Queens Division Bus Proposals/Ideas

[Armandito]

1 minute ago, B35 via Church said:

Assuming you know what the word communal means, it isn't about "defining" anything....

If you're looking for an instantaneous grab of knowledge for the sake of running off to go render some google map, then let's not waste each other's time...

Otherwise, I mean, I don't see what's so difficult to understand here... If you're really inquisitive enough about this stuff, pay attention to people's complaints on social media, blog comment sections, any transit related or specific community based/related forum you happen to stumble across - No matter how silly you may deem any gripe to be.... Read local (as in, neighborhood centric) newspapers.... Pay attention to the on-goings of community boards (if you happen to know people that attend such meetings [like I do], pick their brain a little and do some inquiring)..... Actually venture out to these communities (or neighborhoods, if that tickles your fancy).... Ride and/or notice people's ridership habits on/off buses/trains/RR's.... Eavesdrop on people's (transit related) conversations whilst on some mode of transit..... There's legwork that has to be done at some minimal level & coming on here snidely asking how I'd define communal needs tells me your interest level isn't quite there....

The one thing I can say about this forum is that discussions have evolved on here.... Unlike the MTA, we actually give a shit about the people that utilize their services to get around this city - and that starts with listening with open ears.....

I've been going to different neighborhoods and riding a few of their buses on my free time, though I don't do this often as I tend to be busy with other stuff. Little would I know that planning routes would be a lot harder than I thought, and that means I'll have to do research--LOTS of research. Fortunately I could handle that, given the fact that I'm doing a sociology major in school where I've been able to learn about the inner workings of research.

[aemoreira81]

On 1/16/2019 at 11:00 PM, lara8710 said:

If that's the case, it would be best to terminate the route at the current Q23 terminus at Crescent Apartments.

The problem with that is that one has to go the wrong way in a loop (remember, there is no left turn from Woodhaven Boulevard to Union Turnpike, which necessitated the reversal of the Q23 terminal loop from counter-clockwise to clockwise. That may be a justification to not terminate the route in Glendale by Metropolitan and Woodhaven. While the eastern part of Myrtle (beyond Cooper, and especially beyond 80/Dry Harbor) can be seen as being over-served, westward past Cooper is possibly under-served.

One doesn't have a really good list of ideal turn-around options in the area. Heck, if Dale Hemmerdinger (whose Atco Properties developed Atlas Park before it was sold to Macerich) wasn't the chairman of the MTA at the time, I doubt the Q47 extension would be possible since the Q47 uses mall property as a turnaround likely as a written agreement.

 

[LGA Link N Train]

Hey, I'd thought it'd be accurate to post this here rather than making a seperate thread, But I'm working on a Queens Bus Redesign map and I'm currently having trouble with coming up with ideas. (I'm currently just working on routes). Does anybody have any input?

All I have so far is the following:

Q66SBS 

Q101 to LIC Ferry Terminal (Credit to @BM5 via Woodhaven)

Q103 Connection with LIRR and Ferry

Q38 being split in half (63rd Drive/Penelope portion being the Q38, and the Eliot Av portion being the Q45)

A slightly simplified Q42

And a Q64 extension via Yellowstone Blvd

Edited January 19, 2019 by LaGuardia Link N Tra

[Orion6025]

4 hours ago, LaGuardia Link N Tra said:

Hey, I'd thought it'd be accurate to post this here rather than making a seperate thread, But I'm working on a Queens Bus Redesign map and I'm currently having trouble with coming up with ideas. (I'm currently just working on routes). Does anybody have any input?

All I have so far is the following:

Q66SBS 

Q101 to LIC Ferry Terminal (Credit to @BM5 via Woodhaven)

Q103 Connection with LIRR and Ferry

Q38 being split in half (63rd Drive/Penelope portion being the Q38, and the Eliot Av portion being the Q45)

A slightly simplified Q42

And a Q64 extension via Yellowstone Blvd

For the love of god do not touch the Q104. That route works good enough as is and all those ideas of making the q104 the official Broadway bus to god knows where screw over a good portion of the ridership base.

[B35 via Church]

3 hours ago, LaGuardia Link N Tra said:

Hey, I'd thought it'd be accurate to post this here rather than making a seperate thread, But I'm working on a Queens Bus Redesign map and I'm currently having trouble with coming up with ideas. (I'm currently just working on routes). Does anybody have any input?

All I have so far is the following:

Q66SBS 

Q101 to LIC Ferry Terminal (Credit to @BM5 via Woodhaven)

Q103 Connection with LIRR and Ferry

Q38 being split in half (63rd Drive/Penelope portion being the Q38, and the Eliot Av portion being the Q45)

A slightly simplified Q42

And a Q64 extension via Yellowstone Blvd

I don't understand... You're working on a map you barely have ideas for?

12 hours ago, Orion6025 said:

For the love of god do not touch the Q104. That route works good enough as is and all those ideas of making the q104 the official Broadway bus to god knows where screw over a good portion of the ridership base.

Personally, I would send that route to Roosevelt Island on 15 mins. headways all day.... The Q102's routing to get there is beyond asinine & the Q104 (current riderbase) is under-served.... I have always felt there's untapped potential with that route.....

As for a Broadway route, AFAIC you're preaching to the choir, because that service gap isn't one I think needs to be addressed (with any route).

[Armandito]

On 1/19/2019 at 1:02 AM, aemoreira81 said:

The problem with that is that one has to go the wrong way in a loop (remember, there is no left turn from Woodhaven Boulevard to Union Turnpike, which necessitated the reversal of the Q23 terminal loop from counter-clockwise to clockwise. That may be a justification to not terminate the route in Glendale by Metropolitan and Woodhaven. While the eastern part of Myrtle (beyond Cooper, and especially beyond 80/Dry Harbor) can be seen as being over-served, westward past Cooper is possibly under-served.

One doesn't have a really good list of ideal turn-around options in the area. Heck, if Dale Hemmerdinger (whose Atco Properties developed Atlas Park before it was sold to Macerich) wasn't the chairman of the MTA at the time, I doubt the Q47 extension would be possible since the Q47 uses mall property as a turnaround likely as a written agreement.

 

At the same time, it's been argued that there's not enough demand for a route along Cooper Avenue to Ridgewood, which negates any sort of extension west of Glendale.

Edited January 20, 2019 by lara8710

[LGA Link N Train]

47 minutes ago, B35 via Church said:

I don't understand... You're working on a map you barely have ideas for?

It’s not that I have I barely have any ideas for it. Coming up with one and putting it on a map is time consuming for me. Especially when you don’t have time to understand how the bus network works. (And by that, I mean exploring each route from Nortrh Terminal to South Terminal). So that’s why I ask for additional input. I’ll work on my map later on today. 

[LGA Link N Train]

I’m going to add on to my proposal of my Queens Bus Redesign map since I’ve come up with more ideas since. One thing I’ll make clear is that my map is far from finished and it is still a Work In Progress. 

On 1/19/2019 at 4:47 PM, LaGuardia Link N Tra said:

All I have so far are the following: 

Q6:  This Route becomes SBS as planned. It’s overall route is unaltered. 

Q11: The Q11 will be rerouted to 63rd Drive and run with the Q38 to 108th Street. It’s main southern terminal will be Howard Beach-JFK station on the  line. However, buses will continue to branch off to help serve Howard Beach and Hamilton Beach

Q12: Converted to SBS as planned. Northern Blvd will receive bus lanes. 

Q19: Service will be increased to 8-7 minute headway’s and once the Q19 reaches 108th Street, it will replace the Q48 route to Main Street and terminate. 

Q23: The Q23 remains unaltered but now shares part of its route with the Q64. 

Q38: The Q38 will be split in half. The Q38 as we know today will continue to operate on the 63rd Drive/Penelope Avenue portion of its route, then it’ll Terminate with the Q67 at Fresh Pond Road

Q42: The Q42 will become a slightly simplified route. It’ll continue to serve the same areas, but relocated to a few different streets. 

Q43: The Q43 gets an SBS conversion and the potential for a BRT Street design should be studied on Hillside Avenue. 

Q45: The Second Half of the Q38 will be renamed into the Q45, which will take over the Eliot Avenue and Corona portion of its route. Once the Q45 reaches Metropolitan Avenue, it will continue to Metropolitan Avenue until it reaches the Shops at Atlas Park and Terminate. 

Q46: The Q46 is planned for SBS conversion. Therefore it could do something similar to the B82/B82SBS since the B46 currently runs a Limited service. 

The Q48 is eliminated and replaced by the Q19 for a portion of its route.

Q52/53 SBS: remains unaltered in terms of their respective routes and share 5 minute headway’s. 

Q55: remains Unaltered. 

Q58: The Q58 gets an SBS conversion along with a bit of a reroute. Buses will now turn on 108th Street going north and head to Roosevelt Avenue. They will run with the Q19 and both routes terminate near Main Street. 

Q60: The Q60 will run less trips to 109th Avenue. These lost trips are short turns at Sutphin Blvd. The Q60 may be altered in terms of bus stops and the Queens Blvd Median project (assuming that this is inevitable) which I have yet to get to. 

Q64: The Q64 will get an extension via Austin Street and Yellowstone Blvd where it will meet up with the Q52/53 SBS. The Q64 will then continue under Cooper Avenue where it will terminate At the Shops at Atlas Park with the Q47. 

Q65: The Q65 is converted to SBS as planned. Bus Lanes should be added on College Point Blvd. It’s overall route remains unaltered though I’m considering the option of swapping the Q25 and Q65 terminals. 

Q66: The Q66 receives an SBS conversion and Bus Lanes are added on Northern Blvd. The Q66 will replace the Q101 on the Manhattan Bridge but instead of terminating at 2nd Avenue, all Q66 SBS buses will go to Columbus Circle as planned. 

LGALink Q70 SBS: The Q70 remains unaltered. 

Q72: The Q72 can potentially be renamed to LGA Link Q72. Its overall route is unaltered. It could potentially have some Bus stops altered but I have not gotten to that yet. 

Q101: The Q101 will be rerouted last Queens Plaza via 21st Street and Center Blvd to LIC Ferry Terminal next to the LIRR. This would improve LIC connections and will also be a boon to Amazon HQ2. (Credit to @BM5 via Woodhaven)

Q102: The Q102 will remain unaltered in terms of its route until it reaches Roosevelt Island. Once the Q102 reaches Roosevelt Island, it will continue north to the Bird S Coler Roadway and Hospital, terminate, the loop back to Astoria. The southern portion of Roosevelt Island will be taken over by the Q104 and the Roosevelt Island buses. 

Q103: The Q103 will be extended past it’s current terminal at Vernon Blvd via Borden Avenue to provide a better Connection with LIRR and Ferry at Center Blvd. As a bonus, it will also connect with the Q101 at the LIC Ferry Terminal. Better connecting the area. 

Q104: The Q104 is extended west to the Roosevelt Island Tramway. It will run on par with the Q103 until it reaches the Roosevelt Island Bridge where it will replace the Q102 on the Southern portion of Roosevelt Island. However, it won’t go far south and will only connect with the Tramway and the  line.  

As you can see, I have updated the list above. However, like I stated earlier, my map is no where near complete and it is still a work in progress! I am open to input and opinions as to what I will change on my map, so feel free to criticize. 

One last thing is that I’m adding all routes planned for SBS routes as SBS routes in my redesign. (Reference to the SBS Planning thread) I’m currently in the process of adding more bus routes. 

 

 

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

1 hour ago, LaGuardia Link N Tra said:

I’m going to add on to my proposal of my Queens Bus Redesign map since I’ve come up with more ideas since. One thing I’ll make clear is that my map is far from finished and it is still a Work In Progress. 

As you can see, I have updated the list above. However, like I stated earlier, my map is no where near complete and it is still a work in progress! I am open to input and opinions as to what I will change on my map, so feel free to criticize. 

One last thing is that I’m adding all routes planned for SBS routes as SBS routes in my redesign. (Reference to the SBS Planning thread) I’m currently in the process of adding more bus routes. 

 

 

Some of my comments:

Q11: Disagree with sending buses to Rego Park and Woodhaven. I don't know exactly what's being accomplished here. I do feel like the Woodhaven Boulevard local should be one bus instead of two routes. Other people have differing opinions on what exactly to do, but I would have the Q21 as the sole Woodhaven Boulevard local, with 7 minute headways during the rush hour, 15 minute headways during middays and weekends, and 20 minute headways during late evenings. This way, the Q11 can be knocked out of Woodhaven Boulevard, and the Q41 only operates north/east of Rockaway Boulevard. The Q11 can remain a shuttle south of the  . 

Q19: 7-8 minute headways is EXCESSIVE, even during rush hours. 

Q38: Agree with a Q38 split, but disagree with having said southern split terminate at Fresh Pond Road. I don't even think the Q67 should end there now, it's pretty random.

Q45: Disagree on having more routes terminating at Atlas Park Mall. The Q54 serves the mall from those areas anyway, and the Q47 & Q29 come from the north. 

Q58: That route will have to terminate somewhere different than the Q58 local. That being said, I don't know if necessarily against that plan, but I feel that the northern split of the Q38 should have some role in this instead of terminating at Otis Avenue.

Q60: I've mentioned it before, but I would eliminate all service south of Archer Avenue, and boost the Q6. It would be a short-turn between 165 Street and Rockaway Boulevard. 

Q64: Like the Q45, I disagree with sending it to Atlas Park Mall. I feel that there should be a Yellowstone Boulevard route, but the Q64 should not be involved in it. 

Q102: I don't have a clue what to do with this route, because it's just so messed up as it is right now, and it doesn't look like much can be done, but I don't think service should go to Roosevelt Island. The two options I would look into is that from Queens Plaza/Queensboro Plaza, the bus heads into Manhattan (East Side via 2nd or Lex/3rd Avenues, which isn't served by the  or  directly), or Brooklyn.

Q104: I would still run the route far south to Cornell Tech, but I would not bother running any MTA buses north of the Roosevelt Island bridge, on Roosevelt Island.

 

Edited January 24, 2019 by BM5 via Woodhaven

[Armandito]

@BM5 via Woodhaven I've been working on my own map of Brooklyn bus route revisions but I can't show it here because it's the wrong thread.

[LGA Link N Train]

1 hour ago, BM5 via Woodhaven said:

Some of my comments:

Q11: Disagree with sending buses to Rego Park and Woodhaven. I don't know exactly what's being accomplished here. I do feel like the Woodhaven Boulevard local should be one bus instead of two routes. Other people have differing opinions on what exactly to do, but I would have the Q21 as the sole Woodhaven Boulevard local, with 7 minute headways during the rush hour, 15 minute headways during middays and weekends, and 20 minute headways during late evenings. This way, the Q11 can be knocked out of Woodhaven Boulevard, and the Q41 only operates north/east of Rockaway Boulevard. The Q11 can remain a shuttle south of the  .

I’ll admit that the Q11 to Rego Park was an Experimental idea that I thought about. I do see your point on why you’d want to kick the Q11 out of Woodhaven Boulevard. It’s branches in Howard Beach are Quite confusing to be honest.  

Q19: 7-8 minute headways is EXCESSIVE, even during rush hours. 

So what you’re telling me is that the Q19 doesn’t need as much service compared to other routes like the Q18 or Q46? Ok, but I’m still trying to provide a reasonable amount of frequency for it since it replaces the Q48 in my proposal. 

Q38: Agree with a Q38 split, but disagree with having said southern split terminate at Fresh Pond Road. I don't even think the Q67 should end there now, it's pretty random.

If the current Q67 terminal is random and it would not be a good idea for the Q38 to terminate there, then where would be a better suited place? 

Q45: Disagree on having more routes terminating at Atlas Park Mall. The Q54 serves the mall from those areas anyway, and the Q47 & Q29 come from the north. 

I guess I have to look into alternatives for my Q45. I told one friend of mine about my map. They also told me that I should terminate the Q38 and Q45 elsewhere. 

Q58: That route will have to terminate somewhere different than the Q58 local. That being said, I don't know if necessarily against that plan, but I feel that the northern split of the Q38 should have some role in this instead of terminating at Otis Avenue

Wait, we’re still talking about the Q58 or are you suggesting that my Q58SBS should terminate with my Q45? I’m kind of confused. 

Q60: I've mentioned it before, but I would eliminate all service south of Archer Avenue, and boost the Q6. It would be a short-turn between 165 Street and Rockaway Boulevard. 

Since the Q6 is SBS under my proposal, you suggest to move the Q60’s main terminal North? Not a bad idea to be honest. It’ll be helpful for both the Q6 and Q60. 

Q64: Like the Q45, I disagree with sending it to Atlas Park Mall. I feel that there should be a Yellowstone Boulevard route, but the Q64 should not be involved in it. 

I’ve tried to create a new Yellowstone Blvd route, but it ended up just becoming an extended Q64 because I couldn’t think of suitable terminals for it.  Atlas Park was the closest terminal I could find for my extended Q64. So until I can find a better alternative, I’ll leave it at that. 

Q102: I don't have a clue what to do with this route, because it's just so messed up as it is right now, and it doesn't look like much can be done, but I don't think service should go to Roosevelt Island. The two options I would look into is that from Queens Plaza/Queensboro Plaza, the bus heads into Manhattan (East Side via 2nd or Lex/3rd Avenues, which isn't served by the  or  directly), or Brooklyn.

You make it sound like those are some pretty good options for the Q102. I also see your point about why no  Bus should serve Roosevelt Island. Because of the Street layout and it’s geometry? I also don’t like it’s Astoria Routing Either since an  Shuttle Bus does a better job serving 31st in my opinion. There’s also the option of eliminating the Q102, but no one will smoothly with that. 

Q104: I would still run the route far south to Cornell Tech, but I would not bother running any MTA buses north of the Roosevelt Island bridge, on Roosevelt Island.

Cornell Tech? What’s that? The only reason I have the Q104 going to Roosevelt Island in the First Place is so that it can provide a connection with the  and Roosevelt Island Tramway. Nothing else. 

All replies are in Bold. 

[TransitMan0251]

Who thinks Far Rockaway Depot should become it's own and only house Express bus service like Yonkers & Meredith?

[Orion6025]

3 hours ago, TransitMan0251 said:

Who thinks Far Rockaway Depot should become it's own and only house Express bus service like Yonkers & Meredith?

I can't see why not. Is there a reason for far rockaway's existence beyond lowering DH times for all the rockaway routes? the only issue i can see is that jfk could get overwhelmed spacewise if all 50whatever local buses are moved over. But space may be a nonissue anyway lmao.

 

i doubt the deadhead times from jfk to the rockaways are that bad anyway.

[JeremiahC99]

6 minutes ago, Orion6025 said:

the only issue i can see is that jfk could get overwhelmed spacewise if all 50whatever local buses are moved over.

The 52 local buses for the Far Rockaway Local routes are currently in rotation with JFK Depot (due to Sandy), which currently has 252 buses, 208 of which are standard buses. Discounting the 52 units on rotation, the standard fleet roster is 156 buses. Therefore, they have room for the Far Rockaway local routes if the Far Rockaway Local routes moved over.

[B35 via Church]

1 hour ago, TransitMan0251 said:

Who thinks Far Rockaway Depot should become it's own and only house Express bus service like Yonkers & Meredith?

Become its own.... What?

On 1/24/2019 at 2:58 PM, LaGuardia Link N Tra said:

I’m going to add on to my proposal of my Queens Bus Redesign map since I’ve come up with more ideas since. One thing I’ll make clear is that my map is far from finished and it is still a Work In Progress.

Any reason why you put everything all on one layer?

Anyway, at least you (unlike the two BrooklynBus disciples doppelgangers on here) have some original ideas here.... Let's see...

Q11: I know I'm in a minuscule minority (i.e., myself), but I would combine both branches... Any trip running south of Pitkin/Cross Bay would be serving both branches (there'd be nothing terminating on the Hamilton Beach side).... As for running buses to the current Q38 terminal in Rego Park, forget it... You'd be forcing even more people along Woodhaven into taking Q52's/Q53's than the MTA has more people along Woodhaven doing now with the bastardization of local bus service (frequency-wise) along Woodhaven....

Q19: Yes, I agree with B35 via Church's idea too 

Q23: Unless I'm missing something, this is the current route...

Q38: Just run it to Woodhull Hosp. via Met. av & Flushing av & call it a day... As was said, the current Q67 terminal is a stub.

Q42: LOL.... You can't make up your own rules here; Wren isn't a two way street & even if it was, forget about routing buses bi-directionally on a quiet street like that in front of a school... Streets like that tend to be riddled with school buses & parents dropping off/picking up during school let-in/let-out hrs... Something else I'll say is that, I wouldn't have a problem with buses running uni-directionally on 174th (SB) & 175th (NB) - But if you're going to maintain bi-directional service on that stretch b/w 108th & 111th, may as well keep it on 174th....

Q45: The Eliot spur of the (real) Q38.... I'd run this on down to Crescent & Atlantic (via Forest & via Cypress Hills st <> Crescent st).... Cypress Hills (the neighborhood) needs more coverage to other areas... The B13 to Ridgewood is good, but it's still not enough IMO....

Q46 SBS/LTD: Pick one.

Q52/53 SBS: Can't agree with the Q52 running to Woodside with the Q53.... Leave the Q52 at Hoffman, it acts as a short turn for SBS service in mainland Queens.

Q55: Disagree with the turnaround scenario on the Ridgewood end... Agree with having the last dropoff stop on the Richmond Hill end also be the first pickup stop....

Q58 SBS... That would actually be slower than the current Q58 b/w Ridgewood terminal & Fresh Pond (M).... No thanks.

Q60: On the South Jamaica end, why 107th/108th instead of 108th/109th?
Also, screwing QB riders between 50th & 72nd by having it on the main road (instead of the service road) isn't exactly an improvement....

Q64: Can't agree with any extension of that route - especially to have it practically carry air.... That route is the perfect storm to the QB line from the east in that general pocket of Queens... Q46 is too far south & not only is the Q88 too far north, but it doesn't even offer a direct connection to the QB express... Why do you think that line carry as heavy as it does....

Q66 SBS: *farts*... (and shoo's it in your direction)

Q70 SBS: Yeah, best idea the MTA's had a quite some time (looks at B83 extension to Gateway Mall)....

Q72 LGA Link: Doesn't need to be branded as such... The Q70 is unique in that regard & it should stay that way.

Q101: Holy mackerel, what on god's good green earth do you have this route doing down there???? For starters, you do realize there's a shuttle bus that runs b/w those bldg's along Center Blvd & Court Sq. subway (21st st/44th dr side)? Secondly, while I agree that the thing shouldn't run to E. Midtown anymore, I can't concur with doing all that in Hunters Point either...

Q102: I wouldn't run it to RI in any facet (especially to only have it serving Coler)... I'd stop it dead at QBP subway.

Q103: I can see it happening, but I personally wouldn't bother sending it to Ferry terminal....

Q104: Looks like you took heed to my suggestion when you were asking for ideas last week (or whenever it was).... I personally wouldn't route it that way, but alright, I guess....

[Orion6025]

20 minutes ago, JeremiahC99 said:

The 52 local buses for the Far Rockaway Local routes are currently in rotation with JFK Depot (due to Sandy), which currently has 252 buses, 208 of which are standard buses. Discounting the 52 units on rotation, the standard fleet roster is 156 buses. Therefore, they have room for the Far Rockaway local routes if the Far Rockaway Local routes moved over.

That doesn't answer the question. All that 208 means is that 208 40 foot buses are registered to JFK. That said at any point, some of those orions will be housed in Far rockaway even though they are registered to JFK (I have no idea if FR ever holds all 52, but they hold some). My question is that since we know 156 locals can be held all at once within JFK, can it hold 208 all at once..

[B35 via Church]

On 1/24/2019 at 4:27 PM, BM5 via Woodhaven said:

Some of my comments:

Q11: Disagree with sending buses to Rego Park and Woodhaven. I don't know exactly what's being accomplished here. I do feel like the Woodhaven Boulevard local should be one bus instead of two routes. Other people have differing opinions on what exactly to do, but I would have the Q21 as the sole Woodhaven Boulevard local, with 7 minute headways during the rush hour, 15 minute headways during middays and weekends, and 20 minute headways during late evenings. This way, the Q11 can be knocked out of Woodhaven Boulevard, and the Q41 only operates north/east of Rockaway Boulevard. The Q11 can remain a shuttle south of the  . 

Q19: 7-8 minute headways is EXCESSIVE, even during rush hours. 

Q38: Agree with a Q38 split, but disagree with having said southern split terminate at Fresh Pond Road. I don't even think the Q67 should end there now, it's pretty random.

Q45: Disagree on having more routes terminating at Atlas Park Mall. The Q54 serves the mall from those areas anyway, and the Q47 & Q29 come from the north. 

Q58: That route will have to terminate somewhere different than the Q58 local. That being said, I don't know if necessarily against that plan, but I feel that the northern split of the Q38 should have some role in this instead of terminating at Otis Avenue.

Q60: I've mentioned it before, but I would eliminate all service south of Archer Avenue, and boost the Q6. It would be a short-turn between 165 Street and Rockaway Boulevard. 

Q64: Like the Q45, I disagree with sending it to Atlas Park Mall. I feel that there should be a Yellowstone Boulevard route, but the Q64 should not be involved in it. 

Q102: I don't have a clue what to do with this route, because it's just so messed up as it is right now, and it doesn't look like much can be done, but I don't think service should go to Roosevelt Island. The two options I would look into is that from Queens Plaza/Queensboro Plaza, the bus heads into Manhattan (East Side via 2nd or Lex/3rd Avenues, which isn't served by the  or  directly), or Brooklyn.

Q104: I would still run the route far south to Cornell Tech, but I would not bother running any MTA buses north of the Roosevelt Island bridge, on Roosevelt Island.

Q11: I personally don't care for the fact that the Q21 was extended past Rockaway Blvd to have less service on the (as in, THE) Woodhaven Blvd. local - the Q11... The days where it was just the Q11 & the Q53 wrecking shop along Woodhaven & Cross Bay should be reverted.... Nothing was wrong with that pattern.... Now that the MTA injected a Q21/Q21LTD (aka the Q52 SBS) along Woodhaven, shit's a mess along Woodhaven.... The Q41 is a separate animal.... I'll stop here, because I can go on all day about Woodhaven service....

Q19: Yeah, that's just ridiculous...

Q45: Atlas Park Mall is a jay-oh-kay-e, JOKE... It's enough that the Q54 was diverted to serve it & that the Q47 ends there.... It's not the major ridership generator he (LGA Link N train) might think that it is.... Anyway, I'm quite sure that pocket west of 80th towards Myrtle would appreciate some bus service (too bad the street grid is shit out there though)...

I just got through reading some google reviews about the place & this dude needs to get out of my head:

Quote

A bit of a strange mall that still doesn't seem fully developed. It has a random assortment of business that don't really seem cohesive at all. Most of the stores are not too appealing or special. But there's some decent quick food stands and a movie theater that keep it going. Without those I'm not sure it would survive honestly. They need to be more current.

- Thomas Iaquinto, posted "about a week ago"

The only thing dude didn't comment on was its locale.... Easily the worst situated mall in the NYC/NJ area..... Don't know why he gave it 4 stars after saying that though.

Q58: I'm more or less indifferent to any SBS idea (to be honest) since I'm no proponent of the service type in general, but having a Q58 SBS it go Myrtle > Fresh Pond from Ridgewood is asking for trouble (time-wise)...

Q60: Look at his idea again.... Buses don't need to be bypassing parts of Queens like that.... That part of it is just plain old ordinary crazy to me.

Q64: I disagree with serving it anywhere past QB in that direction.

Q102: Basically agree... See my last reply.... Its Manhattan usage has waned, but it's Queens usage has increased in recent years..... I guess I'd still keep it around, but end it right there at QBP.....

Q104: Agreed on both points.

Edited January 26, 2019 by B35 via Church

[B35 via Church]

On 1/24/2019 at 6:12 PM, LaGuardia Link N Tra said:

Some of my comments:

Q11: I’ll admit that the Q11 to Rego Park was an Experimental idea that I thought about. I do see your point on why you’d want to kick the Q11 out of Woodhaven Boulevard. It’s branches in Howard Beach are Quite confusing to be honest.  

Q19: So what you’re telling me is that the Q19 doesn’t need as much service compared to other routes like the Q18 or Q46? Ok, but I’m still trying to provide a reasonable amount of frequency for it since it replaces the Q48 in my proposal. 

Q38: If the current Q67 terminal is random and it would not be a good idea for the Q38 to terminate there, then where would be a better suited place? 

Q45: I guess I have to look into alternatives for my Q45. I told one friend of mine about my map. They also told me that I should terminate the Q38 and Q45 elsewhere. 

Q58: Wait, we’re still talking about the Q58 or are you suggesting that my Q58SBS should terminate with my Q45? I’m kind of confused. 

Q60: Since the Q6 is SBS under my proposal, you suggest to move the Q60’s main terminal North? Not a bad idea to be honest. It’ll be helpful for both the Q6 and Q60. 

Q64: I’ve tried to create a new Yellowstone Blvd route, but it ended up just becoming an extended Q64 because I couldn’t think of suitable terminals for it.  Atlas Park was the closest terminal I could find for my extended Q64. So until I can find a better alternative, I’ll leave it at that. 

Q102:  You make it sound like those are some pretty good options for the Q102. I also see your point about why no  Bus should serve Roosevelt Island. Because of the Street layout and it’s geometry? I also don’t like it’s Astoria Routing Either since an  Shuttle Bus does a better job serving 31st in my opinion. There’s also the option of eliminating the Q102, but no one will smoothly with that. 

Q104: Cornell Tech? What’s that? The only reason I have the Q104 going to Roosevelt Island in the First Place is so that it can provide a connection with the  and Roosevelt Island Tramway. Nothing else. 

Q11: Looking at the bus map, I can see where it can be confusing... All you need to know is that when either branch hits 160th from the north, one bus turns left (Hamilton Beach) & the other bus turns right (Old Howard Beach)...

Q19: You should never provide service on a bus route in comparison to what some other bus route gets.... I happen to like the Q19, but it's noooooooooooooo Q46.

Q38: Just opined on that.... See my last reply to you.

Q45: Well there you go... Now you have other opinions that support a contrary position.

Q58: I believe he's saying that a Q58 SBS should run on Eliot (instead of Grand)....

Q102: Between QBP & Astoria PJ's, people are patronizing it more.... If it weren't for that, I'd suggest canning the thing & wouldn't even wince (regardless of backlash)....

Q104: Cornell Tech is campus of Cornell university; a college.....

[JeremiahC99]

33 minutes ago, Orion6025 said:

That doesn't answer the question. All that 208 means is that 208 40 foot buses are registered to JFK. That said at any point, some of those orions will be housed in Far rockaway even though they are registered to JFK (I have no idea if FR ever holds all 52, but they hold some). My question is that since we know 156 locals can be held all at once within JFK, can it hold 208 all at once..

Maybe it can. However, there may be space constraints at JFK Depot, which was why the Far Rockaway fleet was sent to Building 78 at JFK Airport after Sandy. IF more auxiliary lots nearby can be found, or if the MTA can lease Building 78 for bus storage, then it can hold all 208 at once.

 

It is also noted that in 2004, the JFK Depot (under Green Lines Ops) was noted to have sufficient space for the current fleet, but would have problems storing an expanded fleet, while Far Rockaway Depot, a light maintenance shop, would have room for more buses.

[LGA Link N Train]

1 hour ago, B35 via Church said:

Any reason why you put everything all on one layer?

Anyway, at least you (unlike the two BrooklynBus disciples doppelgangers on here) have some original ideas here.... Let's see...

Q11: I know I'm in a minuscule minority (i.e., myself), but I would combine both branches... Any trip running south of Pitkin/Cross Bay would be serving both branches (there'd be nothing terminating on the Hamilton Beach side).... As for running buses to the current Q38 terminal in Rego Park, forget it... You'd be forcing even more people along Woodhaven into taking Q52's/Q53's than the MTA has more people along Woodhaven doing now with the bastardization of local bus service (frequency-wise) along Woodhaven.... 

Q19: Yes, I agree with B35 via Church's idea too 

Q23: Unless I'm missing something, this is the current route...

Q38: Just run it to Woodhull Hosp. via Met. av & Flushing av & call it a day... As was said, the current Q67 terminal is a stub.

Q42: LOL.... You can't make up your own rules here; Wren isn't a two way street & even if it was, forget about routing buses bi-directionally on a quiet street like that in front of a school... Streets like that tend to be riddled with school buses & parents dropping off/picking up during school let-in/let-out hrs... Something else I'll say is that, I wouldn't have a problem with buses running uni-directionally on 174th (SB) & 175th (NB) - But if you're going to maintain bi-directional service on that stretch b/w 108th & 111th, may as well keep it on 174th....

Q45: The Eliot spur of the (real) Q38.... I'd run this on down to Crescent & Atlantic (via Forest & via Cypress Hills st <> Crescent st).... Cypress Hills (the neighborhood) needs more coverage to other areas... The B13 to Ridgewood is good, but it's still not enough IMO....

Q46 SBS/LTD: Pick one.

Q52/53 SBS: Can't agree with the Q52 running to Woodside with the Q53.... Leave the Q52 at Hoffman, it acts as a short turn for SBS service in mainland Queens.

Q55: Disagree with the turnaround scenario on the Ridgewood end... Agree with having the last dropoff stop on the Richmond Hill end also be the first pickup stop....

Q58 SBS... That would actually be slower than the current Q58 b/w Ridgewood terminal & Fresh Pond (M).... No thanks.

Q60: On the South Jamaica end, why 107th/108th instead of 108th/109th?
Also, screwing QB riders between 50th & 72nd by having it on the main road (instead of the service road) isn't exactly an improvement....

Q64: Can't agree with any extension of that route - especially to have it practically carry air.... That route is the perfect storm to the QB line from the east in that general pocket of Queens... Q46 is too far south & not only is the Q88 too far north, but it doesn't even offer a direct connection to the QB express... Why do you think that line carry as heavy as it does....

Q66 SBS: *farts*... (and shoo's it in your direction)

Q70 SBS: Yeah, best idea the MTA's had a quite some time (looks at B83 extension to Gateway Mall)....

Q72 LGA Link: Doesn't need to be branded as such... The Q70 is unique in that regard & it should stay that way.

Q101: Holy mackerel, what on god's good green earth do you have this route doing down there???? For starters, you do realize there's a shuttle bus that runs b/w those bldg's along Center Blvd & Court Sq. subway (21st st/44th dr side)? Secondly, while I agree that the thing shouldn't run to E. Midtown anymore, I can't concur with doing all that in Hunters Point either...

Q102: I wouldn't run it to RI in any facet (especially to only have it serving Coler)... I'd stop it dead at QBP subway.

Q103: I can see it happening, but I personally wouldn't bother sending it to Ferry terminal....

Q104: Looks like you took heed to my suggestion when you were asking for ideas last week (or whenever it was).... I personally wouldn't route it that way, but alright, I guess....

 

31 minutes ago, B35 via Church said:

Q11: Looking at the bus map, I can see where it can be confusing... All you need to know is that when either branch hits 160th from the north, one bus turns left (Hamilton Beach) & the other bus turns right (Old Howard Beach)...

Q19: You should never provide service on a bus route in comparison to what some other bus route gets.... I happen to like the Q19, but it's noooooooooooooo Q46.

Q38: Just opined on that.... See my last reply to you.

Q45: Well there you go... Now you have other opinions that support a contrary position.

Q58: I believe he's saying that a Q58 SBS should run on Eliot (instead of Grand)....

Q102: Between QBP & Astoria PJ's, people are patronizing it more.... If it weren't for that, I'd suggest canning the thing & wouldn't even wince (regardless of backlash)....

Q104: Cornell Tech is campus of Cornell university; a college.....

Ok. Thanks for the compliment about me having original ideas compared to Alon Levy and whoever the other guy was. (No offense to them). One thing I want to make clear is that once I'm done laying out each route on my map, I'm going to seperate them in groups by what depot they use (or should use since I was looking at the Routes that Should've never moved/stayed thread, so I'll get to that when I have the chance. If not, then I'll do something else, either way my map is still no where near complete. With that out of the way, here is my response:

Q11: I'll admit that the Rego Park reroute was mostly experimental. I do see your point on the impact that it'll have on Q52/53 service, thus, I'll remove it as soon as I finish writing this post. And from what I can understand, you're telling me to remove the Hamilton Branch of the line? OK. To be honest, I was initially not going to add it but though about the people that wanted bus service in that area, so I kept it. Maybe if I just leave the Howard Beach branch of the route, it'll be less confusing. Also, looking at your post and what @BM5 via Woodhaven said about the Q21 makes me a little conflicted as to whether I should add it in my map or not. 

Q19: I was unaware that the Q19 replacing the Q48 was your idea. I was looking at some old thread's in this site a few days ago and found that proposal in a comment. I didn't check as to who came up with the idea. Thanks for making me aware that this (Q19 replacing the Q48) was your idea. Also, I have no intention of planning route frequencies in comparison to other routes since this is a mistake that planners have made in the past (If I'm not mistaken, planners still make this mistake today). 

Q23: I'm unsure of what to do to this route so until I can think of an idea, it's staying as is. 

Q38: OK. I'll make that change and extend the Q67 as well. 

Q42: Yikes! I see that issue happen in front of P.S.139 and J.H.S.190 nearly every time I pass by.  So what you're saying is that I should leave the Q42 as is on its eastern end. 

Q45: Using it to supplement B13 service doesn't sound like a bad idea at all. And I also read the quote that Atlas Park isn't "fully developed". From what I can understand, only one route is good enough in that area? 

Q46: SBS

Q52 SBS: I'm not sending the Q52 to woodside. I got lazy after making the Q53 SBS route on my map. So I created the Q52 stub to Arverne. Guess, I should've elaborated on that.   

Q55: I don't think I altered the route in any way, but if Ridgewood isn't a good place to terminate the Q55, then where is?

Q58 SBS: I tried to make it as planned, but I guess I could terminate it elsewhere if Ridgewood isn't a good place to terminate. Maybe, I can seperate it from the Q58 Local, but I don't know about rerouting it via Eliot Avenue. 

Q60: Welp, looks like I made an error in my map. I'll fix that one. 

Q64: Well, considering that I keep seeing an XN60 on that route, I guess sending it to Yellowstone Blvd isn't a good idea. Yet, If a local route SHOULD serve Yellowstone Blvd, then where should I place it's terminals?

Q66 SBS: Like I said in one of my earlier posts, I'm adding all planned SBS routes as SBS routes. Besides, Queens is the last borough to undergo a redesign by the , so I'm not changing my Q66 SBS. 

Q72: Maybe I don't need to brand it as a LGA Link. But in terms of Alterations, I'm leaving the route as is. 

Q101: The Q101 proposal was BM5's idea, and I incorporated it into my map. Also, I don't see why a Center Blvd route won't work. But then again, the NYC Ferry serves is along with the LIRR. Not only that, but that section of LIC is still undergoing development, so I think that the Q101 and the Q103 would generate good ridership if they were connected closer to that particular area. 

Q102: Dead-ending the Q102 at Queensboro Plaza, I don't know, But not sending any bus to Roosevelt Island, agree. When you said that riders are patronizing the Q102, is that a way of saying that they don't want to get rid of the route under any circumstance? 

Q103: See my response for the Q101

Q104: Guess I'll take @BM5's suggestion then.

[TransitMan0251]

Yes become it’s own, currency JFK and Far Rockaway share maintenance buildings and local buses. Like I said I believe this depot should be home to express only and take the express routes away from BP & LGA and then give them back local runs.

[B35 via Church]

1 hour ago, LaGuardia Link N Tra said:

Ok. Thanks for the compliment about me having original ideas compared to Alon Levy and whoever the other guy was. (No offense to them). One thing I want to make clear is that once I'm done laying out each route on my map, I'm going to seperate them in groups by what depot they use (or should use since I was looking at the Routes that Should've never moved/stayed thread, so I'll get to that when I have the chance. If not, then I'll do something else, either way my map is still no where near complete. With that out of the way, here is my response:

Q11: I'll admit that the Rego Park reroute was mostly experimental. I do see your point on the impact that it'll have on Q52/53 service, thus, I'll remove it as soon as I finish writing this post. And from what I can understand, you're telling me to remove the Hamilton Branch of the line? OK. To be honest, I was initially not going to add it but though about the people that wanted bus service in that area, so I kept it. Maybe if I just leave the Howard Beach branch of the route, it'll be less confusing. Also, looking at your post and what @BM5 via Woodhaven said about the Q21 makes me a little conflicted as to whether I should add it in my map or not. 

Q19: I was unaware that the Q19 replacing the Q48 was your idea. I was looking at some old thread's in this site a few days ago and found that proposal in a comment. I didn't check as to who came up with the idea. Thanks for making me aware that this (Q19 replacing the Q48) was your idea. Also, I have no intention of planning route frequencies in comparison to other routes since this is a mistake that planners have made in the past (If I'm not mistaken, planners still make this mistake today). 

Q23: I'm unsure of what to do to this route so until I can think of an idea, it's staying as is. 

Q38: OK. I'll make that change and extend the Q67 as well. 

Q42: Yikes! I see that issue happen in front of P.S.139 and J.H.S.190 nearly every time I pass by.  So what you're saying is that I should leave the Q42 as is on its eastern end. 

Q45: Using it to supplement B13 service doesn't sound like a bad idea at all. And I also read the quote that Atlas Park isn't "fully developed". From what I can understand, only one route is good enough in that area? 

Q46: SBS

Q52 SBS: I'm not sending the Q52 to woodside. I got lazy after making the Q53 SBS route on my map. So I created the Q52 stub to Arverne. Guess, I should've elaborated on that.   

Q55: I don't think I altered the route in any way, but if Ridgewood isn't a good place to terminate the Q55, then where is?

Q58 SBS: I tried to make it as planned, but I guess I could terminate it elsewhere if Ridgewood isn't a good place to terminate. Maybe, I can seperate it from the Q58 Local, but I don't know about rerouting it via Eliot Avenue. 

Q60: Welp, looks like I made an error in my map. I'll fix that one. 

Q64: Well, considering that I keep seeing an XN60 on that route, I guess sending it to Yellowstone Blvd isn't a good idea. Yet, If a local route SHOULD serve Yellowstone Blvd, then where should I place it's terminals?

Q66 SBS: Like I said in one of my earlier posts, I'm adding all planned SBS routes as SBS routes. Besides, Queens is the last borough to undergo a redesign by the , so I'm not changing my Q66 SBS. 

Q72: Maybe I don't need to brand it as a LGA Link. But in terms of Alterations, I'm leaving the route as is. 

Q101: The Q101 proposal was BM5's idea, and I incorporated it into my map. Also, I don't see why a Center Blvd route won't work. But then again, the NYC Ferry serves is along with the LIRR. Not only that, but that section of LIC is still undergoing development, so I think that the Q101 and the Q103 would generate good ridership if they were connected closer to that particular area. 

Q102: Dead-ending the Q102 at Queensboro Plaza, I don't know, But not sending any bus to Roosevelt Island, agree. When you said that riders are patronizing the Q102, is that a way of saying that they don't want to get rid of the route under any circumstance? 

Q103: See my response for the Q101

Q104: Guess I'll take @BM5's suggestion then.

Q11: I'm not conveying Hamilton Beach service should be eliminated.... What I'm saying is, instead of having a Q11 trip that terminates in Hamilton Beach & having a Q11 trip terminate in Old Howard Beach, all trips would terminate in Old Howard Beach (serving Hamilton Beach first, before terminating in Old Howard Beach).... In other words, I'm eliminating the branching aspect of it... It would be a continuous route; Old Howard Beach via Hamilton Beach.

As for whether the Q21 should be kept over the Q11 (or vice versa) as the lone Woodhaven local, that's going to have to be up to you for your reasons... In terms of opinions, I don't want to push anything onto anyone & for damn sure, I don't want any d**kriders... I want free-thinking people.

Q38/Q67: Where would you extend the Q67 (curious)?

Q42: Pretty much... Yup.

Q45: Yeah, only because there's no space for it to terminate with the Q29 down on Myrtle..... As for Atlas Park itself, it does have that feel to it... All these years now that it's existed & it still resembles a work in progress - except, there's no progress.. LOL!

Q52: Alright, gotcha.

Q55: You're missing my point.... The way you drew the terminal scenarios on both ends of the route are not the same as what the route currently does.... On the Richmond Hill end, the last dropoff stop is on 117th/Jamaica & the first pickup stop is over there on Myrtle/Hillside... Albeit a short walk, for some reason, I never liked that walk from the Q56 to Myrtle/Hillside....The way you drew it, it looks like you'd have buses making the first pickup & the last dropoff on 117th/Jamaica (which is something I agree with)...

As for the Ridgewood end, I'm not saying it shouldn't end at Ridgewood Terminal.... My gripe (not with you, but w/ the MTA) is that they keep changing what buses do over there (in terms of turnarounds).... I believe the inbound Q55 continues on Myrtle to Gates, then does the whole Gates > Irving > Palmetto bit.... So it makes its first pickup over there a few yards ahead of the Q58, instead of a few yards ahead of the B54.... The B54 & the Q55 used to pickup on the same side of Palmetto....

The musical chairs bit is a bit... much, over there....

Q64: That depends on its origin.... Hard to discern a destination if you don't have an origin (hence the term O/D pair; origin-destination).

Q72: ...which is why I only made the comment about the branding.... I wouldn't change the Q72 routing either.

Q101/103: Center Blvd isn't an area I'd route a public bus down... The vibe I get from that area is that they're rather insular; almost like they're trying to separate themselves from the rest of Hunterspoint, let alone the rest of Queens (kind of like how some Riverdalians like to separate themselves from not being in the Bronx).... When that area fully develops, there's gonna be so many dam taxi's & delivery vehicles over there on that narrow ass street, it'll make your head spin.... I wouldn't subject the Q101 or any other bus route to that....

As for the Q103, it already serves Hunterspoint in general... Unless I'm missing something, all you did was send it to the Ferry Terminal.... That's not the part of Center blvd. where all the action's at (so to speak)....

Q102: I wouldn't send it to RI & I wouldn't bother running it anywhere south of the bridge.... I don't see exactly see ending a route at a future CBD (some already consider it a CBD; Central Business District) as dead-ending a route, but okay, I suppose...... As for your question, I don't think the increased patronage is some effort to not have the MTA get rid of the route.... The construction along the out there has quite a bit to do with it.

[Italianstallion]

On 1/24/2019 at 6:12 PM, LaGuardia Link N Tra said:

All replies are in Bold. 

"Cornell Tech? What’s that? The only reason I have the Q104 going to Roosevelt Island in the First Place is so that it can provide a connection with the  and Roosevelt Island Tramway. Nothing else."

 

If you don't know what Cornell Tech is, you have no business making transit suggestions about Roosevelt Island.

[LGA Link N Train]

47 minutes ago, Italianstallion said:

If you don't know what Cornell Tech is, you have no business making transit suggestions about Roosevelt Island.

I was told what Cornell Tech is a few posts back. I also just found out that it’s in Roosevelt Island. Now that I’m aware of these few facts, that contradicts your statement that I just quoted, don’t you think? 

Also, I personally think that the Roosevelt Island Bus Service should be capable to handle those who live/work in Roosevelt Island. (Along with connecting them to the  and Tramway)

[P3F]

1 hour ago, LaGuardia Link N Tra said:

I was told what Cornell Tech is a few posts back. I also just found out that it’s in Roosevelt Island. Now that I’m aware of these few facts, that contradicts your statement that I just quoted, don’t you think? 

Also, I personally think that the Roosevelt Island Bus Service should be capable to handle those who live/work in Roosevelt Island. (Along with connecting them to the  and Tramway)

He's not wrong, though. If you intend for your suggestions about bus route changes to be taken seriously, you should at least do minimal research about the areas that the routes serve.