CenSin Posted February 15, 2012 Author Share #226 Posted February 15, 2012 I agree with your post. Express trains should stay on the express tracks and and local trains should stay on the local tracks. It keeps the trains moving with minimal delays and allows more trains per hour to be run on the tracks. That's why I've suggested and agreed with others who have suggested sending the to 2nd Avenue with the rather than keeping it at Astoria and having it switch from the local to the express tracks between 42nd and 34th as it used to before the June 2010 service cuts (and as the currently does). Because the will require a higher frequency after extending to the Upper East Side, it's pretty much written in stone that it will be the Broadway express. However, will Astoria residents let their express service go to another neighborhood? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T to Dyre Avenue Posted February 15, 2012 Share #227 Posted February 15, 2012 Express service only benefits those headed to 14th, Canal or Brooklyn. If you're headed to Midtown, you only have local service because the doesn't start running express until after 34th. The pre-July 2010 and 2001-2004 operated the same way. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CenSin Posted February 15, 2012 Author Share #228 Posted February 15, 2012 Express service only benefits those headed to 14th, Canal or Brooklyn. If you're headed to Midtown, you only have local service because the doesn't start running express until after 34th. Not after 2 Avenue opens up for service… The doesn't really have an option to run local lest the MTA decides it's worth it to tie up other services with double-switching. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
West End Posted February 15, 2012 Share #229 Posted February 15, 2012 I agree with your post. Express trains should stay on the express tracks and and local trains should stay on the local tracks. It keeps the trains moving with minimal delays and allows more trains per hour to be run on the tracks. That's why I've suggested and agreed with others who have suggested sending the to 2nd Avenue with the rather than keeping it at Astoria and having it switch from the local to the express tracks between 42nd and 34th as it used to before the June 2010 service cuts (and as the currently does). I'm not a fan of bottlenecks either, but I do think track switching is necessary on the Broadway Line. Two lines will need to serve Astoria on weekdays based on its sheer volume of commuters. Having them both run local to the Manhattan Bridge would create a bigger bottleneck than there is now, and having them both go via Whitehall Street is out of the question. I understand that service may need to be supplemented, but not enough to send another line there. The can have shorter headways and wait at Times Square, 57th/7th or Lexington/63rd if congestion on the express track gets too bad (sort of what Middle Village-bound trains do at Essex Street in the morning rush since the budget cuts). Outside of the terminating at East Side - 96th Street, I say that the Broadway Line should return to its pre-2010 glory days. Maybe it's just me. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeystoneRegional Posted February 16, 2012 Share #230 Posted February 16, 2012 Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallyhorse Posted February 16, 2012 Share #231 Posted February 16, 2012 Because the will require a higher frequency after extending to the Upper East Side, it's pretty much written in stone that it will be the Broadway express. However, will Astoria residents let their express service go to another neighborhood? That may or may not be the case, depending on what happens with a possible Queens Boulevard-LIRR Rockaway branch connection discussed in other threads. If that connection IS NOT built, I suspect we will be then see increased service to Astoria since that appears to be the only line at that point that can serve Astoria. If that connection IS built, then I suspect we see the following wholesale changes: A revived as previously noted in other threads would be the line to me most likely to serve that (Whitehall-Rockaway Park), replacing the along QB to 63rd Drive (and the returning to run to 71st-Continental all times and possibly along with the to 179th rush hours with the a full-length QB Express rush hours). The and switch Brooklyn terminals and the becomes a full-time 4th Avenue local so the can have Coney Island for a yard (with the and both 24/7 locals along 4th Avenue). The goes back to Astoria 24/7 and the remains going to Astoria from 5:30 AM-10:00 PM Monday-Friday and other times supplements the to 96th-2nd and later 125th-Lexington as a 24/7 express in Manhattan and Brooklyn (since the and in this scenario would both be 24/7 locals on Broadway and the and would both be 24/7 locals on 4th Avenue in Brooklyn). What happens once the SAS opens may come down to whether or not they actually do build the connection from the Queens Boulevard to the Rockaway branch. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CenSin Posted February 16, 2012 Author Share #232 Posted February 16, 2012 That may or may not be the case, depending on what happens with a possible Queens Boulevard-LIRR Rockaway branch connection discussed in other threads. Sure… but the scales seem to be heavily weighted on one side. Genting won't even pay for street improvements and you expect an entire line rehabilitated and new service added? If that connection IS NOT built, I suspect we will be then see increased service to Astoria since that appears to be the only line at that point that can serve Astoria. And what makes you so sure that's how it will go? There are at least a dozen posts on how the MTA could possibly schedule service (all in this thread too). You might want to enlighten yourself. If that connection IS built, then I suspect we see the following wholesale changes: A revived as previously noted in other threads would be the line to me most likely to serve that (Whitehall-Rockaway Park), replacing the along QB to 63rd Drive Fair enough: I explained why before. (and the returning to run to 71st-Continental all times Not likely… and possibly along with the to 179th rush hours with the a full-length QB Express rush hours). Time for someone to pull their foam extinguisher out… The and switch Brooklyn terminals and the becomes a full-time 4th Avenue local so the can have Coney Island for a yard (with the and both 24/7 locals along 4th Avenue). The will still be able to access the yard via the Sea Beach express track. It's not something I think the MTA would use as a reason to screw with service. And also, as much as I'd love to see the get shoved off the (N)'s express tracks, it's just preposterous that you think the MTA could make the local and even run to Bay Ridge! What happens once the SAS opens may come down to whether or not they actually do build the connection from the Queens Boulevard to the Rockaway branch. Whether the MTA might do what you suggested may come down to whether you can become the MTA's chairman/CEO. Because if there were ears listening for ideas, they would've stopped listening right at this: (and the returning to run to 71st-Continental all times and possibly along with the to 179th rush hours with the a full-length QB Express rush hours). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IRT Bronx Express Posted February 16, 2012 Share #233 Posted February 16, 2012 ...and possibly along with the to 179th rush hours with the a full-length QB Express rush hours).Not gonna happen. The reason why the via Hillside Local worked in the past was because:1. the went (and still does today) express west of Forest Hills. 2. the went express between Forest Hills and Jamaica, yet still operated express west of Forest Hills. Send the via Hillside local, and expect empty trains. They want express service, hence why the extension to Jamaica failed years ago after the was shifted to Jamaica Center. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallyhorse Posted February 16, 2012 Share #234 Posted February 16, 2012 Yes, I admit it is heavily tilted towards whether or not they build that Rockaway connection, but it also shows how ONE change like that could potentially lead to a whole bunch of other changes, foam or not. And yes, yard issues with an to Astoria (brought up repeatedly on another board) are why I would in the latter scenario have the and swap routes in Brooklyn with both local on 4th Avenue if that part of it were to happen. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CenSin Posted February 16, 2012 Author Share #235 Posted February 16, 2012 Yes, I admit it is heavily tilted towards whether or not they build that Rockaway connection, but it also shows how ONE change like that could potentially lead to a whole bunch of other changes, foam or not. Really? Show us the cause and effect relationship. I call it foam because there's no obvious connection, rhyme, or reason. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadcruiser1 Posted February 16, 2012 Share #236 Posted February 16, 2012 Yes, I admit it is heavily tilted towards whether or not they build that Rockaway connection, but it also shows how ONE change like that could potentially lead to a whole bunch of other changes, foam or not. And yes, yard issues with an to Astoria (brought up repeatedly on another board) are why I would in the latter scenario have the and swap routes in Brooklyn with both local on 4th Avenue if that part of it were to happen. You are as dumb as ever. The has access to the Jamaica Yard. It is one of the best yards in Queens. Why would the need access to the Coney Island Yard when it has access to the Jamaica Yard? Not just that why the hell would the even go to the Rockaway Beach Branch. We have been through this before. Did you forget to take you Ritalin you dumb***? I told you the would serve the Astoria Line along with the that is it. Nothing else. The best idea is to take the , and move it to a super express track, have the run express and have the run on the Rockaway Beach Branch. This is the easiest option and has been proposed since the 1930's. This is the configuration that would work. Not your fantasy line to nowhereville. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
overclocked Posted February 16, 2012 Share #237 Posted February 16, 2012 Take it easy, nerve cells do no regenerate. BTW the last posts have absolutely nothing to do with SAS...:eek: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CenSin Posted February 16, 2012 Author Share #238 Posted February 16, 2012 You are as dumb as ever. This is the easiest option and has been proposed since the 1930's. This is the configuration that would work. Not your fantasy line to nowhereville. Just a reminder: not all of the MTA's ideas were that bright either. Just because an idea has been proposed before, doesn't make it work today—especially an idea that's prehistoric. I, for one, don't think the to the Rockaways is a good idea. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Line1291 Posted February 16, 2012 Share #239 Posted February 16, 2012 Let's stay on topic! The Rockaway Branch and has nothing to do w/ whats going on on 2nd Ave. The only reason why I mention Astoria and the Broadway line is the for SAS phase 2 should go to 125th St and it'll take way Astoria's local and express service. You are as dumb as ever. The has access to the Jamaica Yard. It is one of the best yards in Queens. Why would the need access to the Coney Island Yard when it has access to the Jamaica Yard? Not just that why the hell would the even go to the Rockaway Beach Branch. We have been through this before. Did you forget to take you Ritalin you dumb***? I told you the would serve the Astoria Line along with the that is it. Nothing else. The best idea is to take the , and move it to a super express track, have the run express and have the run on the Rockaway Beach Branch. This is the easiest option and has been proposed since the 1930's. This is the configuration that would work. Not your fantasy line to nowhereville.SMH.. Your remarks and comments is only hurting your self-image and not Wallyhorse. Don't forget... You used to purpose the same crazy interesting ideas on your first go round B) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadcruiser1 Posted February 16, 2012 Share #240 Posted February 16, 2012 Your remarks and comments is only hurting your self-image and not Wallyhorse. Don't forget... You used to purpose the same crazy interesting ideas on your first go round B) He is not new here. He has been saying the same things over and over again for a year and a half now. He should have had grown up and act like a grown up and think like a man, but nope... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T to Dyre Avenue Posted February 16, 2012 Share #241 Posted February 16, 2012 @ CenSin - Right. I meant Astoria riders. Any Midtown-bound riders to/from Astoria are the ones who have local service only because the and are both on the local tracks until the switches to the express. Of course 2nd Ave riders will have a full Broadway Express from 57th to Canal once the 2nd Ave stations open. At that time, if the stays at Astoria and the is revived and joins it there, Astoria line riders are likely to still have both of their lines running local until 34th St. I guess it's really not that huge of a deal since there's only one local stop above 34th. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Line1291 Posted February 16, 2012 Share #242 Posted February 16, 2012 Wouldn't the criss-crossing local express tracks at 34th delay service? What amazes me is it's like that cause of Astora's demands! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallyhorse Posted February 16, 2012 Share #243 Posted February 16, 2012 Remember, in this version, I have the going to Astoria, NOT 71-Continental if they did build the LIRR-Rockaway connection as I see a new train replacing the on QB and being a new Rockaway line using the connection if that did in fact get built. That's where the yard issues (repeatedly pointed out on another board) come into play if the reverted back to its old 95th Street-Astoria 70(RR) days. That's why I have the Brooklyn branch swap if that were to happen to alleviate that problem. And if you read my entire original post on this, it IS SAS related because this would be when the also would be going to 96th/2nd. At that point, as part of it, the would continue to go to Astoria, but with the the 24/7 Astoria Line and the N being a 16.5/5 (5:30 AM-10:00 PM Monday-Friday) line to Astoria. The rest of the time, the would go with the on the SAS to 96th/2nd to bolster SAS service as I would do it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadcruiser1 Posted February 16, 2012 Share #244 Posted February 16, 2012 Remember, in this version, I have the going to Astoria, NOT 71-Continental if they did build the LIRR-Rockaway connection as I see a new train replacing the on QB and being a new Rockaway line using the connection if that did in fact get built. That's where the yard issues (repeatedly pointed out on another board) come into play if the reverted back to its old 95th Street-Astoria 70(RR) days. That's why I have the Brooklyn branch swap if that were to happen to alleviate that problem. And if you read my entire original post on this, it IS SAS related because this would be when the also would be going to 96th/2nd. At that point, as part of it, the would continue to go to Astoria, but with the the 24/7 Astoria Line and the N being a 16.5/5 (5:30 AM-10:00 PM Monday-Friday) line to Astoria. The rest of the time, the would go with the on the SAS to 96th/2nd to bolster SAS service as I would do it. NO. The reason is the was switched to the Queens Boulevard Line in the early times to give it access to the Jamaica Yard so no. Again if Manhattan access is needed the can run express on the Queens Boulevard Line instead and the can be extended down the Rockaway Beach Branch. This would also be a Manhattan service which Censin wanted earlier. The problem would be solved and the complications removed. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CenSin Posted February 16, 2012 Author Share #245 Posted February 16, 2012 NO. The reason is the was switched to the Queens Boulevard Line in the early times to give it access to the Jamaica Yard so no. Again if Manhattan access is needed the can run express on the Queens Boulevard Line instead and the can be extended down the Rockaway Beach Branch. This would also be a Manhattan service which Censin wanted earlier. The problem would be solved and the complications removed. The should not be extended as an express at all. It simply wasn't designed to connect that way. You'd introduce the same problem (if not a worse problem) as the Rogers' Junction on Eastern Parkway. The or (whatever Broadway line goes there) would be fine. The Broadway local serves the line 7 days a week anyway and has excellent transfer options. Anyhow, the topic's been discussed to death; refer to the previous posts so we don't rehash the same points again and again. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grand Concourse Posted February 17, 2012 Share #246 Posted February 17, 2012 Wouldn't the criss-crossing local express tracks at 34th delay service? What amazes me is it's like that cause of Astora's demands! At least around 34th, the switch is level. The one at Prince st requires the to cross slowly on it to go to Canal and over the bridge. Imo, the should've stayed as an express if it has to go over the bridge. 34th st's switch is better. Assuming the returns, I don't see why things can't go back the way it was: express, local. The only difference b/w the pre 2010 cuts and the future is the is going a few stops north on the UES. I don't see how it can be so complicated as some have been making it seem. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallyhorse Posted February 17, 2012 Share #247 Posted February 17, 2012 At least around 34th, the switch is level. The one at Prince st requires the to cross slowly on it to go to Canal and over the bridge. Imo, the should've stayed as an express if it has to go over the bridge. 34th st's switch is better. Assuming the returns, I don't see why things can't go back the way it was: express, local. The only difference b/w the pre 2010 cuts and the future is the is going a few stops north on the UES. I don't see how it can be so complicated as some have been making it seem. That is actually how I would do it IF things otherwise stayed status quo AND the 2010 cuts were restored (except for the current remaining as it currently is), or just simply add more service to make up for the being moved to the SAS at that point. The other stuff ONLY is in play if the Rockaway connection to Queens Boulevard is built, which would likely see a ripple effect of changes as a result of adding a line there. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1447 Posted February 17, 2012 Share #248 Posted February 17, 2012 The other stuff ONLY is in play if the Rockaway connection to Queens Boulevard is built, which would likely see a ripple effect of changes as a result of adding a line there.[/color][/size][/font] This will never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, NEVERRRRRRRRRRRRR happen. So why keep bringing this up? Do you have some "pleasurable" dreams of this at night? Keep dreaming.. More clean up to do! This is why you get hit with criticisms all the time, smh! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallyhorse Posted February 17, 2012 Share #249 Posted February 17, 2012 This will never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, NEVERRRRRRRRRRRRR happen. So why keep bringing this up? Do you have some "pleasurable" dreams of this at night? Keep dreaming.. More clean up to do! This is why you get hit with criticisms all the time, smh! Before the Convention Center was in play, I would have agreed, but things have changed, especially if Gov. Cuomo wants such a connection and he were to convince Genting to pay for it, which I do see as an alternative to what Genting really seems to want as I understand it, but has no chance in getting and that being essentially a revival on the because that would severely disrupt the Fulton Street branch in Brooklyn too much. That's why I listed BOTH scenarios. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1447 Posted February 17, 2012 Share #250 Posted February 17, 2012 Before the Convention Center was in play, I would have agreed, but things have changed, especially if Gov. Cuomo wants such a connection and he were to convince Genting to pay for it, which I do see as an alternative to what Genting really seems to want as I understand it, but has no chance in getting and that being essentially a revival on the because that would severely disrupt the Fulton Street branch in Brooklyn too much. That's why I listed BOTH scenarios. There is plans to convert the line into a park, just like the High Line, NOT a rail. Maybe a LRT would be nice, but even that I wouldn't see. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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