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Random Thoughts Thread - Nassau Inter-County Express (NICE)


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Judging by the video, I think we can assume that all proposed January cuts will be made in April, as well as most of the other cuts proposed for April.

 

Still don't know how the n35 north of Hempstead is a lower priority to preserve when compared to the n26 and n57...

 

When the MTA was thinking of cutting it, they figured that they would have to add back those buses in the form of n22 & n25 short-turns to prevent overcrowding, so it was easier to just keep it as a separate route. NICE probably came to the same conclusion.

 

The n57 is (or at least used to be) a relatively efficient route, and alternatives-wise, the n58 isn't as proximate of an alternative as the n15/16/27 & n22 are for the n35.

 

Also, as was mentioned in the video, due to relatively poor bus service and an aging population, there has been a shortage of labor in some North Shore areas, where people can't find people to fill positions because the area isn't easily accessible.

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According to Newsday, the following routes will be eliminated on April due to the deficit in the budget: n19, n36, n45, n47, n51, n57, n78/79, Freeport, Hicksville, and Rockville Center Community shuttles.

Service will be reduced on the following routes: Elmont Flexi, n27, n70/71/72, and n80/81.

 

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/nassau/nice-proposing-to-cut-10-routes-reduce-service-on-4-others-to-fill-6-8m-deficit-1.13042048

 

Advocates are also calling on the state to help fund the bus system out on Long Island.

 

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/transportation/advocates-long-island-bus-commuters-deserve-fair-share-of-funding-1.13037783

Edited by NY1635
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According to Newsday, the following routes will be eliminated on April due to the deficit in the budget: n19, n36, n45, n47, n51, n57, n78/79, Freeport, Hicksville, and Rockville Center Community shuttles.

Service will be reduced on the following routes: Elmont Flexi, n27, n70/71/72, and n80/81.

 

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/nassau/nice-proposing-to-cut-10-routes-reduce-service-on-4-others-to-fill-6-8m-deficit-1.13042048

 

Advocates are also calling on the state to help fund the bus system out on Long Island.

 

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/transportation/advocates-long-island-bus-commuters-deserve-fair-share-of-funding-1.13037783

 

None of those cuts surprise me (but at this point, NICE could eliminate all non-Queens routes besides the n15 and the n40/41 and still not surprise me).

 

As for the routes which are being reduced in terms of service but not eliminated, I think we could see the n80/81 being reduced to every 120 minutes each (meaning every 60 minutes combined) mid-day, and probably the elimination of Saturday service on both routes. The n70/71/72 will probably end up with no more service beyond Route 110, or perhaps into Suffolk County at all, unless Suffolk is willing to pony up some funds for NICE to save those routes. The FLEXI will probably lose some deviations (i.e, those that don't attract many riders), and the n27 will probably be cut back to Roslyn.

 

Part of me does wonder if they're going to put the minibuses on routes like the n80/81, push them into AbleRide service, or sell them on the market.

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None of those cuts surprise me (but at this point, NICE could eliminate all non-Queens routes besides the n15 and the n40/41 and still not surprise me).

 

As for the routes which are being reduced in terms of service but not eliminated, I think we could see the n80/81 being reduced to every 120 minutes each (meaning every 60 minutes combined) mid-day, and probably the elimination of Saturday service on both routes. The n70/71/72 will probably end up with no more service beyond Route 110, or perhaps into Suffolk County at all, unless Suffolk is willing to pony up some funds for NICE to save those routes. The FLEXI will probably lose some deviations (i.e, those that don't attract many riders), and the n27 will probably be cut back to Roslyn.

 

Part of me does wonder if they're going to put the minibuses on routes like the n80/81, push them into AbleRide service, or sell them on the market.

 

I think the minibuses are going to be kept and put on the remaining routes. As for the n27, I believe a possible reduction means that it will be hourly on weekdays, or that it will be cut from Hempstead back to Roosevelt Field during non peak hours. The route still serves as vital link between the North Shore and Central Nassau.

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This is a totally different set of cuts than I expected...I wonder why the n48 Jericho Quad is staying, that segment has almost no ridership.

 

NICE is trying their best to cut service where the least amount of riders will be affected, or where riders have an alternative to the propose route cuts. I bet the little aid that they got from the state might've influenced the changes to the cuts, along with pressure from the County Legislators.The n48 Jericho Quad is staying mostly to link riders between the offices and the Hicksville LIRR. The n20H can't really stop at Jerhico Quad as it's too much of a workhorse. It looks like the n1, and n35 have been spared.

Edited by NY1635
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According to Newsday, the following routes will be eliminated on April due to the deficit in the budget: n19, n36, n45, n47, n51, n57, n78/79, Freeport, Hicksville, and Rockville Center Community shuttles.

Service will be reduced on the following routes: Elmont Flexi, n27, n70/71/72, and n80/81.

 

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/nassau/nice-proposing-to-cut-10-routes-reduce-service-on-4-others-to-fill-6-8m-deficit-1.13042048

 

Advocates are also calling on the state to help fund the bus system out on Long Island.

 

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/transportation/advocates-long-island-bus-commuters-deserve-fair-share-of-funding-1.13037783

 

So the n78/79 get eliminated, but the n80/81 only see reduced service? Not saying it's good to eliminate either pair of routes, but it should be the other way around.

 

The n19 used to be a strong route, but with all the cuts its seen recently I guess that's no surprise. The n36, n45, n47, and n51 all have low ridership so that's no surprise, and I guess the n57, while efficient still duplicates the n58 too much for their liking.

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So the n78/79 get eliminated, but the n80/81 only see reduced service? Not saying it's good to eliminate either pair of routes, but it should be the other way around.

 

The n19 used to be a strong route, but with all the cuts its seen recently I guess that's no surprise. The n36, n45, n47, and n51 all have low ridership so that's no surprise, and I guess the n57, while efficient still duplicates the n58 too much for their liking.

 

The n78/79 is most likely getting eliminated for the same reason that the n72 will no longer travel east of Route 110: NICE can not afford to provide transportation deep into Suffolk with it's shoe string budget. The n80/81 is most likely being kept to serve the businesses in Bethpage, and not keep Sunrise Mall without a bus.

 

It also appears that the n22a will also be eliminated now that the n22x exists.

Edited by NY1635
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The n78/79 is most likely getting eliminated for the same reason that the n72 will no longer travel east of Route 110: NICE can not afford to provide transportation deep into Suffolk with it's shoe string budget. The n80/81 is most likely being kept to serve the businesses in Bethpage, and not keep Sunrise Mall without a bus.

 

It also appears that the n22a will also be eliminated now that the n22x exists.

 

An elimination of the n22a isn't that bad, especially if they convert some of the existing n22a runs into n22x runs or short-turn n22 locals.

 

But knowing NICE, they'll just eliminate all the n22a runs and add no n22/n22x runs to replace them.

Edited by MrBeardedBread
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An elimination of the n22a isn't that bad, especially if they convert some of the existing n22a runs into n22x runs or short-turn n22 locals.

 

But knowing NICE, they'll just eliminate all the n22a runs and add no n22/n22x runs to replace them.

 

Why would NICE add more runs on the n22/n22x when they get help from the n24 between Hicksville and Jamaica?

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Why would NICE add more runs on the n22/n22x when they get help from the n24 between Hicksville and Jamaica?

So there will be no gaps in service for riders BETWEEN Mineola and Jamaica

An elimination of the n22a isn't that bad, especially if they convert some of the existing n22a runs into n22x runs or short-turn n22 locals.

 

But knowing NICE, they'll just eliminate all the n22a runs and add no n22/n22x runs to replace them.

Having N22 short turn is even more expensive than the current N22A Service, because it's a longer route ( unless maybe if they ended at Mineola)
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I would suggest Nice bus eliminate the N48 Jerchio Quad, N80,Mercy Hospital Shuttle btw RVC and Mercy, the n79 but save the n78 and extend to Woodbury Loop where N94 used to end. N70 be eliminated and replaced by n72 trips to Farmingdale State (eliminated service to Babylon). Service will be 30 min on Hempstead tpk. N21 should also be eliminated. The n45 should be perserved and rerouted down Merrick AV and Camp AV with service to Bellmore via Merrick Road

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http://patch.com/new-york/gardencity/nice-bus-plans-eliminate-10-routes-reduce-others-due-lack-funding                                                                                                                                                      "There are many other routes that will be affected too, but the adjustments do not rise to the level of require [bus Transit Committee] approval."  

Edited by Mtatransit
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http://patch.com/new-york/gardencity/nice-bus-plans-eliminate-10-routes-reduce-others-due-lack-funding                                                                                                                                                      "There are many other routes that will be affected too, but the adjustments do not rise to the level of require [bus Transit Committee] approval."  

 

Since NICE had to go through the Committee to attempt to reduce Saturday frequencies on the n48/49 from 30 minutes to 40 minutes during the proposed January 2017 cuts (which, as we all know, were never passed), this means that we will most likely see changes in timing and interlining, though I am not certain.

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Just out of curiosity, how is the n33 ridership? It seems like a very short route and looking at the time it takes from Point A -> Point B, it looks like ridership is low (unless i'm mistaken)

Nearly all of the riders it get either gets on at Far Rockaway eastbound. On westbound, it picks up riders, (not usually full, with the back empty) toward Far Rockaway.

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So there will be no gaps in service for riders BETWEEN Mineola and Jamaica

Having N22 short turn is even more expensive than the current N22A Service, because it's a longer route ( unless maybe if they ended at Mineola)

 

The n24 already helps fill in the service gaps for riders between Mineola and Jamaica. It's not uncommon to see the n24 arrive at RFM, Mineola, or Jamaica a few minutes after the n22 leaves, or even at the same time.

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I'm suprised with no change/cut on the n21. Now it has bare bones service already, but most people want the n20H over the n21

 

Yeah. It seems that NICE is only looking at entire routes or hours of entire routes to cut, and not looking deep enough into segments (Glen Cove part of the n21, Kings Point n58, Jericho Quad n48, etc.) They may be small savings each, but added together it's sizeable, especially if you can save peak vehicles.

 

The threshold for committee action is 25% of the service hours on a given route.

Edited by Amtrak7
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I want to know what "major reductions" mean, especially for the routes that are being mentioned (except for the 72; the route would essentially be eliminated). Now that the 72 is essentially being eliminated, can't they run the buses on weekends to Farmingdale State (to connect to the 2B).

 

I believe the n21 is being kept for several reason. First off, riders going to from Queens would have to make three transfers (the n27, to the n20H, to the n20G). Additionally, it does provide for a uniform headway west of Great Neck, and converting them to n20H buses would cost more in the long run. Lastly, the 21 IIRC interlines with the 27 in Glen Cove.

 

The south shore is getting screwed over, but not as much as it was before.

Edited by BM5 via Woodhaven Bl
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I want to know what "major reductions" mean, especially for the routes that are being mentioned (except for the 72; the route would essentially be eliminated).

 

Now that the 72 is essentially being eliminated, can't they run the buses on weekends to Farmingdale State (to connect to the 2B).

 

The n72 isn't being eliminated. It will most likely terminate at Route 110 in Farmingdale like it currently does on Sunday.

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The n72 isn't being eliminated. It will most likely terminate at Route 110 in Farmingdale like it currently does on Sunday.

That's the entire n70 route though. It would be logical, if all service is getting cut from Babylon (plus all service cut east of Farmingdale State on the n70), to have a uniform number. There's no need to have different numbers for the short-turn.  

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That's the entire n70 route though. It would be logical, if all service is getting cut from Babylon (plus all service cut east of Farmingdale State on the n70), to have a uniform number. There's no need to have different numbers for the short-turn.  

 

There is a need to have different numbers for the short turn and it's to avoid confusion. The n72 already terminates at Conklin and Route 110 in Farmingdale when it's not going to Babylon, while the n70 has to travel north on 110 to reach Famingdale State University.

Edited by NY1635
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Hopefully if the n72 is eliminated, SCT would run some route out to either the Farmingdale LIRR station or Farmingdale State College. (In the long term, the LIRR is planning on rebuilding the Republic Station IINM, so if it went to Farmingdale State College, it would connect to the LIRR at Route 110).

 

Not sure what can really be done with the n79, though. When I rode it, it seemed like a good chunk of its ridership came from Plainview Road, not Manetto Hill Road, so maybe if the n78 were extended to Route 110, it could at least connect with the S1 to get riders to Walt Whitman (the thing that sucks is that you're depending on SCT's crummy service span)

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