LIRR And MNRR Random Thoughts Thread

[MassTransitHonchkrow]

I disagree.  In some cases the may be able to get the vendor to foot the costs.  Either way they are very useful being on the go, and I see plenty of people using the outlets, myself included.  

I guess, in that sense, the has become soft to the wrong plight. Your statement, while unfair, is absolutely correct and reflects how out of touch they are and will remain.

 

I'm just waiting for the 70s relapse so I can carry my a** upstate with an excuse.

[N6 Limited]

Ever since I started using the LIRR to avoid the QBL ride of horrors after 10PM and weekends, I've been getting accustomed to using it to the point that i't's starting to become the default choice. 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

1 hour ago, N6 Limited said:

Ever since I started using the LIRR to avoid the QBL ride of horrors after 10PM and weekends, I've been getting accustomed to using it to the point that i't's starting to become the default choice. 

Yep. You're getting older and becoming tired of the day-to-day BS that the subway entails. Welcome to my world.  After a long day in the office, I just want to get home without the panhandlers, crowds and everything else.

[bobtehpanda]

3 hours ago, N6 Limited said:

Ever since I started using the LIRR to avoid the QBL ride of horrors after 10PM and weekends, I've been getting accustomed to using it to the point that i't's starting to become the default choice. 

For all of its faults, the LIRR never really had an extended period of deferred maintenance, so the LIRR doesn't have massive service changes the way that the subway does.

That being said, the LIRR is still a pretty terrible railroad, and it generally isn't available between 1-5.

[N6 Limited]

4 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Yep. You're getting older and becoming tired of the day-to-day BS that the subway entails. Welcome to my world.  After a long day in the office, I just want to get home without the panhandlers, crowds and everything else.

Yeah, I still use the subway in Manhattan  but the delays during trackwork hours are just so frustrating , I'd rather keep my sanity and just use the railroad.

2 hours ago, bobtehpanda said:

For all of its faults, the LIRR never really had an extended period of deferred maintenance, so the LIRR doesn't have massive service changes the way that the subway does.

That being said, the LIRR is still a pretty terrible railroad, and it generally isn't available between 1-5.

I've experienced short delays on the LIRR of a couple mins or so, but not to the extent that I've experienced on the subway. The thing is once you've used it a few times you know your train times. The service gap between 1 and 5 depends on the line.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

6 hours ago, N6 Limited said:

Yeah, I still use the subway in Manhattan  but the delays during trackwork hours are just so frustrating , I'd rather keep my sanity and just use the railroad.

I've experienced short delays on the LIRR of a couple mins or so, but not to the extent that I've experienced on the subway. The thing is once you've used it a few times you know your train times. The service gap between 1 and 5 depends on the line.

Yes that definitely helps as it cuts down on waiting and lowers your commuting time. That's something I used to not think about that I definitely factor in now. Reaching some subway stations for me is at least a ten minute walk, then there's the dodging of a thousand people just to get to the platform. You eliminate all of that if you can board where there are exits with less pedestrian traffic. With the train time apps, you can even check beforehand so that you board a few minutes before the train is due to leave. It's really beautiful. 

[N6 Limited]

7 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Yes that definitely helps as it cuts down on waiting and lowers your commuting time. That's something I used to not think about that I definitely factor in now. Reaching some subway stations for me is at least a ten minute walk, then there's the dodging of a thousand people just to get to the platform. You eliminate all of that if you can board where there are exits with less pedestrian traffic. With the train time apps, you can even check beforehand so that you board a few minutes before the train is due to leave. It's really beautiful. 

The train time app is really helpful, one day the train was running a few mins late, so I was able to catch a train I otherwise would have thought I missed and not attempted to catch.

[bobtehpanda]

20 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Yes that definitely helps as it cuts down on waiting and lowers your commuting time. That's something I used to not think about that I definitely factor in now. Reaching some subway stations for me is at least a ten minute walk, then there's the dodging of a thousand people just to get to the platform. You eliminate all of that if you can board where there are exits with less pedestrian traffic. With the train time apps, you can even check beforehand so that you board a few minutes before the train is due to leave. It's really beautiful. 

To be fair, the scramble for the trains at Penn is also atrocious. They don't announce the platform until five minutes before, get shocked when people can't get to the platform on time on account of the tiny stairwells, and the train ends up leaving 15 minutes late.

I can understand not announcing track numbers during rush hours when all the platforms could theoretically be in use by any train, but at 11PM there is no fight for tracks.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

5 hours ago, bobtehpanda said:

To be fair, the scramble for the trains at Penn is also atrocious. They don't announce the platform until five minutes before, get shocked when people can't get to the platform on time on account of the tiny stairwells, and the train ends up leaving 15 minutes late.

I can understand not announcing track numbers during rush hours when all the platforms could theoretically be in use by any train, but at 11PM there is no fight for tracks.

Well at Grand Central, the track assignments are generally up well in advance, though there are instances where there are last minute track changes or assignments, but those are usually during rush hour. I haven't had too many issues with LIRR.

[Trainmaster5]

23 hours ago, bobtehpanda said:

To be fair, the scramble for the trains at Penn is also atrocious. They don't announce the platform until five minutes before, get shocked when people can't get to the platform on time on account of the tiny stairwells, and the train ends up leaving 15 minutes late.

I can understand not announcing track numbers during rush hours when all the platforms could theoretically be in use by any train, but at 11PM there is no fight for tracks.

I’m not a regular Peak train rider of the LIRR but I’ve noticed that the Ronkonkoma, Babylon local and express trains  generally leave from the same tracks off Peak hours. Correct me if I’m mistaken. I was told by an employee that the tracks are posted 10 minutes in advance generally but track changes occur when trains come from West Side Yard if the scheduled crew is unavailable. I’ve seen pandemonium at 10 pm when a track is posted, especially after an event upstairs at MSG. Reminds me of the running of the bulls. Carry on.

[bobtehpanda]

39 minutes ago, Trainmaster5 said:

I’m not a regular Peak train rider of the LIRR but I’ve noticed that the Ronkonkoma, Babylon local and express trains  generally leave from the same tracks off Peak hours. Correct me if I’m mistaken. I was told by an employee that the tracks are posted 10 minutes in advance generally but track changes occur when trains come from West Side Yard if the scheduled crew is unavailable. I’ve seen pandemonium at 10 pm when a track is posted, especially after an event upstairs at MSG. Reminds me of the running of the bulls. Carry on.

10 minutes, particularly for the last train on some of the less busy branches (and by less busy I mean just with less scheduled trains; the Port Jefferson line in particular would probably be pretty popular if they ran a decent amount of service on it) is really not enough for everyone to get to the platform. Plus, with all the track work that Amtrak had to do, it's been less predictable.

It would be one thing if we were talking about GCT with its wide access ways, but Penn has crappy three-foot-wide stairways. Some of the platforms have narrower stairways than subway platforms.

[RailRunRob]

On 10/9/2017 at 8:14 AM, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Well at Grand Central, the track assignments are generally up well in advance, though there are instances where there are last minute track changes or assignments, but those are usually during rush hour. I haven't had too many issues with LIRR.

Grand Central dynamics wise is terminal station wouldn't it be easier to know where your assets are im taking a guess here but are trains are fixed? On the tracks, they come into beside maybe rush with stock in storage needing to flow in? GC also has more than double the tracks. Penn really is a pass thru Station wouldn't that affect operations abit? Flexibility, predictability to assign accurately Further ahead? Just wondering.

Edited October 10, 2017 by RailRunRob

[Via Garibaldi 8]

9 minutes ago, RailRunRob said:

Grand Central dynamics wise is terminal station wouldn't it be easier to know where your assets are im taking a guess here but are trains are fixed? On the tracks, they come into beside maybe rush with stock in storage needing to flow in? GC also has more than double the tracks. Penn really is a pass thru Station wouldn't that affect operations abit? Flexibility, predictability to assign accurately Further ahead? Just wondering.

How is Penn Station a pass through station?  Trains terminate at both Grand Central and Penn. As far as logistics go, Penn needs to be rehabbed, plain and simple, and quite frankly Grand Central could use some upgrades too.  The platforms are rather depressing and some are down right filthy since they are NEVER power washed.  Inexcusable to charge the fares that MNRR does with such a lack of cleanliness.  It isn't from passengers for the most part either.  They just never clean the platforms. Some times I get off of the train and we have to dodge leaks.  They have buckets for the water on the platforms and leading to them as well, so while Penn Station is a disaster, if monies aren't spent updating Grand Central, it too will turn into a mess.  

I also would like to see more done to keep out the homeless.  Most of them clearly have mental problems and are a menace to the public and themselves.  They go around digging and eating out of the garbage cans.  I can't even imagine what they carry.  They have those people that go around every so many weeks to try to assist them and get them shelter, but they don't go out enough.

Edited October 10, 2017 by Via Garibaldi 8

[RailRunRob]

9 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

How is Penn Station a pass through station?  Trains terminate at both Grand Central and Penn. As far as logistics go, Penn needs to be rehabbed, plain and simple, and quite frankly Grand Central could use some upgrades too.  The platforms are rather depressing and some are down right filthy since they are NEVER power washed.  Inexcusable to charge the fares that MNRR does with such a lack of cleanliness.  It isn't from passengers for the most part either.  They just never clean the platforms. Some times I get off of the train and we have to dodge leaks.  They have buckets for the water on the platforms and leading to them as well, so while Penn Station is a disaster, if monies aren't spent updating Grand Central, it too will turn into a mess.  

I also would like to see more done to keep out the homeless.  Most of them clearly have mental problems and are a menace to the public and themselves.  They go around digging and eating out of the garbage cans.  I can't even imagine what they carry.  They have those people that go around every so many weeks to try to assist them and get them shelter, but they don't go out enough.

How is Penn not a Pass thru station?  I'm talking Infrastructure not operations. What am I missing? What do you see when you look at these layouts?

[Via Garibaldi 8]

3 minutes ago, RailRunRob said:

How is Penn not a Pass thru station?  I'm talking Infrastructure not operations. What am I missing? What do you see when you look at these layouts?

Even so what's your point exactly?  I mean sure trains could terminate in New Jersey, but why are you bringing this up?

[RailRunRob]

7 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Even so what's your point exactly?  I mean sure trains could terminate in New Jersey, but why are you bringing this up?

I'm saying that in a full terminal station it's easier to route and know where assets (Trains) are and where they're going to be. Better Communication more information for riders further out. To the Point that trains in Penn receive tracks just 10 mins before. Pass Thru station is harder to predict just the way the Pennsylvania railroad built that station it that's inherently going to be a problem and limitation.  It was in intended as a Pass-thru It's just the current operations that made it a terminal. 

Edited October 10, 2017 by RailRunRob

[paulrivera]

Did they discontinue thru service on the New Haven Line to Secaucus for football games at the Meadowlands? There's no schedule online, while AFAIK neither MN or NJT have outright said they weren't going to offer the service anymore.

[N6 Limited]

4 hours ago, RailRunRob said:

Grand Central dynamics wise is terminal station wouldn't it be easier to know where your assets are im taking a guess here but are trains are fixed? On the tracks, they come into beside maybe rush with stock in storage needing to flow in? GC also has more than double the tracks. Penn really is a pass thru Station wouldn't that affect operations abit? Flexibility, predictability to assign accurately Further ahead? Just wondering.

Would it make sense for the LIRR and NJT to run Joint train service between say Secaucus and Jamaica? This way the LIRR can save on running time by just making connections in Jamaica and NJT in Secaucus (I guess they'd need a diesel to do that?)

Which brings up the question (which I'm sure has come up before) Why doesn't the LIRR switch to catenary? Cost?

[MNR Beacon Line]

2 minutes ago, N6 Limited said:

Which brings up the question (which I'm sure has come up before) Why doesn't the LIRR switch to catenary? Cost?

Cost. One million times cost.

 

It would be an absolutely non-trivial thing to convert the power infrastructure—it would basically have to be a complete teardown and rebuilt.

[Trainmaster5]

8 hours ago, RailRunRob said:

I'm saying that in a full terminal station it's easier to route and know where assets (Trains) are and where they're going to be. Better Communication more information for riders further out. To the Point that trains in Penn receive tracks just 10 mins before. Pass Thru station is harder to predict just the way the Pennsylvania railroad built that station it that's inherently going to be a problem and limitation.  It was in intended as a Pass-thru It's just the current operations that made it a terminal. 

You've hit the nail on the head. The very names tell the story. Pennsylvania Station and Grand Central Terminal. New York Penn, like Newark Penn, were not terminals on the Pennsylvania Railroad. Many Amtrak trains do originate or end at NY Penn but Boston and Union Station in DC are probably considered the terminals on the Northeast Corridor. It's an Amtrak station that has LIRR and NJT trains terminating there. Trenton, NJ and 30th St(?) Philadelphia have commuter lines terminating at those locations but they are Amtrak pass through locations. Grand Central Terminal doesn't have the same function. Hope this adds to your clarification. I knew what you were getting at immediately. Carry on.

[Truckie]

22 hours ago, paulrivera said:

Did they discontinue thru service on the New Haven Line to Secaucus for football games at the Meadowlands? There's no schedule online, while AFAIK neither MN or NJT have outright said they weren't going to offer the service anymore.

Yes, direct service was quietly discontinued.

[RailRunRob]

17 hours ago, Trainmaster5 said:

You've hit the nail on the head. The very names tell the story. Pennsylvania Station and Grand Central Terminal. New York Penn, like Newark Penn, were not terminals on the Pennsylvania Railroad. Many Amtrak trains do originate or end at NY Penn but Boston and Union Station in DC are probably considered the terminals on the Northeast Corridor. It's an Amtrak station that has LIRR and NJT trains terminating there. Trenton, NJ and 30th St(?) Philadelphia have commuter lines terminating at those locations but they are Amtrak pass through locations. Grand Central Terminal doesn't have the same function. Hope this adds to your clarification. I knew what you were getting at immediately. Carry on.

Thanks for the verification at least I know I'm not crazy haha your input is always valued on this end. I don't always know the in's and outs of the operations and scheduling but I do understand Infrastructures and dynamics I have some training there. It's pretty obvious looking at layouts the limitations and task Involved probably a difficult one for Guys/Gals that have to route tracks at Penn it's a very active dynamic layout have to be on your toes 30th Street seems like another tuffie to your point.

Edited October 11, 2017 by RailRunRob

[RailRunRob]

18 hours ago, N6 Limited said:

Would it make sense for the LIRR and NJT to run Joint train service between say Secaucus and Jamaica? This way the LIRR can save on running time by just making connections in Jamaica and NJT in Secaucus (I guess they'd need a diesel to do that?)

Which brings up the question (which I'm sure has come up before) Why doesn't the LIRR switch to catenary? Cost?

1

I think so as well..  Logically it makes sense I just don't have the Math to Verify (TPH ect).  I've gotten pushback on the idea mostly on Premise of the East River tubes being at capacity. But in my mind if you added to more two more tubes on the Hudson side. And locked 2 tracks for each direction I don't see the issue.  Take a few tracks out at Penn and widen the platforms that should cut on dwele times.  Where the trains go? Some to Sunnyside , Jamaica, Huntspoint? Secaucus, Newark Penn? Seems workable again i'd have to understand headways And scheduling I can probably run a simulation from that. 

 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

1 hour ago, Truckie said:

Yes, direct service was quietly discontinued.

I'm guessing due to a lack of ridership?

[RailRunRob]

14 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

I'm guessing due to a lack of ridership?

I've seen a few trains over the years they seemed Moderately full.. maybe 60-75% full. Maybe it was an operation thing? Crew Scheduling?