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aemoreira81

Fixing the M60 Route from Delays?

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As anyone who has ridden that route has noticed, it suffers from a myriad of issues, including reliability issues and overcrowded buses (well beyond loading guidelines) and overservice to Marine Air Terminal while not being able to handle service to the the Central Terminal area, I have to wonder why the MTA has not looked at fixing this route.

 

There are three other routes (1 fully artic, 1 mostly artic, and 1 mostly rigid) running between Amsterdam Avenue and Second Avenue on 125 Street. As such, I would proplse making the M60 a SBS service, with stops as follows, as well as a related M61 route, also in the same SBS:

 

1. 106 Street between West End Avenue and Broadway - dedicated stop

2. Broadway and Cathedral Parkway - shared stop with M104

3. Broadway and 116 Street/Columbia University - shared stop with M4 and M104

4. 125 Street and Old Broadway (shared with M104 and Bx15)

5. 125 Street and St. Nicholas Avenue (near side, dedicated stop)

6. 125 Street and Lenox Avenue (near side, dedicated stop)

7. 125 Street, mid-block between Park Avenue and Lexington Avenue (Lexington Avenue stop extended westbound, Park Avenue stop extended eastbound, dedicated stop)

8. 125 Street and 2 Avenue (shared stop with other 125 Street routes)

 

Over RFK Bridge

 

9. Hoyt Avenue and 31 Street (dedicated stop)

 

Via the Grand Central Parkway between Exit 45 (I-278) and Exit 5 (GCP) nonstop

 

10. 82 Street between Astoria Boulevard and 23 Avenue (dedicated stop).

 

M61 SBS trips, to Marine Air Terminal (Terminal A only):

 

11. Marine Air Terminal, last stop and layover.

 

M60 SBS trips, to the Central Terminal Area only

 

12. 94 Street and 23 Avenue (shared with Q33 and Q72) (driver changes going to LGA)

13. Terminal D

14. Terminal C

15. Terminal B

 

For stops 13-15, stops would be shared with the Q33, Q48, and Q72.

 

I propose running the M60 with artics and M61 with rigids, and have every third bus as an M61.

 

Customers going from Terminals D, C, or B to Terminal A could use PANYNJ shuttles or the Q48 instead.

 

To replace lost service along Astoria Boulevard, the Q19 would have expanded hours of service between 82 Street and 21 Street only, running every 10 minutes between these two points.

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Not a bad idea. I remember returning from San Diego at the end of the 2010 X-mas/New Years Holidays that Sunday (Jan 2 2011)at LGA at around 10pm. Could not get on 2 straight (M60) and waited 25 minutes in brutal cold. Thus had to take the (Q33) to 74th/Jackson Heights and then the (7)train to get to Grand Central. The (M60) could use a minor revision.

IMO every other (M60) should run non stop between the 31st/Astoria Blvd (N)(Q) station and the central terminals using the GCP highway in both directions at least until 10pm.

Unless the buses can't fit onto the GCP.

If a "M61' was created to serve Marine terminal, I would run it only between the 125th/Lex (4)

(5) (6)station and Marine Terminal making all stops along the GCP service road.

 

 

With that said, after 10pm daily the (M60)could make all stops in both directions. Maybe the other guys can offer better replies to your suggestion and if your proposed "M61" is really needed.

 

 

 

As anyone who has ridden that route has noticed, it suffers from a myriad of issues, including reliability issues and overcrowded buses (well beyond loading guidelines) and overservice to Marine Air Terminal while not being able to handle service to the the Central Terminal area, I have to wonder why the MTA has not looked at fixing this route.

 

There are three other routes (1 fully artic, 1 mostly artic, and 1 mostly rigid) running between Amsterdam Avenue and Second Avenue on 125 Street. As such, I would proplse making the M60 a SBS service, with stops as follows, as well as a related M61 route, also in the same SBS:

 

1. 106 Street between West End Avenue and Broadway - dedicated stop

2. Broadway and Cathedral Parkway - shared stop with M104

3. Broadway and 116 Street/Columbia University - shared stop with M4 and M104

4. 125 Street and Old Broadway (shared with M104 and Bx15)

5. 125 Street and St. Nicholas Avenue (near side, dedicated stop)

6. 125 Street and Lenox Avenue (near side, dedicated stop)

7. 125 Street, mid-block between Park Avenue and Lexington Avenue (Lexington Avenue stop extended westbound, Park Avenue stop extended eastbound, dedicated stop)

8. 125 Street and 2 Avenue (shared stop with other 125 Street routes)

 

Over RFK Bridge

 

9. Hoyt Avenue and 31 Street (dedicated stop)

 

Via the Grand Central Parkway between Exit 45 (I-278) and Exit 5 (GCP) nonstop

 

10. 82 Street between Astoria Boulevard and 23 Avenue (dedicated stop).

 

M61 SBS trips, to Marine Air Terminal (Terminal A only):

 

11. Marine Air Terminal, last stop and layover.

 

M60 SBS trips, to the Central Terminal Area only

 

12. 94 Street and 23 Avenue (shared with Q33 and Q72) (driver changes going to LGA)

13. Terminal D

14. Terminal C

15. Terminal B

 

For stops 13-15, stops would be shared with the Q33, Q48, and Q72.

 

I propose running the M60 with artics and M61 with rigids, and have every third bus as an M61.

 

Customers going from Terminals D, C, or B to Terminal A could use PANYNJ shuttles or the Q48 instead.

 

To replace lost service along Astoria Boulevard, the Q19 would have expanded hours of service between 82 Street and 21 Street only, running every 10 minutes between these two points.

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One of the things about the M60 and other LGA buses that I've been wondering about is the usefulness of overnight service (between 1-4 am) within the airport proper. From what I can gather about LGA's flight schedules, there are no scheduled departures between 10 pm & 5 am and no scheduled arrivals between midnight and 6 am. As such, I would probably consider "short-turning" service just outside the airport between 1-4 am.

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SBS is not gonna happen on the M60. they are running artics on that route now though...

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As anyone who has ridden that route has noticed, it suffers from a myriad of issues, including reliability issues and overcrowded buses (well beyond loading guidelines) and overservice to Marine Air Terminal while not being able to handle service to the the Central Terminal area, I have to wonder why the MTA has not looked at fixing this route.

 

There are three other routes (1 fully artic, 1 mostly artic, and 1 mostly rigid) running between Amsterdam Avenue and Second Avenue on 125 Street. As such, I would proplse making the M60 a SBS service, with stops as follows, as well as a related M61 route, also in the same SBS:

 

1. 106 Street between West End Avenue and Broadway - dedicated stop

2. Broadway and Cathedral Parkway - shared stop with M104

3. Broadway and 116 Street/Columbia University - shared stop with M4 and M104

4. 125 Street and Old Broadway (shared with M104 and Bx15)

5. 125 Street and St. Nicholas Avenue (near side, dedicated stop)

6. 125 Street and Lenox Avenue (near side, dedicated stop)

7. 125 Street, mid-block between Park Avenue and Lexington Avenue (Lexington Avenue stop extended westbound, Park Avenue stop extended eastbound, dedicated stop)

8. 125 Street and 2 Avenue (shared stop with other 125 Street routes)

 

Over RFK Bridge

 

9. Hoyt Avenue and 31 Street (dedicated stop)

 

Via the Grand Central Parkway between Exit 45 (I-278) and Exit 5 (GCP) nonstop

 

10. 82 Street between Astoria Boulevard and 23 Avenue (dedicated stop).

 

M61 SBS trips, to Marine Air Terminal (Terminal A only):

 

11. Marine Air Terminal, last stop and layover.

 

M60 SBS trips, to the Central Terminal Area only

 

12. 94 Street and 23 Avenue (shared with Q33 and Q72) (driver changes going to LGA)

13. Terminal D

14. Terminal C

15. Terminal B

 

For stops 13-15, stops would be shared with the Q33, Q48, and Q72.

 

I propose running the M60 with artics and M61 with rigids, and have every third bus as an M61.

 

Customers going from Terminals D, C, or B to Terminal A could use PANYNJ shuttles or the Q48 instead.

 

To replace lost service along Astoria Boulevard, the Q19 would have expanded hours of service between 82 Street and 21 Street only, running every 10 minutes between these two points.

 

Write letter to MTA

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One of the things about the M60 and other LGA buses that I've been wondering about is the usefulness of overnight service (between 1-4 am) within the airport proper. From what I can gather about LGA's flight schedules, there are no scheduled departures between 10 pm & 5 am and no scheduled arrivals between midnight and 6 am. As such, I would probably consider "short-turning" service just outside the airport between 1-4 am.

 

With that in mind, I have to wonder if 24-hour service on the M60 is even needed. This to me highlights the need to merge NYCT and MTA Bus operations, because I would have 3 or 4 buses lay over nightly at LaGuardia (with drivers transported back to the 126 Street Depot via a crew van).

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SBS is not gonna happen on the M60. they are running artics on that route now though...

For real?

 

When is best time to catch Artic and where?

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SBS is not gonna happen on the M60. they are running artics on that route now though...

 

I didn't know you can see the future... Can I get tomorrows lottery numbers?

 

jk I'm just playing but you never know it could happen, they do have a "plan" for it.

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I don't think SBS on the M60 would work. I've never ridden it, but I'm just assuming that most passengers are going to the airport, so they'll be carrying luggage with them right? Yes, it would speed things up, but not by much since it'll still take time to load it on the bus.

 

And tourists, and still a lot of New Yorkers get confused with the SBS machine, so having it on an airport bus might not be the best idea.

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I agree.

 

Speaking of SBS, M15 SBS travels through popular tourist attraction like from airport line to Museum Mile, RIT, Grand Central/United Nations, East 34th St Ferry, East Village, Lower East Side, Chinatown, Financial District, Seaport, South Ferry.

 

I remember one time I was on M60, I help disable tourist, and I figured out Lex Av Subway line might be crowded for AM Rush Hour, so I teach them to use M15 SBS after they told me they want to see Statue of Liberty.

 

Another one is Bx12 SBS also passeds Bronx's Little Italy and stop by Bronx Zoo, another tourist attraction.

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the SBS part of it, I don't see it happening either, but I agree w/ the general message behind the OP....

 

Of the M60's I see at marine air terminal, seldom anyone disembarks there... it picks up about a handful of people, the b/o stalls there for a couple mins (of course, w/ a crushloaded bus), and pulls out accordingly....sometimes they don't even stall.... under no circumstances would I make marine air terminal, a terminal for any variant of the M60....

 

The first thing I'd address is, why do so many M60's "do the loop" (without terminating in queens at all), so to speak... It's possible to ride from Morningside hgts to... Morningside hgts on one fare, and that shouldn't be....

 

I wouldn't bother splitting them up into each separate terminals they'd serve either... that "M61" would only be useful b/w (within) manhattan, and 23rd/ditmars (the last stop before it enters the airport)..... you'd just have ppl. disembarking for Q72's or 33's at that point... you don't have to create an unnecessary xfer situation to fix the M60....

 

I see you have good intentions w/ all this, though.

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The first thing I'd address is, why do so many M60's "do the loop" (without terminating in queens at all), so to speak... It's possible to ride from Morningside hgts to... Morningside hgts on one fare, and that shouldn't be....

 

...

 

Why would anyone do that though?

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I do.

There are some people who going to Manhattan boards along 23rd Av and 94th St.

Some people prefer to catch M60 at 94th St/23rd Av, but I mostly prefer LGA especially when raining outside.

 

I even due same thing with Q33, Q72 and Q48 buses as well.

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I do.

There are some people who going to Manhattan boards along 23rd Av and 94th St.

 

Some people prefer to catch M60 at 94th St/23rd Av, but I mostly prefer LGA especially when raining outside.

 

I even due same thing with Q33, Q72 and Q48 buses as well.

Thank you.

 

That's the gist of what I was gettin at, moreso than an actual rider wanting to ride from manhattan, through queens, back to manhattan....

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Thank you.

 

That's the gist of what I was gettin at, moreso than an actual rider wanting to ride from manhattan, through queens, back to manhattan....

 

 

So Bro B35 what do you propose for the future of the (M60)? Personally this route should be 24/7 but overnight service between 2-4am should be reduced to every hour (not just LGA air passengers but workers who live in Astoria or Harlem as well)but those in Astoria connecting to/from Upper Manhattan. All airports get lighter between 12 Midnight-5am but keep in mind with TSA security checks some board these airport buses as early as 4am for a 6am flight.

 

And guys could the (M60) be allowed to use the GCP(not counting artics)to go non stop between Astoria Blvd station and the main terminals?

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speaking about the M60 i seen a artic today on that route.

 

So Bro B35 what do you propose for the future of the (M60)? Personally this route should be 24/7 but overnight service between 2-4am should be reduced to every hour (not just LGA air passengers but workers who live in Astoria or Harlem as well)but those in Astoria connecting to/from Upper Manhattan. All airports get lighter between 12 Midnight-5am but keep in mind with TSA security checks some board these airport buses as early as 4am for a 6am flight.

 

And guys could the (M60) be allowed to use the GCP(not counting artics)to go non stop between Astoria Blvd station and the main terminals?

Speaking of Grand Central Parkway, every time when I'm on (M60) Inbound to Manhattan, I always see College Point Depot and some LGA Depots heading for their route runs entering GCP along with Correction Police Bus at GCP/82nd St.

 

I remember X51 Viking Trip also used portion of GCP near LGA Airport.

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With that in mind, I have to wonder if 24-hour service on the M60 is even needed. This to me highlights the need to merge NYCT and MTA Bus operations, because I would have 3 or 4 buses lay over nightly at LaGuardia (with drivers transported back to the 126 Street Depot via a crew van).

 

You forgot 1)those who live in Astoria and travel to upper manhattan via the RFK triboro 2)those on 125th St 3)Airport employees who travel all hours of the night.

 

The (M60) only was expanded to 24/7 a few years ago so with that it should run hourly instead of every 30 minutes between 2-4am.

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So Bro B35 what do you propose for the future of the (M60)? Personally this route should be 24/7 but overnight service between 2-4am should be reduced to every hour (not just LGA air passengers but workers who live in Astoria or Harlem as well)but those in Astoria connecting to/from Upper Manhattan. All airports get lighter between 12 Midnight-5am but keep in mind with TSA security checks some board these airport buses as early as 4am for a 6am flight.

 

And guys could the (M60) be allowed to use the GCP(not counting artics)to go non stop between Astoria Blvd station and the main terminals?

 

1) Keep the M60 on local roads east of Astoria blvd subway during the day (let those hawk runs use the GCP, if need be)

 

2) LGA bound, create short turns b/w [st. nicholas/125th] & the airport

(every run leaving the airport will continue to end at broadway/106th)

 

3) drastically dwindle the # of runs that don't really terminate @ the airport

(a 2 min. pit stop @ central terminal & marine air terminal don't count)

 

3a) give drivers actual layover time @ central terminal (much like those Q10, Q3, and B15 drivers get at JFK)

 

3b) as AEMoreira pointed out, have some M60's NOT serve marine air terminal...

 

4) throw artics on certain runs during the day (seemingly as they're starting to do now)...

 

5) run that sucker non stop along astoria blvd b/w Steinway st & 82nd st, both directions...

(let the Q19 handle those intermediate stops along astoria blvd... that's why it's there....)

Edited by B35 via Church
clarity reasons....

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I also suggest Q19 eastbound bus stop to relocate on 31st St bet Astoria Blvd & Hoyt Av by making left on 31st St, stopping at bus stop under el (similar to Q102/Bx13 under El, then make right turn onto Astoria Blvd.

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5) run that sucker non stop b/w Steinway st & 82nd st, both directions...

(let the Q19 handle those intermediate stops along astoria blvd... that's why it's there....)

 

No from 31st to 82nd because of Grand Central

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No from 31st to 82nd because of Grand Central

 

 

I think (B35) was saying the "M60" would be a semi super express' between 31st and 82nd making only the following stops along the GCP SERVICE road.

 

1)31st/Astroria Blvd (N) station 2)Steinway 3)82nd 4)94th/Ditmars (eastbound only) then all stops in the Main terminals.

 

I actually agree with him. Late nights between 12 Misnight-6am when the Q19 is not is only time the M60 should make all stops along the GCP service road.

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