Brighton Express Posted March 11, 2012 Share #1 Posted March 11, 2012 I know this one may be an easy one, but on trains like the R68, R62, R40M/S, why does the driver always hold down the throttle? Also, when the train is in the 3rd position, or full power, what would happen if the driver were to let the throttle go? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted March 11, 2012 Share #2 Posted March 11, 2012 It's a deadmans switch to verify that the operator isn't incapacitated. If the handle is released while the brakes are not in emergency or full service, the train will automatically apply the emergency brakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadcruiser1 Posted March 11, 2012 Share #3 Posted March 11, 2012 The R160's have that too. Once the TO's start the car they can't stop holding onto that switch because if they let go the train stops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted March 11, 2012 Share #4 Posted March 11, 2012 Can the handle be released in full service braking on the new techs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoTimer Posted March 11, 2012 Share #5 Posted March 11, 2012 All subway car classes (and probably with railroad equipment too): A full, complete answer... The T/O must hold down the master controller when the train does not have a full service brake (72 pounds minimum on R32/42/46/68/68A, full service notch on R142/143/160) applied to it, otherwise the train will go into emergency (emergency brake, train "dumps", etc). Period. If the train does not go into emergency, the train does not enter service, or is removed from service immediately. A T/O while preparing a train for service - whether in a yard or underground - must check both ends of the train for a working pilot valve (what this feature is officially called). Similarly, this pilot valve test must be done every time (terminal, relay, yard, etc) the train is put in emergency, unless it is actually an emergency, then it must be actually placed in emergency by placing the handle in emergency (MC Handle). This is very important on NTT (R142 and up), as the event recorder not only records the train going into emergency, it also records how the train was put in emergency (PEHU in the passenger area, c/r handle, trip valve, deadman, MC handle). In an emergency, the train must be put in emergency via the MC handle or C/R handle (if c/r put the train in emergency) - and this would show up in the computer. A T/O can release the handle as long as the train has a full service brake applied, even while the train is moving (even though that would be a serious breach of the rules and the T/O taken out of service immediately if caught). In transit lingo, putting the train in full service and releasing the "deadman" is called a "pop and stop" (and again, it is illegal even though railfans love to see T/O's do it and have the train stop right where it was supposed to stop). The "pop" refers to the sound the controller makes on R68 equipment and older makes when it is let go. The train does not dump in this case and basically slides to a stop. When done at the precise time, it is possible to stop the train in the right place, but the T/O gives up control of the train while it is still moving, which is the gist of it being a NONO. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted March 11, 2012 Share #6 Posted March 11, 2012 Interesting. I wonder if hanging something moderately heavy on the MC handle was common back in the day. Would make sense as to why the current deadmans are rather "minimal"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoTimer Posted March 11, 2012 Share #7 Posted March 11, 2012 Even on the R188 (formerly R142A) the handle was moved from a neutral position (can be operated easily by a lefty) to the right side by the window, in the same place where the R160 handle is at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fresh Pond Posted March 11, 2012 Share #8 Posted March 11, 2012 The R160's have that too. Once the TO's start the car they can't stop holding onto that switch because if they let go the train stops. True but the difference with that is you gotta rotate the handle instead of keeping the handle down Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rr4567 Posted March 11, 2012 Share #9 Posted March 11, 2012 (and probably with railroad equipment too) It's different on the railroads. The deadman's switch is not integrated into the throttle. They have to press an alerter button every few seconds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted March 11, 2012 Share #10 Posted March 11, 2012 It's different on the railroads. The deadman's switch is not integrated into the throttle. They have to press an alerter button every few seconds. "Ah gee pah, what's that there telephone ringing in that cab there?!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoTimer Posted March 11, 2012 Share #11 Posted March 11, 2012 It's different on the railroads. The deadman's switch is not integrated into the throttle. They have to press an alerter button every few seconds. I figured it was the alerter type deadman (which is on the now). When the is run in ATO mode, the handle remains in full service the entire time. *sigh* its late B) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubwayGuy Posted March 20, 2012 Share #12 Posted March 20, 2012 Can the handle be released in full service braking on the new techs? Yes, and that's the only way. It actually recently caused an issue when a T/O did this as desired, reached up outside the window to punch for a lineup, and this individual's girth nudged the controller out of full service for a CHOW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubwayGuy Posted March 20, 2012 Share #13 Posted March 20, 2012 I know this one may be an easy one, but on trains like the R68, R62, R40M/S, why does the driver always hold down the throttle? Also, when the train is in the 3rd position, or full power, what would happen if the driver were to let the throttle go? Since terminology is important, I just want to clarify for you in addition to the above posts...throttles are for diesels. The device you are referring to is the "master controller" or "controller" for short. You are asking specifically about the "deadman's device" "deadman's switch" or, most accurately, "deadman's feature" of the master controller. Which TwoTimer's post above describes quite well in its operation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoTimer Posted March 20, 2012 Share #14 Posted March 20, 2012 The most accurate is actually "pilot valve", although anything deadman is a valid substitute but its more of a popular nickname. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
INDman Posted March 20, 2012 Share #15 Posted March 20, 2012 The most accurate is actually "pilot valve", although anything deadman is a valid substitute but its more of a popular nickname. But the NTTs don't have a pilot valve associated with their MC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoTimer Posted March 21, 2012 Share #16 Posted March 21, 2012 But the NTTs don't have a pilot valve associated with their MC. Im old skool hmmph Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FriedChikkin Posted March 21, 2012 Share #17 Posted March 21, 2012 Im old skool hmmph ...don't worry, RCC knows what you're talking about... if you decide to talk to them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epic Ike Posted December 3, 2020 Share #18 Posted December 3, 2020 All I know is that for the R160 and other NTTs you have to turn it counter clockwise and then if you let go the train will go into emergency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trainmaster5 Posted December 4, 2020 Share #19 Posted December 4, 2020 15 hours ago, Epic Ike said: All I know is that for the R160 and other NTTs you have to turn it counter clockwise and then if you let go the train will go into emergency. We try not to respond to 8 year old posts. I see that you are new to the forums but that's the etiquette around here. Welcome aboard. Carry on. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epic Ike Posted December 4, 2020 Share #20 Posted December 4, 2020 What do you mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deucey Posted December 4, 2020 Share #21 Posted December 4, 2020 54 minutes ago, Epic Ike said: What do you mean? It's called necroposting - reviving long-dead posts by answering unanswered questions or posting new ones. Oftentimes it happens because they show up in other parts of messageboard sites as suggested or recommended posts, but replying to them is discouraged because the information in them could be out of date or the posters in it may not be active anymore. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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