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Q43LTD

Queens Division Bus Proposals/Ideas

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19 hours ago, BM5 via Woodhaven said:

Haven't checked all of the proposals, but everything below and including the Q68 proposal is straight up unnecessary. They either parallel routes way too much, does not serve a sizable base, look like they're drawn out just because, or all three. 

i fixed the maps. And the Q68 proposal is a little unnecessary since i saw the van wyck expy recently hence the Q10A discontinuation 

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Posted (edited)

My small commentary on the Flushing feeders....

Q12: For the love of god, please don't extend this thing to LIRR Great Neck... It's enough that it has to put up with Sanford, alone !!

Q13: As much as I don't care for the thing, it's a necessary evil... I find this thing to be slower than the Q12 between Downtown Flushing & Bell/Northern.... Route has a tendency to die, north of commercial Bell Blvd, though....

Q15/a: The most underrated of all the Flushing feeders... All that hoopla out of the Whitestone folks (15a creation) for nothing.... I'd leave this puppy alone.

Q26: Doesn't count....

Nah, seriously though, I would have this supplement the Q27 to QCC (via current Q26 route, north of Holly)..... A span expansion is also in order....
I just can't, with buses going Kissena > Holly (a la the Q27)....

Q28: One of my favorite routes in the entire city to ride... AFAIC, easily the most reliable of the Flushing feeders....

"Q14"/Q16: The problem I've always had with the Q16 is its branching & just how ill-utilized it is, west of Franny Lou.... Not sure how I would divvy up service levels, but to eliminate that branching (and frugality), I would split the Q16 into two services... The "Q14" would share a common (the current) terminal w/ the Q16 in Flushing.... Both would have the same exact routing until Francis Lewis/26th, then:

 

Q14: ...continues north along Francis Lewis, then commences a clockwise loop in serving the area binding Willets Pt. Blvd > Utopia Pkwy > 26th av, then heads back to Flushing via the current Q16 route... Save for random, select trips to Ft. Totten (for the sole purpose of serving the BayBridge condos), the route's only terminal would be in Flushing.....

Q16: ...continues east along 26th to Corp. Ken., parallels the Q28 to Bell Blvd, then runs up Bell to eventually terminate in Ft. Totten....

Edited by B35 via Church
spoiler tag f**king up....
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1 hour ago, B35 via Church said:

"Q14"/Q16: The problem I've always had with the Q16 is its branching & just how ill-utilized it is, west of Franny Lou....

ouch...

Should read "east" of Franny Lou...

On ‎5‎/‎15‎/‎2019 at 3:23 PM, BM5 via Woodhaven said:

Haven't checked all of the proposals, but everything below and including the Q68 proposal is straight up unnecessary. They either parallel routes way too much, does not serve a sizable base, look like they're drawn out just because, or all three. 

I mean, honestly...

For the life of me (and this used to be done with LTD service proposals, before the advent of SBS...), I'll never understand what people don't get about recklessly extending bus routes (or otherwise conjuring up long, drawn out routes) & having them run LTD (or now, SBS) doesn't make the physical route any shorter & wouldn't reduce the susceptibility of delays, either....

Practicality man...... Practicality.

 

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6 hours ago, B35 via Church said:

Q12: For the love of god, please don't extend this thing to LIRR Great Neck... It's enough that it has to put up with Sanford, alone !!

The only way I'd support that is to have the trips to Great Neck run as a limited-stop variant (local service would remain unchanged, save for the possibility of night service in Nassau) on a more favorable schedule than the current N20 (I know, the split, but it hardly matters). That said, I can't really say that Nassau residents would be too keen on that, as it would mean sharing space with NYC residents under open-door operation.

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Just now, Lex said:

The only way I'd support that is to have the trips to Great Neck run as a limited-stop variant (local service would remain unchanged, save for the possibility of night service in Nassau) on a more favorable schedule than the current N20 (I know, the split, but it hardly matters). That said, I can't really say that Nassau residents would be too keen on that, as it would mean sharing space with NYC residents under open-door operation.

Nassau residents would be some of the main ones taking advantage of it...

MTA  (insert some exorbitant amount of greater than signs)  NICE

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1 minute ago, B35 via Church said:

Nassau residents would be some of the main ones taking advantage of it...

MTA  (insert some exorbitant amount of greater than signs)  NICE

That's fair.

Honestly, even taking how poor the MTA's bus operations can be, the fact that it's viewed as far more favorable than NICE (that acronym is a load of crock) is embarrassing. (It doesn't help that under the MTA, buses could be loaned if necessary.)

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23 hours ago, Lex said:

That's fair.

Honestly, even taking how poor the MTA's bus operations can be, the fact that it's viewed as far more favorable than NICE (that acronym is a load of crock) is embarrassing. (It doesn't help that under the MTA, buses could be loaned if necessary.)

Nassau got exactly what it paid for. Can't help people who don't want helping.

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1 hour ago, bobtehpanda said:

Nassau got exactly what it paid for. Can't help people who don't want helping.

Well, Mangano did, anyway...

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On 5/17/2019 at 4:26 PM, Lex said:

That's fair.

Honestly, even taking how poor the MTA's bus operations can be, the fact that it's viewed as far more favorable than NICE (that acronym is a load of crock) is embarrassing. (It doesn't help that under the MTA, buses could be loaned if necessary.)

Well in reality, lets say that even though (MTA) does its shenanigans, they are far more reliable than nice in any category.

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On 5/17/2019 at 9:07 AM, B35 via Church said:

Q26: Doesn't count....

Nah, seriously though, I would have this supplement the Q27 to QCC (via current Q26 route, north of Holly)..... A span expansion is also in order....
I just can't, with buses going Kissena > Holly (a la the Q27)....

amen. couldn't agree more

 

On 5/17/2019 at 9:07 AM, B35 via Church said:

Q28: One of my favorite routes in the entire city to ride... AFAIC, easily the most reliable of the Flushing feeders....

again, couldn't agree more. I enjoyed riding the 28 in years past, especially middays and during the summer. concise & to the point. 

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18 hours ago, Lex said:

Well, Mangano did, anyway...

He's been out for two years. Nothing's changed.

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30 minutes ago, bobtehpanda said:

He's been out for two years. Nothing's changed.

I mean they added back some n79 Saturday service and made shuttles in Port Washington and the Freeport/Merrick area. 

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Future ENY OP said:

I think the Q55 could use a possible extension either in Bushwick via Myrtle (J)(M)(Z) or Hillside-Sutphin (F) 

Don't see it being worth it, either way..... Anyone coming from off the Q55 in Ridgewood are all gunning for the subway anyway & I can't believe the masses only want Myrtle, at, or short of Broadway.... That immediate area is a terrible place to terminate a bus route full time, on top of it...

Even if you wanted to run it to Jamaica (the neighborhood) via Hillside, you're better off running it to Jamaica -Van Wyck (E)(J)(Z) for QB line service over Sutphin (F) (if that's the thought process).... I mean, I don't see/know of & haven't read about much of any demand for folks along/around Myrtle (Glendale & Kew Gardens) trying to get to Jamaica proper for shopping purposes or whatever.... It's not like that of those that live more proximate to the Q56, that ride out towards Sutphin.....

Another thing w/ that route is, what should be a 1/2 hour ride, actually comes close to doubling that.... It used to be that Myrtle, east of Woodhaven used to be a cake walk (duration-wise), but now, not so much anymore....

Edited by B35 via Church
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10 minutes ago, B35 via Church said:

Don't see it being worth it, either way..... Anyone coming from off the Q55 in Ridgewood are all gunning for the subway anyway & I can't believe the masses only want Myrtle, at, or short of Broadway.... That immediate area is a terrible place to terminate a bus route full time, on top of it...

Even if you wanted to run it to Jamaica (the neighborhood) via Hillside, you're better off running it to Jamaica -Van Wyck (E)(J)(Z) for QB line service over Sutphin (F) (if that's the thought process).... I mean, I don't see/know of & haven't read about much of any demand for folks along/around Myrtle (Glendale & Kew Gardens) trying to get to Jamaica proper for shopping purposes or whatever.... It's not like that of those that live more proximate to the Q56, that ride out towards Sutphin.....

Another thing w/ that route is, what should be a 1/2 hour ride, actually comes close to doubling that.... It used to be that Myrtle, east of Woodhaven used to be a cake walk (duration-wise), but now, not so much anymore....

Only reason I thought about was only b/c since the 55 is via Myrtle in both directions why not extend to Bushwick-Bed Stuy. However, I totally forgot about that dirty area of Myrtle-Broadway & Stockholm Street. Park Avenue is not a proper layover area. 

As for the Jamaica portion you may be right. Those Ridgewood-Glendale-Kew Gardens folks don’t necessarily need Jamaica service. Although the route is about 45 mins long and has pretty frequent service. Just wanted to see the consensus on an extension. I don’t have anything against the current layover on Hillside & Jamaica-117th which is pretty near the 121 (J).

I like the Jamaica-Van Wyck idea since the buses would terminate on Metro Avenue. However, nothing pass that.  

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On 5/20/2019 at 9:31 AM, B35 via Church said:

Don't see it being worth it, either way..... Anyone coming from off the Q55 in Ridgewood are all gunning for the subway anyway & I can't believe the masses only want Myrtle, at, or short of Broadway.... That immediate area is a terrible place to terminate a bus route full time, on top of it...

Even if you wanted to run it to Jamaica (the neighborhood) via Hillside, you're better off running it to Jamaica -Van Wyck (E)(J)(Z) for QB line service over Sutphin (F) (if that's the thought process).... I mean, I don't see/know of & haven't read about much of any demand for folks along/around Myrtle (Glendale & Kew Gardens) trying to get to Jamaica proper for shopping purposes or whatever.... It's not like that of those that live more proximate to the Q56, that ride out towards Sutphin.....

Another thing w/ that route is, what should be a 1/2 hour ride, actually comes close to doubling that.... It used to be that Myrtle, east of Woodhaven used to be a cake walk (duration-wise), but now, not so much anymore....

What I personally don’t like about the Q55 is how on the weekends reliable tends to tank as well. There has been plenty of weekends where I’d take or try to take it and there’s a bus missing. It’s bad enough it’s headways are every 20 but to have a bus missing increases the wait time to 40 mins. I don’t know if the Q55 is one of those routes where they will pull a bus off to full a gap elsewhere but I swear that route tends to suffer from gaps a lot.

 

I also would agree to extend the Q55 to Jamaica Van Vyck, I always felt like it just dead end stops at Jamaica Ave and 117th and should at least have a connection to the (E) 

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1 hour ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

I don’t know if the Q55 is one of those routes where they will pull a bus off to full a gap elsewhere

the only time a SLD would pull a run from a line is if that line has a headway high enough that the run in question "won't be missed" (won't cause a noticeable gap in service) there's no way runs would be pulled from the Q55 with a 20 minute headway to in turn create a 40 minute headway. there must be an inefficient exta list to cover the open run(s) or lateness from an interlined run with a second half Q55... or someone consistently takes a personal, making that "missing" run constantly late. 

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1 hour ago, EastFlatbushLarry said:

the only time a SLD would pull a run from a line is if that line has a headway high enough that the run in question "won't be missed" (won't cause a noticeable gap in service) there's no way runs would be pulled from the Q55 with a 20 minute headway to in turn create a 40 minute headway. there must be an inefficient exta list to cover the open run(s) or lateness from an interlined run with a second half Q55... or someone consistently takes a personal, making that "missing" run constantly late. 

That’s good to know, I’m guessing it’s probably due to a lateness due to interlining perhaps? When I take the Q55 I usually have the issues with it more on Sundays than Saturdays. On Sunday’s I usually try to avoid that route unless I see a bus coming. 

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8 hours ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

What I personally don’t like about the Q55 is how on the weekends reliable tends to tank as well. There has been plenty of weekends where I’d take or try to take it and there’s a bus missing. It’s bad enough it’s headways are every 20 but to have a bus missing increases the wait time to 40 mins. I don’t know if the Q55 is one of those routes where they will pull a bus off to full a gap elsewhere but I swear that route tends to suffer from gaps a lot.

 

I also would agree to extend the Q55 to Jamaica Van Vyck, I always felt like it just dead end stops at Jamaica Ave and 117th and should at least have a connection to the (E) 

Welcome to the "Cipher Zone"! (imagine having to use that to get to Jamaica when both the (L) and (J) are out!)
(So-called, because it feels like all the buses to Queens are like this; like the 58 being so slow, and still bunched up even with the LTD, and then similarly stopping short of the main part of Flushing, and the 54, once you get to it, made slower by the detour to Atlas, and the 39 being so torturously long, and they continued to add new kinks to it, like when streets are made one way. And no direct access to Jackson Heights or Forest Hills at all).

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11 hours ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

I also would agree to extend the Q55 to Jamaica Van Vyck, I always felt like it just dead end stops at Jamaica Ave and 117th and should at least have a connection to the (E) 

To me I never liked the Jamaica/Hillside/117th stop. Having the route extended at least to Jamaica-Van Wyck makes it a bit easier for the (E), also with a stop for 121 (J) would make things OKAY for the 55. 

 

9 hours ago, EastFlatbushLarry said:

the only time a SLD would pull a run from a line is if that line has a headway high enough that the run in question "won't be missed" (won't cause a noticeable gap in service) there's no way runs would be pulled from the Q55 with a 20 minute headway to in turn create a 40 minute headway. there must be an inefficient exta list to cover the open run(s) or lateness from an interlined run with a second half Q55... or someone consistently takes a personal, making that "missing" run constantly late. 

The only interline I know for the 55 is Ridgewood (correct me please) or any Fresh Pond op that’s on this board. What is the interline for the Q55? There should be no reason that the weekends it’s 20 min headways and buses are flowing in at 40 minutes. 

This clearly reminds me of Grand Avenue and their mismanagement of the B13, B15, B43 and B47. 3 of those forementioned routes went back home to their respective depots meanwhile the 47 has those similar headways and is treated by 40 min headways with 3 buses going in one direction. 

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On 5/17/2019 at 4:13 PM, Lex said:

The only way I'd support that is to have the trips to Great Neck run as a limited-stop variant (local service would remain unchanged, save for the possibility of night service in Nassau) on a more favorable schedule than the current N20 (I know, the split, but it hardly matters). That said, I can't really say that Nassau residents would be too keen on that, as it would mean sharing space with NYC residents under open-door operation.

The limited stop variant of the Q12 would still be outsped by the n20G running closed door in Queens, and cause a lot of people to miss their connection with the n20H, n21, and n25 at Middle Neck and Northern. 

The n20 has it's schedule due to a mix of traffic at Downtown Flushing, on Northern Blvd, and that small detour off Northern to go thru Roslyn Clock Tower. 

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1 hour ago, NY1635 said:

The limited stop variant of the Q12 would still be outsped by the n20G running closed door in Queens, and cause a lot of people to miss their connection with the n20H, n21, and n25 at Middle Neck and Northern.

I mean, those could have their times adjusted...

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1 minute ago, Lex said:

I mean, those could have their times adjusted...

They could adjust the travel times to make room for the Q12 going to Great Neck, and people will still end up missing their connection because the city bus is delayed by traffic or has a hard time going around to traffic circle by the railroad station to get to the layover spot. 

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5 minutes ago, NY1635 said:

They could adjust the travel times to make room for the Q12 going to Great Neck, and people will still end up missing their connection because the city bus is delayed by traffic or has a hard time going around to traffic circle by the railroad station to get to the layover spot. 

Because that totally doesn't happen now.

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I'm not concurring with running Q12's to LIRR Great Neck at all, but mistimed connections is a poor reason to not send a bus route somewhere, if there's a demand for it..... The point of the extension/suggestion was never to supplant the n20....

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