NJT proposals/ideas thread 2012-2013

[46Dover]

I know they're doing construction in the Hudson River Tubes on the weekends, where the trains have to be bunched up entering and leaving Manhattan, but is there enough intra-NJ ridership for the following proposals?

 

Extend the Gladstone short-turns (assuming they're not bustituting them anymore) down to either Newark or Hoboken and space the trains out to provide 30 minute headways between Summit and Newark (maybe have a 40 minute gap, then the Gladstone train, and then a 20 minute gap for the NYP train)?

 

Add an extra train per hour to the NE Corridor Line that uses the Waterfront Connection, that at least gives intra-NJ riders an option to reach Newark.

 

I also noticed that there's a lot of neighborhoods in some of those medium-sized cities (New Brunswick, Elizabeth, Paterson) that don't have Sunday service. For example, in New Brunswick, the #810, #815, and #818 are the only routes with Sunday service (unless I missed one), and those serve the area by the train station on the northern side of the city. If you live along say, Livingston Avenue, you have to walk all the way to either the Jersey Avenue or New Brunswick stations. In Paterson, the Northside area has no Sunday service (the #712 goes out towards Totowa, so that doesn't count), and in Elizabeth, the area by the Goethals Bridge has no Sunday service.

 

In Paterson, I think I offered the suggestion of running the #703 & #744 to that area on Sundays. For the other areas, I'd have to look into how to restructure the routes to give those areas Sunday service.

That 744 is Community Coach's responsibility and like their other Passaic Line routes, don't think that's going to happen

[PSCTTNJ]

The 744 is a contract line & seeing as Community  has no  contract lines  that operate on Sunday that will not happen.If anything an NJT operated line would  have its route changed.

[A Former New Yorker]

I Had An Proposal The Essex Union Light Rail This Has Two Lines (As Of Now) The Red and Green Lines

 

Red Line (Park St - E 5th St) Serves Montclair,Bloomfield,Newark, Elizabeth,Rahway,Clark,Westfield,Scotch Plains,Fanwood,Plainfield

 

Green Line (Pompton Av - New Providence Rd) Serves Cedar Grove,Essex Fells,West Orange,Orange,Newark,Hillside,Union,Kenilworth,Cranford,Garwood,Westfield,Mountainside

 

Both Lines Run Every 3-6 Min There Will Be A Park&Ride Between Stuyvesant Ave and Morris Av. If You Have Any Idea For Another Line, New Light Rail Vehicles Add-ons You Can Comment On This Or PM Me. Thanks You For Your Time

[checkmatechamp13]

The 744 is a contract line & seeing as Community  has no  contract lines  that operate on Sunday that will not happen.If anything an NJT operated line would  have its route changed.

 

Which lines in that area are operated by Community Coach?

 

BTW, I realized the #112 actually does run on Sundays. Would've come in handy if I had realized that. Instead, I ended up taking the #59 to Market Street and walking over to Newark Penn for the PATH (if I had known the #112 was coming soon, I would've paid the extra fare and relaxed all the way to NYC)

[PSCTTNJ]

Community operates the 702,705,707,709,722,744,746,748, & 758.They are the Passaic County P Line contract.

[checkmatechamp13]

What do you guys think of this: https://transitism.wordpress.com/2015/06/22/will-we-ever-get-a-newark-passaic-express-bus/

 

Maybe start in Paterson, parallel the #74/190, and then hop on Route 21 to get to Newark? Or maybe start in Paterson, parallel the #171/770 and then travel down McClean Blvd to reach Passaic, and then hop back on to get to Newark.

 

Community operates the 702,705,707,709,722,744,746,748, & 758.They are the Passaic County P Line contract.

 

Yeah, the #746/748 between Downtown Paterson and Riverside is another one that should definitely run on Sunday.

 

Maybe those City Hall short-turns on the #712 can be extended up Madison Avenue on Sundays, and the #703 can maintain Sunday service west of the Passaic River to Haledon.

[checkmatechamp13]

So a few NJT proposals:

 

#707: Routed straight down Passaic Street instead of looping around 8th Street & Midland Avenue. That route is covered by a rerouted #780. 

 

#112: Straightened out to operate via Fairmount-Newark-Broad (the area up by Broad & North is already served by the #113 for those who don't want to walk from the #112)

 

#115: Sunday service added. Off-peak trips operate via Elizabethport (take Bayway to Clarkson, follow the #58 route to South 5th, then take South 5th Street to East Jersey Street, and follow the 24B route to Jersey Gardens). I think there would be a decent amount of people who don't want to put up with the 24A/B up to the Elizabeth NJT station who would take the #115 instead. 

 

On the southern end, it should be extended to the Woodbridge Mall, as a quicker alternative to the #48.

 

I'm going to add my own modification to an earlier proposal made by B35 via Church.

 

Like I mentioned in that post, I do agree wholeheartedly with a Plainfield-Woodbridge Mall-Perth Amboy Road. I would restructure the #819 & #822 in conjunction with it:

 

#819: All buses travel from Rock Avenue (Piscataway) to Middlesex Community College via Park Avenue-Randolph Road-Plainfield Avenue-Hamilton Blvd-Stelton Road, divert to serve the Hadley Center, then continue down Stelton Road/Plainfield Avenue to Woodbridge Avenue and follow the #814 to Middlesex Community College. Somebody can feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but I think most of the ridership from Metuchen to Plainfield is from transfers off the #810/813. In this case, with the #816 providing direct service from Plainfield to the Woodbridge Mall & Perth Amboy, and the #819 providing direct service to MCC (and a quick connection to the #813 for service to Raritan Center), and both of those routes connecting to the #810, those needs are basically covered.

 

#822: Extended down Greenbrook Road, Washington Avenue, divert to the Hadley Center, continue down Metlars Lane & Route 18 to the New Brunswick NJT station.

[Mtatransit]

So a few NJT proposals

 

#112: Straightened out to operate via Fairmount-Newark-Broad (the area up by Broad & North is already served by the #113 for those who don't want to walk from the #112)

 

#115: Sunday service added. Off-peak trips operate via Elizabethport (take Bayway to Clarkson, follow the #58 route to South 5th, then take South 5th Street to East Jersey Street, and follow the 24B route to Jersey Gardens). I think there would be a decent amount of people who don't want to put up with the 24A/B up to the Elizabeth NJT station who would take the #115 instead..

115 definitely should have Sunday Service. I believe that the Elizabeth AV Branch Service should be eliminated, and reroute on the normal route. Also the 115 bus is pretty empty until Jersey Gardens, where its packed, like standing all the way from front to back. It was worse until NJT made the 115 skip Union City. The 112 should not make the Broad/North AV Deviation, it wastes people's time with that deviation. One last proposal STOP CHARGING PEOPLE FARES THAT REQUIRE NICKELS AND DIMES! Edited December 26, 2016 by Mtatransit

[checkmatechamp13]

115 definitely should have Sunday Service. I believe that the Elizabeth AV Branch Service should be eliminated, and reroute on the normal route. Also the 115 bus is pretty empty until Jersey Gardens, where its packed, like standing all the way from front to back. It was worse until NJT made the 115 skip Union City. The 112 should not make the Broad/North AV Deviation, it wastes people's time with that deviation. One last proposal STOP CHARGING PEOPLE FARES THAT REQUIRE NICKELS AND DIMES!

 

Yeah, the Sunday service is more for coverage than for ridership. Obviously, if buses are pretty empty until Jersey Gardens, and fill up there, then the solution is to run more #111 buses, but at the same time there is a need for coverage in that portion of Elizabeth. Without the #56/57/58 running, the nearest bus is the 24A, but by the time you walk over to that, you might as well have taken the more direct walk to the Elizabeth NJT station for the bus service there. Plus, it gives Jersey Gardens riders an option to bypass Union City. If it's timed right with the trains (so it fills in that 40 minute gap in service on the weekends like the #112 does) it could work out well.

 

And yeah, I agree those fares are annoying. It should be something like 1 zone is $1.50, 2 zones $2.50, 3 zones $3.25, and $0.50 for every extra zone from there. 

 

I don't know what the point of that rerouted 115 is. I mean, the #57 runs during those times. Maybe there's some industrial park in that area or something. 

Edited December 26, 2016 by checkmatechamp13

[checkmatechamp13]

A couple of more proposals:

 

#96 extended to Branch Brook Park light rail station for connections to the #74 (as well as the #27 & #99), and to provide continuity of north-south service in that part of Newark.

 

#709 extended to Branch Brook Park light rail station via Montgomery/Mill Street to replace the old #93 bus.

 

I'm not sure of the exact routing, but I think something (maybe a branch or reroute of the #108) should serve the Springfield/Belmont area (basically, the center of Newark. The #107 serves Weequahic, and the #108 serves the Ironbound and Downtown areas) 

[46Dover]

A couple of more proposals:

 

#96 extended to Branch Brook Park light rail station for connections to the #74 (as well as the #27 & #99), and to provide continuity of north-south service in that part of Newark.

 

#709 extended to Branch Brook Park light rail station via Montgomery/Mill Street to replace the old #93 bus.

 

I'm not sure of the exact routing, but I think something (maybe a branch or reroute of the #108) should serve the Springfield/Belmont area (basically, the center of Newark. The #107 serves Weequahic, and the #108 serves the Ironbound and Downtown areas)

 

Re: 709

 

Imagine that: A Community line deep into Essex County. There were rumors of them taking the 72 and the 703

[checkmatechamp13]

Re: 709

 

Imagine that: A Community line deep into Essex County. There were rumors of them taking the 72 and the 703

 

If they were to do that, I would hope they would change their policy of no Sunday service.

[Mtatransit]

NJT Rail Ticket should provide " discounted Transfers" to bus routes. This way NJT could save money by not having as many bus route enter New York. It also provides more efficient service. Right now, I have 2 options I could take the Rail out of New York, or I could take the bus out of New York. With the discounted transfer, the bus will end at the rail station and the rail will take me into New York. I believe it's more efficient this way

Edited December 28, 2016 by Mtatransit

[DaTransitMan4608]

I'm not sure of the exact routing, but I think something (maybe a branch or reroute of the #108) should serve the Springfield/Belmont area (basically, the center of Newark. The #107 serves Weequahic, and the #108 serves the Ironbound and Downtown areas) 

That got me thinking a bit last night, what if they extended the 108 to Bloomfield via Park Ave and Grove St? It could follow the 41 onto Park and then the 90 to Branch Brook Park. 

[checkmatechamp13]

Long-term, I think it would be better to reactivate the Ampere station to cover that area: http://www.reconnectingamerica.org/assets/Uploads/bestpractice241.pdf

 

I'd be more inclined to have it take Springfield-South 10th-Central-South 8th-Park-Grove. It's more circuitous and cuts out the current section past Newark Penn, but it serves more isolated areas of Newark (in terms of not having rail access). Those areas are either a short walk or bus ride from Newark Broad anyway.

[B35 via Church]

Never cared for the #108; riderbase is too narrow & it does not help that it serves Newark-Penn, where too many are gunning for the PATH into the city....

 

Outside of how DeCamp #44 serves Bloomfield (back-doors it), I can agree to running 108's to Bloomfield... However, I would simply have it running along Bloomfield av.... It would take the turnpike to 280 (which is what the 107x does btw) & serve the Pavilion apartments (which would the 1st stop), before serving Bloomfield av...

 

Only question I'd have is, where should it end exactly; dead at Bloomfield rail (w/ the GO bus 28), or somewhere up along Broad w/i Bloomfield......

 

Speaking of Bloomfield... I wonder how an ex co-worker of mine is doing over there at Troy Towers....

Edited December 29, 2016 by B35 via Church

[checkmatechamp13]

Never cared for the #108; riderbase is too narrow & it does not help that it serves Newark-Penn, where too many are gunning for the PATH into the city....

 

Outside of how DeCamp #44 serves Bloomfield (back-doors it), I can agree to running 108's to Bloomfield... However, I would simply have it running along Bloomfield av.... It would take the turnpike to 280 (which is what the 107x does btw) & serve the Pavilion apartments (which would the 1st stop), before serving Bloomfield av...

 

Only question I'd have is, where should it end exactly; dead at Bloomfield rail (w/ the GO bus 28), or somewhere up along Broad w/i Bloomfield......

 

Speaking of Bloomfield... I wonder how an ex co-worker of mine is doing over there at Troy Towers....

 

When I took the #108, it seemed like a decent amount of the riders it got were headed for Union City, which is relatively difficult to get to from Downtown Newark (and any connecting buses). You have to take the PATH (which runs like crap on the weekends) to JSQ for another bus or jitney. (The other option is to go to Secaucus for the #124, but nobody's going to do that). 

 

And it would also make it a PITA to get to Manhattan from the Ironbound. You'd have to backtrack on the #1 to Newark Penn (or hope you can catch one of the unreliable #1 buses to Jersey City).

 

Basically, I do think it's important to have a bus linking two major transfer points (Newark Penn and Union City). I know a lot of buses bypass Union City, but at the same time, it does provide a lot of connections for buses going between different parts of the state, without having to go all the way to the PABT.

 

When I got on the bus, I think there were about 15 people. If you had to guess, how many of those people came from Newark Penn itself, vs. Downtown Newark, vs the areas north of I-280? (I was the last one on the bus at Newark Penn, so that's an honest question).

[Kanarsie Guy]

When I took the #108, it seemed like a decent amount of the riders it got were headed for Union City, which is relatively difficult to get to from Downtown Newark (and any connecting buses). You have to take the PATH (which runs like crap on the weekends) to JSQ for another bus or jitney. (The other option is to go to Secaucus for the #124, but nobody's going to do that). 

 

And it would also make it a PITA to get to Manhattan from the Ironbound. You'd have to backtrack on the #1 to Newark Penn (or hope you can catch one of the unreliable #1 buses to Jersey City).

 

Basically, I do think it's important to have a bus linking two major transfer points (Newark Penn and Union City). I know a lot of buses bypass Union City, but at the same time, it does provide a lot of connections for buses going between different parts of the state, without having to go all the way to the PABT.

 

When I got on the bus, I think there were about 15 people. If you had to guess, how many of those people came from Newark Penn itself, vs. Downtown Newark, vs the areas north of I-280? (I was the last one on the bus at Newark Penn, so that's an honest question).

The best way to help the 108 is send it further in to say maybe Orange.

 

108 Orange - New York Via Union City Local - Routes extended from Colonade to Main & Day, Orange Via 280 also serving Orange Station

108 Orange - New York Via 280, Newark Express - Making the following stops: Colonade, Pavillon N & S, Newark Penn, New York

108 Newark - New York Via Union City Local - Weekday trips starting at the Colonade

[46Dover]

Never cared for the #108; riderbase is too narrow & it does not help that it serves Newark-Penn, where too many are gunning for the PATH into the city....

 

Outside of how DeCamp #44 serves Bloomfield (back-doors it), I can agree to running 108's to Bloomfield... However, I would simply have it running along Bloomfield av.... It would take the turnpike to 280 (which is what the 107x does btw) & serve the Pavilion apartments (which would the 1st stop), before serving Bloomfield av...

 

Only question I'd have is, where should it end exactly; dead at Bloomfield rail (w/ the GO bus 28), or somewhere up along Broad w/i Bloomfield......

 

Speaking of Bloomfield... I wonder how an ex co-worker of mine is doing over there at Troy Towers....

If you say DeCamp back doors Bloomfield, have you tried Carefree/Saddle River's route from Bloomfield to New York? (Not sure where in NY it ends up though)

[checkmatechamp13]

If you say DeCamp back doors Bloomfield, have you tried Carefree/Saddle River's route from Bloomfield to New York? (Not sure where in NY it ends up though)

 

It has one trip that serves the PABT, 42nd & 5th, and Madison & 53rd inbound, and 41st & 7th outbound. 

 

http://www.srtbus.com/_content/commuter_schedules/55%20Line%20from%20NJ%20to%20Midtown%20Manhattan.pdf

[B35 via Church]

When I took the #108, it seemed like a decent amount of the riders it got were headed for Union City, which is relatively difficult to get to from Downtown Newark (and any connecting buses). You have to take the PATH (which runs like crap on the weekends) to JSQ for another bus or jitney. (The other option is to go to Secaucus for the #124, but nobody's going to do that). 

 

And it would also make it a PITA to get to Manhattan from the Ironbound. You'd have to backtrack on the #1 to Newark Penn (or hope you can catch one of the unreliable #1 buses to Jersey City).

 

Basically, I do think it's important to have a bus linking two major transfer points (Newark Penn and Union City). I know a lot of buses bypass Union City, but at the same time, it does provide a lot of connections for buses going between different parts of the state, without having to go all the way to the PABT.

 

When I got on the bus, I think there were about 15 people. If you had to guess, how many of those people came from Newark Penn itself, vs. Downtown Newark, vs the areas north of I-280? (I was the last one on the bus at Newark Penn, so that's an honest question).

You beat me to the point... sort of.

 

I have a problem with the fact that the 108 is a commuter route to NY (which is why I mentioned PATH, and also why I mentioned its thin riderbase).... It'd suit me just fine if they turned the 108 into an intrastate route ending somewhere in Hudson County, instead of extending it too deep to Bloomfield, Orange, or wherever else any of us can think of on the Essex county end - in hopes of garnering more usage as a NY commuter route.....

 

Without hesitation, I'd say it'd garner more usage as an intraborough route..... Anytime I hear of someone speaking about that route, it's always how epically (lol) late it is; upwards of 30 mins. plus - and I can speak to that, because I remember one Jersey fantrip I had, where everything went according to plan (think it was 14 or 15 (NJT) routes or something; have to check my old logs - if that particular one hasn't faded by now) EXCEPT for the trip back to NYC on the 108... Shit never came after 1 whole hour, so I hoofed it over to PATH & called it a night.... That's just one instance I can recall vividly.....

 

I'll admit, a Union City-Secaucus-Newark route does have a nice ring to it (the 78 does Newark-Secaucus only, and the 124/129 both do NY-Union City-Secaucus)... Which leaves the #108 to serve Union City coming from Newark, which wouldn't be a problem IMO if it didn't run to NYC.... IDK how they perform these days, but of the times I've taken the 129 out of PABT, each one of those suckers left crushloaded..... The 124 I've never taken, so I can't speak to that.... Reading your post there regarding the Secaucus, technically you're right - but you likely meant the taking of the 129 (as it's more frequent... the 124 is more for those UPS workers IIRC, and only has like a handful of trips each way or so)....

 

As to your question, Lol... When you mention north of 280, you're virtually talking solely the ridership it gets from the 2 stops inside the  Pavilion apts! Barely anyone takes the route past that point (thank the #41 for that).... There used to be 108 trips that ended at the Pavilion apts, instead of serving the Colonnade apts over on Clifton (av) - kind of like the M98's that ended at GWB, even though they were scheduled to end at Cabrini blvd.....

But with that said, and I'm not saying this in jest, I'd guess that 6 of the ppl on your bus came from the Pavilion apts north of 280, another 6 boarded somewhere b/w Newark-Broad & short of Newark Penn, and [you & 2 other poor souls] boarded at Newark Penn....

 

Hope that explains my position a little better, as well as addressing your inquiry there....

 

I've been sleeping on the NJT section, as it's been basically dead for like months now.... If I remember, I'll try to get to some of your other ideas.....

 

If you say DeCamp back doors Bloomfield, have you tried Carefree/Saddle River's route from Bloomfield to New York?

(Not sure where in NY it ends up though)

Nope.

 

Didn't know Saddle River even offered commuter services (thought they only did charter), to be honest....

 

It has one trip that serves the PABT, 42nd & 5th, and Madison & 53rd inbound, and 41st & 7th outbound. 

 

http://www.srtbus.com/_content/commuter_schedules/55%20Line%20from%20NJ%20to%20Midtown%20Manhattan.pdf

LOL!

[Mtatransit]

You beat me to the point... sort of.

 

I have a problem with the fact that the 108 is a commuter route to NY (which is why I mentioned PATH, and also why I mentioned its thin riderbase).... It'd suit me just fine if they turned the 108 into an intrastate route ending somewhere in Hudson County, instead of extending it too deep to Bloomfield, Orange, or wherever else any of us can think of on the Essex county end - in hopes of garnering more usage as a NY commuter route.....

 

Without hesitation, I'd say it'd garner more usage as an intraborough route..... Anytime I hear of someone speaking about that route, it's always how epically (lol) late it is; upwards of 30 mins. plus - and I can speak to that, because I remember one Jersey fantrip I had, where everything went according to plan (think it was 14 or 15 (NJT) routes or something; have to check my old logs - if that particular one hasn't faded by now) EXCEPT for the trip back to NYC on the 108... Shit never came after 1 whole hour, so I hoofed it over to PATH & called it a night.... That's just one instance I can recall vividly.....

 

I'll admit, a Union City-Secaucus-Newark route does have a nice ring to it (the 78 does Newark-Secaucus only, and the 124/129 both do NY-Union City-Secaucus)... Which leaves the #108 to serve Union City coming from Newark, which wouldn't be a problem IMO if it didn't run to NYC.... IDK how they perform these days, but of the times I've taken the 129 out of PABT, each one of those suckers left crushloaded..... The 124 I've never taken, so I can't speak to that.... Reading your post there regarding the Secaucus, technically you're right - but you likely meant the taking of the 129 (as it's more frequent... the 124 is more for those UPS workers IIRC, and only has like a handful of trips each way or so)....

 

As to your question, Lol... When you mention north of 280, you're virtually talking solely the ridership it gets from the 2 stops inside the  Pavilion apts! Barely anyone takes the route past that point (thank the #41 for that).... There used to be 108 trips that ended at the Pavilion apts, instead of serving the Colonnade apts over on Clifton (av) - kind of like the M98's that ended at GWB, even though they were scheduled to end at Cabrini blvd.....

But with that said, and I'm not saying this in jest, I'd guess that 6 of the ppl on your bus came from the Pavilion apts north of 280, another 6 boarded somewhere b/w Newark-Broad & short of Newark Penn, and [you & 2 other poor souls] boarded at Newark Penn....

 

Hope that explains my position a little better, as well as addressing your inquiry there....

 

I've been sleeping on the NJT section, as it's been basically dead for like months now.... If I remember, I'll try to get to some of your other ideas.....

 

 

Nope.

 

Didn't know Saddle River even offered commuter services (thought they only did charter), to be honest....

 

LOL!

I believe that Saddle River over some of the Coach USA Rockland Coaches route when they cut a few routes

[checkmatechamp13]

I think the #78 & #108 could be combined if restructured the right way. When you mentioned a Newark-Secaucus-Union City route, I looked at the map to see how the #78 currently serves Secaucus and was just like, wow lol.

 

I think a combined #78/108 should get off the turnpike at Secaucus Junction, take County Avenue-Metro Way-Enterprise Avenue-Secaucus Road-County Avenue-Paterson Plank Road. For anybody looking to travel to the western part of Secaucus they can transfer to the #2/124/129/329 (whatever happens to be running at the time, since the #329 looks like it covers the southern part of Secaucus when the #129 doesn't run).

 

While we're at it, I wonder if there's a way to restructure the #2 bus. It sucks the way you have to loop around the entire city of Secaucus to reach the NJT station (or walk a few blocks along the industrial road to get to the NJT station from where it first enters Secaucus). I know there's a few trips that bypass the northern section of Secaucus, but still.

[46Dover]

I believe that Saddle River over some of the Coach USA Rockland Coaches route when they cut a few routes

Yes, in addition to the GWB Bus terminal routes taken from Rockland Coaches, Saddle River operates the old Carefree 54, 55 routes out of Bloomfield to New York with brand new 45 foot State buses

[A Former New Yorker]

Some Proposal I Had:The Newark IBOA (Couldn't Think Of A Good IBOA Name)

 

Bergen St / 1st St IBOA: Will Run From Bergen St & Chancellor Av To 1st St & Park Av Right Near The Park Ave Light Rail Sta. Will Probably Bring New Jobs To Bergen St And 1st St. It Also Provide Additional Service To University Hospital Or Whenever The 1st St/ I-280 Area Is.

 

Irvington Term To Hoboken Term Via Newport Mall: Will Bring Additional Service To Exchange Pl and Communipaw Av / Grand St. Will Also Be Used As An Alternative For PATH Passengers Heading To Exchange Pl Or Grove St And Newport From Newark Penn. Will Also Be The First Bus Route From Irvington and Newark To Hoboken. It Might Have An Express Service Possibly

 

118: Goes From Summit And Maplewood To Lower Manhattan Via Broad St Sta And Broad & Market. Would Lessen PATH Ridership Alot. Especially Will How Crowded It Is. Trust Me.

 

7: Will Run From Maplewood Loop To Rutherford RR Sta.