Brooklyn Division Bus Proposals/Ideas

[NX Express]

The ( is only two blocks from Bay Academy, according to Google Maps...

 

There are also the B36 school trips.

[checkmatechamp13]

There most certainly is. The point is the B4 needs to be brought back. Without it the businesses along Emmons Ave will continue to suffer.

 

But why do you keep bringing it up? Nobody's denying that the B4 needs to go back to Emmons Avenue.

 

....which is where the demand is anyway (bensonhurst, included).

 

Had the route continued to serve sheepshead all times, I don't think you would have heard a peep out of brighton riders about some neptune avenue service.... I remember you sayin you used to live out there, so you know how minimal the demand for bus service was.... at the time I attended Grady, going & coming, I would notice the nuances of the B4 along neptune.... Never understood why the route was hardly utilized, until I came to some realizations.... It was all about the brighton (line), the WB B1 (heading towards CI hosp, etc), and the NB B68 (heading towards kings hwy, etc.)..... The B4 was an afterthought; large in part b/c the service was shit (for lack of a better term).....

 

I have to concur with you.... with the route having the service that it did, there was no reason to have continued service along neptune... It's a similar situation w/ the B7 up here - some routes simply don't serve people's needs - this is part of what's wrong w/ the network now; antiquated routings & the refusal of "modernizing" our routes....

 

That sounds like a pretty accurate description of B4 ridership patterns. Obviously, I didn't have much of a choice in trips (because I was a small child and had to go wherever my parents took me), but we very rarely used the B4. We used the B1, B49, and B68, and even the B36 (even though we didn't live too close to it, but for instance sometimes we would go to the amusement parks in CI and then take the B36 to SHB or something, and then walk or take the home) far more often. And yeah, all of those routes (except maybe the B36, but just because of its bunching) were much more frequent than the B4.

 

My grandparents used to live in a different portion of Brighton Beach (I lived a few blocks east of the train, whereas they lived west of CI Avenue and north of BB Avenue, but then they moved into the same building my immediate family lived in), but even then, they would talk about using the B1, B36, or B68, but would never talk about the B4, even though they were closer to Neptune Avenue than Avenue Z.

 

The school is Bay Academy. Without the B4, they're only left with the B49, which would probably be packed with Kingsborough students by the time the bus gets to Bay Academy.

 

But if they had to, they could take the B4 to Ocean Avenue and then backtrack.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

....which is where the demand is anyway (bensonhurst, included).

 

Having the route go down that stretch of Neptune that it did, hardly did anyone justice..... b/w CI Hospital & shore blvd, sure you'd see ppl waiting for the sheepshead bound B4 - but these folks would be those coming off 68's.... Not having the route serve neptune anymore wasn't the problem, as much as it was the fact that it no longer served sheepshead bay (all times)..... Most the B4 usage b/w CI hosp. & shore blvd were of students - not grady or lincoln kids, but by that school over there across the street from the BM3 terminal, which is more sheepshead bay than it is brighton......

 

Had the route continued to serve sheepshead all times, I don't think you would have heard a peep out of brighton riders about some neptune avenue service.... I remember you sayin you used to live out there, so you know how minimal the demand for bus service was.... at the time I attended Grady, going & coming, I would notice the nuances of the B4 along neptune.... Never understood why the route was hardly utilized, until I came to some realizations.... It was all about the brighton (line), the WB B1 (heading towards CI hosp, etc), and the NB B68 (heading towards kings hwy, etc.)..... The B4 was an afterthought; large in part b/c the service was shit (for lack of a better term).....

 

I have to concur with you.... with the route having the service that it did, there was no reason to have continued service along neptune... It's a similar situation w/ the B7 up here - some routes simply don't serve people's needs - this is part of what's wrong w/ the network now; antiquated routings & the refusal of "modernizing" our routes....

 

 

You hit the nail on the head right there... The B4 was an afterthought because it ran like shit, not because it wasn't useful along Neptune Avenue. I can remember waiting for the B4 at Emmons and Shore Blvd after school and waiting 40 minutes for a bus when almost 3 buses were scheduled. If folks had a reliable bus, there would've been more ridership in that portion of Sheepshead Bay, just like there would be more ridership on the B4 going to Sheepshead Bay train station.

 

But why do you keep bringing it up? Nobody's denying that the B4 needs to go back to Emmons Avenue.

 

Are you blind or what? The point is it needs to go back NOW, and in addition to that, the route needs to go back ON Neptune. You have no idea how bad businesses are doing along Emmons Avenue and the toll that is having on the community as a whole. I'm sorry but I've used that line for years from end to end, and the ridership would be there if the line didn't run so poorly for so many years. Folks were forced to other routes that were more frequent and reliable unlike the B4, hence why the B4 was an afterthought. Even I would avoid the B4 at times when in a hurry and instead take the B36 because it was more reliable. Hell anything was better than the B4. The point is the caused this, NOT the riders. They clearly wanted to cut the entire segment of the B4 and they did by destroying ridership for years (a good 20+ years) with crap service all through the 90s and up through the 2000s. :tdown::tdown:

[checkmatechamp13]

1) You hit the nail on the head right there... The B4 was an afterthought because it ran like shit, not because it wasn't useful along Neptune Avenue. I can remember waiting for the B4 at Emmons and Shore Blvd after school and waiting 40 minutes for a bus when almost 3 buses were scheduled. If folks had a reliable bus, there would've been more ridership in that portion of Sheepshead Bay, just like there would be more ridership on the B4 going to Sheepshead Bay train station.

 

2) Are you blind or what? The point is it needs to go back NOW, and in addition to that, the route needs to go back ON Neptune. You have no idea how bad businesses are doing along Emmons Avenue and the toll that is having on the community as a whole. I'm sorry but I've used that line for years from end to end, and the ridership would be there if the line didn't run so poorly for so many years. Folks were forced to other routes that were more frequent and reliable unlike the B4, hence why the B4 was an afterthought. Even I would avoid the B4 at times when in a hurry and instead take the B36 because it was more reliable. Hell anything was better than the B4. The point is the caused this, NOT the riders. They clearly wanted to cut the entire segment of the B4 and they did by destroying ridership for years (a good 20+ years) with crap service all through the 90s and up through the 2000s. :tdown::tdown:

 

1) And how do you know that? Even if the B4 ran more reliably, the B1 is still more frequent and goes to more popular destinations, so people would still take it over the B4.

 

My grandmother lived in that part of Brighton Beach from the early 1970s until the 1990s, and then moved to a different part of Brighton Beach, and she never talked about using the B4. Did she probably use it occasionally? Yes, but if a person has lived in a neighborhood for over 30 years and hasn't talked about using a certain bus route too often (she's used the B1/36/49/68 plenty of times), that gives you an idea of where the demand is at.

 

2) So complaining isn't going to do anything. You've already did all you could do by writing to whatever politician represents that area and writing to the MTA. That's it. Now all you can do is wait. There's no point in wasting your time over and over talking about how businesses closed on Emmons Avenue.

 

And you keep ignoring the fact that even if ridership decreased, it was still solid. It was something like 2,000 riders per day, which is nothing to sneeze at for a relatively short portion.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

1) And how do you know that? Even if the B4 ran more reliably, the B1 is still more frequent and goes to more popular destinations, so people would still take it over the B4.

 

Simple. Because from my observations the B4 was gaining ridership along Emmons Avenue. You have a revitalization going on down there with new shops and such opening up. Since the B4 has been cut, Emmons Ave is not nearly as lively as it used to be.

 

2) So complaining isn't going to do anything. You've already did all you could do by writing to whatever politician represents that area and writing to the MTA. That's it. Now all you can do is wait. There's no point in wasting your time over and over talking about how businesses closed on Emmons Avenue.

 

You're right. Where in the hell are the residents at?? :mad:

 

And you keep ignoring the fact that even if ridership decreased, it was still solid. It was something like 2,000 riders per day, which is nothing to sneeze at for a relatively short portion.

 

I'm not ignorning anything. I know the ridership was solid despite the crappy service. That's what annoys me even more.

[checkmatechamp13]

1) Simple. Because from my observations the B4 was gaining ridership along Emmons Avenue. You have a revitalization going on down there with new shops and such opening up. Since the B4 has been cut, Emmons Ave is not nearly as lively as it used to be.

 

2) You're right. Where in the hell are the residents at?? :mad:

 

3) I'm not ignorning anything. I know the ridership was solid despite the crappy service. That's what annoys me even more.

 

1) So what does this have to do with Neptune Avenue? The B4 can still go down Emmons Avenue without going down Neptune Avenue.

 

2) You tell me.

 

3) Again, preaching to the choir.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

1) So what does this have to do with Neptune Avenue? The B4 can still go down Emmons Avenue without going down Neptune Avenue.

 

What you think businesses along Neptune Avenue are somehow exempt by the loss of the B4??

[Broadway Local]

MY IDEA FOR SOUTH BROOKLYN:

 

B1: Current routing.

B4: Extra runs added.

B8: Full time to Shore Road.

B10a (Or B10):Via 13 & 14 Avenue & Bath Ave to Coney Island. Combined with B64.

B10b (Or B19): Via 13 & 14 Avenues & 65 Street to Sunset Park.

B16: Rerouted along Fort Hamilton Parkway between McDonald Avenue & 58 Street.

B19: See B10a.

B33: Via Avenue X & Bay Ridge Avenue from Sheepshead Bay to Bay Ridge. (Taken partially from ConeyIslandAve7's signature.)

B64: Combined with B10/B10a.

B70: Terminates as Shore Road.

 

To me, the B1 should go to Shore Road and the B64 to 4th Av Terminal! Make it like it's pre-2010 budget cuts!

 

The B4 should go to Knapp Street at all times for more ridership services. It can go through the Sheepshead Bay ( station for transfer.

 

I see what you're trying to do to the B8, but I think it should stay terminated at 95th St Station at all times! We don't want the B8 to be so long like the B6.

 

I think one route via 13th Av & Bath Av between Coney Island and Shore Road is fine with me. Not a lot of people ride the B64, so there's no need for the B10a.

 

The B10b idea is not completed. We need to know the terminals first before we examine whether it's a good idea or not.

 

What's wrong with the B16 going to 13th and 14th Av? Borough Park needed more service, and the B70 is kind of close to Fort Hamilton.

 

On the B33, the idea that was close to mine, I figured out that it was a bad idea because it's almost the same as the B4. I can make the B76 run through someplace where it's not near either the B4 or the B9. I got nothing so far.

 

Why B70 to Shore Road? V A Hospital patients or people needed service to Bay Ridge, and Sunset Park by riding this route!

[NX Express]

How many businesses are there near the ex-B4 along Neptune (except near the B49/B68)? Around two?

[checkmatechamp13]

What you think businesses along Neptune Avenue are somehow exempt by the loss of the B4??

 

First of all, that's still a seperate issue from Emmons Avenue.

 

Second of all, the main purpose of running buses is to find the most effective way to serve the riders. Not the businesses. Not the politicians. The riders. If moving the B4 off Neptune Avenue helps riders overall (of course, with any reroute, some people will be negatively affected) at the expense of a few businesses, so be it.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

First of all, that's still a seperate issue from Emmons Avenue.

 

Second of all, the main purpose of running buses is to find the most effective way to serve the riders. Not the businesses. Not the politicians. The riders. If moving the B4 off Neptune Avenue helps riders overall at the expense of a few businesses, so be it.

 

First of all, it's not a separate issue. You act like Neptune Avenue is this Avenue separate from Emmons Avenue. What do you think Emmons Avenue turns into past Shore Blvd???

 

Second of all, the main purpose of running the buses is to serve the riders, which is who??? THE COMMUNITY, which includes the businesses. I also am getting rather annoyed with your nonchalantness of saying that it's okay for a "few businesses" to go under. Well yeah it's easy for you to say since it's not your family that has to be fed and clothed, and shuttered businesses does nothing but further damages the community. It affects EVERYONE, including these riders that you keep talking about. You're obsessed with costs, but lets see bus service be taken away from Richmond Avenue and you'd see the effects that it would have on your community. Imagine ShopRite being shuttered and you having to go elsewhere for your groceries, which could be much more expensive since there would a lack of competition. The knows the effects that taking away transportation from a community has, but they were hell bent on cutting that portion of the B4 and I have no idea why either.

 

You can talk about costs and riders all you want, but morally the knows that they should be doing all that they can to keep bus service running in all communities. They've missed the ball on this one big time. :tdown: They themselves have admitted that these cuts are painful and will hurt communities, so they know very well that's about far more than serving riders and costs. That's their purpose on the surface yes, but they're a public agency, not a private one.

[NX Express]

First of all, it's not a separate issue. You act like Neptune Avenue is this Avenue separate from Emmons Avenue. What do you think Emmons Avenue turns into past Shore Blvd???

 

Second of all, the main purpose of running the buses is to serve the riders, which is who??? THE COMMUNITY, which includes the businesses. I also am getting rather annoyed with your nonchalantness of saying that it's okay for a "few businesses" to go under. Well yeah it's easy for you to say since it's not your family that has to be fed and clothed, and shuttered businesses does nothing but further damages the community. It affects EVERYONE, including these riders that you keep talking about. You're obsessed with costs, but lets see bus service be taken away from Richmond Avenue and you'd see the effects that it would have on your community. The knows the effects that taking away transportation from a community has, but they were hell bent on cutting that portion of the B4 and I have no idea why either.

 

It's impossible to please everyone. I'm pretty sure non-Neptune Av riders were annoyed by the Av Z > Neptune > Av Z > Emmons turns, which wasted time.

 

Besides, how many people would take a bus to go to a deli?

[Via Garibaldi 8]

It's impossible to please everyone. I'm pretty sure non-Neptune Av riders were annoyed by the Av Z > Neptune > Av Z > Emmons turns, which wasted time.

 

Besides, how many people would take a bus to go to a deli?

 

Who said anything about a deli??? :confused::confused:

[NX Express]

Sorry, my mistake. I skimmed over CC13's post and the word 'devil' in his signature registered as deli in my mind.

 

Anyway, there isn't too much business there except delis.

[B36 Via Ave U]

Sorry, my mistake. I skimmed over CC13's post and the word 'devil' in his signature registered as deli in my mind.

 

Anyway, there isn't too much business there except delis.

 

Isint there a supermarket there also, cuz i remember seeing one on Neptune on the B4, forgot where though, that place prob got hurt from the cut also, and i remember some people gettig on the bus with bags of food going both ways, i think, clear up for me if there is a market there.

[B35 via Church]

B1: Current routing.

B4: Extra runs added.

B8: Full time to Shore Road.

B10a (Or B10):Via 13 & 14 Avenue & Bath Ave to Coney Island. Combined with B64.

B10b (Or B19): Via 13 & 14 Avenues & 65 Street to Sunset Park.

B16: Rerouted along Fort Hamilton Parkway between McDonald Avenue & 58 Street.

B19: See B10a.

B33: Via Avenue X & Bay Ridge Avenue from Sheepshead Bay to Bay Ridge. (Taken partially from ConeyIslandAve7's signature.)

B64: Combined with B10/B10a.

B70: Terminates as Shore Road.

don't know why I didn't see this post initially.....

 

B1: yup...

B4: yup, but that's not all that needs to be done...

B8: redundant/not necessary...

B16: I wouldn't exactly do it that way, but ok, for the most part....

B33: how would it get to av. X from bay ridge av ?

B70: that's exactly what I did w/ it on my map !

 

* Your whole B10/B19/64 thing confuses me.... mind posting the terminals for both routes ?

 

 

What's wrong with the B16 going to 13th and 14th Av? Borough Park needed more service, and the B70 is kind of close to Fort Hamilton.

 

On the B33, the idea that was close to mine, I figured out that it was a bad idea because it's almost the same as the B4. I can make the B76 run through someplace where it's not near either the B4 or the B9. I got nothing so far.

 

Why B70 to Shore Road? V A Hospital patients or people needed service to Bay Ridge, and Sunset Park by riding this route!

 

B16: Nothing... except there is a need for service along Ft. Hamilton Pkwy. where there is none.... I mean, the B16 basically avoids Maimonides.....

Not just for the hospital - but regardless, the simplest solution is to "straighten" out the B16 along ft. hamilton pkwy.....

 

B70: if you have a route coming up from VA hospital to Bay ridge, there's no need for another route going down to the hospital from bay ridge...... Furthermore, Sunset Park riders aren't the ones taking the 70 to the hospital (for the most part)... and the route would still serve the areas of Bay Ridge & Sunset Park w/ what he's suggesting....

 

 

Second of all, the main purpose of running buses is to find the most effective way to serve the riders. Not the businesses. Not the politicians. The riders.

Not entirely true, fam.....

 

When it really boils down to it, it really is a chicken & egg argument.... which VG8 perfectly illustrated below:

 

"Second of all, the main purpose of running the buses is to serve the riders, which is who??? THE COMMUNITY, which includes the businesses."

 

 

....But yeah, the basic purpose of public transportation is to serve the riding public between some two points (which is what transport is) - regardless of whatever mode.... If people had nowhere to go, you eliminate one half of the equation.....

 

You're big on logic...

What happens during a logical conjunction when either proposition is false.....

Edited March 18, 2012 by B35 via Church

[Threxx]

don't know why I didn't see this post initially.....

 

B1: yup...

B4: yup, but that's not all that needs to be done...

B8: redundant/not necessary...

B16: I wouldn't exactly do it that way, but ok, for the most part....

B33: how would it get to av. X from bay ridge av ?

B70: that's exactly what I did w/ it on my map !

 

* Your whole B10/B19/64 thing confuses me.... mind posting the terminals for both routes ?

[/Quote]

 

Didn't see your map with the B70.

 

B4: I know that's not all. But wanting full time service back to Emmons Avenue is wishful thinking, to say the least.

B8: How is it not necesary?

B10/64: Prospect Park Sta-Coney Island, combined with B64. (Via 13/14 Avs)

B19: Prospect Park Sta- Bay Ridge. (Via 13/14 Aves, 65 St & 3rd Avenue)

 

B33: Towards Sheepshead Bay: Bay Ridge Avenue > Bay Parkway > W.6 St > Avenue X

From Sheepshead Bay: Avenue X > W.6 St > Bay Parkway > 68 St.

[B35 via Church]

Didn't see your map with the B70.

 

B4: I know that's not all. But wanting full time service back to Emmons Avenue is wishful thinking, to say the least.

B8: How is it not necesary?

B10/64: Prospect Park Sta-Coney Island, combined with B64. (Via 13/14 Avs)

B19: Prospect Park Sta- Bay Ridge. (Via 13/14 Aves, 65 St & 3rd Avenue)

 

B33: Towards Sheepshead Bay: Bay Ridge Avenue > Bay Parkway > W.6 St > Avenue X

From Sheepshead Bay: Avenue X > W.6 St > Bay Parkway > 68 St.

whoa whoa whoa.....

 

B70: Yeah, and neither did anyone else, dude... I was just sayin that's what I did on it (albeit, not for the same reason)....

regardless, wasn't accusing you of anything.... smh....

 

B4: Good for you....

 

B8: There is no justifiable reason to send the B8 to Shore Road..... None.

 

How is it not necessary?

For starters.... that area b/w shore road & 95th st , the 63 is more than sufficient....

 

The reason the (real) 70 serves that area in question was a bit of a compromise for the loss of the B37.... it comes up from shore road to continue serving VA Hospital.... so it just so happens to be a secondary measure for those folks down there by shore road, etc to get to the ..... Whereas you want to truncate the 70 for the purpose of extending the 8 (of all routes) to shore road.....

 

Furthest it (the 8) should go, if anywhere, was back to it's prior terminal @ 95th st subway....

 

B10/19/33/64: cool....

Edited March 18, 2012 by B35 via Church
add on....

[checkmatechamp13]

1) First of all, it's not a separate issue. You act like Neptune Avenue is this Avenue separate from Emmons Avenue. What do you think Emmons Avenue turns into past Shore Blvd???

 

2) Second of all, the main purpose of running the buses is to serve the riders, which is who??? THE COMMUNITY, which includes the businesses. I also am getting rather annoyed with your nonchalantness of saying that it's okay for a "few businesses" to go under. Well yeah it's easy for you to say since it's not your family that has to be fed and clothed, and shuttered businesses does nothing but further damages the community. It affects EVERYONE, including these riders that you keep talking about. You're obsessed with costs, but lets see bus service be taken away from Richmond Avenue and you'd see the effects that it would have on your community. Imagine ShopRite being shuttered and you having to go elsewhere for your groceries, which could be much more expensive since there would a lack of competition. The knows the effects that taking away transportation from a community has, but they were hell bent on cutting that portion of the B4 and I have no idea why either.

 

 

1) Yeah, but my point is that you could still serve one without serving the other.

 

2) First of all, it's not a good comparison because Richmond Avenue is literally the only north-south corridor in the area. You can't say that the S57 on Willowbrook Road or the S46 on South Avenue is a reasonable alternative for most people on the route. Neptune Avenue, is closer to Brighton Beach Avenue than Richmond Avenue is to either of those streets. Even Emmons Avenue, while it's still a far walk to Avenue Z is still within somewhat of a walking distance of the B36. You can't say the same about this area because the streets are messed up (not to mention that neither the S46 or S57 goes too far south anyway. If you're going south of Victory Blvd along Richmond Avenue, you would literally have no bus at all in the neighborhood)

 

Second of all, ShopRite goes into areas with far worse transportation and still does fine. I don't think there's transportation in Ellenville or Garnerville, NY. Being the large store that it is, ShopRite expects most of its customers to come by car. When they have that huge Can Can Sale twice a year, I doubt they expect people to carry 30 cans of beans onto a bus, in addition to whatever else they're buying.

 

Do you see people carrying bags of food onto the bus? Yes, of course. I've done it myself. But are the majority of the customers doing that? No. Most of the people I see are filling up a shopping cart. If you're doing that, I highly doubt you plan to bring that stuff on a bus.

 

If Richmond Avenue (and I assume Forest Avenue as well) lost bus service, yeah, ShopRite would see its sales go down, but it definitely wouldn't cause it to go under.

 

And the same applies to smaller stores like Walgreens: Most of the customer base are either people who are walking or driving there.

 

And how do you know that the stores aren't just being shut down because of a bad economy? There were a bunch of stores that went down these past few years: Circuit City, Blockbuster, Hollywood Videos (I don't know if it's a chain or anything, but it was a local movie store). The economy has affected everybody. In practically every neighborhood, there are more boarded-up homes than there used to be (even if it just went from being no boarded-up homes to one or two). The same way people are forced out of their homes is the same way businesses are being shut down.

 

Who said anything about a deli??? :confused::confused:

 

Well, most of the stores along Neptune Avenue are little stores like delis and Chinese food places. They aren't things people would take a bus to get to. I mean, maybe if they're waiting for the bus they could stop by at the deli, but still, if you're going to establish a business in the neighborhood, you should have more of a customer base than people waiting for a bus.

 

....But yeah, the basic purpose of public transportation is to serve the riding public between some two points (which is what transport is) - regardless of whatever mode.... If people had nowhere to go, you eliminate one half of the equation.....

 

You're big on logic...

What happens during a logical conjunction when either proposition is false.....

 

The entire argument is false. I know about that.

 

But the thing is that it's not like you're taking all of the destinations away from the people. Even if one store is shut down, people still have to go to work or school or the senior center or whatever and they can still get there by transit. Maybe if it's a big enough destination, transit should run to keep it around, but if it's a big enough destination, it could probably survive between the people who can walk there and the people who drive there, and isn't dependant on a bus being there.

[Broadway Local]

B33: Towards Sheepshead Bay: Bay Ridge Avenue > Bay Parkway > W.6 St > Avenue X

From Sheepshead Bay: Avenue X > W.6 St > Bay Parkway > 68 St.

 

This is almost my idea. I planned for the B76 to run almost the same as the B33. Like I said, the B33 (or B76) can be another B4, because it runs almost parallel to the B4, except it touches each other on Avenue Z.

 

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=214107502878968930302.0004bb88e3be3504a842b&msa=0&ll=40.62138,-73.974037&spn=0.109058,0.154324

Edited March 18, 2012 by Coneyislandav7

[Threxx]

whoa whoa whoa.....

 

B70: Yeah, and neither did anyone else, dude... I was just sayin that's what I did on it (albeit, not for the same reason)....

regardless, wasn't accusing you of anything.... smh....

 

B4: Good for you....

 

B8: There is no justifiable reason to send the B8 to Shore Road..... None.

 

How is it not necessary?

For starters.... that area b/w shore road & 95th st , the 63 is more than sufficient....

 

The reason the (real) 70 serves that area in question was a bit of a compromise for the loss of the B37.... it comes up from shore road to continue serving VA Hospital.... so it just so happens to be a secondary measure for those folks down there by shore road, etc to get to the ..... Whereas you want to truncate the 70 for the purpose of extending the 8 (of all routes) to shore road.....

 

Furthest it (the 8) should go, if anywhere, was back to it's prior terminal @ 95th st subway....

 

B10/19/33/64: cool....

 

I realize that truncating the (B70) is a dumb idea, but I stand by my (B8)!

 

When you said "cool" about my other routes (B10/19/33), did you mean that you liked them, or were you being sarcastic? It's hard to pick up sarcasm over the Internet.

 

This is almost my idea. I planned for the B76 to run almost the same as the B33. Like I said, the B33 (or B76) can be another B4, because it runs almost parallel to the B4, except it touches each other on Avenue Z.

 

(Stay tuned for my B76 map)

 

I got the idea for the B33 from your sig! Originally, the B33 was a useless Avenue X crosstown. Now, it has meaning!

 

You wouldn't mind including the B33 on that map, for comparison?

(As a note, where Bay Ridge Avenue is one-way, B33 uses 68 St-Ovington Avenue for other direction. Between Coney Island Avenue & Ocean Avenue, serves Sheepshead Bay Station. Sheepshead Bay loop: Avenue X > Knapp St > Emmons Avenue > Nostrand Avenue > Shore Parkway > Knapp St > Avenue X.

[Broadway Local]

You wouldn't mind including the B33 on that map, for comparison?

(As a note, where Bay Ridge Avenue is one-way, B33 uses 68 St-Ovington Avenue for other direction. Between Coney Island Avenue & Ocean Avenue, serves Sheepshead Bay Station. Sheepshead Bay loop: Avenue X > Knapp St > Emmons Avenue > Nostrand Avenue > Shore Parkway > Knapp St > Avenue X.

 

I live very close to Bay Ridge Av, so I kind of know the directions.

 

Sure, I'll compare it!

 

But I need your terminals! Thanks...

[B35 via Church]

When you said "cool" about my other routes (B10/19/33), did you mean that you liked them, or were you being sarcastic? It's hard to pick up sarcasm over the Internet.

Neither.

 

I asked you to post the terminals for those ideas, and you did just that.... that's the only reason why I said "cool".....

 

I was fin to map out those routings in my head & formulate an opinion, but since you came w/ that little 'tude in that last post (at least that's how it came off to me anyway), I didn't bother.....

 

 

The entire argument is false. I know about that.

 

But the thing is that it's not like you're taking all of the destinations away from the people. Even if one store is shut down, people still have to go to work or school or the senior center or whatever and they can still get there by transit.

 

Maybe if it's a big enough destination, transit should run to keep it around, but if it's a big enough destination, it could probably survive between the people who can walk there and the people who drive there, and isn't dependant on a bus being there.

 

lol....

If you know about that, then why are you trying to rationalize a "false" argument

 

The comment I replied to of yours about the main purpose being the riders, was a half-truth.....

In this reply of yours now, the part in bold is reinforcing what I said regarding the purpose of public transportation....

 

That last segment of the reply (which I'm not sure why you even brought up), you might wanna re-think that....

In sayin that, you are assuming there aren't people from other areas in mass numbers that are trying to get to some big enough destination you speak of - that don't drive... It's almost like you're trying to undermine how important public (surface) transportation can be.....

[Threxx]

I live very close to Bay Ridge Av, so I kind of know the directions.

 

Sure, I'll compare it!

 

But I need your terminals! Thanks...

 

B33: Bay Ridge: Current B9/B64 terminal.

Sheepshead Bay: Some short turns at Sheepshead Bay Station, full route ends at Nostrand & Emmons Avenue.

[Threxx]

Neither.

 

I asked you to post the terminals for those ideas, and you did just that.... that's the only reason why I said "cool".....

 

I was fin to map out those routings in my head & formulate an opinion, but since you came w/ that little 'tude in that last post (at least that's how it came off to me anyway), I didn't bother.....

 

 

Sorry about the 'tude. Didn't mean to be disrespectful. It was just a question, thats all. I wouldn't mind your opinion, though!