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Q43LTD

Queens Division Bus Proposals/Ideas

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6 hours ago, Eric B said:

Welcome to the "Cipher Zone"! (imagine having to use that to get to Jamaica when both the (L) and (J) are out!)
(So-called, because it feels like all the buses to Queens are like this; like the 58 being so slow, and still bunched up even with the LTD, and then similarly stopping short of the main part of Flushing, and the 54, once you get to it, made slower by the detour to Atlas, and the 39 being so torturously long, and they continued to add new kinks to it, like when streets are made one way. And no direct access to Jackson Heights or Forest Hills at all).

Funny you say that because a few weeks ago that’s exactly what happened.  The (J) was cut back once again to Broadway Junction because of track replacement so I decided to take the Q56 from Jamaica/Parsons to Myrtle for the Q55. I could have taken the (E) to the shuttle bus but honestly I don’t like that we have to do that. The (E) has its moments where it’s delayed and I wish the shuttle bus could run to at least Sutphin Blvd/Archer Av, just to avoid having to make an extra transfer for just one stop. There has been times where the (E) took 10 to 15 mins to come and the shuttle bus could have already been to Sutphin/Archer, but I guess this is the (MTA) trying to save all the money they can get. 

Anyways I get off and wait for the Q55 at Myrtle & Hillside Ave. I checked the transit app and I noticed a bus was all the down by Myrtle & Forest Ave, but no other bus was heading to Ridgewood terminal. I checked for the next bus to Jamaica & 117th street and it was a good 22 minutes away. So it was apparent to me that a bus was either super late or completely missing, which honestly is no surprise to me because it’s happened to me several times. So I ended up having to take the shuttle bus all the way to Broadway Junction and then wait 10 minutes for the (L) because the partial shutdown had just started so (L) service was reduced. 

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41 minutes ago, B35 via Church said:

I'm not concurring with running Q12's to LIRR Great Neck at all, but mistimed connections is a poor reason to not send a bus route somewhere, if there's a demand for it..... 

You said it better than I could.

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6 hours ago, Eric B said:

Welcome to the "Cipher Zone"! (imagine having to use that to get to Jamaica when both the (L) and (J) are out!)
(So-called, because it feels like all the buses to Queens are like this; like the 58 being so slow, and still bunched up even with the LTD, and then similarly stopping short of the main part of Flushing, and the 54, once you get to it, made slower by the detour to Atlas, and the 39 being so torturously long, and they continued to add new kinks to it, like when streets are made one way. And no direct access to Jackson Heights or Forest Hills at all).

........ The whole Queens Division is like this 

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6 hours ago, Future ENY OP said:

The only interline I know for the 55 is Ridgewood 

i could be wrong, but i believe that the Q55 does strictly swing (relief) interlines at Ridgewood Terminal with the 26, 52 & B54. 

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1 hour ago, EastFlatbushLarry said:

i could be wrong, but i believe that the Q55 does strictly swing (relief) interlines at Ridgewood Terminal with the 26, 52 & B54. 

Gotchu good sir. 

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21 hours ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

I also would agree to extend the Q55 to Jamaica Van Wyck, I always felt like it just dead end stops at Jamaica Ave and 117th and should at least have a connection to the (E) 

 

It ends there now because the Myrtle Avenue streetcar ended there 100 years ago.

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16 hours ago, Gotham Bus Co. said:

 

It ends there now because the Myrtle Avenue streetcar ended there 100 years ago.

I think it just goes to show how outdated the Queens bus network is. 

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8 minutes ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

I think it just goes to show how outdated the Queens bus network is. 

This says something about bus planning (or lack thereof) in this city:

On June 27, 1999, the Q44 began limited-stop service in Queens, with the Q20 split into two branches (Q20A and Q20B) to provide local service. Weekend service was also restored on the Q20A. Since the Q44 became limited, the Q20 was extended south along Main Street to make local stops. At this time, the Q44 was shifted from its historical route in the neighborhood of Briarwood between Union Turnpike and Hillside Avenue. It had previously turned east onto the Grand Central Parkway service road and then turned south onto 150th Street towards Jamaica, the same route employed since 1938 when Main Street dead-ended at the Grand Central service road.

This was edited by my fellow editor Tdorante10 on Wikipedia. I love telling this example to people. It is absurd. And, local residents complained bitterly about the loss of service on 150th Street.

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On 5/23/2019 at 1:18 PM, Union Tpke said:

This says something about bus planning (or lack thereof) in this city:

On June 27, 1999, the Q44 began limited-stop service in Queens, with the Q20 split into two branches (Q20A and Q20B) to provide local service. Weekend service was also restored on the Q20A. Since the Q44 became limited, the Q20 was extended south along Main Street to make local stops. At this time, the Q44 was shifted from its historical route in the neighborhood of Briarwood between Union Turnpike and Hillside Avenue. It had previously turned east onto the Grand Central Parkway service road and then turned south onto 150th Street towards Jamaica, the same route employed since 1938 when Main Street dead-ended at the Grand Central service road.

This was edited by my fellow editor Tdorante10 on Wikipedia. I love telling this example to people. It is absurd. And, local residents complained bitterly about the loss of service on 150th Street.

It’s crazy to think that it took about 60 years for limited service to be implemented  to the Q44. I can only imagine how long the trip from Jamaica Ave/ Merrick Blvd to E 180th street in the Bronx. Probably had to be over 2 hours since the Q44 was alone before 1999. 

Some changes I would make to the Q44 is to have it cut back from Merrick Blvd to Sutphin LIRR. The Q20 would continue to run to Merrick. Routes would probably need to be shifted around to allow the Q44 to terminate at Sutphin. I’d say move the Q43 to turn left on Archer Ave and another left on 147th Place and have it lay over there. The first stop towards 268th street would be at Sutphin & Jamaica Av. I would also have the Q44 skip the routing on Union Street & Parsons Blvd and allow the Q20 to pick up whoever needs service over there. Instead the Q44 would follow the Q50 towards the Bronx. I think these two changes would help speed up the route even more.

There are other changes I would make to other Queens routes. I think the whole Jamaica hub needs to be reconstructed too. I don’t think the Q24 or Q54 should run to 168th & 171st. I would get rid of that weird backtracking route the Q112 does to travel to Ozone Park. The Q110 should provide service to the Jamaica LIRR station but I’d probably have it terminate with the Q40 on Hillside Ave. 

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18 minutes ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

I would also have the Q44 skip the routing on Union Street & Parsons Blvd and allow the Q20 to pick up whoever needs service over there. Instead the Q44 would follow the Q50 towards the Bronx. I think these two changes would help speed up the route even more.

You haven't actually seen Union Street, have you?

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16 minutes ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

It’s crazy to think that it took about 60 years for limited service to be implemented  to the Q44. I can only imagine how long the trip from Jamaica Ave/ Merrick Blvd to E 180th street in the Bronx. Probably had to be over 2 hours since the Q44 was alone before 1999. 

Some changes I would make to the Q44 is to have it cut back from Merrick Blvd to Sutphin LIRR. The Q20 would continue to run to Merrick. Routes would probably need to be shifted around to allow the Q44 to terminate at Sutphin. I’d say move the Q43 to turn left on Archer Ave and another left on 147th Place and have it lay over there. The first stop towards 268th street would be at Sutphin & Jamaica Av. I would also have the Q44 skip the routing on Union Street & Parsons Blvd and allow the Q20 to pick up whoever needs service over there. Instead the Q44 would follow the Q50 towards the Bronx. I think these two changes would help speed up the route even more.

There are other changes I would make to other Queens routes. I think the whole Jamaica hub needs to be reconstructed too. I don’t think the Q24 or Q54 should run to 168th & 171st. I would get rid of that weird backtracking route the Q112 does to travel to Ozone Park. The Q110 should provide service to the Jamaica LIRR station but I’d probably have it terminate with the Q40 on Hillside Ave. 

I also recommend that the Q40, Q110, Q111, Q112, Q113, and Q114 also be rerouted from Hillside Avenue to terminate at Jamaica Center-Parsons Archer station for the Q110-Q114 vía 153rd Street, and at 165th Street Bus terminal for the Q40 via the routing of the former Green Bus Line routes in the area. Since the Archer Line was complete, express service was bought into the Jamaica Center core. As a result, service to Hillside is unnecessary. The Q110 service to 179th Street would be unaffected.

The Q112 should also travel along Liberty Avenue between Sutphin Blvd and Brewer Blvd to straighten the route, but retain the backtracking.

For the Q44 changes, i am very neutral, but they should actually construct an off-street bus terminal for all of the Flushing routes of land is to be found. Otherwise, some local streets could be closed to accommodate this.

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29 minutes ago, Lex said:

You haven't actually seen Union Street, have you?

Plenty of times, the only reason why I mentioned it was because I’ve used the route past Main Street towards the Bronx. What’s the point of the Q44 serving Union St and Parsons Blvd when the Q20 also does that. I proposed taking the Q44 off of Union to speed up service for Bronx passengers. There isn’t a lot of people using the Q44 over there to the Bronx anyways. If people want Bronx service on the Q44 they can board at 35th Ave on Linden Place two blocks to the west. If they want service on 20th Ave the Q44 will be available on the Whitestone Expressway one block west from Parsons Blvd. The Q20 and Q44 don’t necessarily have to stick together, this is all about service improvements and offering faster service especially since the Q44 serves two boroughs. 

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45 minutes ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

Plenty of times, the only reason why I mentioned it was because I’ve used the route past Main Street towards the Bronx. What’s the point of the Q44 serving Union St and Parsons Blvd when the Q20 also does that. I proposed taking the Q44 off of Union to speed up service for Bronx passengers. There isn’t a lot of people using the Q44 over there to the Bronx anyways. If people want Bronx service on the Q44 they can board at 35th Ave on Linden Place two blocks to the west. If they want service on 20th Ave the Q44 will be available on the Whitestone Expressway one block west from Parsons Blvd. The Q20 and Q44 don’t necessarily have to stick together, this is all about service improvements and offering faster service especially since the Q44 serves two boroughs. 

I was thinking the same thing. With a Q25 conversion to SBS, I was thinking the Following as part of rerouting buses

Q44+ - Routed off Parsons Blvd and onto the Whitestone Expressway with the 50 Limited

Q25 - Limited becomes Select Bus Service and picks up the Q44 Slack until 20th Avenue where it'll go back to the Normal Route. Local service remains the Same. 

Q20A/B stays as is until further notice

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6 minutes ago, LaGuardia Link N Tra said:

I was thinking the same thing. With a Q25 conversion to SBS, I was thinking the Following as part of rerouting buses

Q44+ - Routed off Parsons Blvd and onto the Whitestone Expressway with the 50 Limited

Q25 - Limited becomes Select Bus Service and picks up the Q44 Slack until 20th Avenue where it'll go back to the Normal Route. Local service remains the Same. 

Q20A/B stays as is until further notice

Musical chairs isn't helpful.

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57 minutes ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

Plenty of times, the only reason why I mentioned it was because I’ve used the route past Main Street towards the Bronx. What’s the point of the Q44 serving Union St and Parsons Blvd when the Q20 also does that. I proposed taking the Q44 off of Union to speed up service for Bronx passengers. There isn’t a lot of people using the Q44 over there to the Bronx anyways. If people want Bronx service on the Q44 they can board at 35th Ave on Linden Place two blocks to the west. If they want service on 20th Ave the Q44 will be available on the Whitestone Expressway one block west from Parsons Blvd. The Q20 and Q44 don’t necessarily have to stick together, this is all about service improvements and offering faster service especially since the Q44 serves two boroughs. 

Look at 39th Street. The B35 and B70 have enough difficulty along that street, and that's the portion of the former with relatively low frequency. You're basically saying to make Union Street (a street already having difficulty fitting the buses in) that on steroids. As soon as a bus can't continue on Union Street, it's stuck, as buses have no real way to pass each other, and that'll only become much more likely with the Q44's frequency. Moreover, if the reasoning for moving it is just because you want those buses to reach the Bronx faster, then you've utterly missed the bigger picture (not everyone is using the route to travel between the Bronx and Queens, nor should everyone using it be trying to go between the two). In addition, while the Q20 does run on the same route, the Q20A splits at 20th Avenue, whereas the Q44 breaks from the Q20B. The latter Q20 has nowhere near as much demand, nor is the MTA willing to supply much more of it (in part because of 14th Avenue's more residential nature). That's not even getting into the fact that the 26th Avenue and Bayside Avenue stops are in locations where the Q50's route is utterly incapable of being particularly useful (the former especially so, as there's no way across the freeway, hence the Q34's odd route).

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Just to touch on something that was mentioned on a now-locked thread...

 

If the Q26 is supposedly being discontinued in the Fall pick, then when/where was the public hearing held?

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29 minutes ago, Gotham Bus Co. said:

Just to touch on something that was mentioned on a now-locked thread...

 

If the Q26 is supposedly being discontinued in the Fall pick, then when/where was the public hearing held?

It would be mentioned in the next board meeting before a hearing occurs.

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6 hours ago, Lex said:

Look at 39th Street. The B35 and B70 have enough difficulty along that street, and that's the portion of the former with relatively low frequency. You're basically saying to make Union Street (a street already having difficulty fitting the buses in) that on steroids. As soon as a bus can't continue on Union Street, it's stuck, as buses have no real way to pass each other, and that'll only become much more likely with the Q44's frequency. Moreover, if the reasoning for moving it is just because you want those buses to reach the Bronx faster, then you've utterly missed the bigger picture (not everyone is using the route to travel between the Bronx and Queens, nor should everyone using it be trying to go between the two). In addition, while the Q20 does run on the same route, the Q20A splits at 20th Avenue, whereas the Q44 breaks from the Q20B. The latter Q20 has nowhere near as much demand, nor is the MTA willing to supply much more of it (in part because of 14th Avenue's more residential nature). That's not even getting into the fact that the 26th Avenue and Bayside Avenue stops are in locations where the Q50's route is utterly incapable of being particularly useful (the former especially so, as there's no way across the freeway, hence the Q34's odd route).

I’m kind of lost with the first part of your response. I feel like you meant to say Linden Place which is where I’d reroute the Q44 to take a faster route to the Bronx. 

The reason why I proposed this routing for the Q44 is because there are several people who use the Q44 from Jamaica to reach the Bronx and there are also quite a bit of people who board at Main Street/ 38th Ave to get to the Bronx. I feel like there is no reason for the Q44 to make that detour through Whitestone which slows the route down when the Q20 is already serving those stops. I understand that the Q20B especially doesn’t have much demand but I was having the Q44 make correlating stops at 14th and 20th Aves on the Whitestone expressway and then one on Linden Place and 35th Ave. The Q34 may see a little boost in ridership above Roosevelt which it currently has low ridership on that segment of its route. So the only stops that will get lose Q44 service is Bayside Ave and 28th Street but you already have the Q16, Q20 serving the Bayside Ave stop and the Q20 and Q34 serving 28th Ave. 

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5 hours ago, Gotham Bus Co. said:

Just to touch on something that was mentioned on a now-locked thread...

 

If the Q26 is supposedly being discontinued in the Fall pick, then when/where was the public hearing held?

If this were to happen I feel like residents along Hollis Court Blvd would fight for it to stay. I honestly don’t know what should be done to that route because it really is one massive duplicate of the Q27 and parts of the Q65 route. 

I was honestly thinking that the Q26 and Q65 swap routing in that area where the Q65 would turn left on Sanford, right on Parsons Blvd and a left on 46th Street to Pigeon Meadow Road where it will continue its normal route. The Q26 would turn onto Bowne Street from Roosevelt and continue south until 45th street. The Q26 will turn left onto 45th Ave and continue to 162nd street. It would turn right on 162nd until 46th Ave where it would resume its normal route to Fresh Meadows. 

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3 hours ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

I’m kind of lost with the first part of your response. I feel like you meant to say Linden Place which is where I’d reroute the Q44 to take a faster route to the Bronx.

As a matter of fact, I did, but I got sloppy and called out the wrong street (and I can't edit it because that window's passed).

 

3 hours ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

The reason why I proposed this routing for the Q44 is because there are several people who use the Q44 from Jamaica to reach the Bronx and there are also quite a bit of people who board at Main Street/ 38th Ave to get to the Bronx. I feel like there is no reason for the Q44 to make that detour through Whitestone which slows the route down when the Q20 is already serving those stops. I understand that the Q20B especially doesn’t have much demand but I was having the Q44 make correlating stops at 14th and 20th Aves on the Whitestone expressway and then one on Linden Place and 35th Ave. The Q34 may see a little boost in ridership above Roosevelt which it currently has low ridership on that segment of its route. So the only stops that will get lose Q44 service is Bayside Ave and 28th Street but you already have the Q16, Q20 serving the Bayside Ave stop and the Q20 and Q34 serving 28th Ave. 

The Whitestone portion has very little effect on the route's speed, and there's far more worth serving along it than there is along the Q50's route. As for Linden Place (not Union Street, contrary to what my idiot self said in that earlier post), that street's just barely able to accommodate what it has now, and with the Q44 having artics and a higher frequency, the buses over there will constantly get stuck in traffic, resulting in the exact opposite of the intended effect. Then you have the community to contend with, and I'm certain that the people will not be happy about getting shafted like that (especially if we're talking about weekends, which will ensure that they'll be forced to use the Q20A instead of having options in some form).

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Posted (edited)

I'm hearing that some people are agreeing to eliminate the Q34 entirely. How do you guys feel about this?

Edited by NBTA

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1 hour ago, NBTA said:

I'm hearing that some people are agreeing to eliminate the Q34 entirely. How do you guys feel about this?

I know people that rely on that bus to get to the subway from their home near Willets Pt Blvd. Not a smart move imo.

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7 hours ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

If this were to happen I feel like residents along Hollis Court Blvd would fight for it to stay. I honestly don’t know what should be done to that route because it really is one massive duplicate of the Q27 and parts of the Q65 route. 

I was honestly thinking that the Q26 and Q65 swap routing in that area where the Q65 would turn left on Sanford, right on Parsons Blvd and a left on 46th Street to Pigeon Meadow Road where it will continue its normal route. The Q26 would turn onto Bowne Street from Roosevelt and continue south until 45th street. The Q26 will turn left onto 45th Ave and continue to 162nd street. It would turn right on 162nd until 46th Ave where it would resume its normal route to Fresh Meadows. 

 

I would swap the Q27 and Q65 paths through the area...

  • Q27 via Parsons between 46th and Sanford. (Q26 could either disappear or become a part-time branch of the Q27)
  • Q65 on Kissena (instead of Bowne) between 45th and Sanford.

 

There is no reason to run a bus on Bowne Street south of Sanford, other than the fact that a streetcar ran there 100 years ago.

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1 hour ago, NBTA said:

I'm hearing that some people are agreeing to eliminate the Q34 entirely. How do you guys feel about this?

I would leave the Q34 in place and extend it to Fort Totten to replace the Q16 (Franny Lew branch). Then I'd run all the Q16s on Utopia to Le Havre. 

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1 hour ago, Bay Ridge Express said:

I know people that rely on that bus to get to the subway from their home near Willets Pt Blvd. Not a smart move imo.

Unless you replace it with a different Local Route to Jamaica.

 

On a Side Note, Veering the discussion away from Flushing for a moment, I thought of a restructured Q39 that would be more direct between LIC and Ridgewood. 

Buses will start at Queens Plaza like they currently do, but run down Queens Blvd instead to access Van Dam Street. (N/B) Buses will do the same but will have some sort of loop around 21st Street in order to begin (S/B) Trips. The route remains the same until 48th Street/Laruel Hill Blvd where the route will continue down 48th Street until it reaches 56th Road/Rust Street. Between Rust Street and 61st Street/Fresh Pond Road, (S/B) buses will run via 58th Avenue and (N/B) Buses will run via Maspeth Avenue before ultimately replacing the Southern Portion of the Q58 Route. Its Current South Terminal will be replaced by a Split Q54 route. Any thoughts or opinions?

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