Burrstone Posted July 3, 2012 Share #1 Posted July 3, 2012 Is it really that far off? I can legitimately seeing NICE want to move to NFI now that they won't be able buy Orion's any more. NICE had said keeping a good relationship is important to them and then you hear NICE will be getting new Orion's off of the option of the Long Island Bus order. Maybe in a year or so we'll see C40LF's on LI if the isnt interested in taking any or some of the buses on the C40LF option. It's not too far off, & Veolia already have this "relationship", it's a cng bus, and by that time it will be a very proven bus. I could also see them taking more Orion's from NYC bus options, BUT does the city have options out there for more cng Orion buses? AND they need to get away from Orion sometime. This would be a great time for them to test some good cng new flyers in the fleet for a good price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
User Posted July 3, 2012 Share #2 Posted July 3, 2012 It really could be any CNG bus from New Flyer, can't it. Does it have to be the C40LF? I could see it happening though. As long as NICE doesn't do something stupid like go with Gillig or NABI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion VII 4 Life Posted July 3, 2012 Share #3 Posted July 3, 2012 It's possible, though I have a bad feeling they're gonna go all "cheapo" next time around with NABI or Gillig crap. This isn't the anymore, this is a private company that needs to save as much money as they can for Nassau County's sake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ MC Posted July 3, 2012 Share #4 Posted July 3, 2012 It could be from anyone (MTS, Gillig, NABI, NFI. or Nova). They all build CNG buses. I just hope who ever they choose will go a long way to improving NICE in general. As for a C40LF it's not out of the question either. They could also be used as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burrstone Posted July 3, 2012 Author Share #5 Posted July 3, 2012 It really could be any CNG bus from New Flyer, can't it. Does it have to be the C40LF? I could see it happening though. As long as NICE doesn't do something stupid like go with Gillig or NABI. Yes it could be anyone, but are there other CNG buses that the has an option besides the C40LF? It's possible, though I have a bad feeling they're gonna go all "cheapo" next time around with NABI or Gillig crap. This isn't the anymore, this is a private company that needs to save as much money as they can for Nassau County's sake. It could be from anyone (MTS, Gillig, NABI, NFI. or Nova). They all build CNG buses. I just hope who ever they choose will go a long way to improving NICE in general. As for a C40LF it's not out of the question either. They could also be used as well. Yes, i know NICE needs to save money and I know other manufacturers build CNG buses, but wouldn't buying off an existing option be cheaper? NICE is not the only agency that does this to save money. And if you are buying off an order wy not a CNG bus that is spec'd like your entire fleet, right? what do these buses cost? $400,000 -$450,000 a piece? Wouldn't that be one of NICE's best options if the didn't use that option? I'm also going to research what other Veolia run agencies have options left on CNG bus orders, but wouldn't they ultimately chose a good but cheap bus that is spec'd like their current fleet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel Up Front Posted July 3, 2012 Share #6 Posted July 3, 2012 If those Gilligs turn out to be lemons, they'll only drain more money than a bus that was slightly more expensive but more reliable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ MC Posted July 3, 2012 Share #7 Posted July 3, 2012 If those Gilligs turn out to be lemons, they'll only drain more money than a bus that was slightly more expensive but more reliable. C40LF is a New Flyer model not a Gillig. The Advatage from Gillig is similair, but there are external differences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailBus63 Posted July 4, 2012 Share #8 Posted July 4, 2012 It's possible, though I have a bad feeling they're gonna go all "cheapo" next time around with NABI or Gillig crap. This isn't the anymore, this is a private company that needs to save as much money as they can for Nassau County's sake. In most cases where operations are contracted out, the city or county buys the buses. Even when Veolia does oversee the purchase of new buses, there's no proof they go cheap - for the New Orleans RTA, they bought Orion VII's instead of Gilligs or NABI's. There are also other transit agencies they operate for which have New Flyers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VWM Posted July 4, 2012 Share #9 Posted July 4, 2012 If I see one Gillig, NABI, or any other hunk of junk like that in the system, I will puke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailBus63 Posted July 4, 2012 Share #10 Posted July 4, 2012 If I see one Gillig, NABI, or any other hunk of junk like that in the system, I will puke. So that explains the puke I saw on the ground at Bedford Park Blvd. last time I was there ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VWM Posted July 4, 2012 Share #11 Posted July 4, 2012 So that explains the puke I saw on the ground at Bedford Park Blvd. last time I was there ... Lol, I havent been to the Bronx in 2 years or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threxx Posted July 4, 2012 Share #12 Posted July 4, 2012 The C40LF is a retired model that was only brought back because the pressured New Flyer. The C40 is out of the question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Novabus 5000 Posted July 4, 2012 Share #13 Posted July 4, 2012 Its not the worst idea.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burrstone Posted July 5, 2012 Author Share #14 Posted July 5, 2012 The C40LF is a retired model that was only brought back because the pressured New Flyer. The C40 is out of the question. You said it was built because of pressure form the . So, if there is an interest in it I'm sure anything's possible... AND if you read my post I was talking about an option the has on a current order, so that wouldn't make it out of the question, would it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYCtrainfan01 Posted July 5, 2012 Share #15 Posted July 5, 2012 If NICE does decide to order from New Flyer, I think it would be the C40LFR since the LF model is discontinued... Or they can order the XN40. I believe the C40LF option the has is only for NYC.... I believe they are going to exercise it too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SevenEleven Posted July 5, 2012 Share #16 Posted July 5, 2012 The C40LF is a retired model that was only brought back because the pressured New Flyer. The C40 is out of the question. Nope. We wound up with the old face because the CTA placed an order for the last LF production buses but backed out last minute. Thus, the LF option was still available. The and MTA Maryland were two of the transit agencies that took advantage. We obviously got them with the C40s and Maryland with their artics. @Burrstone: I think that the only options left are from the ones that are coming up. The has 30 on their 74 buses, if exercised and the order coming in for NICE is the last option from the 2009 order. (IIRC) I don't think NICE will be able to piggyback since whatever we're getting will be retiring our V CNGs and older C40s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burrstone Posted July 5, 2012 Author Share #17 Posted July 5, 2012 @Burrstone: I think that the only options left are from the ones that are coming up. The has 30 on their 74 buses, if exercised and the order coming in for NICE is the last option from the 2009 order. (IIRC) I don't think NICE will be able to piggyback since whatever we're getting will be retiring our V CNGs and older C40s. So what options does (or will have in a year or two) for CNG buses? If NICE does decide to order from New Flyer, I think it would be the C40LFR since the LF model is discontinued... Or they can order the XN40. I believe the C40LF option the has is only for NYC.... I believe they are going to exercise it too. Yes, I also believe the will exersize this option for multiple reasons but a guy can dream can't he...? lol As far as "if NICE decides to order from New Flyer." IMHO I believe NICE will chose to order from an existing option (whoever it will be) rather than choosing a new company and putting in a new order, it's just cheaper and quicker that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burrstone Posted July 5, 2012 Author Share #18 Posted July 5, 2012 ...and if other agencies showed interest I don't think seeing the C40LF back on the menu is far off. I mean it's not like they'd have to scramble to find parts, or find out how to build the thing again considering it's in production now. With so many competitors it would be stupid to turn interested customers away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailBus63 Posted July 6, 2012 Share #19 Posted July 6, 2012 ...and if other agencies showed interest I don't think seeing the C40LF back on the menu is far off. I mean it's not like they'd have to scramble to find parts, or find out how to build the thing again considering it's in production now. With so many competitors it would be stupid to turn interested customers away. Judging by the sales numbers, New Flyer's customers are happy with the more modern-looking LFR and Xcelsior series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burrstone Posted July 6, 2012 Author Share #20 Posted July 6, 2012 Judging by the sales numbers, New Flyer's customers are happy with the more modern-looking LFR and Xcelsior series. Could you tell me the sales numbers for the Xcelsior & LFR (I'm asking cause I don't know). It seems when I read about an order these days) it's for a few up to 20 and maybe 40 rarely. They seem to pale in comparison to the 's order of C40LF's. Do you honestly believe that if a customer called New Flyer tomorrow wanting an order of 200+ C40LF's like the is getting they'd tell them no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailBus63 Posted July 6, 2012 Share #21 Posted July 6, 2012 Could you tell me the sales numbers for the Xcelsior & LFR (I'm asking cause I don't know). It seems when I read about an order these days) it's for a few up to 20 and maybe 40 rarely. They seem to pale in comparison to the 's order of C40LF's. Do you honestly believe that if a customer called New Flyer tomorrow wanting an order of 200+ C40LF's like the is getting they'd tell them no? Sales numbers don't really tell you anything. Yes, the NYCTA threw its weight around and demanded the LF model, but a look at what New Flyer has been selling in recent years when they offered both the LF and LFR shows a definite preference for the LFR series, even from customers who already had the LF model and may have been inclined to standardize (SEPTA, MARTA, King County Metro, WMATA, Baltimore MTA, OCTA, various Toronto-area operators such as Mississaiga Transit, etc.). Even CTA didn't make a fuss and demand the return of the LF when it placed its latest order. Most agencies would rather go for a sleek new design instead of the early 1990's look of the LF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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