$500 for farebeaters...

[LTA1992]

How'd you get a Student MetroCard like that? You have Satuurday school or something? Mine works Monday-Friday from 05:30-20:30, with 3 trips per day.

 

 

I'm in this program called YABC so our MetroCards work from Sunday-Friday 5:30am-11pm. I never got why they just didn't make it 7 days a week since there is Saturday school for some of the students there.

 

P.S, I just thought of this about students "farebeating". Since their fare is technically already paid for by the DOE, it really wouldn't make a difference if they dipped their cards or not. Just a thought.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I'd just like to point out that on SI, the farebox recovery route of the express buses is only slightly higher than that of the local routes (I'm too tired to figure it out now, but I believe it's 50% for the local routes and 45% for the express routes. On the weekends, the express buses actually have a higher FRR than the SI local routes)

 

SI express routes aren't really any more expensive than the routes in the other boroughs. They travel further, but they get more passengers so the cost is lower.

 

Thank you! Enough with express buses cost so much nonsense. The X10 for example is quite cheap to run and they cut back on the X1s to cut costs there too, so the has been tightening their belt when it comes to express bus service. The thing is people want drastic changes over night, which simply can't happen. The cuts and reductions continue to happen since the 2010 cuts.

 

As far as off-peak and reverse-peak ridership goes, discounts during those times could help boost ridership, but a certain somebody doesn't want "riff-raff" riding his beloved express routes.

 

The key thing is "could"... People can't have it both ways. One minute folks are arguing that the prices should be raised, then they say offer off peak discounts. Anything to harp on the idea of express buses being "so expensive". Meanwhile MetroNorth and LIRR cost more to ride than the express bus and I don't see folks constantly complaining about that. Just like with the express buses, the also reduces service on the LIRR and MetroNorth lines as needed. As I've said many times, they review ALL express bus lines every 3 months, so they're very aware of the ridership on each line. They want to reduce costs, but they also understand that once they cut the service, they more than likely won't restore it, so if there's any chance of a run having the potential to gain ridership, they try to keep it around.

 

 

1) If you're going to Lower Manhattan, you have to pay another fare if you take Metro-North. You only save money if you work (and do most of your other daily activities) within walking distance of Grand Central (or home), or else you're better off (financially) buying a weekly express bus pass. So in some ways it's a mattter of convenience, and in other ways it's a matter of cost.

 

That's a moot point since most folks have unlimited Metrocards anyway. If you take the shuttle bus to MetroNorth, you would have to pay and use your Metrocard to ride it.

 

2) Aside from the fact that there are express buses that parallel subway lines, how do you know he's not willing to pay for the cost of more subway lines (or light rail which is a stupid idea if you're trying to get people to Manhattan)? The long-term savings are definitely worth it (not to mention additional real estate tax and things like that).

 

Oh please. The guy favors cuts across the board. If he doesn't even want certain local buses around in Brooklyn, he's not forking over monies for expensive subways for Staten Island.

 

 

Actually, I've seen that happen a few times. Whether it was an error with the farebox or they somehow managed to take 3 rides at 07:30 in the morning I don't know, but in any case the B/O just let them on (I mean, where else would a teenager with books, trying to use a Student MetroCard be going at 07:30 in the morning?)

 

Well these "kids" had nothing on them and did not show any sort of MetroCard. They just walked on and that was that. I still don't think they were "kids". Just a bunch of dropouts that should've graduated years ago if they were actually "kids".

 

I've never had that problem, but in any case I'm just saying it's possible.

 

I'm sure you haven't because I never had that problem. What some of these kids do is pass their Metrocard around. Who knows. The kid could give his card to a relative or something to use. Some of these guys are short and can pass for kids. Quite frankly some of them are not kids but grown men passing themselves off as kids.

 

 

 

This is another issue that it raises: If you have a zero tolerance policy, what do you do on those routes where the bus is so full that the only way to get in is through the back? Are you really going to start fining people who intend to pay but physically can't (and they might have to make a transfer so they'll pay anyway).

 

Simple... They wait for the next bus. That's all. No excuses. With Bus Time now, folks will be able to see where the buses are, so they'll have a choice of getting the crowded bus or waiting for the next one.

[Blitz]

I'm in this program called YABC so our MetroCards work from Sunday-Friday 5:30am-11pm. I never got why they just didn't make it 7 days a week since there is Saturday school for some of the students there.

 

P.S, I just thought of this about students "farebeating". Since their fare is technically already paid for by the DOE, it really wouldn't make a difference if they dipped their cards or not. Just a thought.

 

a lot of those "students" use up all their fares going to other places besides school, that's why they beat the fare...

[Via Garibaldi 8]

[/b]

 

a lot of those "students" use up all their fares going to other places besides school, that's why they beat the fare...

 

Yeah, it's total BS. You're NOT a student 24/7, so that means hanging out with friends is NOT part of school activities and you shouldn't get a free ride. I've been using the S54 from the express bus just about every day this week (busy nights of late in the office so I've been leaving later) and the last few nights I've caught the same local bus and this same "kid" gets on walks by the driver like getting on and not paying is the norm and takes a seat. I got so irritated last night that I was very close to saying something to the "kid" and the driver for that matter. I had a few bags from the market along with my briefcase and umbrella and I went through all of the trouble of dipping my card. Meanwhile this "kid" (which I don't buy that he's a kid) gets on and just takes a friggin' seat. The B/O is a really nice guy though, so I didn't make a stink, but what really irked me is that I don't even think the B/O presses the friggin' button to register the "kid" as a farebeater. :mad: If he's not going to say anything at least register this "kid" as beating the fare.

[LTA1992]

And? It's not like there's anyone to stop the people who do use the cards. It's a student metro. They can do as they please. And I hope I don't have to repeat this again, THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A FREE RIDE. AT THE END OF THE DAY, SOMEONES PAYING FOR IT.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

And? It's not like there's anyone to stop the people who do use the cards. It's a student metro. They can do as they please. And I hope I don't have to repeat this again, THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A FREE RIDE. AT THE END OF THE DAY, SOMEONES PAYING FOR IT.

 

Again you are misinformed... I have saw people stopped by undercover cops for using Student MetroCards. It is a just a question of whether or not they will be caught. Also, to be clear, the DOE is not paying for the MetroCards. The pays for them.

[LTA1992]

Again you are misinformed... I have saw people stopped by undercover cops for using Student MetroCards. It is a just a question of whether or not they will be caught. Also, to be clear, the DOE is not paying for the MetroCards. The pays for them.

 

I was talking about students using them sir, not regular people. Second, that doesn't change the fact that the rides are technically paid for and either way, for students who have a full fare card, doesn't matter if you dip it or not. It's not like the student is paying for his/her ride. But for those who just walk on the bus, they could at least show ID or something. The only times I have to "farebeat" as you would call this, is when I'm coming home from school and I get on the s98 at 10:16pm, and the card reader doesn't recognize my second transfer.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I was talking about students using them sir, not regular people. Second, that doesn't change the fact that the rides are technically paid for and either way, for students who have a full fare card, doesn't matter if you dip it or not. It's not like the student is paying for his/her ride. But for those who just walk on the bus, they could at least show ID or something. The only times I have to "farebeat" as you would call this, is when I'm coming home from school and I get on the s98 at 10:16pm, and the card reader doesn't recognize my second transfer.

 

The issue is that the is paying for these cards (which we are paying for one way or another ) and they're broke and you've got students farebeating left and right. That's why so many folks supported the doing away with them. The abuse of those Student cards is insane. I say get rid of them or better yet make certain requirements for students to be able to use them. They should be more personalized.

[checkmatechamp13]

1) Thank you! Enough with express buses cost so much nonsense. The X10 for example is quite cheap to run and they cut back on the X1s to cut costs there too, so the has been tightening their belt when it comes to express bus service. The thing is people want drastic changes over night, which simply can't happen. The cuts and reductions continue to happen since the 2010 cuts.

 

2) The key thing is "could"... People can't have it both ways. One minute folks are arguing that the prices should be raised, then they say offer off peak discounts. Anything to harp on the idea of express buses being "so expensive". Meanwhile MetroNorth and LIRR cost more to ride than the express bus and I don't see folks constantly complaining about that. Just like with the express buses, the also reduces service on the LIRR and MetroNorth lines as needed. As I've said many times, they review ALL express bus lines every 3 months, so they're very aware of the ridership on each line. They want to reduce costs, but they also understand that once they cut the service, they more than likely won't restore it, so if there's any chance of a run having the potential to gain ridership, they try to keep it around.

 

3) That's a moot point since most folks have unlimited Metrocards anyway. If you take the shuttle bus to MetroNorth, you would have to pay and use your Metrocard to ride it.

 

4) I'm sure you haven't because I never had that problem. What some of these kids do is pass their Metrocard around. Who knows. The kid could give his card to a relative or something to use. Some of these guys are short and can pass for kids. Quite frankly some of them are not kids but grown men passing themselves off as kids.

 

5) Simple... They wait for the next bus. That's all. No excuses. With Bus Time now, folks will be able to see where the buses are, so they'll have a choice of getting the crowded bus or waiting for the next one.

 

1) And the X1 and BxM7 on weekends perform just as well as the average local route citywide (they make back roughly 80% of their operating costs, which is only marginally lower than the average local route)

 

2) Simple. Raise the peak fare and lower the off-peak fare. Everybody's happy

 

Part of the reason why express buses cost so much to operate is because of their peaky service patterns. If you solve that, you lower the costs and you might not even need to raise the peak fare.

 

3) You get a UniTicket for $30 a month. You don't need an Unlimited MetroCard for those routes for $104.

 

4) And they somehow managed to use 3 rides in 2 hours (the MetroCard is valid starting at 05:30, and these incidents happened around 07:30). It's possible, but highly unlikely.

 

5) You've got to be kidding me. So you're saying that if you've already waited 20 minutes, you should be forced to wait an extra 10 minutes for the next bus and probably miss your connections to boot.

 

And alright Mr. Zero-Tolerance, how about those times when the "regulars" forgot their MetroCard occasionally and you used your Express Bus Plus MetroCard to help them out? That's technically illegal. Your Unlimited MetroCard is meant for one person, not two, so you should be fined as well. And that time you sold a swipe off your Unlimited MetroCard for $5.50 was clearly illegal and you should definitely be fined (maybe even doubly fined because an express bus is more than double the local fare) because you essentially did what the "subway swipers" do.

 

Also, to be clear, the DOE is not paying for the MetroCards. The pays for them.

 

The DOE pays for part of the cost. When it was up for elimination, the program cost $214 million. The city put in $25 million and the state put in $45 million (it could've been the other way around, though I'm pretty sure this was the case).

[LTA1992]

The issue is that the is paying for these cards (which we are paying for one way or another ) and they're broke and you've got students farebeating left and right. That's why so many folks supported the doing away with them. The abuse of those Student cards is insane. I say get rid of them or better yet make certain requirements for students to be able to use them. They should be more personalized.

 

Get rid of those cards and more kids wont be going to school. Most families can't afford to par for their kid to travel to/from school everyday, plus after school activities and other commitments. I can already see you saying something about them going to school in their neighborhood and I say this, some parents don't want their child going to school in their neighborhood for certain reasons. Especially If a child lives in a rough neighborhood, a parent might not want him/her to be exposed to that in school so they register the child in a school in the next neighborhood where it's a lot safer.

[checkmatechamp13]

Get rid of those cards and more kids wont be going to school. Most families can't afford to par for their kid to travel to/from school everyday, plus after school activities and other commitments. I can already see you saying something about them going to school in their neighborhood and I say this, some parents don't want their child going to school in their neighborhood for certain reasons. Especially If a child lives in a rough neighborhood, a parent might not want him/her to be exposed to that in school so they register the child in a school in the next neighborhood where it's a lot safer.

 

And aside from that, there are neighborhoods without a local school. I don't live too far from you, and there's no public high school within walking distance for either of us (I mean, I've walked to my high school a couple of times but I can't do that every day, with a heavy backpack, in inclement weather)

 

Plus, there are times when the zones don't even correspond to the closest school. I've heard there are some examples on the South Shore (I think kids were closer to I.S.75 and were going to I.S.34), and I know Arlington is zoned for I.S.72 in Heartland Village when they are closer (though not really within walking distance of) I.S.51.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

2) Simple. Raise the peak fare and lower the off-peak fare. Everybody's happy

 

Yeah right... Everybody has a "solution" don't they?

 

 

3) You get a UniTicket for $30 a month. You don't need an Unlimited MetroCard for those routes for $104.

 

Forget about those routes... I would still use my Express Bus Plus card so that I have access to the express buses and local buses.

 

4) And they somehow managed to use 3 rides in 2 hours (the MetroCard is valid starting at 05:30, and these incidents happened around 07:30). It's possible, but highly unlikely.

 

Indeed.

 

5) You've got to be kidding me. So you're saying that if you've already waited 20 minutes, you should be forced to wait an extra 10 minutes for the next bus and probably miss your connections to boot.

 

In other countries, that "the bus was too crowded so I couldn't pay" line doesn't fly. You are fined period. You are expected to get your ticket stamped when you board no matter how crowded the bus is. End of the story. In this case you would be expected to dip your card.

 

And alright Mr. Zero-Tolerance, how about those times when the "regulars" forgot their MetroCard occasionally and you used your Express Bus Plus MetroCard to help them out? That's technically illegal. Your Unlimited MetroCard is meant for one person, not two, so you should be fined as well. And that time you sold a swipe off your Unlimited MetroCard for $5.50 was clearly illegal and you should definitely be fined (maybe even doubly fined because an express bus is more than double the local fare) because you essentially did what the "subway swipers" do.

 

Well that's funny. The B/O thanked me for dipping my card. It's not like I got on saying oh let me make some money off of folks that don't have a card. We express bus riders are certainly not the ones farebeating so don't even try it. The regular went to the store to buy a MetroCard and they were all out, so she had no other options. A working professional versus some deadbeat... Can't compare the two. This is completely different from farebeating. If I had a Pay-Per-Ride card, I could certainly dip my card for her just the same. The only difference is that I had an Unlimited card and I do not believe in using it like that. The other lady had a problem with her Metrocard and her other friend had already used up her own MetroCard so since they were already on and had no other options other than getting off, I allowed her to use my card. And yes I charged her for it because I really didn't want her using it. She was lucky I was in a good mood. That's all.

 

 

The DOE pays for part of the cost. When it was up for elimination, the program cost $214 million. The city put in $25 million and the state put in $45 million (it could've been the other way around, though I'm pretty sure this was the case).

Yeah well even if they pay for part of it, the still absorbs a good brunt of the cost, which is passed on to we the taxpayers. We provide free education. There is no mandate saying we have to give students free transportation all over the city to galavant and such and BS with friends or whatever. These kids are joke. They step on the bus, not a book in sight. Too many kids farebeating just to walk the halls and hangout.

 

Get rid of those cards and more kids wont be going to school. Most families can't afford to par for their kid to travel to/from school everyday, plus after school activities and other commitments. I can already see you saying something about them going to school in their neighborhood and I say this, some parents don't want their child going to school in their neighborhood for certain reasons. Especially If a child lives in a rough neighborhood, a parent might not want him/her to be exposed to that in school so they register the child in a school in the next neighborhood where it's a lot safer.

 

 

Oh, I am so sick of hearing that line. So it's okay for them to abuse the MetroCards and give it to every Tom, *ick and Harry? I'm sorry but I disagree. Hanging out with friends does not qualify as a real "commitment". You guys think that all of your rides should be free and they shouldn't. The sense of entitlement is unbelievable. I had a Student MetroCard too and when I went to hang out with friends I paid out of my pocket for it and didn't scam the system. More often then not you guys use them for personal use and not for school related things. Not much has changed since I went to high school when it comes to those Student MetroCards. The main difference is that they're abused now more than when I was going to high school and that's why they need to be cut out or more heavily regulated. You're right, parents have the right to send their kids to whatever school they want... Just don't expect the taxpayers to keep forking over the money for free trips to hang out with friends and other BS because guess what?? Just like the parents can't afford it, neither can we?? We have bills and expenses too just like the parents do and we are sick of absorbing the costs.

 

School and SCHOOL related activities is one thing. Working a job (unless it is connected to school) and hanging out with friends are NOT school related. That's for your own personal benefit. 3 rides are good enough. After that you either pay or walk home. That's what I would do.

[checkmatechamp13]

1) Yeah right... Everybody has a "solution" don't they?

 

2) Forget about those routes... I would still use my Express Bus Plus card so that I have access to the express buses and local buses.

 

3) In other countries, that "the bus was too crowded so I couldn't pay" line doesn't fly. You are fined period. You are expected to get your ticket stamped when you board no matter how crowded the bus is. End of the story.

 

4) Well that's funny. The B/O thanked me for dipping my card. It's not like I got on saying oh let me make some money off of folks that don't have a card. We express bus riders are certainly not the ones farebeating so don't even try it. The regular went to the store to buy a MetroCard and they were all out, so she had no other options. A working professional versus some deadbeat... Can't compare the two. This is completely different from farebeating. If I had a Pay-per-ride card, I could certainly dip my card for her just the same. The only difference is that I had an Unlimited card and I do not believe in using it like that. The other lady had a problem with her Metrocard and her other friend had already used up her own MetroCard so since they were already on and had no other options other than getting off, I allowed her to use my card. And yes I charged her for it because I really didn't want her using it. She was lucky I was in a good mood. That's all.

 

5) Yeah well even if they pay for part of it, the still absorbs a good brunt of the cost, which is passed on to we the taxpayers. We provide free education. There is no mandate saying we have to give students free transportation all over the city to galavant and such and BS with friends or whatever. These kids are joke. They step on the bus, not a book in sight. Too many kids farebeating just to walk the halls and hangout.

 

6) Oh, I am so sick of hearing that line. So it's okay for them to abuse the MetroCards and give it to every Tom, *ick and Harry? I'm sorry but I disagree. Hanging out with friends does not qualify as a real "commitment". You guys think that all of your rides should be free and they shouldn't. The sense of entitlement is unbelievable. I had a Student MetroCard too and when I went to hang out with friends I paid out of my pocket for it and didn't scam the system. More often then not you guys use them for personal use and not for school related things. Not much has changed since I went to high school when it comes to those Student MetroCards. The main difference is that they're abused now more than when I was going to high school and that's why they need to be cut out or more heavily regulated. You're right, parents have the right to send their kids to whatever school they want... Just don't expect the taxpayers to keep forking over the money for free trips to hang out with friends and other BS.

 

School and SCHOOL related activities is one thing. Working a job (unless it is connected to school) and hanging out with friends are NOT school related. That's for your own personal benefit. 3 rides are good enough. After that you either pay or walk home. That's what I would do.

 

1) Yes, we do. Now if the MTA implemented those solutions, we would have fewer problems.

 

2) That's my point. For the most part, the express buses are cheaper than the MNRR (though that's only because the MTA's fare structure makes it so)

 

3) The last time I checked, NYC's buses don't have proof-of-payment.

 

4) Yeah, because the B/O is understanding and realizes that everything doesn't have to be enforced to the letter. And the point is that you still cheated the MTA out of $5.50. She came up to you and paid you $5.50 instead of giving the MTA $5.50. You used an Unlimited MetroCard, so the MTA lost out on $5.50.

 

5) Yeah, OK. None of the students who step onto the bus have a backpack on them.

 

6) Sure you didn't. You said "Oh gee, I have 2 rides left, but because I'm such an upstanding citizen, I'm going to pay the regular fare".

 

And how the hell do you know if a job is or isn't connected to school? Many schools require you to do volunteer activities and internships. I manage to get by because of the transfers and stuff like that, but still.

 

On Wednesdays when I got out of high school early, I always headed to this stint I had going on as an apprentice to my dad's friend's law office, and I used one ride from school to work. That would be my second ride of the day. The last ride would go towards traveling home from work.

 

Three rides is enough. I don't know why it's there but hey it does help but more than that and you're pushing it.

 

And if you have two after-school activities?

 

Take me for instance. I have (essentially) an internship. On one of those days, I have a club at the YMCA. Here's how I use my rides:

 

Ride 1: Get to school (S59 and then walk, or S44/S89 to the S46/S96 or walk)

Ride 2: Get to internship (S46)

 

To get to the YMCA, I walk down to Forest Avenue for the S48 and I use a transfer to get to Broadway

 

And ride 3 gets me home from the YMCA.

 

Or sometimes I walk from school to the internship and then I have 2 rides left: One to get to the YMCA and the other to get home. And I have other tricks up my sleeve in case the farebox takes off an extra transfer or something, like walking up to Cary Avenue/Broadway for the S44/S94, or just walking home from the S48/S98 at Forest Avenue/South Avenue.

 

The point is that it's possible to have 2 after-school activities in 1 day and while I can manage to use the transfers to get around, that isn't the case with everybody.

[LRG]

On Wednesdays when I got out of high school early, I always headed to this stint I had going on as an apprentice to my dad's friend's law office, and I used one ride from school to work. That would be my second ride of the day. The last ride would go towards traveling home from work.

 

Three rides is enough. I don't know why it's there but hey it does help but more than that and you're pushing it.

[MHV9218]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[LTA1992]

Ahhh, the sound of common sense. But 3 rides is not enough, really. I used to have an internship before school. Sometimes we got out early and I used all 3 fares before walking in the school door that afternoon. And if ur wondering why that is, I was not going to school 3 hours early so I used that 2nd fare to go to my grandmothers house. Then when it was time for school, 3rd fare took me there. Then going home? Had to ask to get on.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Another absurdly elitist and ignorant comment, I thought we'd stopped with that?

 

1) There already are requirements, it's been a while but I know there are distance regulations for the value and usage ability of each card.

 

2) Eliminating student Metrocards asks every poor student across NYC to pay $5.50 or more just to go to school every day. You think everybody can afford that? You're talking about asking just around $1000 out of family pockets just for school transportation service. Hope you don't like high attendance too much, cause nobody's gonna show up...

 

 

1) Yeah, those requirements existed when I was back in high school.... Big deal... Shows how outdated those requirements are.

 

2) Yeah right "elitist". So all of the folks calling for it to be eliminated recently are "elitists"? I doubt it. Many of them are middle class working folks who are struggling to make ends meet. LTA1992 claims that parents can't afford it, yet it's okay to pass those costs on to others who can't afford it either??? Nothing elitist about that at all. The passes those costs on to the riding public, many of who are also poor, so there is nothing "elitist" about that. It's called the truth. Furthermore, they should be either eliminated or heavily regulated because they're abused.

[MHV9218]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[Via Garibaldi 8]

It is absolutely elitist. You sit in your cozy Riverdale or Staten Island home and tell struggling parents from Brownsville that they should start paying an extra $1000 per year to send their kids to school, just because you say so. Just because you say it's not that much money. Take a look around and leave your own world for a second. $1000 is a whole lot of money to pay for transportation, and free Metrocards are the only reason many students even make it to school and stay off the streets. And if you're so thick as to blame the cards for service cuts, you should realize that the Student Metrocards are only ever brought up as a political ploy: they should not and will not be cut, as that is inhumane and impractical, and not something the MTA has ever considered doing. Let's end that pipe dream now.

 

Oh please with the Riverdale comment. Yes, I'll be living in Riverdale shortly but that has nothing to do with the thousands of other middle class folks who use public transportation that are struggling. You think it's okay for them to eat these costs?? If you call that elitist then I don't know what to say. And yes last I checked the was going to cut them because they're paying the brunt of the costs for them and of course the riding public one way or another will pay for them and many folks supported getting rid of them and they certainly weren't swimming in dough either. You excuse the students' abuse of them and them passing them to others to use and call my criticisms "elitist"... Please.

[MHV9218]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Again, this discussion is moot because the MTA will not cut them. Don't believe everything you read. It's a political tactic and nothing more, not unless types like you start actually advocating for something so selfish.

 

Don't be surprised... We folks in Riverdale have power you know... Quite frankly I probably won't make much a stink about it up here. As long as my express buses in Riverdale aren't touched I could care less. Let them have their 3 rides.

[East New York]

I agree with both posts above... Now when will the step up to the plate and enforce the fare??? :mad::mad: The paying public can't keep affording to pay for the farebeaters and the problem will eventually culminate into something that wasn't necessary to begin with.

 

Personally, I think the only route that should not be strictly enforced is the M35. That is a whole topic of discussion all in itself though.

 

My evaluation of MTA is about half complete. Buses and B&T are done, Subway is near complete, then there is LIRR and MNR. But I dont think I will be done with the latter anytime soon. MTA is in an interesting place right now, but I want to have some heavy discussions about a few areas and divisions.....

[checkmatechamp13]

1) Yeah, those requirements existed when I was back in high school.... Big deal... Shows how outdated those requirements are.

 

2) Yeah right "elitist". So all of the folks calling for it to be eliminated recently are "elitists"? I doubt it. Many of them are middle class working folks who are struggling to make ends meet. LTA1992 claims that parents can't afford it, yet it's okay to pass those costs on to others who can't afford it either??? Nothing elitist about that at all. The passes those costs on to the riding public, many of who are also poor, so there is nothing "elitist" about that. It's called the truth. Furthermore, they should be either eliminated or heavily regulated because they're abused.

 

1) And how does it make the requirements outdated because they are the same from when you were in school? Did the physical abilities of students somehow change that drastically that the same standards aren't valid?

 

2) And most of the "middle class working folks" in this city support having Student MetroCards around. Sure, there are some that don't, but most do.

 

Students make up roughly 7% of the riders in the system (and a third of the costs are covered by the DOE), so the extra fare that the "working folks" have to pay is relatively small. So if there were no Student MetroCards, the monthly pass would've gone to say, $100 instead of $104, and the bonus might've been 10% instead of 7%. The burden to those people is a lot less than it is to the students.

 

Say somebody lives in the South Bronx, where a lot of the students can't afford the roughly $750 per year to buy a MetroCard. A "working class" person is going to have to deal with the extra problems caused by kids hanging out on the streets, so even to them it's worth the slightly higher fare to get a better quality of life. Not to mention that it's cheaper to give kids a Student MetroCard than it is to pay for welfare and the possible costs of them being arrested.

 

I'm not implying that eveybody who gets a Student MetroCard is going to grow up and be successful and not be a burden on the system, but it's definitely a start.

 

It is absolutely elitist. You sit in your cozy Riverdale or Staten Island home and tell struggling parents from Brownsville that they should start paying an extra $1000 per year to send their kids to school, just because you say so. Just because you say it's not that much money. Take a look around and leave your own world for a second. $1000 is a whole lot of money to pay for transportation, and free Metrocards are the only reason many students even make it to school and stay off the streets. And if you're so thick as to blame the cards for service cuts, you should realize that the Student Metrocards are only ever brought up as a political ploy: they should not and will not be cut, as that is inhumane and impractical, and not something the MTA has ever considered doing. Let's end that pipe dream now.

 

Well, inhumane is a bit of an exaggeration, but otherwise I agree.

 

Personally, I think the only route that should not be strictly enforced is the M35. That is a whole topic of discussion all in itself though.

 

My evaluation of MTA is about half complete. Buses and B&T are done, Subway is near complete, then there is LIRR and MNR. But I dont think I will be done with the latter anytime soon. MTA is in an interesting place right now, but I want to have some heavy discussions about a few areas and divisions.....

 

What evaluation are you referring to?

 

As far as "strict enforcement" goes, you've mentioned times when you were running late for work and forgot your monthly MetroCard. Keep in mind that you'd be hit with the fine as well. Also keep in mind that there are times when there are legitimate problems (a transfer really doesn't work, or it took off a partial fare instead of taking off a transfer).

 

I don't agree with any policy of zero-tolerance (with regards to anything) because there are many situations where the person isn't harming anybody, but the book says that they are doing something wrong and they should get the full punishment.

[Grand Concourse]

On the student metrocard thing: I think it should be incentive based. If the kid has an A/B average = full fare, C/D = half fare, F = out of pocket. That way you reward students for doing well in school and weed out others that just uses school as an excuse to hang out with other kids or abuse the cards and play hookie elsewhere in the city. I think that's more than fair. However, I still feel the student cards should be more a DOE issue than put all the burden on the MTA. The DOE and/or the City should be paying for them, not just the MTA [seems like way over 50% last i looked].

[checkmatechamp13]

On the student metrocard thing: I think it should be incentive based. If the kid has an A/B average = full fare, C/D = half fare, F = out of pocket. That way you reward students for doing well in school and weed out others that just uses school as an excuse to hang out with other kids or abuse the cards and play hookie elsewhere in the city. I think that's more than fair. However, I still feel the student cards should be more a DOE issue than put all the burden on the MTA. The DOE and/or the City should be paying for them, not just the MTA [seems like way over 50% last i looked].

 

The MTA covers a little over 2/3 of the cost (back in 2010, it was $144 million out of $214 million)

 

And for somebody like me with a 100+ average (though occasionally I dip into the 90s ), obviously I'll have no problem getting a Student MetroCard. But as I've said before, for those with a C/D average, they have it so that teachers can get the Student MetroCards for students in that category if they feel they're trying hard enough.

 

So if somebody has a C average and they can get 3/4 of their teachers to fill out a form saying that they are well-behaved and are trying hard, then they should get a Student MetroCard.