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MTA Mulls restoring Service Cuts??? *Subway Comments Only Please*

RTOMan

By RTOMan,
in New York City Subway

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ACEVE14

ACEVE14

Posted
Posted

Besides talking about the (J) and (W) trains, I feel there needs to be more service on the (A) I've ridden the (A) at night and that casino has the ridership on the (A) high at this point and the (C) needs to run until 12 midnight, the (D) needs help in the bronx, the (B) needs to go to Bedford pk until 8:30pm, and the (G) need more cars, ridership on the (G) has risen just like the (L), the (G) can go back to its Pre 2001 when it used 6 car R46's A-B-B-A hooked to the A-A cars

 

 

1. I agree that the (A) needs more service for the Aqueduct Racetrack Casino. For extra service to Aqueduct, I'm thinking that there should be a construction on the Aqueduct Racetrack station with the creation of the southbound platform, leave the (C) as it is now; running its train service until 11:00 PM.

2. For the plan to make the (B) run all weekday long to Bedford Park Blvd officially work, it has to run weekday evenings, late nights, and all weekend to/from 145th St, and the (D) will have to run all trips express in The Bronx (6:15 AM-12:30 PM southbound and 1:00-8:15 PM northbound).

3. The (G) does need to run more cars to increase ridership, have it run full 8-car R-68/R-68A trains instead of half.

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Roadcruiser1

Roadcruiser1

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Posted

1. I agree that the (A) needs more service for the Aqueduct Racetrack Casino. For extra service to Aqueduct, I'm thinking that there should be a construction on the Aqueduct Racetrack station with the creation of the southbound platform, leave the (C) as it is now; running its train service until 11:00 PM.

2. For the plan to make the (B) run all weekday long to Bedford Park Blvd officially work, it has to run weekday evenings, late nights, and all weekend to/from 145th St, and the (D) will have to run all trips express in The Bronx (6:15 AM-12:30 PM southbound and 1:00-8:15 PM northbound).

3. The (G) does need to run more cars to increase ridership, have it run full 8-car R-68/R-68A trains instead of half.

 

 

1. The demand isn't high enough for it.

2. Not enough money.

3. Ridership isn't high enough to warrant this so it won't happen. In fact none of this would happen.

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RollOver

RollOver

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Posted

While another line can be rerouted to pick up the passengers, this cannot be sustained as trains go into the barn, they don't leave the same day. Fixing a train car is not the same thing as fixing a regular car, where as long as the mechanic can get to it that day (and no extra parts are needed), it can be fixed and reenter service the same day. There are also regular inspections and the such. Its foolhardy for railfans on here to estimate and think they KNOW how a barn functions. Even something small such as vandalism can bring a train into the barn for work or cleaning. Not every yard has the room available to fix small cosmetic issues on the track, leaving the train ready for service. And I have yet to discuss longer-term issues like overhauls, or trains leaving service for investigations (12-9, derailments, etc)

 

There is plenty of trains to increase off peak service of all kinds (which will be the focus of any kind of service expansion), but right now, in the heat of rush hour, the yards are basically empty.

 

If any of you were old enough to become a T/O and actually go through school car, you would know this. School Car (both T/O and C/R) basically have to wait out the rush hour for a train to utilize/practice on, as there usually is at most a train or possibly two on standby in the yard, and that's the gap train. In fact, most road operations (where T/O's actually learn to make station stops and perfect them) is during the midnight shift for this reason (to be able to get a train right away and use it throughout the tour). So much for trying to extend rush hour service (its assinine for any of you to focus service expansion on rush hour *cough* (W)*cough* while acknowleding the growth in off-peak travel). Any kind of service expansion will hinge on the fringes of rush hour and off-peak, and possibly late night.

 

I'll actually post my recommendations later today.

 

 

I understand.

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AndrewJC

AndrewJC

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1. The demand isn't high enough for it.

2. Not enough money.

3. Ridership isn't high enough to warrant this so it won't happen. In fact none of this would happen.

 

 

Agreed completely. But answers 1 and 3 also apply to 2: the D alone can easily handle off-peak demand on the Concourse line. What would be the point of extending the B?

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AndrewJC

AndrewJC

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The point is, "This train could be extended to this place! More service = GOOD! Express service = GOOD!"

 

Whenever there isn't a train on a particular line, it seems as if somebody will always suggest that there should be.

 

 

In this case, in fact, Concourse riders at local stops would are better off without Bronx B service (assuming most of them prefer express service on CPW).

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Caelestor

Caelestor

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What needs to be done?

 

Better headways on the weekend, especially on the IRT, which is constantly crowded. No local station should have more than 6 minute headways.

 

If some funds are left over, a restoration of the W would benefit the B'way line immensely. Besides, it's coming back anyway when the SAS opens and the Q (and possibly the N) are diverted to the UES.

 

There is no need to extend any Nassau St service to Brooklyn. If there eventually is, an extension of the W along 4th Ave makes more sense logistically. Not sure where to terminate it at Bay Ridge or 86th St or Bay Parkway, though.

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TheSubwayStation

TheSubwayStation

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What needs to be done?

 

Better headways on the weekend, especially on the IRT, which is constantly crowded. No local station should have more than 6 minute headways.

 

Remember, though, the (1) was the only IRT line that received service cuts. The other ones have always had long headways. IND/BMT often have long headways, too.
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Threxx

Threxx

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What needs to be done?

 

Better headways on the weekend, especially on the IRT, which is constantly crowded. No local station should have more than 6 minute headways.

 

 

That's not possible. Unless you have the money and cars somewhere, 6 minutes is wishful thinking....

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Threxx

Threxx

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Sorry I didn't clarify, 6 minutes on the (1)/(6), which is very doable considering the higher demand along those lines. The other lines that are further out can have 8-12 minute headways.

 

 

The (6), in the future when it gets back the R62's, but the (1) isn't doable now as it's cars are going through SMS...

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GreatOne2k

GreatOne2k

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Agreed completely. But answers 1 and 3 also apply to 2: the D alone can easily handle off-peak demand on the Concourse line. What would be the point of extending the B?

 

 

(B) should run to the Bronx 5:25am - 9:56am from Bedford Park, and from 145 St 3:29pm - 7:57pm (this could be later since I've heard that the (D) still needs help after this time), and from 10:10pm - 10:55pm (running in service to the yard). That would cover most midday crowding and some evening crowding.

 

In this case, in fact, Concourse riders at local stops would are better off without Bronx B service (assuming most of them prefer express service on CPW).

 

 

Unless they don't mind long waits and more crowding, the (B) could also get them to/from the (A) since the (D) is known to be late at times.

 

Remember, though, the (1) was the only IRT line that received service cuts. The other ones have always had long headways. IND/BMT often have long headways, too.

 

 

(2), (3), (5), and (6) had their weekend cuts in 2003.

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Concourse Express

Concourse Express

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Posted

 

 

In this case, in fact, Concourse riders at local stops would are better off without Bronx B service (assuming most of them prefer express service on CPW).

 

 

The (D) alone cannot handle Concourse Line ridership during rush hours.

 

As a general point, I've said this many times and I'll say it again - PM rush hour service on the Delta ENDS TOO EARLY (last express leaves 145 @6:41p, last Bravo leaves 145 @6:49p, (D) runs on a 10-min headway starting with the *second-to-last* Concourse Express train). Crowding on the (D) persists often up to Tremont or Fordham (and sometimes further north!) even after 9pm.

 

As for the Concourse Local service, with (B) trains running roughly every 10 mins, service at those stations in the peak direction is among the least frequent in the SYSTEM despite high ridership. Service increases on the (B) and (D), as well as an expansion of the rush-hour pattern (especially PMs), *are* warranted - the principal obstacle, however, is cost.

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GreatOne2k

GreatOne2k

Posted
Posted

The (D) alone cannot handle Concourse Line ridership during rush hours.

 

As a general point, I've said this many times and I'll say it again - PM rush hour service on the Delta ENDS TOO EARLY (last express leaves 145 @6:41p, last Bravo leaves 145 @6:49p, (D) runs on a 10-min headway starting with the *second-to-last* Concourse Express train). Crowding on the (D) persists often up to Tremont or Fordham even after 9pm.

 

As for the Concourse Local service, with (B) trains running every 10 mins, riders at those stations in the peak directiom receive the least frequent rush-hour service in the SYSTEM outside of the Rockaway branches and the Franklin Shuttle, despite much higher ridership. Service increases on the (B) and (D), as well as an expansion of the rush-hour pattern (especially PMs), *are* warranted - the principal obstacle, however, is cost.

 

 

The (B) and (D) have better reverse peak service on Concourse individually.

 

Dyre Av has some 10-13 minute gaps in service during rush hours peak direction, Pelham local has a few 9 minute gaps in local service peak direction (not that much). The (J) local stops can have about 10+ minute waits in service as well. There are a few periods where peak (B) service does run less than 10 minutes (usually no better than 8-9 minutes).

 

The last 5 (B) trains could easily run on Concourse in the evenings, however they would likely be bunching up with the (D) (assuming the everything is on time).

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TwoTimer

TwoTimer

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As a T/O on the (B)(D), sometimes the (B) in front of me is still in the station getting "cleaned out" and I'm at 125 already, and sometimes 135. And one wants to fit the (D) service in between so all trains go to BPK in service (laughs)? There's a reason the service runs light from 145. An extra hour of Bedford service (and Concourse express obviously) on either end of the PM rush hour would be appreciated and warranted. @Concourse Express Note that this takes away the over the top move that (D) uses on occasion to get to 205 and back to BPK quicker.

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Concourse Express

Concourse Express

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The (B) and (D) have better reverse peak service on Concourse individually.

 

Dyre Av has some 10-13 minute gaps in service during rush hours peak direction, Pelham local has a few 9 minute gaps in local service peak direction (not that much). The (J) local stops can have about 10+ minute waits in service as well. There are a few periods where peak (B) service does run less than 10 minutes (usually no better than 8-9 minutes).

 

The last 5 (B) trains could easily run on Concourse in the evenings, however they would likely be bunching up with the (D) (assuming the everything is on time).

 

 

I forgot about the long headways on the Dyre branch and the (J) / (Z) skip-stop stations. The Pelham Local doesn't see the long headways 'til the midday hours though...

 

That said, peak-direction Concourse Local service is still too infrequent. While you're correct that the (B) has a brief period of 8-9 minute service (AM rush only), there is also a 12-minute gap thrown in there, so it's still only 7 TPH peak.

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Concourse Express

Concourse Express

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As a T/O on the (B)(D), sometimes the (B) in front of me is still in the station getting "cleaned out" and I'm at 125 already, and sometimes 135. And one wants to fit the (D) service in between so all trains go to BPK in service (laughs)? There's a reason the service runs light from 145. An extra hour of Bedford service (and Concourse express obviously) on either end of the PM rush hour would be appreciated and warranted. @Concourse Express Note that this takes away the over the top move that (D) uses on occasion to get to 205 and back to BPK quicker.

 

 

Indeed, even an extra hour of PM rush Concourse service would be a godsend (this would also help tremendously during Yankees night games; as it is, the last express leaves nearly half an hour before game time, meaning damn near impossible crowding on the early evening (D) trains).

 

Also, what is the "over the top" move you're describing?

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Concourse Express

Concourse Express

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Posted

Maybe the (W) can run to Bay Ridge-95 street via 4th Avenue Express Rush Hours and Middays Terminate at 9th Avenue

 

 

No room for a third 4th Ave express train. The (D) and (N) are more than adequate there; what is arguably needed is additional local service.

 

That said, if the (W) returns it'll likely terminate at Whitehall as it did before it was axed.

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