Astoria Line Posted August 19, 2012 Share #101 Posted August 19, 2012 Aside from that, in order to live in NYCHA, you're required to show some proof of income. So that means either you're working, living off disability, or living off unemployment (which means you're looking for a job). People keep talking about "People who sit on their butts and live off welfare" when that isn't entirely true (I mean, of course, you do have people who find ways around it, and then there could be parents who work, but their kids are out causing trouble), but let's not act like that's the majority of the people. As I've always said, it's always 5-10% who cause the trouble for the other 90-95% of the residents. And as far as he's concerned, even if all that did happen (People were provided with temporary housing and all that), he'd still be talking about how bad some areas are. I mean, look at Canarsie. It has a median income of $52,490 (compared to a citywide median of $50,033), a crime rate that's average, and he's still mentioned how bad it is. See, a few comments here: http://www.nyctransi..._20#entry391182 http://www.nyctransi..._20#entry391193 So the crime rate's been continuously going down since the 1990s (when Canarsie was mostly White), and yet the area went "downhill"? And of course, he's been saying the same thing about parts of the North Shore where I could probably walk around with $100 bills sticking out of my pockets and not get mugged (not that I'd test it out, though. ) I know about NYCHA qualifications, I lived in it for 13 years lol.. and yeah I agree, at least someone sees what I am saying ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
checkmatechamp13 Posted August 19, 2012 Share #102 Posted August 19, 2012 Neighborhoods get bad reputations because they're sinkholes. Nobody said anything about black residents until you chimed in. Why is that? Alright, so you're going to tell me that Canarsie is a crime-filled slum and that the stats were fudged that much to make it look like an average neighborhood? I have a hard time believing that's the case, and so I doubt it's crime rate is that much higher than average. So if it's bad reputation isn't because of the crime then where is it from? We've already had a certain user talking about how it was so much better when it was Italian & Jewish (even though the crime rate has continuously decreased), so I have to believe that's the reason for it's reputation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted August 19, 2012 Share #103 Posted August 19, 2012 compstat (and by extension, the NYPD) is such a numbers game that you can't determine anything from the data except what they intend for the statistics to be. You have to hear the stories and spend time yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted August 19, 2012 Share #104 Posted August 19, 2012 compstat (and by extension, the NYPD) is such a numbers game that you can't determine anything from the data except what they intend for the statistics to be. You have to hear the stories and spend time yourself. Exactly. Stats don't tell the whole story. Another thing is that some neighborhoods get a lot of crime from OUTSIDERS. Most of the crime in Riverdale for example comes from the thugs there in Kingsbridge or other areas of the Bronx because the more affluent neighborhoods are targets for crime, BUT crime WITHIN those affluent neighborhoods tend to be low. Two of the last major crimes that I heard of in Riverdale (Riverdale and Fieldston to be exact) were committed within Riverdale, BUT by thugs from Kingsbridge (the Bronx), but that would still go down as a crime occurring in Riverdale, which is total BS. Both crimes were robberies (one was a robbery and a murder of a Riverdale resident by thugs from Kingsbridge by the Riverdale/Kingsbridge border) and the other was a break-in in Fieldston, again by thugs from the Bronx. Despite the crime from outsiders, we still have one of the lowest crime rates in the city, which means that crime committed by actual Riverdalians is EXTREMELY low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
checkmatechamp13 Posted August 19, 2012 Share #105 Posted August 19, 2012 compstat (and by extension, the NYPD) is such a numbers game that you can't determine anything from the data except what they intend for the statistics to be. You have to hear the stories and spend time yourself. I know a guy who lives in nearby Flatlands, and I knew a kid who moved to SI from Canarsie. Neither of them mentioned anything about crime. As VG8 would say, "it's nice and suburban", and it looks like a nice area (For instance, here: https://www.google.com/maps?q=Glenwood+Houses+Outdoor+Mini+Pool,+Glenwood+Road,+Brooklyn,+New+York,+NY&hl=en&ll=40.637567,-73.88988&spn=0.000065,0.042272&sll=40.632649,-73.920093&sspn=0.015731,0.042272&oq=glenwood+houses+Brooklyn,+New+York,+NY&hq=Glenwood+Houses+Outdoor+Mini+Pool,&hnear=Glenwood+Rd,+Brooklyn,+Kings,+New+York&t=m&z=15&layer=c&cbll=40.637651,-73.889958&panoid=yCdtVjBB-TxtqBgIaQw1Ag&cbp=12,210,,0,0) So in any case, you want stories? Here are some stories: http://www.city-data.com/forum/new-york-city/389875-canarsie-brooklyn.html http://www.city-data.com/forum/new-york-city/1456902-when-did-canarsie-become-ghetto.html http://www.city-data.com/forum/new-york-city/672393-carnarsie-brooklyn.html http://www.city-data.com/forum/new-york-city/863435-your-thoughts-canarsie-brooklyn.html http://www.city-data.com/forum/new-york-city/1644590-how-safe-canarsie-brooklyn-ny.html Yeah, there are a few people talking about how they think it's ghetto, but most people consider it a decent area. You have people mentioning "I thought it would look like a warzone, but it still looked nice when I visited" and mentioning how the Italian mob used to dump bodies back in the day. And somebody mentioned that whatever crime does happen often occurs at block parties in the summer, where people from other neighborhoods are invited. In any case, as I've said before, I doubt the stats were manipulated that much. If the crime rate is double what it truly is (and even then, that would leave it at the same level it was in the 90s, back when it was all-White), that's not "fudging" the stats. That's outright throwing them out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTARegional Bus Posted August 19, 2012 Share #106 Posted August 19, 2012 You clearly didn't read what I wrote... That's on you.... It is my opinion that you can help others and not have projects. I would much rather apartments which would have temporary housing for these folks who were on hard times and if they needed help they would have to earn their keep. What Giuliani did when he put abled folks to work was a good thing because he made those folks responsible and accountable. I support social programs, but I don't support just putting a bunch of folks in public housing and leaving them there. What good is that? Get these people working (the ones that aren't) and trying to improve themselves. It is not only more productive for them but for society as a whole. Unfortunately many don't like facing reality or discussing it for that matter. Before there was any housing projects those areas were originality apartments, they were slums but they were good neighborhoods with hard working people,small business,but the city thought it was a eyesore. at first housing projects were a good thing for working class family's when they first opened Now it's become a heaven for the lazy,drugs and crime.now was there crime the slum apartments? yes but not at a level that we see in housing projects. This is the 2nd worse thing next the Crossbronx express Robert moses has ever done. My father and I had a conversation the other day about the housing projects, he said ''I would rather be on the streets then live in Public housing, those are nothing but homeless shelters''LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threxx Posted August 19, 2012 Share #107 Posted August 19, 2012 I see no one took my advice... I saw even more BS in the past few posts and I'd also like to say that it can be offensive to some when you make uncalled for generalizations about a certain group of people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel Up Front Posted August 19, 2012 Share #108 Posted August 19, 2012 Six pages of VG8 waving his dick and dropping the name of his town, thinking it's floating 12,000 feet above the earth and that nothing bad happens there. Why does this happen whenever something about crime in another area pops up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fresh Pond Posted August 19, 2012 Share #109 Posted August 19, 2012 I still say it ain't as bad as half of you people make it out to be... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peacemak3r Posted August 19, 2012 Share #110 Posted August 19, 2012 This thread is still striving?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realizm Posted August 19, 2012 Author Share #111 Posted August 19, 2012 @ Via Giabaldi - Let me put it this way -- as far as living in the South Bronx is concerned -- I'm not a big fan of living in the ghetto so it is what it is -- but I've learned a long time to go the talent of adapting to many situations. Brownsville was no exception. In the boogie down I've lived here for three years and as long as you are out of the wrong areas of the long time, be cool with everybody and basically don't protray yourself ( not you just saying) like a dick a person can do great in the Bronx. I want to come back home to Flushing Queens and rent out a good apartment there, as close to the business district as possible. Alot of my peoples throughout Queens represent themselves in t in living in this area. So there's a personal reason to why I want to move eventualy. Another story..... Otherwise, given I did'nt have that need, then I would be a Bronx Resident for life. Sure beats living in Brownsville in Brooklyn, lol been there done that and not fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threxx Posted August 19, 2012 Share #112 Posted August 19, 2012 Six pages of VG8 waving his dick and dropping the name of his town, thinking it's floating 12,000 feet above the earth and that nothing bad happens there. Why does this happen whenever something about crime in another area pops up? Because he thinks that every other damn place that's not either a gated community on SI or Riverdale is a dump full of horrible, criminal, minority scum that aren't worth as much as the dirt on his shoes. That's why... This may seem rude, but we are seriously tired of hearing how good Riverdale is. Frankly, it looks just like some other neighborhoods in the Bronx. It's nothing special AT ALL. Stop waving it in our face, we are all at our wits end with this BS... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fresh Pond Posted August 19, 2012 Share #113 Posted August 19, 2012 ...or just cut to the chase and lock the goddamn thread already Everyone said what they had to say already, VG8 gonna keep yammering about Riverdale and its just gonna keep on going back sand forth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
checkmatechamp13 Posted August 19, 2012 Share #114 Posted August 19, 2012 Because he thinks that every other damn place that's not either a gated community on SI or Riverdale is a dump full of horrible, criminal, minority scum that aren't worth as much as the dirt on his shoes. That's why... This may seem rude, but we are seriously tired of hearing how good Riverdale is. Frankly, it looks just like some other neighborhoods in the Bronx. It's nothing special AT ALL. Stop waving it in our face, we are all at our wits end with this BS... Even if it is a gated community on SI, he'll still think it's a dump full of worthless minority scum. Check this out: http://www.nyctransi...140#entry474165 It's understandable that there would be Blacks there because those condos are probably cheap. Of course, those Black people couldn't afford a regular-priced condo. And notice here. Those condos are full of "prima donnas", but it's "mainly a run-down area". And he loves fighting for more express service, except when it will be used by minorities. So it's alright for a bunch of express routes to serve the area by the VZ bridge, but he doesn't even want to let the area by the Goethals Bridge have one express route: http://www.nyctransi...th/#entry355542 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ MC Posted August 19, 2012 Share #115 Posted August 19, 2012 This thread is still striving?! It's unbelievable isn't it? Wouldn't be the first. There are some threads in the past I'm still shocked lasted as long as they did and this one is no different then the last ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted August 19, 2012 Share #116 Posted August 19, 2012 Y esto, mis amigos, es la razon porque estas discucciones mayormente los sierran. (English: And that, my friends, is the reason why these discussions most of the time are locked) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted August 19, 2012 Share #117 Posted August 19, 2012 Before there was any housing projects those areas were originality apartments, they were slums but they were good neighborhoods with hard working people,small business,but the city thought it was a eyesore. at first housing projects were a good thing for working class family's when they first opened Now it's become a heaven for the lazy,drugs and crime.now was there crime the slum apartments? yes but not at a level that we see in housing projects. This is the 2nd worse thing next the Crossbronx express Robert moses has ever done. My father and I had a conversation the other day about the housing projects, he said ''I would rather be on the streets then live in Public housing, those are nothing but homeless shelters''LOL Wow, pretty strong words... Well quite frankly the only way I see things changing in Brownsville is a change in the housing there. Projects as was stated before was originally created for working middle class folks. The idea was good, but the result hasn't been and IMO that's the real problem with high crime areas like Brownsville. You simply can't have that many people packed into buildings like that, not unless it is more structured. It seems like the government realizes its wrongs though as I haven't heard of any new housing projects being built the way the current ones have been. They're much smaller and there seems to be better guidelines in place. @ Via Giabaldi - Let me put it this way -- as far as living in the South Bronx is concerned -- I'm not a big fan of living in the ghetto so it is what it is -- but I've learned a long time to go the talent of adapting to many situations. Brownsville was no exception. In the boogie down I've lived here for three years and as long as you are out of the wrong areas of the long time, be cool with everybody and basically don't protray yourself ( not you just saying) like a dick a person can do great in the Bronx. I want to come back home to Flushing Queens and rent out a good apartment there, as close to the business district as possible. Alot of my peoples throughout Queens represent themselves in t in living in this area. So there's a personal reason to why I want to move eventualy. Another story..... Otherwise, given I did'nt have that need, then I would be a Bronx Resident for life. Sure beats living in Brownsville in Brooklyn, lol been there done that and not fun. Interesting take... Hey listen I'm a Brooklyn native and I've been to quite a few ghetto neighborhoods, but Brownsville has not been one of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MHV9218 Posted August 20, 2012 Share #118 Posted August 20, 2012 LOL! You're one to talk... What I support is gentrification and a strong middle and upper middle class. No, I don't necessarily support projects per se because of the crime issue. When you have neighborhoods like Brownsville with high levels of projects, you usually end up with high levels of crime, though of course there are some exceptions. Quite frankly I would get rid of projects all together and create a system in which folks had temporary housing in apartments. Projects create an environment that allows folks to be lazy and not earn their keep. Now I know I'm going to hear the well there are plenty of folks that live in projects that are hard working, which is fine and good, but they aren't in the majority and that's the problem. When I would wait for the express bus sometimes over by Hylan Blvd or by the Todt Hill Houses in Staten Island, I'd see these types of individuals... Shiftless types draining the system and laying around all day while hard working upper middle class folks like myself get killed in taxes. That is socialism to the extreme and that helps to foster neighborhoods like Brownsville. I mean what do these folks have to look up to but drug dealers and crime?? Then the other issue is how projects hold down not only the neighborhoods that they are in but also the surrounding communities. I mean look at the Bronx. It has a high crime rate and also I believe has the highest amount of housing projects out of all of the other boroughs. It is no coincidence that neighborhoods like Riverdale and neighborhoods in the Bronx (i.e. Country Club, Schulyerville, etc.) have some of the lowest crime rates in the entire city... There are no projects... I don't even know where to start. This is just ignorant, elitist, ridiculous, classist, and confused. Your disdain for people who have less than you ("what do these folks hav to look up to but drug dealers and crime") is completely disgusting, you clearly don't have a clue what socialism is, and your solution to "fixing" crime is putting every poorer person in a temporary shelter? Is this a joke, a Romney-parody of yourself? Lord and mercy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted August 20, 2012 Share #119 Posted August 20, 2012 I don't even know where to start. This is just ignorant, elitist, ridiculous, classist, and confused. Your disdain for people who have less than you ("what do these folks hav to look up to but drug dealers and crime") is completely disgusting, you clearly don't have a clue what socialism is, and your solution to "fixing" crime is putting every poorer person in a temporary shelter? Is this a joke, a Romney-parody of yourself? Lord and mercy... Who said anything about a temporary shelter?? You clearly chose to read what you wanted to. What I said was that I would get rid of current set up and get rid of projects. You would have apartments available for folks at low rents that were eligible for them and they could stay there BUT they would have to show that they were making strides to improve themselves. In other words, projects were not made originally to be a permanent thing. They were supposed to be temporary until folks could do better. I see nothing wrong with that set up, as it would weed out the lazy folks leeching off of hard working taxpayers and shine light on those trying to better themselves. Giuliani's restructuring of the welfare system for example was the best thing for this city because it made able bodied folks EARN THEIR KEEP instead of them being out in the streets causing trouble. I'm willing to bet in fact that if you had this set up, you'd see a major decrease in crime in areas like Brownsville. Seeing that you have a problem with trying to create programs to get folks to be more productive instead of looking to taxpayers for handouts and running around committing crimes, it is clear that you think the current set up in places like Brownsville is fine... High unemployment, rampant crime and no end in sight... That IMO is troublesome, but yes, I'm an "elitist" as usual... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realizm Posted August 20, 2012 Author Share #120 Posted August 20, 2012 FYI the housing program sponsered by the NYC Housing Authority has been in a frozen state since 2006 due to an overload of applicants. For whatever reason that is the current state of things. Shelters are still open but are of course overcrowded too. Save for the Housing dept vacancies for persons involved with being evicted because of building code violations fro landloards but that is another story. The housing program will be in a locked state for years to come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted August 20, 2012 Share #121 Posted August 20, 2012 FYI the housing program sponsered by the NYC Housing Authority has been in a frozen state since 2006 due to an overload of applicants. For whatever reason that is the current state of things. Shelters are still open but are of course overcrowded too. Save for the Housing dept vacancies for persons involved with being evicted because of building code violations fro landloards but that is another story. The housing program will be in a locked state for years to come. And it should be... We simply can't afford to keep asking taxpayers to spend monies to house these folks when some of them (hard working taxpayers) that is are in living in far more deplorable conditions or are under water in their homes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realizm Posted August 20, 2012 Author Share #122 Posted August 20, 2012 I totally agree with this statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threxx Posted August 20, 2012 Share #123 Posted August 20, 2012 This thread hasn't gotten the lock and chain yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted August 20, 2012 Share #124 Posted August 20, 2012 No because we're having a civil discussion. Just because you disagree with opinions that others have doesn't automatically mean that the thread needs to be locked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted August 20, 2012 Share #125 Posted August 20, 2012 some of them (hard working taxpayers) "some of them" indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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