the knows this to a degree.

 

Yeah, I'm interested in that too though... I don't think they need to advertise on certain lines though. I've heard folks talking on the X12 in the morning and this chick was chatting with a friend of hers who apparently had moved in with her or was staying with her from out of town or something and she was telling her not to take the ferry. She said just take the express bus and call me and I'll pick you up if it's late at night. lol She made up this story about what a pain it was to take the bus to the ferry, but I got the feeling that she would feel safer with her taking the express bus and I've seen plenty of parents along Hylan Blvd that drive their kids to the X1 and see them off to the city because they feel like it's safer than the local bus and such.

[checkmatechamp13]

1) Believe it or not I still hear people saying "Where does that bus go?" from time to time if I get off of the X30 on SI at night and the S48 hasn't picked up or something. Most people do know of them but can't afford them, but others aren't quite sure if they can use them or not. Part of it has to do with the fact that it is Drop-Off only coming home, so that could throw some people off. You even admitted that you were a bit confused when you saw them in Brooklyn and it was the same thing with me when I saw them. The X30 had only recently started up (though the route had been run privately before then) and the X16 was not all that old either, so express bus service in some parts of the island being run by the is still a rather "new concept". Before then like I said, they didn't even have timetables up, so you may have seen them but you didn't know when they came unless you checked the website.

 

2) That was really the first time that I had ventured into Port Richmond, and I got a weird vibe at the time, like the area wasn't as affluent as West Brighton, so I scrapped that idea moreso because of the long walk more than anything and it took a while as well to get to Forest. I eventually kept studying the map and venturing to other express bus routes until I found a few routes that I liked and then used car service a few times when the bus wasn't an option and now with car service it doesn't matter what I take. Today though I was really puzzled. I had to make a stop at Staples over on Forest to ship some things via UPS and took car service and just took a slow walk over to the X10 from there. I waited for an hour for that bus and yet as we get down past the SIE on Richmond Avenue, there were still folks waiting for the X10 when they have the X17C across the street. :confused:

 

I'm like Jesus... Is the X17C ******* up as well or what? I mean they both go the exact same way and anytime that I've gone over by Richmond near the SIE on the weekend, I've always used the X17C. Seems like the obvious option, but I guess not.

 

3) Yeah well I'm still interested in knowing how they called themselves advertising the BxM8 more aside from the signage change? They never went into details of how they did that other than that change. I think that they're under the impression that those who need to know about them will because I notice while looking at co-ops online Thursday evening up in Riverdale that just about all of the ads that I read mentioned all of the express buses and Metro North of course. They really prop up their great transportation up there, but then again if you're in certain areas, like I've said in the past, areas like Shore Rd, if you're looking for an apartment there (lots of folks like to buy high end condos over there, the express bus is going to mentioned all of the time because it's a selling point). Same thing in Riverdale and perhaps the knows this to a degree.

 

4) Yeah, I'm interested in that too though... I don't think they need to advertise on certain lines though. I've heard folks talking on the X12 in the morning and this chick was chatting with a friend of hers who apparently had moved in with her or was staying with her from out of town or something and she was telling her not to take the ferry. She said just take the express bus and call me and I'll pick you up if it's late at night. lol She made up this story about what a pain it was to take the bus to the ferry, but I got the feeling that she would feel safer with her taking the express bus and I've seen plenty of parents along Hylan Blvd that drive their kids to the X1 and see them off to the city because they feel like it's safer than the local bus and such.

 

1) Well, I was confused but I still wouldn't have wanted to use the X29. I've always liked trains better than buses and never really liked fancy things either (I used to hate it when the B1 would get the buses those soft, comfortable seats. For some crazy reason, I prefered the hard, plastic seats. I also hated riding in cars). So I'm definitely not getting on a fancy bus.

 

Obivously I was a kid, so I'd have to travel however my parents wanted to travel, but if I had a say in the mode we'd take (such as whether to make 2 transfers on the subway to get to Bay Ridge or just take the B1 directly there), I'd always pick the train. If it was a choice of express bus vs. subway (even if I had known anybody could use the express bus and even if the express bus was the same price as the subway), I'd pick the subway, and if it was a choice of subway vs. local bus, I'd pick the subway.

 

And the X30 was a new route (though like you said, it was privately run, but people tend to have more knowledge of a route if it's run by the MTA). However, the X16 had been around for a while. I have a map from 1993 and it shows the X16 running, so it was definitely long enough for people to know about it. The X30 had started in 2002, so it's understandable that people wouldn't know about it.

 

2) Like I said, that's not really Port Richmond. That's the border of "Upper Port Richmond" and Westerleigh, which as you know is a nice area. In any case, you could've walked down College Avenue instead, but I guess you weren't familiar with the area so you didn't know that.

 

As far as the X10 vs. X17 goes, there's the chance that the people had arrived a few minutes earlier and knew they had missed the X17, so they took the X10 when it came.

 

When my family first moved to SI, the X17 had a tendancy to go MIA on Saturdays. When we would use it, we'd always wait for the X10 (my grandmother didn't want to cross the street and also she wanted to get sort of a tour of SI, since the X10 goes on residential streets), and we wouldn't see the X17 for a while. Then a year later, we decided to take the X17 whenever we went to Manhattan and it would come as scheduled.

 

And now that I think about it, it's been well over a year since I've taken an express bus at all (though my mother takes them occasionally because she's able to get the 4 hour transfer, and yesterday my mother and grandmother took the X17J to get to Manhattan, but I myself haven't taken them in over a year)

 

3) As far as advertising goes, they'll mention every single thing possible to make their condo look good. It's just how advertising works: Make it sound as good as possible and you can jack up the price.

 

4) Well, it is a PITA to take the ferry. You and I both know that.

 

But I'm also on city-data, and whenever somebody asks a question about how to get to Manhattan, I always recommend the express bus.