Here we go again: Wal-Mart looking to open shop in Queens

[Tokkemon]

Walmart is just an example of the inevitable globalization of the world economy. The jobs go to where they are done most cheaply. That's capitalism at its rawest form. What do you expect to do about it? I'm not going to pay more for my food if I don't have to.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Walmart is just an example of the inevitable globalization of the world economy. The jobs go to where they are done most cheaply. That's capitalism at its rawest form. What do you expect to do about it? I'm not going to pay more for my food if I don't have to.

 

 

You keep saying that as if just because it comes from overseas, that automatically makes it cheaper in terms of cost. Not necessarily the case.

[Tokkemon]

Then show me where it's different. I don't give a crap where it comes from. That's the attitude of most Americans, especially the low-income ones without a choice.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Then show me where it's different. I don't give a crap where it comes from. That's the attitude of most Americans, especially the low-income ones without a choice.

 

 

I know you don't... The point you keep raising is that food is cheaper because it comes from overseas, which is not necessarily the case. The thing you also keep refusing to acknowledge or admit is that low prices don't help poor people like yourself have any chance at changing their financial situation down the road. How do you expect to do any better than you are now if there are no decent paying jobs with them being sent overseas? I don't understand how you don't see the correlation between low prices and a lack of decent wages for folks like yourself. Or is that you simply don't care so long as you have your low prices? If that's the case that's funny because soon you may not even be able to afford that if there are no jobs (not even low paying ones).

[Tokkemon]

I'm not making any of those points. I'm just saying that low-income people can't afford expensive versions of products. When you're living month to month, you don't care if American jobs are being sent overseas. You have to eat, not worry about the grander economic problems in life. You don't try to better yourself, you just try to survive.

 

You don't have that problem because you have enough financial security to choose. I agree with you in principle that one shouldn't be buying products that have a greater economic consequence. But some people don't have that option.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I'm not making any of those points. I'm just saying that low-income people can't afford expensive versions of products. When you're living month to month, you don't care if American jobs are being sent overseas. You have to eat, not worry about the grander economic problems in life. You don't try to better yourself, you just try to survive.

 

You don't have that problem because you have enough financial security to choose. I agree with you in principle that one shouldn't be buying products that have a greater economic consequence. But some people don't have that option.

 

 

I'm just saying that not all low priced versions have to come from Walmart. The assumption is that Walmart has the best prices and based on quality, size etc., I'm not so sure that is the case.

[Tokkemon]

Right. So show me where a better place is and I will gladly shop there. From my experience, only a few select discount grocery stores come close, like A&P or GIANT.

[Shortline Bus]

Actually B& J and Coastco can be cheaper than Target or Wal-Mart. However they require a annual fee i.e $50-$1000 as they are both wholesale stores.

[Tokkemon]

True. But living month to month doesn't allow people to have that annual fee, or to buy in bulk.

[CenSin]

Sometimes I wonder if economic equality is even achievable. Everyone group will always want something better for themselves, and the economy is a multidimensional tug-of-war that often sees different groups winning out and other groups losing. The fight for wealth is a zero-sum game. There will always be winners that won't want to give anything up, and because of that there will always be losers. Some country will buy another's natural resources cheaply, and deprive it of its ability to develop needed infrastructure to grow. Some country will allow its workers to be exploited like slaves to create wealth for another country. Some country will flood another country with highly-desired goods, draining their wealth.

[MHV9218]

Sometimes I wonder if economic equality is even achievable. Everyone group will always want something better for themselves, and the economy is a multidimensional tug-of-war that often sees different groups winning out and other groups losing. The fight for wealth is a zero-sum game. There will always be winners that won't want to give anything up, and because of that there will always be losers. Some country will buy another's natural resources cheaply, and deprive it of its ability to develop needed infrastructure to grow. Some country will allow its workers to be exploited like slaves to create wealth for another country. Some country will flood another country with highly-desired goods, draining their wealth.

 

 

What you're talking about are the flaws with the system itself. And the system is massively, massively flawed. That's why I personally believe we need to abandon the economic model we work with. Capitalism has and will continue to fail us. The way forward, after the class war that we're approaching, will likely be some form of moderate Democratic Socialism.

[Tokkemon]

Capitalism is great for allowing people to make money easily. What it's terrible at is injecting human and moral values into our use of money.

[MHV9218]

It's also great for allowing people to lose money easily. It's a game of many losers and many winners, but mainly losers. And because of that, it's inherently flawed. Even Adam Smith, the so-called "father of capitalism," didn't believe a free market was necessarily the way forward. I'm not sure how much inequality America will need to see before true class warfare hits, but I think it's coming.

[Tokkemon]

It's simple. Apply Nash's equilibrium. Do what's best for himself and the group. I.e. What Canada does. Look how Canada's economy is soaring by leaps and bounds compared to the US. And, interestingly, Canada has recently just passed the US in average Household wealth.

[CenSin]

What you're talking about are the flaws with the system itself. And the system is massively, massively flawed. That's why I personally believe we need to abandon the economic model we work with. Capitalism has and will continue to fail us. The way forward, after the class war that we're approaching, will likely be some form of moderate Democratic Socialism.

I'm not talking about the US itself, but on a global scale. Maybe it'd apply if there was only a global socialist democratic supergovernment, but just as capitalism within a country causes citizens to exploit each other for gain the current international relationships see rich nations like the US (and soon, China) exploit other countries to further their own growth.

[qjtransitmaster]

Heck I sometimes use 3 buses B15,Q3& Q85 to get to wal mart its worth the savings man. WHO CARES why does NYC descriminate against WAL-MART I think WAL-MART should be allowed why is this crap even legal!!!

[youngblaze]

Heck I sometimes use 3 buses B15,Q3& Q85 to get to wal mart its worth the savings man. WHO CARES why does NYC descriminate against WAL-MART I think WAL-MART should be allowed why is this crap even legal!!!

 

 

Because there will be a detrimental effect on the small businesses in the surrounding area. Wal-Mart will come in with the "lowest" prices around...knock out all the mom & pops and once their competitors are gone they may very well jack up those prices to maximize profit. Not to mention the trap Wal-Mart may lure its employees' to. You see....with a family run small business these individuals are more likely (not always) able to use their earnings to better their situation (i.e. investment accounts, real-estate etc...) because there is no corporate giant standing behind with his or her hand out nor are they on a set hourly salary. Meanwhile, the vast majority of employees at Wal-Mart earn minimum wage and dangerously live paycheck to paycheck (better known as a dead end job). Yes, Wal-Mart has stated they offer programs like tuition reimbursement etc... but quite frankly how many of the people that work there who aren't teenagers take advantage of that when they probably have to put in 50+ hours of work to pay their rent. IMO it is harmful to the American economy to continue outsourcing and as VG8 stated it is NOT always cheaper to outsource as our current economic state is just one of the many prices we have paid to "lower" the prices on goods and services.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

It's simple. Apply Nash's equilibrium. Do what's best for himself and the group. I.e. What Canada does. Look how Canada's economy is soaring by leaps and bounds compared to the US. And, interestingly, Canada has recently just passed the US in average Household wealth.

 

 

Yeah, but Canada also isn't outsourcing jobs at the rate the U.S. is. There is still some sense of pride and moral values with some Canadian companies who have stated that they could've shifted production overseas, but instead decided to stay in Canada. There is no way that a country can sustain itself if it keeps outsourcing its jobs at the rate the U.S. has been and replacing them with very few jobs. Walmart is particularly disliked especially because they have contributed to the acceleration of the outsourcing process, so yes maybe they're allowing poor folks to shop at low prices, but overall, they're draining the wealth out of this country and destroying opportunities for others to prosper (be it small businesses who create jobs to middle class folks who can't find jobs or get jobs paying much less) while raking in the profits for themselves.

 

I disagree with those that say that the free market can't work. Capitalism has served us well for years. The problem with Walmart is that they don't play fair. They bully suppliers into slashing their prices to the bone, forcing them either to go overseas to stay in business, or reduce the amount of jobs available within their companies significantly. For those that say well these vendors can just not do business with Walmart, Walmart is simply too big for some vendors to ignore particularly because they've wiped out so much of the competition and that's the scary part.

 

 

Heck I sometimes use 3 buses B15,Q3& Q85 to get to wal mart its worth the savings man. WHO CARES why does NYC descriminate against WAL-MART I think WAL-MART should be allowed why is this crap even legal!!!

 

 

Maybe you would understand if you took the time to see why they're doing it. Or do you seriously believe that everyone is out to get Walmart? I'm very familiar with Walmart because as a college student up in Plattsburgh, we only had a few options. When I started as a freshman, we had a Shop Rite and a Walmart in one of the main shopping centers in town. The prices at Walmart were great, so I thought. Then Shop Rite went out of business there and I realized what was being given up. They often times wouldn't have certain brands that I liked to buy, or they would buy a bunch of it and then when it ran out you'd be **** out of luck until they were able to restock again which was quite annoying to say the least, not to mention you usually had very few sizes to pick from, so you want Doritos? Here, here is an enormous bag of Doritos. Of course their sizes are really for families and not one person, which I learned the hard way as I gained a good 10 pounds and it took a while to realize why I put on weight and then I added it all up. You don't want to waste what you buy, so you eat everything even though it was way too much for one person, so I just stopped shopping there for certain things and got my things from other places when possible.

 

There are so many negatives to Walmart that it isn't even funny, one being IMO that they're contributing to obesity in this country as well. People buy with their eyes. I mean who needs a jar of pickes that weighs 6 pounds and can last one for an entire year? Utterly ridiculous.

[Tokkemon]

Having no other choices but Walmart has a lot more to do with your place of living rather than Walmart itself. In New York there is plenty of competition, both large and small.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Having no other choices but Walmart has a lot more to do with your place of living rather than Walmart itself. In New York there is plenty of competition, both large and small.

 

 

Yes and no. Just because I was living in a small town doesn't mean I shouldn't have access to other options besides Walmart. Furthermore, you seem to be quite gullible to think that many businesses here in NYC wouldn't be affected by Walmart opening here.

[Tokkemon]

Frankly, I don't care. I'm not a business owner and I don't live in Queens at the moment. It is more a point in principle. But whatever.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Frankly, I don't care. I'm not a business owner and I don't live in Queens at the moment. It is more a point in principle. But whatever.

 

 

lol... You should care because Walmart affects everyone.

[Q10 Airport]

Walmart has a history of mistreating its workforce and cultivating forced labor at sweatshops, both at home and abroad. Frankly, the other retailers are just as guilty of these offenses as Walmart. The only reason everyone is targeting Walmart instead of Target or Costco or some other retailer is because they are the "800-pound gorilla."

[SoSpectacular]

Walmart has a history of mistreating its workforce and cultivating forced labor at sweatshops, both at home and abroad. Frankly, the other retailers are just as guilty of these offenses as Walmart. The only reason everyone is targeting Walmart instead of Target or Costco or some other retailer is because they are the "800-pound gorilla."

 

 

Walmart went down the drain not too long after its founder, Sam Walton died in 1992. When I was an employee and had access to the employee benefits website the veteran employees would often talk about the days when Sam Walton was still alive and how he'd visit random stores just to spend some time with the employees.

 

I would think about those stories and wonder what it would have been like before 1992...

[Shortline Bus]

Walmart went down the drain not too long after its founder, Sam Walton died in 1992. When I was an employee and had access to the employee benefits website the veteran employees would often talk about the days when Sam Walton was still alive and how he'd visit random stores just to spend some time with the employees.

 

I would think about those stories and wonder what it would have been like before 1992...

 

 

Wal Mart did went down the tubes after Sam Walton died. Now the Walton Family heirs and close knit of friends does treat their workers like crap since then by nickle and dime them. With that said no one is forced to work at Wal Mart or buy there.