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FamousNYLover

Staten Island Bus Proposal Thread 2012-2013

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I proposed it for 7-day service, and during the early morning and weekends, it would run local. Keep in mind that I still want bus lanes and TSP, but just not off-board fare payment.

 

 

Off-board fare payment saves a lot of time. I am really antsy for the SBS on the B44 here in Brooklyn, but New Flyer is screwing around with the artics...

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So basically a Q44/Q53 7 day a week limited i.e they run 630am-10pm Monday-Saturday and 8am-930pm sundays is what your propose for the S79 right?

 

 

Eh, maybe not that long. I mean, once the frequency for the local lines gets worse than 20 minutes, I'd just run all-local service. In the evening, the locals don't run too bad anyway.

 

Off-board fare payment saves a lot of time. I am really antsy for the SBS on the B44 here in Brooklyn, but New Flyer is screwing around with the artics...

 

 

The thing is that the S79 doesn't really run that frequently, so if you miss one because you were fumbling with the ticket machine, you could be waiting a while for the next one. It's not like you have 5 minute headways the whole day or anything.

 

I mean to me, the big expense time-wise is having to stop the bus. Once it's stopped, then it doesn't really take that much longer to load the people the old-fashioned way. I don't really ride the buses in the other boroughs much, but I don't think you have the huge crowds you get at big stops like The Junction or anything like that. I mean for the most part, you have heavy loading at the first stop in Bay Ridge, and then for the rest of the trip, the loading isn't too bad. A lot of times (not all the time of course), you can load the people while the light is red, and then when it turns green, you're good to go.

 

I'm not vehmently opposed or anything, but I would just prefer to keep things as is.

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I sent my proposal to the head of the Ferry Riders Committee, so we'll see if we can work together to actually pass some of these proposals. B) They actually sent me a response the next day saying they'd be willing to help.

 

They mostly deal with the ferry service, but obviously, the bus system is interconnected to the ferry, and a lot of ferry riders (obviously) use buses to reach the ferry.

 

Their website is http://statenislandferryriders.com/.

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Eh, maybe not that long. I mean, once the frequency for the local lines gets worse than 20 minutes, I'd just run all-local service. In the evening, the locals don't run too bad anyway.

 

 

 

The thing is that the S79 doesn't really run that frequently, so if you miss one because you were fumbling with the ticket machine, you could be waiting a while for the next one. It's not like you have 5 minute headways the whole day or anything.

 

I mean to me, the big expense time-wise is having to stop the bus. Once it's stopped, then it doesn't really take that much longer to load the people the old-fashioned way. I don't really ride the buses in the other boroughs much, but I don't think you have the huge crowds you get at big stops like The Junction or anything like that. I mean for the most part, you have heavy loading at the first stop in Bay Ridge, and then for the rest of the trip, the loading isn't too bad. A lot of times (not all the time of course), you can load the people while the light is red, and then when it turns green, you're good to go.

 

I'm not vehmently opposed or anything, but I would just prefer to keep things as is.

 

 

I don't understand how you come up with your conclusions... You say that you don't really ride the other buses in the other neighborhoods, but yet you conclude that you don't think that the loading is that bad... Based on what???

 

The S79 would benefit from paying before boarding and I DO know because I've used the line to say so.

Edited by Via Garibaldi 8

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I don't understand how you come up with your conclusions... You say that you don't really ride the other buses in the other neighborhoods, but yet you conclude that you don't think that the loading is that bad... Based on what???

 

The S79 would benefit from paying before boarding and I DO know because I've used the line to say so.

 

 

I said I don't really ride the buses in other neighborhoods, but geez, how am I supposed to ride a bus that doesn't go to any of the destinations I need to get to on a regular basis?

 

Yeah, I ride it occasionally. I don't live in a bubble. I ride it enough to get a basic idea of the ridership habits. It's just not one of the main lines I use. It's not like I never go down towards Hylan Blvd (and it's not like I rode one time for 2 stops and am basing the experience just on that)

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I said I don't really ride the buses in other neighborhoods, but geez, how am I supposed to ride a bus that doesn't go to any of the destinations I need to get to on a regular basis?

 

Yeah, I ride it occasionally. I don't live in a bubble. I ride it enough to get a basic idea of the ridership habits. It's just not one of the main lines I use. It's not like I never go down towards Hylan Blvd (and it's not like I rode one time for 2 stops and am basing the experience just on that)

 

 

There's no problem with that, but I do have a problem with you assuming things that you're really not sure of. The S79 is much like the S53 in some instances and it would benefit from having a pay before boarding system. That would be the first step in trying to get the buses from bunching so much because they get bogged down with boarding at several stops.

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There's no problem with that, but I do have a problem with you assuming things that you're really not sure of. The S79 is much like the S53 in some instances and it would benefit from having a pay before boarding system. That would be the first step in trying to get the buses from bunching so much because they get bogged down with boarding at several stops.

 

 

I'm not assuming things I'm not really sure of.

 

Like I said, the fact that it's infrequent makes it harder to justify off-board fare payment. And like I said, at a lot of stops (like say, Clove & Hylan or New Dorp & Hylan), the bus can pick up and drop off the people, and then by the time the light turns green, they're ready to go.

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I'm not assuming things I'm not really sure of.

 

Like I said, the fact that it's infrequent makes it harder to justify off-board fare payment. And like I said, at a lot of stops (like say, Clove & Hylan or New Dorp & Hylan), the bus can pick up and drop off the people, and then by the time the light turns green, they're ready to go.

 

 

If you know so much about the route which you ride "occasionally" then explain why it suffers so much from bunching #1 and #2 explain why the (MTA) thinks that it should be a SBS route...

Edited by Via Garibaldi 8

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If you know so much about the route which you ride "occasionally" then explain why it suffers so much from bunching #1 and #2 explain why the (MTA) thinks that it should be a SBS route...

 

 

B35 gave a fairly accurate description for the reason. Basically, the issue (maybe not the issue, but a major factor) is that the route has a lot of periods of inactivity and periods with activity. For instance, in the Great Kills area, you can often go nonstop, but then in New Dorp, you could have a lot of people getting on and off. And then of course, you have the Verrazanno Bridge (not necessarily because of the traffic, but because it's a long nonstop segment and then as soon as it hits Brooklyn it starts making a lot of stops). That, and it's a long route in general, which is why sometimes if I'm waiting at say, Eltingville, I can easily see 2 or 3 S79s before an S59 passes, but then there's a big gap before the next group of S79s. Plus, traffic along certain parts of Hylan Blvd (for instance, New Dorp) can tie up the route.

 

I mean, I definitely support bus lanes and traffic signal priority, but it's just the off-board fare payment that I don't like, because it's not a particularly frequent route outside of rush hours. Like I said, I'm not vehemently opposed to it, but I just don't think it's needed.

 

As for why the MTA thinks the S79 should have +SBS+, I think it's just to say "Oh, look, we didn't forget Staten Island". I think a route like the Bx41, B82 or Q43 or something should get +SBS+ before the S79 does, even if it means a borough gets 2 +SBS+ routes while SI doesn't have any. I mean, out of all the SI routes, the S79 is the best candidate for +SBS+. I mean, all routes could and should get TSP, but bus lanes won't really work on that many streets. Either there's no space or there aren't enough buses to justify taking away space from cars (I mean, if the bus runs every 15 minutes, it's not really worth taking away a lane from cars, since the lane moves more people as a car lane, or it's more useful as a parking lane), but that doesn't necessarily mean the S79 has to get +SBS+.

 

The MTA made a chart showing what percentage of the time a bus spends moving, and on average, it's something like 54% of the time is spent in motion, 20% is spent at traffic lights, and 20% is spent at the stops themselves (and then another few percentage points for other miscellaneous delays). If you get rid of the traffic light factor by putting TSP on the buses, it saves 20% right there, and bus lanes (if enforced properly) can save another few percentage points. Keep in mind that it still takes time for a bus to stop and pick up the passengers, even if they don't dip in a MetroCard, so even with POP, you're not going to eliminate the full 20%.

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shortline I say yes to points 1&2 but no to 3 the reason if ppl had a choice between (R) or (N) the ppl would choose the N connection everytime. Ppl only put up with (R) cause it is the only subway that links to S53/79 If those buses went to 59th (R) ridership to those lines would drop and ppl looking for connections would abandon the (R)

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B35 gave a fairly accurate description for the reason. Basically, the issue (maybe not the issue, but a major factor) is that the route has a lot of periods of inactivity and periods with activity. For instance, in the Great Kills area, you can often go nonstop, but then in New Dorp, you could have a lot of people getting on and off. And then of course, you have the Verrazanno Bridge (not necessarily because of the traffic, but because it's a long nonstop segment and then as soon as it hits Brooklyn it starts making a lot of stops). That, and it's a long route in general, which is why sometimes if I'm waiting at say, Eltingville, I can easily see 2 or 3 S79s before an S59 passes, but then there's a big gap before the next group of S79s. Plus, traffic along certain parts of Hylan Blvd (for instance, New Dorp) can tie up the route.

 

I mean, I definitely support bus lanes and traffic signal priority, but it's just the off-board fare payment that I don't like, because it's not a particularly frequent route outside of rush hours. Like I said, I'm not vehemently opposed to it, but I just don't think it's needed.

 

As for why the MTA thinks the S79 should have +SBS+, I think it's just to say "Oh, look, we didn't forget Staten Island". I think a route like the Bx41, B82 or Q43 or something should get +SBS+ before the S79 does, even if it means a borough gets 2 +SBS+ routes while SI doesn't have any. I mean, out of all the SI routes, the S79 is the best candidate for +SBS+. I mean, all routes could and should get TSP, but bus lanes won't really work on that many streets. Either there's no space or there aren't enough buses to justify taking away space from cars (I mean, if the bus runs every 15 minutes, it's not really worth taking away a lane from cars, since the lane moves more people as a car lane, or it's more useful as a parking lane), but that doesn't necessarily mean the S79 has to get +SBS+.

 

The MTA made a chart showing what percentage of the time a bus spends moving, and on average, it's something like 54% of the time is spent in motion, 20% is spent at traffic lights, and 20% is spent at the stops themselves (and then another few percentage points for other miscellaneous delays). If you get rid of the traffic light factor by putting TSP on the buses, it saves 20% right there, and bus lanes (if enforced properly) can save another few percentage points. Keep in mind that it still takes time for a bus to stop and pick up the passengers, even if they don't dip in a MetroCard, so even with POP, you're not going to eliminate the full 20%.

 

Yeah and I remember that description pretty well and one reason included the buses getting bogged down with boarding at certain stops...

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shortline I say yes to points 1&2 but no to 3 the reason if ppl had a choice between (R) or (N) the ppl would choose the N connection everytime. Ppl only put up with (R) cause it is the only subway that links to S53/79 If those buses went to 59th (R) ridership to those lines would drop and ppl looking for connections would abandon the (R)

 

Not necessarily. You do have some people who are going to Downtown Brooklyn, where it's not worth transferring back and forth from the local to the express (though if they go to 59th Street, they could take the (N) and try and catch up to the (R)).

 

Yeah and I remember that description pretty well and one reason included the buses getting bogged down with boarding at certain stops...

 

I'm saying it would help, but it's not direly needed IMO.

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I'm saying it would help, but it's not direly needed IMO.

 

Uhhh ooookayyy... <_<

Edited by Via Garibaldi 8

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B35 gave a fairly accurate description for the reason. Basically, the issue (maybe not the issue, but a major factor) is that the route has a lot of periods of inactivity and periods with activity.
Yeah and I remember that description pretty well and one reason included the buses getting bogged down with boarding at certain stops...

lol... How did I end up in this....

 

I don't mind anyone agreeing with anything I say, but Via asked you (Checkmate) to explain what it is he asked about - In regards to whatever assumption(s) or questionable conclusions he felt you were making.... Not sure if you realize it, but you basically proved his conjecture by bringing me up the way you did there......

 

Despite that.... Can either one of you two refresh my memory, because I don't have the faintest idea of what statement/description of mine that's being referred to here.....

 

 

As for why the MTA thinks the S79 should have +SBS+, I think it's just to say "Oh, look, we didn't forget Staten Island".

This is why I generally don't like to talk about SI's routes.... the never-ending *we're the victim* mentality out of SI-ers.... Any cut, and it's "they don't care about us" (as a borough)... Any addition, and it's one done out of possible supposed pity....

 

Not saying this is specifically you, but you can't bitch about the shitty service in SI... then knock just about every attempt that's made to try to improve matters.... When it comes to public transportation, this is the one major gripe I have about SI..... You can't improve on anything by keeping matters stagnant.....

 

As critical of the MTA that I am, I can't agree with this notion that the MTA thought about running an SBS route out in SI due to simple inclusion.... What I do think is, they chose the 79 over the 53 due to the fact that the 79 travels a "straighter" path..... Of course, the 53 being the route w/ the higher ridership.....

Edited by B35 via Church
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lol... How did I end up in this....

 

I don't mind anyone agreeing with anything I say, but Via asked you (Checkmate) to explain what it is he asked about - In regards to whatever assumption(s) or questionable conclusions he felt you were making.... Not sure if you realize it, but you basically proved his conjecture by bringing me up the way you did there......

 

Despite that.... Can either one of you two refresh my memory, because I don't have the faintest idea of what statement/description of mine that's being referred to here.....

 

 

 

This is why I generally don't like to talk about SI's routes.... the never-ending *we're the victim* mentality out of SI-ers.... Any cut, and it's "they don't care about us" (as a borough)... Any addition, and it's one done out of possible supposed pity....

 

Not saying this is specifically you, but you can't bitch about the shitty service in SI... then knock just about every attempt that's made to try to improve matters.... When it comes to public transportation, this is the one major gripe I have about SI..... You can't improve on anything by keeping matters stagnant.....

 

As critical of the MTA that I am, I can't agree with this notion that the MTA thought about running an SBS route out in SI due to simple inclusion.... What I do think is, they chose the 79 over the 53 due to the fact that the 79 travels a "straighter" path..... Of course, the 53 being the route w/ the higher ridership.....

 

Some months ago you mentioned having used the S79 and talked about why it suffers from being delayed/bunching and basically the main reason was that buses get bogged down with heavy loading at certain stops. As for the SI mentality, I do believe that SIers have a valid gripe. Even the (MTA) has admitted that SI should have more service, but they claim that they simply can't afford to add it.

 

They've also stated for years that they couldn't add more service on SI because their depots were over capacity, but when Charleston opened up the idea was that more service would be gradually added. Mind you SI has been fighting for that new depot for over 20 years, so it's been many years that SIers have been shortchanged when it comes to more service.

 

What always pissed me was okay, so you can't give us more frequent service, fine, but if I've got a bus running every half hour, at least make sure that I get that bus and don't have the bus go MIA or come whenever when there is no excuse for it (i.e. no traffic, etc.). Travel within Staten Island has to be the worst out of all of the boroughs, mainly because buses come when they want and don't come as scheduled (or at least that was certainly the case before Bus Time), so I think if the (MTA) just provided the service that they're supposed to have on SI, the complaints would be less, though of course there would still be complaints because there should be more service on some lines to match the growing demand. A line like the S79 for example has seen cutbacks instead of more added service.

 

In sum I always had the feeling that living on SI, I should just be happy for whatever service we got and that was it and that was another reason I left because it was clear to me that the (MTA) was going to continue to drag their feet on providing the service that they should've been providing a long time ago. Furthermore, I think the (MTA) has this mentality that SI doesn't need the service that it gets because most folks drive or can drive, so why bother giving them more service? The car mentality on SI doesn't help either.

 

In sum Staten Islanders feel shortchanged because the (MTA) has made empty promises.

Edited by Via Garibaldi 8
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Some months ago you mentioned having used the S79 and talked about why it suffers from being delayed/bunching and basically the main reason was that buses get bogged down with heavy loading at certain stops. As for the SI mentality, I do believe that SIers have a valid gripe. Even the (MTA) has admitted that SI should have more service, but they claim that they simply can't afford to add it.....

 

....In sum Staten Islanders feel shortchanged because the (MTA) has made empty promises.

 

Oh I know their gripes aren't baseless; if I thought SI-ers were a bunch of delusionists, I'd have quickly pointed that out....

What I was gettin at, is that the victim mentality is far too apparent (and quite frankly IMO, annoying)...

I get the sense that no matter what the MTA does, SI-ers will never be satisfied......

 

The last point.... yep, they feel the same way about JAzumah's services....

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Oh I know their gripes aren't baseless; if I thought SI-ers were a bunch of delusionists, I'd have quickly pointed that out....

What I was gettin at, is that the victim mentality is far too apparent (and quite frankly IMO, annoying)...

I get the sense that no matter what the MTA does, SI-ers will never be satisfied......

 

The last point.... yep, they feel the same way about JAzumah's services....

 

 

Well I can understand where they're coming from... They have the least representation out of all of the boroughs and the small amount of representation they have usually doesn't do much to help them so they simply have a lack of trust for folks on many levels. They're on the receiving end of most jokes and feel like the odd guy out, so it isn't a surprise that they complain because they have a lot to complain about quite frankly.

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1) lol... How did I end up in this....

 

I don't mind anyone agreeing with anything I say, but Via asked you (Checkmate) to explain what it is he asked about - In regards to whatever assumption(s) or questionable conclusions he felt you were making.... Not sure if you realize it, but you basically proved his conjecture by bringing me up the way you did there......

 

Despite that.... Can either one of you two refresh my memory, because I don't have the faintest idea of what statement/description of mine that's being referred to here.....

 

2) This is why I generally don't like to talk about SI's routes.... the never-ending *we're the victim* mentality out of SI-ers.... Any cut, and it's "they don't care about us" (as a borough)... Any addition, and it's one done out of possible supposed pity....

 

Not saying this is specifically you, but you can't bitch about the shitty service in SI... then knock just about every attempt that's made to try to improve matters.... When it comes to public transportation, this is the one major gripe I have about SI..... You can't improve on anything by keeping matters stagnant.....

 

As critical of the MTA that I am, I can't agree with this notion that the MTA thought about running an SBS route out in SI due to simple inclusion.... What I do think is, they chose the 79 over the 53 due to the fact that the 79 travels a "straighter" path..... Of course, the 53 being the route w/ the higher ridership.....

 

 

1) Well, I did add my own opinion in that just by being a long route in general, and hitting the traffic along parts of Hylan Blvd (like say, in New Dorp) can often tie up the route. But other than that, I was just pointing out that your description of a main reason being the varying periods of activity and inactivity being a factor (which, now that I think about it, "activity" can also mean traffic in addition to passengers boarding)

 

I'm surprised the search function doesn't work, or else I'd just link it to you, but basically, you gave an example of how it typically plays out going Brooklyn-bound (the first bus gets delayed, and then gets hit with all the passengers, and then a second bus doesn't get delayed, and often ends up getting ahead of schedule. Eventually, because of those quiet stretches along Hylan Blvd, it catches up to the first S79, and then depending on the traffic lights in Brooklyn, you could see 3 buses along 86th Street at once (I think that post was made back when the S79 made the same clockwise loop in Brooklyn the S53/93 make).

 

2) Well, that and the streets are wider on the S79, so it makes it easier to have bus lanes and everything.

 

1) As for the SI mentality, I do believe that SIers have a valid gripe. Even the (MTA) has admitted that SI should have more service, but they claim that they simply can't afford to add it.

 

2) What always pissed me was okay, so you can't give us more frequent service, fine, but if I've got a bus running every half hour, at least make sure that I get that bus and don't have the bus go MIA or come whenever when there is no excuse for it (i.e. no traffic, etc.). Travel within Staten Island has to be the worst out of all of the boroughs, mainly because buses come when they want and don't come as scheduled (or at least that was certainly the case before Bus Time), so I think if the (MTA) just provided the service that they're supposed to have on SI, the complaints would be less, though of course there would still be complaints because there should be more service on some lines to match the growing demand. A line like the S79 for example has seen cutbacks instead of more added service.

 

3) In sum I always had the feeling that living on SI, I should just be happy for whatever service we got and that was it and that was another reason I left because it was clear to me that the (MTA) was going to continue to drag their feet on providing the service that they should've been providing a long time ago. Furthermore, I think the (MTA) has this mentality that SI doesn't need the service that it gets because most folks drive or can drive, so why bother giving them more service? The car mentality on SI doesn't help either.

 

 

1) They can't afford it for the other boroughs either. Even before the service reductions, they really weren't gung-ho about improving service there either. The only time they made any significant service improvements (and those were only frequency changes and not really expanding routes into new neighborhoods) was when they took over the private lines, and that was only because of the blank-check agreement. I mean, especially in Brooklyn, some lines are completely antiquated. Yeah, the buses may not be crushloaded, but it doesn't mean they aren't underserved in certain areas. In some cases, the buses don't effectively serve the needs of the community, or at least, they could be more effective)

 

2) Well I agree with you about the buses coming early or going MIA. That's why I always felt that if necessary, they should cut the runtime slightly on some routes. Buses dragging the line don't help anybody, and maybe the MTA could even use that to add more service (since buses aren't dragging the line, they could run every 15 minutes instead of every 20)

 

As for the S79, they did add some service. They just cut one run during middays, but they added service on the weekends. (I think headways went from 15 minutes to 12 minutes in the evenings or something)

 

3) Plus, to add onto that, in general, they don't believe in adding service resulting in improved ridership, which in some cases might even be able to defray most or all of the cost. They do see a need, even in more car-centric areas (I mean, why else did they extend the S55 down Bloomingdale Road, and when I submitted my S93 proposal, they explicitly admitted that they saw the need for east-west service in this area), so it's not like they're really assuming that everybody who's not currently taking a bus is going to drive.

 

Well I can understand where they're coming from... They have the least representation out of all of the boroughs and the small amount of representation they have usually doesn't do much to help them so they simply have a lack of trust for folks on many levels. They're on the receiving end of most jokes and feel like the odd guy out, so it isn't a surprise that they complain because they have a lot to complain about quite frankly.

 

 

We have the least representation because we have the least population. We have 6% of the city's population (and like 4% of local bus riders), so how much representation are we supposed to get?

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We have the least representation because we have the least population. We have 6% of the city's population (and like 4% of local bus riders), so how much representation are we supposed to get?

 

 

I wasn't referring to that specifically... I was referring to the fact that SI representatives don't have as much pull as others do, though the South Shore does get more attention overall when things do happen.

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I wasn't referring to that specifically... I was referring to the fact that SI representatives don't have as much pull as others do, though the South Shore does get more attention overall when things do happen.

 

 

Eh, I wouldn't say that. I mean, they were able to get some of the North Shore service reductions restored (though we don't necessarily know if the MTA did that on their own just to make it look like they "saved" a few routes). I'm referring to the S42 running during rush hours and the S66 serving Grymes Hill.

 

By the way, for anybody who's intererested, somebody's conducting a survey regarding BusTime: http://www.subchat.com/buschat/readflat.asp?Id=259674

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I have a problem with the S/79 SBS and it involves two other players besides Staten island namely Brooklyn (86th Street terminal) and the New York City Department of Transportation. Taking the latter first, BusChat is reporting that the City Department of Transportation is considering cutting the number of lanes on 86th Street east from 4th Avenue by one as there has been too many pedestrian accidents.When i used to take the S/79 bus to Staten Island at 6 AM in the morning, there was no problem as there was no traffic. In the afternoon, it was a zoo with the double parkers and everyone was trying to go around them. You could spend ten plus minutes to go the two blocks to Fort Hamilton Parkway at that time. The second is the B/1 change with the B/64 which added traffic to the 86th Street terminal. Interestingly, there is talk on buschat to extend the B/1 to 3rd Avenue as well which would free up space at 4th Avenue but cause problems with the B/16. If we add the antics and the fare machines, and the wide turns at 86th Street to this equation, you now have a tolerable situation becoming an impossible situation.

 

I agree with Checkmatechamp13, Via Garibaldi and everyone who believes that traffic signal priority and bus lanes in both directions on Hylan Boulevard from Tysens Lane to Clove Road will help the S/79 more than SBS. My opposition to the Antics is based on the all the detours that the S/79 had to take due to accidents, brush fires and everything else that happens. Hylan Boulevard may be wide enough for antics but when the S/79 has to detour to Amboy Road (or Richmond Road) on one lane streets and then turn onto these streets (which are just bad if not worse), forget it. I agree that S/79 needs better service (having rode this route and seeing it grow from when it started to go to Brooklyn with the limited hours into the route that it is today but antics and SBS is not the answer.

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No quotes, b/c I'm about to jet right now.... but in any event:

 

- Via, I already said SI-ers gripes aren't baseless.... Ok, so you say you understand where they're coming from... all well & good... however, in basically repeating yourself, all you're doing is solidifying a stance that's not being disputed.....

 

- I cannot believe that SI's representatives don't have as much pull as reps of other communities; SI's political pull is weaker than those of the other boroughs..... See, that's exactly the victim mentality being displayed I'm referring to.... What I would say is that SI's reps (when it comes to transit, I'm talking about) use more of their "political muscle" when it comes to an express route over a local route....

 

As far as the reps of certain communities in the other outerboroughs though, you will see far more of a fight regarding the local buses of that/those particular communities..... Park Slope, Parkchester, and (dare I say it... ughk) Country Club are real good examples of that.... Hell, I can even throw your newfound neighborhood in that mix as well.....

 

 

- Yeah, South Shore definitely gets more of the focus compared to the North Shore when it comes down to politics.....

 

 

- That survey Checkmate linked.... I also have the same questions "Brooklyn67" (the name rings a bell) have.....

On top of that, I don't know what the ultimate goal of this survey even is.... Usually, a survey is done to try to achieve a desired result....

 

"The goal of the study to help evaluate a tool that tells you where the next bus is."

In other words, the goal of the survey is to help evaluate bustime ?????? Any idiot that uses bustime can evaluate it....

And just WTF does my income, my age, my race, and my online browsing habits gotta do with evaluating bustime....

 

smh.... on that note, I'm outta here for a couple.....

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I have a problem with the S/79 SBS and it involves two other players besides Staten island namely Brooklyn (86th Street terminal) and the New York City Department of Transportation. Taking the latter first, BusChat is reporting that the City Department of Transportation is considering cutting the number of lanes on 86th Street east from 4th Avenue by one as there has been too many pedestrian accidents.When i used to take the S/79 bus to Staten Island at 6 AM in the morning, there was no problem as there was no traffic. In the afternoon, it was a zoo with the double parkers and everyone was trying to go around them. You could spend ten plus minutes to go the two blocks to Fort Hamilton Parkway at that time. The second is the B/1 change with the B/64 which added traffic to the 86th Street terminal. Interestingly, there is talk on buschat to extend the B/1 to 3rd Avenue as well which would free up space at 4th Avenue but cause problems with the B/16. If we add the antics and the fare machines, and the wide turns at 86th Street to this equation, you now have a tolerable situation becoming an impossible situation.

 

I agree with Checkmatechamp13, Via Garibaldi and everyone who believes that traffic signal priority and bus lanes in both directions on Hylan Boulevard from Tysens Lane to Clove Road will help the S/79 more than SBS. My opposition to the Antics is based on the all the detours that the S/79 had to take due to accidents, brush fires and everything else that happens. Hylan Boulevard may be wide enough for antics but when the S/79 has to detour to Amboy Road (or Richmond Road) on one lane streets and then turn onto these streets (which are just bad if not worse), forget it. I agree that S/79 needs better service (having rode this route and seeing it grow from when it started to go to Brooklyn with the limited hours into the route that it is today but antics and SBS is not the answer.

 

If that's the case, that's one more reason for the buses to terminate at the 59th Street station instead of the 86th Street station: Less interference with traffic (and like I said, they could take the faster route along the Gowanus to avoid 86th Street entirely)

 

As for +SBS+, I 100% agree that artics aren't needed (and yes, VG8, I have seen how crowded some of the buses get. The solution to that is to just add a little bit of service rather than putting artics all throughout the line). The thing is: Do you think that proof-of-payment (just getting a ticket and having a random inspection) is better than the current system where you just dip your MetroCard? Because that's another feature of +SBS+.

 

No quotes, b/c I'm about to jet right now.... but in any event:

 

"The goal of the study to help evaluate a tool that tells you where the next bus is."

In other words, the goal of the survey is to help evaluate bustime ?????? Any idiot that uses bustime can evaluate it....

And just WTF does my income, my age, my race, and my online browsing habits gotta do with evaluating bustime....

 

smh.... on that note, I'm outta here for a couple.....

 

I guess supposedly, they want to see if certain groups are being excluded from using BusTime (the elderly because they don't know how to use the Internet, or the poor because they can't afford a phone, etc).

 

The thing is that if they can't use BusTime, they likely aren't going to be browsing the Internet looking for these types of surveys. (And aside from that, isn't it self-explanatory that those groups would be excluded. And realistically, what can you do about it?)

 

In any case, I put it out for VG8 in case he was interested, since we know he thinks BusTime is the greatest creation since sliced bread. :D I don't think any other users on here really use BusTime, but if they use it and are interested then hey, more power to them.

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If that's the case, that's one more reason for the buses to terminate at the 59th Street station instead of the 86th Street station: Less interference with traffic (and like I said, they could take the faster route along the Gowanus to avoid 86th Street entirely)

 

As for +SBS+, I 100% agree that artics aren't needed (and yes, VG8, I have seen how crowded some of the buses get. The solution to that is to just add a little bit of service rather than putting artics all throughout the line). The thing is: Do you think that proof-of-payment (just getting a ticket and having a random inspection) is better than the current system where you just dip your MetroCard? Because that's another feature of +SBS+.

 

I don't think it is superior, considering they don't actually inspect the buses as often as they should.

 

I guess supposedly, they want to see if certain groups are being excluded from using BusTime (the elderly because they don't know how to use the Internet, or the poor because they can't afford a phone, etc).

 

The thing is that if they can't use BusTime, they likely aren't going to be browsing the Internet looking for these types of surveys. (And aside from that, isn't it self-explanatory that those groups would be excluded. And realistically, what can you do about it?)

 

In any case, I put it out for VG8 in case he was interested, since we know he thinks BusTime is the greatest creation since sliced bread. :D I don't think any other users on here really use BusTime, but if they use it and are interested then hey, more power to them.

 

 

BusTime is a tool, like the MetroCard. You can still use coins, but the MetroCard helps you organize your fare. You could use a schedule, but it dosen't tell you if your bus is early or late. BusTime helps you with that. I don't know if this makes sense, but the point is to have it there to be used, even if it hasn't caught on yet.

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No quotes, b/c I'm about to jet right now.... but in any event:

 

- Via, I already said SI-ers gripes aren't baseless.... Ok, so you say you understand where they're coming from... all well & good... however, in basically repeating yourself, all you're doing is solidifying a stance that's not being disputed.....

 

- I cannot believe that SI's representatives don't have as much pull as reps of other communities; SI's political pull is weaker than those of the other boroughs..... See, that's exactly the victim mentality being displayed I'm referring to.... What I would say is that SI's reps (when it comes to transit, I'm talking about) use more of their "political muscle" when it comes to an express route over a local route....

 

As far as the reps of certain communities in the other outerboroughs though, you will see far more of a fight regarding the local buses of that/those particular communities..... Park Slope, Parkchester, and (dare I say it... ughk) Country Club are real good examples of that.... Hell, I can even throw your newfound neighborhood in that mix as well.....

 

 

- Yeah, South Shore definitely gets more of the focus compared to the North Shore when it comes down to politics.....

 

 

Yeah, but you said that their gripes are overboard... I was simply giving background to the situation as to what goes on there and why they feel the way that they do because some folks aren't on the up and up when it comes to Staten Island. The post was quoting you, but was also giving out some general information since of course others are reading this thread.

 

As for SI Representatives not having pull, there is some truth to that. Remember that Staten Island is heavily Republican, while New York City overall is heavily Democratic. If you believe that politics don't come into play as to how much pull they have then I've got a bridge to sell you. Now the South Shore gets more clout because it is wealthier and more Republican, though that isn't to say that you don't have wealthy areas on the North Shore that don't vote Republican, but I'll give you a perfect example of the BS that goes on with politics on Staten Island when it comes to transportation esp.

 

Vito Fossella represented all of SI and parts of Southern Brooklyn (i.e. Bay Ridge and Dyker Heights, Bensonhurst & Gravesend) and he fought for dedicated express bus lanes on the Gowanus which he had some success with, but he seemed to push hard for all express bus riders, be it on the North Shore or the South Shore. Now Grimm has come into office and he's done nothing but cater to the South Shore with that X22 as if they're the only ones who need improved express bus service. Mind you he also lives on the South Shore, so he looks out for his immediate backyard which esp. pissed me since I was a North Shore resident who voted for him. Now whatever pull he has, he used it along with another South Shore representative Vincent Ignizio to try to improve the X22 and I wrote to him on a number of occasions calling him out on it because he did NOTHING for the North Shore to improve express bus service, and nor did any of the do nothing North Shore representatives. When the (MTA) put the X16 on the cutting block, residents in West Brighton were especially vocal and the lame representatives for us, especially Debbie Rose pretty much threw in the towel. Rose talks a good game, but she really has little pull at all.

 

Even the borough president talks a good game and talks about how Staten Island needs more buses but that's about it. Now compare that to Senator Golden who represents Bay Ridge and Dyker Heights amongst other areas in Southern Brooklyn who has exhausted all avenues to restore lost express bus service on the X27 and X28, not once, but on several occasions.

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