Random Thoughts Thread - Nassau Inter-County Express (NICE)

[Astoria Line]

Well my usual N6X has been less crowded lately... (I actually get a seat at Terrace since my 15 doesn't connect with it time-wise at HTC anymore....) Pretty much every NICE route I've seen has been WAY less crowded lately (Ridership being lost is no exaggeration to me....)

 

On the N6 going home yesterday, near Franklin Ave (HTC-bound), a guy got on the bus, didn't pay his fare and told the driver to take off. Everyone has been taking their frustrations on the operators. No one is as friendly with them as they used to be. Says a lot about the satisfaction.

 

I have no complaints about the 6/15/31/32 for the most part, but my god that N4 always comes to Jamaica 6-10 minutes late (which is why I NEVER take it anymore)

[Vistausss]

People being unfriendly doesn't say anything about satisfaction. Ratings over here in my city are pretty good every year yet a lot of people are unfriendly to b/o's. I've noticed it in videos of Express Buses as well.

 

It says more about the people being rude (and sometimes obnoxious) than it says about service, really.

Edited March 20, 2014 by Vistausss

[N6 Limited]

Well my usual N6X has been less crowded lately... (I actually get a seat at Terrace since my 15 doesn't connect with it time-wise at HTC anymore....) Pretty much every NICE route I've seen has been WAY less crowded lately (Ridership being lost is no exaggeration to me....)

 

On the N6 going home yesterday, near Franklin Ave (HTC-bound), a guy got on the bus, didn't pay his fare and told the driver to take off. Everyone has been taking their frustrations on the operators. No one is as friendly with them as they used to be. Says a lot about the satisfaction.

 

I have no complaints about the 6/15/31/32 for the most part, but my god that N4 always comes to Jamaica 6-10 minutes late (which is why I NEVER take it anymore)

People want to be able to board buses and not get passed, they want buses to be on time or minimally late so they can plan their trips accordingly, and they want to be able to make their connections. 

 

These requirements for satisfaction also come into play with 3 legged transfers. If I need to take 3 buses to get somewhere, then I shouldn't have to pad my trip by a couple buses each line to make sure I don't get screwed. One missing trip, extremely late bus, or being flagged by a bus can cause a cascading effect that can make a trip an hour longer or more.

 

When drivers be like "oh my bus is "full" they can take the next one" they should think about that, especially on routes with less frequent headway. 

 

As they already know, a lot of passengers use the system to get to work, lets stop screwing with passenger's income, especially since you need all the fare revenue you can get.  If they have to be concerned with getting to work on time every day because of the bus, then they're going to start getting rides from friends/family/colleagues, buy a car, and/or get a job out of the NICE service area. 

 

I actually got a car because I was going to work and school and got tired of the bus (back when it was LIB), and it was much quicker to get between work and school by car so I was able to take earlier evening classes or get to work earlier after morning classes, depending on the semester. (20-30 mins by car, 1hr+ by bus)

Edited March 20, 2014 by N6 Limited

[PinePower]

People want to be able to board buses and not get passed, they want buses to be on time or minimally late so they can plan their trips accordingly, and they want to be able to make their connections. 

 

These requirements for satisfaction also come into play with 3 legged transfers. If I need to take 3 buses to get somewhere, then I shouldn't have to pad my trip by a couple buses each line to make sure I don't get screwed. One missing trip, extremely late bus, or being flagged by a bus can cause a cascading effect that can make a trip an hour longer or more.

 

When drivers be like "oh my bus is "full" they can take the next one" they should think about that, especially on routes with less frequent headway. 

 

As they already know, a lot of passengers use the system to get to work, lets stop screwing with passenger's income, especially since you need all the fare revenue you can get.  If they have to be concerned with getting to work on time every day because of the bus, then they're going to start getting rides from friends/family/colleagues, buy a car, and/or get a job out of the NICE service area. 

 

I actually got a car because I was going to work and school and got tired of the bus (back when it was LIB), and it was much quicker to get between work and school by car so I was able to take earlier evening classes or get to work earlier after morning classes, depending on the semester. (20-30 mins by car, 1hr+ by bus)

 

And it's not just that, but also buses running early, which is now endemic as well. The 2:05pm n35 from Westbury habitually comes early, usually by 7 or 8 minutes. Last time the guy almost passed someone waiting for the bus as well. Since my EasyPay Metrocard got damaged on a NICE Bus last week and wouldn't work (READ ERROR), I have to pay with change now until I get the new one they sent me. So the transfer shows he came early. If NICE doesn't discipline him now, after I shared the proof with them, it's hopeless. wouldn't even tolerate 2 minutes early. Maybe I complained alot about LIB back in the day, but I should have realized just how good I had it. I see stuff I would never see with now. Yesterday I had another driver on the n35 park on a residential street off route so he could get something in a store, cut through side streets, then turn onto Post Ave from Asbury Lane, and skip the 1st stop on Rockland st entirely! As the Hound would say, you get what you pay for. And apparently Mangano & everyone in the legislature could care less, as well as most of the self-centered people that live in Nassau County. 

With crap like this, the message is "get a car or get out of Nassau".

Edited March 21, 2014 by PinePower

[Hound]

It's good to see that at least one Orion VII is getting a repair job They can do better still but hey, one fixed = one problem less at least.

They're probably doing a duct-tape replacement.

[PinePower]

They're probably doing a duct-tape replacement.

 

I'm surprised they can even afford Duct Tape!

[Vistausss]

Like I said last year: here in The Netherlands and since Q4 2013 also in Germany, Transdev started enforcing new, strict rules about running on schedule in their companies. If you're too far behind schedule and it's something *you* as driver could've prevented, you get a warning. If you're running early (even as early as 3 minutes early - they measure it via the black box), you have to wait at the next stop (or sometimes next timing point, depends on the route) until you're back on schedule again. If not, you'll get a warning. 3 warnings and you're fired.

 

IIRC, Transdev wanted to enforce this on NICE as well starting Q2 2014. But maybe they've changed the date on that (wouldn't surprise me, sometimes they're quite unpredicatble ), I'll ask them next week.

 

 

Oh, I just received word that those new rules are to be put into effect on NICE at or around the final rollout of 'the new system' (by which they mean the first day of Clever, which was Q4 IIRC?). Well, better late than never, I'd say, although for image sake they should've put the new rules into effect by March 30th IMHO.

Edited March 21, 2014 by SevenEleven

[N6 Limited]

Oh, I just received word that those new rules are to be put into effect on NICE at or around the final rollout of 'the new system' (by which they mean the first day of Clever, which was Q4 IIRC?). Well, better late than never, I'd say, although for image sake they should've put the new rules into effect by March 30th IMHO.

It will be easier to implement when every bus could be tracked by GPS. now, they would have to have dispatchers all around at timepoints.

[Vistausss]

It will be easier to implement when every bus could be tracked by GPS. now, they would have to have dispatchers all around at timepoints.

 

You're right, I didn't think of that. In that case it makes sense for them to start enforcing the new rules in Q3/Q4 instead of March 30th  

Edited March 21, 2014 by Vistausss

[bobtehpanda]

There was a time when NICE served Midtown? o.o

[qjtransitmaster]

There was a time when NICE served Midtown? o.o

Well technically they do feed LIRR which goes to midtown.

Edited March 22, 2014 by qjtransitmaster

[Tom Meadow]

Anybody wanna hangout I am gonna be in long beach ny around 4 checking out the bus system there.Meet by the lirr station.

[qjtransitmaster]

I have noticed that all N31 trips go to Hempstead on weekdays now. There are only 2 short turns left 3 on Saturday. Looks like almost all N31 service got extended

Edited March 24, 2014 by qjtransitmaster

[N6 Limited]

I have noticed that all N31 trips go to Hempstead on weekdays now. There are only 2 short turns left 3 on Saturday. Looks like almost all N31 service got extended

They increased headway and extended N31's basically.

[qjtransitmaster]

They increased headway and extended N31's basically.

Yup upgraded service levels on that segment. Thank you NICE.

[N6 Limited]

Yup upgraded service levels on that segment. Thank you NICE.

I have to stop using headway speak. They reduced the frequency of buses but extended the N31. The service was lopsided under LIB because it had more N32 service as it served more businesses on Central Ave, but NICE said "most riders are riding through to/from Far Rockaway" anyway so they just extended the N31 and reduced the frequency of the whole route to make up the difference. 

[Astoria Line]

Another NICE operator got assaulted Yesterday. In Franklin Square, AGAIN. smh.

This is why I ride NICE early in the morning and late at night when all the unstable people are still unconscious

[PinePower]

Another NICE operator got assaulted Yesterday. In Franklin Square, AGAIN. smh.

This is why I ride NICE early in the morning and late at night when all the unstable people are still unconscious

 

I tell you it's getting bad. I don't feel safe on alot of the buses these days. Thats what happens when whatever mainstream ridership you had got fed up, what you're left with it even more evident.

[Astoria Line]

I tell you it's getting bad. I don't feel safe on alot of the buses these days. Thats what happens when whatever mainstream ridership you had got fed up, what you're left with it even more evident.

I don't feel unsafe, considering the times I ride the bus. I'm getting off of this sinking ship of an island soon enough anyways.

[PinePower]

So I went to the meeting today & hardly anyone showed up. The only speakers were myself and Yuki, no one from TSTC, LIBRU (other than Yuki), etc were there. Setzer had an hour-long presentation, giving a new preview to the Smartphone ticket system, which will only be for now on a pay-per-ride basis, no unlimiteds or transfers to MTA. I really don't see how well this will do. No mention of how the system would work for seniors & the disabled half-fare either. Then the budget presentation, with a $3 Million shortfall due to rising expenses, this budget was "conditionally" passed by the BTC assuming the hole will be filled by extra funding from the state, county, or other sources and that service cuts would be a very last resort (yeah right). Setzer claimed Metrocard Read Errors and FB problems are improving, but I think that is a flat out lie, problems are still commonplace and my EasyPay Metrocard was recently damaged by a NICE F/B and now just says READ ERROR, am awaiting a new card after reporting it. The Chairman did ask Setzer about a rise in breakdowns, but Setzer didn't really answer that question, other than they'll "try harder" to improve MDBF. I was the first of only 2 speakers. News 12 didn't even stick around for the whole meeting & left 15 min into Setzer's speech. I actually ran after them and asked them why they were leaving, they said they had to do a "live shot" and would be back after 5pm, but they I never saw them come back. In my speech I had printed out photos of the poor condition of the buses (trash, gang signs,etc) along with facts from the TSTC (TRi-State Transp Campaign) about ridership declines on NICE while NYC & LIRR made gains. Also included were some ideas from myself and some suggested by Brett to streamline the lightest routes, all these were given to the Nassau BTC and shared with Mr.Setzer. I first thanked NICE for service through the rough winter, and tried as much as possible to direct most of the blame toward Nassau County and it's lack of funding the system. I pointed out the breakdowns, farebox malfunctions, and declining ridership due to security & reliability issues. I talked about how the latest changes on March 30 will lead to more frustrated riders who will then leave the system too, like the cuts on the n1. My point was that something needs to be done to improve service reliability, increase security (cops & cameras on buses), and make common sense scheduling adjustments. I did not bring up the MTA, I was really just doing my best to make a point while using a little honey instead of vinegar to make it. I felt like I was cut short, certainly before the 3 mins was up, but I managed to get all in that I said. Yuki's speech was read twice, first by Yuki himself, and then by a BTC member. He suggested running the n48/49 to Jericho Quad on weekends, which to me is a waste. After it was a read I briefly mentioned to the BTC and Mr.Setzer that I think extending the n35 there on weekends would be a better idea, it would provide new service to several shopping centers up there with Kohl's and Home Depot, as well as the Westbury Music Fair & movie theaters. That would help get new ridership, whereas Yuki's suggestion would just serve an office park that has little traffic on weekends, anyway. Going back to my speech I brought up the problems caused by elimination of the n22L, as well as the n27 only running hourly from Glen Cove after 6pm which will result in more crowding. 

It's really just a waste of time folks. Really just giving up. If the riders are so frustrated, why did hardly anyone bother showing up? And watching News 12 later I see no mention of my comments about existing service, the story was basically centered around the $3 Million budget gap and some interviews at HTC. The system is basically a ghetto on wheels and that's the way everyone wants it. The ridership #'s may bump up a bit with routes serving poorer areas with the warmer weather & landscaping season, but the commuters, students,etc are finding other ways around, or just leaving Nassau entirely. Sorry for the feelings in this post but the situation just feels hopeless. At least I tried. 

Edited March 28, 2014 by PinePower

[qjtransitmaster]

So I went to the meeting today & hardly anyone showed up. The only speakers were myself and Yuki, no one from TSTC, LIBRU (other than Yuki), etc were there. Setzer had an hour-long presentation, giving a new preview to the Smartphone ticket system, which will only be for now on a pay-per-ride basis, no unlimiteds or transfers to MTA. I really don't see how well this will do. No mention of how the system would work for seniors & the disabled half-fare either. Then the budget presentation, with a $3 Million shortfall due to rising expenses, this budget was "conditionally" passed by the BTC assuming the hole will be filled by extra funding from the state, county, or other sources and that service cuts would be a very last resort (yeah right). Setzer claimed Metrocard Read Errors and FB problems are improving, but I think that is a flat out lie, problems are still commonplace and my EasyPay Metrocard was recently damaged by a NICE F/B and now just says READ ERROR, am awaiting a new card after reporting it. The Chairman did ask Setzer about a rise in breakdowns, but Setzer didn't really answer that question, other than they'll "try harder" to improve MDBF. I was the first of only 2 speakers. News 12 didn't even stick around for the whole meeting & left 15 min into Setzer's speech. I actually ran after them and asked them why they were leaving, they said they had to do a "live shot" and would be back after 5pm, but they I never saw them come back. In my speech I had printed out photos of the poor condition of the buses (trash, gang signs,etc) along with facts from the TSTC (TRi-State Transp Campaign) about ridership declines on NICE while NYC & LIRR made gains. Also included were some ideas from myself and some suggested by Brett to streamline the lightest routes, all these were given to the Nassau BTC and shared with Mr.Setzer. I first thanked NICE for service through the rough winter, and tried as much as possible to direct most of the blame toward Nassau County and it's lack of funding the system. I pointed out the breakdowns, farebox malfunctions, and declining ridership due to security & reliability issues. I talked about how the latest changes on March 30 will lead to more frustrated riders who will then leave the system too, like the cuts on the n1. My point was that something needs to be done to improve service reliability, increase security (cops & cameras on buses), and make common sense scheduling adjustments. I did not bring up the MTA, I was really just doing my best to make a point while using a little honey instead of vinegar to make it. I felt like I was cut short, certainly before the 3 mins was up, but I managed to get all in that I said. Yuki's speech was read twice, first by Yuki himself, and then by a BTC member. He suggested running the n48/49 to Jericho Quad on weekends, which to me is a waste. After it was a read I briefly mentioned to the BTC and Mr.Setzer that I think extending the n35 there on weekends would be a better idea, it would provide new service to several shopping centers up there with Kohl's and Home Depot, as well as the Westbury Music Fair & movie theaters. That would help get new ridership, whereas Yuki's suggestion would just serve an office park that has little traffic on weekends, anyway. Going back to my speech I brought up the problems caused by elimination of the n22L, as well as the n27 only running hourly from Glen Cove after 6pm which will result in more crowding. 

It's really just a waste of time folks. Really just giving up. If the riders are so frustrated, why did hardly anyone bother showing up? And watching News 12 later I see no mention of my comments about existing service, the story was basically centered around the $3 Million budget gap and some interviews at HTC. The system is basically a ghetto on wheels and that's the way everyone wants it. The ridership #'s may bump up a bit with routes serving poorer areas with the warmer weather & landscaping season, but the commuters, students,etc are finding other ways around, or just leaving Nassau entirely. Sorry for the feelings in this post but the situation just feels hopeless. At least I tried. 

I could have told you that months ago I already suggested an N35 extension years before. Yeah exactly just leave Nassau there are better places to live try the boom towns and get that money. I will say it again Nassau is lifeless.

[Amtrak7]

I watched PinePower's video-one thing that he left off the description above was that "no photography" signs have been posted along the perimeter of Mitchel Field.

[PinePower]

I watched PinePower's video-one thing that he left off the description above was that "no photography" signs have been posted along the perimeter of Mitchel Field.

 

I just saw them yesterday when I went to the meeting. I guess they don't want photos getting taken of the poor condition of the buses behind that fence!

[Astoria Line]

So I went to the meeting today & hardly anyone showed up. The only speakers were myself and Yuki, no one from TSTC, LIBRU (other than Yuki), etc were there. Setzer had an hour-long presentation, giving a new preview to the Smartphone ticket system, which will only be for now on a pay-per-ride basis, no unlimiteds or transfers to MTA. I really don't see how well this will do. No mention of how the system would work for seniors & the disabled half-fare either. Then the budget presentation, with a $3 Million shortfall due to rising expenses, this budget was "conditionally" passed by the BTC assuming the hole will be filled by extra funding from the state, county, or other sources and that service cuts would be a very last resort (yeah right). Setzer claimed Metrocard Read Errors and FB problems are improving, but I think that is a flat out lie, problems are still commonplace and my EasyPay Metrocard was recently damaged by a NICE F/B and now just says READ ERROR, am awaiting a new card after reporting it. The Chairman did ask Setzer about a rise in breakdowns, but Setzer didn't really answer that question, other than they'll "try harder" to improve MDBF. I was the first of only 2 speakers. News 12 didn't even stick around for the whole meeting & left 15 min into Setzer's speech. I actually ran after them and asked them why they were leaving, they said they had to do a "live shot" and would be back after 5pm, but they I never saw them come back. In my speech I had printed out photos of the poor condition of the buses (trash, gang signs,etc) along with facts from the TSTC (TRi-State Transp Campaign) about ridership declines on NICE while NYC & LIRR made gains. Also included were some ideas from myself and some suggested by Brett to streamline the lightest routes, all these were given to the Nassau BTC and shared with Mr.Setzer. I first thanked NICE for service through the rough winter, and tried as much as possible to direct most of the blame toward Nassau County and it's lack of funding the system. I pointed out the breakdowns, farebox malfunctions, and declining ridership due to security & reliability issues. I talked about how the latest changes on March 30 will lead to more frustrated riders who will then leave the system too, like the cuts on the n1. My point was that something needs to be done to improve service reliability, increase security (cops & cameras on buses), and make common sense scheduling adjustments. I did not bring up the MTA, I was really just doing my best to make a point while using a little honey instead of vinegar to make it. I felt like I was cut short, certainly before the 3 mins was up, but I managed to get all in that I said. Yuki's speech was read twice, first by Yuki himself, and then by a BTC member. He suggested running the n48/49 to Jericho Quad on weekends, which to me is a waste. After it was a read I briefly mentioned to the BTC and Mr.Setzer that I think extending the n35 there on weekends would be a better idea, it would provide new service to several shopping centers up there with Kohl's and Home Depot, as well as the Westbury Music Fair & movie theaters. That would help get new ridership, whereas Yuki's suggestion would just serve an office park that has little traffic on weekends, anyway. Going back to my speech I brought up the problems caused by elimination of the n22L, as well as the n27 only running hourly from Glen Cove after 6pm which will result in more crowding. 

It's really just a waste of time folks. Really just giving up. If the riders are so frustrated, why did hardly anyone bother showing up? And watching News 12 later I see no mention of my comments about existing service, the story was basically centered around the $3 Million budget gap and some interviews at HTC. The system is basically a ghetto on wheels and that's the way everyone wants it. The ridership #'s may bump up a bit with routes serving poorer areas with the warmer weather & landscaping season, but the commuters, students,etc are finding other ways around, or just leaving Nassau entirely. Sorry for the feelings in this post but the situation just feels hopeless. At least I tried. 

Do you realize how you sound sometimes? You come off pretty closeminded and prejudiced. If only "poor people" ride NICE, then why do you ride NICE? I'm not poor, but I ride NICE because LIRR gives me shitty service and a car isn't feasible, especially going to college in Manhattan as of August.

 

 

Anyways..

 

I think Setzer is correct about the farebox issues. I had a ton of read errors back at the end of 2013, but I haven't got one in a long while, and I've been re-using the metrocards.

 

You are correct in trying to displace the blame of the county for the most part. I think Mangano doesn't give two s**** about the system, as well as the people who live here. It is typical suburban ignorance, which is why after less than a year in Nassau, amongst other things, I'm moving out within the next year. I'd rather put up with the MTA and its problems only than this sorry excuse for a system. I don't think anything will be done to make this system better without Mangano's help and as you can see, he doesn't care. 

[Tom Meadow]

Breaking nice bus news ed mangano rode the n22 from mineola bus terminal to the legisator building to show he cares for bus riders will have more at 11.btw this a joke don't get serious