Q10 Airport Posted August 20, 2012 Share #126 Posted August 20, 2012 They do that already sometimes in rough situations on the AM rush don't they, when it gets really bottlenecked at the Van Wyck junction or 71st backing all the T/Os up? Or during delays on the R I'm noticing that one of the major issues is that stretch between Union and Roosevelt. Maybe i was just caught up in an unusual morning, but that was my observations that day. I know I'm talking about weekday service but that may be a good idea. But a permanant E local on weekends not sure. It dies make sense for the E tio run local late nights as the TA has been doing but during the day, not too sure... The already runs local late nights when the and don't run on the QBL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realizm Posted August 20, 2012 Share #127 Posted August 20, 2012 Look at the last sentence. I acknowledged that there is of course late night E local service 7 days a week. Which is smart on the part of the MTA. Don't agree with around the clock E local service with all the passengers from ST Albans, South Jamaica, etc dependent on fast one seat rides to Manhattan. Still think more R service would address the needs of mid-Queens riders. The point of my comment is to show a contrast between weekday and weekend patterns. maybe I should have more clear. Highlighting the late night E local service as I mentioned which has already been implented as it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeystoneRegional Posted August 23, 2012 Share #128 Posted August 23, 2012 How about this, every other service will run local, why this should be done is that commuters should know before they go, mainly because of the arguement on the serving JFK Airtrain, forget about the LIRR and Bus arguements since those are not as big as missing your flight. As for the , maybe a slight increase in service if there is demand in Southern Brooklyn. Otherwise every other being local would be the best option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quill Depot Posted August 23, 2012 Share #129 Posted August 23, 2012 The every other train thing gets a different letter like K to help people know which train is local. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeystoneRegional Posted August 24, 2012 Share #130 Posted August 24, 2012 The every other train thing gets a different letter like K to help people know which train is local. Keep it the , just label it Queens Blvd. Local on the train's digital LED signs. The or any addition designation is redundant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Lance Posted August 24, 2012 Share #131 Posted August 24, 2012 Then you run the risk of confusing the riders. They're going to see E on the bulkhead signs on the front or the LEDs on the side and assume express or local, depending on who you ask and time of day. Remember, riders are constantly baffled by the limited 2/5 runs to New Lots and Utica respectively. In their minds, if it's a 2 or 5, it has to run to Flatbush. Similar concept applies with your idea for your dual E line. You've got some E's running local, others express. And everybody's confused. Confused passengers lead to delayed trains. Delayed trains means slow service. And slow service means we're right back at square one in terms of service on Queens Blvd. Also, what's with this "let's run every other E as a Queens Blvd local"? Sure, it gives the local stations more service, but that's at the expense of riders coming from or heading towards Jamaica and points east. It also lowers the amount of E's on 8th Avenue. And remember, the C runs at abysmal headways on the weekends. Slow down the E and you're going to have more crowded trains on both ends of the line. That's why I mentioned beefing up the R-line in an earlier post here. Even bringing in the G or M from their current terminals is a better idea than screwing with the E's service. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CenSin Posted August 24, 2012 Share #132 Posted August 24, 2012 Consistency is the hallmark of good service. When riders get something they don't expect, or something that can't be predicted then it's just bad service. For example… I expect an to get me from Coney Island to 34 Street in under an hour. Now imagine every other went local… via Whitehall Street. I don't know if the train I missed was an express or local, so I can't predict accurately how much time it will take for the next train to get me where I want to go. All the LED signs won't help, because planning a trip is knowing these things in advance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BreeddekalbL Posted August 25, 2012 Share #133 Posted August 25, 2012 They should increase R services on queens blvd by either increasing trains or allowing some existing trains to short turn at Whitehall also what would frequencies be able to enable a short turn and what about frequencies in Manhattan and Brooklyn for the R? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j express Posted August 25, 2012 Share #134 Posted August 25, 2012 In Manhattan the helps the between Lex av and Canal st with 5 min headways combined between those 2 sections. The can handle crowds between Lower Manhattan and Downtown Brooklyn since the is another travel option between those 2 places. At 4 th av local stations the can handle the crowds since many people dump the to the . The only section of the that needs improvement is Queen Blvd only. The candle handle Manhattan and Brooklyn with 10 min headways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BreeddekalbL Posted August 25, 2012 Share #135 Posted August 25, 2012 In Manhattan the helps the between Lex av and Canal st with 5 min headways combined between those 2 sections. The can handle crowds between Lower Manhattan and Downtown Brooklyn since the is another travel option between those 2 places. At 4 th av local stations the can handle the crowds since many people dump the to the . The only section of the that needs improvement is Queen Blvd only. The candle handle Manhattan and Brooklyn with 10 min headways. In that case would a short turn on select R trains be permissible? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreatOne2k Posted August 25, 2012 Share #136 Posted August 25, 2012 Consistency is the hallmark of good service. When riders get something they don't expect, or something that can't be predicted then it's just bad service. For example… I expect an to get me from Coney Island to 34 Street in under an hour. Now imagine every other went local… via Whitehall Street. I don't know if the train I missed was an express or local, so I can't predict accurately how much time it will take for the next train to get me where I want to go. All the LED signs won't help, because planning a trip is knowing these things in advance. Some weekday trains are express in Manhattan, some midday reverse peak trains have been express (not sure if they still run). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CenSin Posted August 25, 2012 Share #137 Posted August 25, 2012 Some weekday trains are express in Manhattan, some midday reverse peak trains have been express (not sure if they still run). I just got on an Broadway Express yesterday. I walked out when I saw the LED sign because I needed to get to Spring and Lafayette Streets. Had I not been observant, I would have missed my Price Street stop. I walked over to the instead so I could get the to Broadway–Lafayette (which turned out to be a bad idea, because the train didn't leave on time making me miss a ). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeystoneRegional Posted August 25, 2012 Share #138 Posted August 25, 2012 Well, I guess that idea isn't the best, so the only few options are whether you 1) Want to piss off Brooklynites by short-turning 's at Whitehall St. 2) Make the run local on Queens Blvd. 3) Make the run full length during Weekend (Daypart). I don't think the will do, nor other lines or creating a new line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q10 Airport Posted August 25, 2012 Share #139 Posted August 25, 2012 I thought we went through this, but the average straphanger disapproves of irregularity. So why are we talking about having irregular service when trying to improve QBL service? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realizm Posted August 25, 2012 Share #140 Posted August 25, 2012 All creative suggestions , but I still think the ultimate answer is increased service on QBL since it has been established already that weekend service is out of the question for a number of reasons which I guess I'll take with a grain of salt. I don't agree with local service on the weekends as that is an inconvenience to Southeast Queens residents already lacking adequete ways into Manhattan quickly. So yeah I'm sticking to my guns. Increased service. Period. Because it solves two problems, one being providing extra local service on the IND QBL other being more local service needed on the 4th Avenue local on the Brooklyn BMT particularly on the weekends. The thing is, can the 60th St tunnel handle the increase of QBL service from Broadway? It's a trade off with Astoria residents also needing frequent service coming from the 60th Street wrap tube. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeystoneRegional Posted August 25, 2012 Share #141 Posted August 25, 2012 I thought we went through this, but the average straphanger disapproves of irregularity. So why are we talking about having irregular service when trying to improve QBL service? Zero irregularity in my 3 suggestions, all logical and done on other times during the week or time of a day, and obviously improvements to QBL services. Don't know how we end up discussing Manhattan services when this is strictly on Service, maybe some trunk line service could be discussed, but when did IRT come in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RollOver Posted August 25, 2012 Share #142 Posted August 25, 2012 The thing is, can the 60th St tunnel handle the increase of QBL service from Broadway? It's a trade off with Astoria residents also needing frequent service coming from the 60th Street wrap tube. As NX Express said in a few pages back, there's no capacity along the 60th Street Tunnel and the Broadway local tracks. That doesn't have anything to plauge the Broadway Line as long as they schedule it properly on the and 's timetables (same with the on weekdays as all B'way trains run every 10 mins through most of that period). Just a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threxx Posted August 25, 2012 Share #143 Posted August 25, 2012 There is capacity in the 63rd Street tunnel and on the Broadway connection there. The switches are still available, so sending trains through 63rd Street isn't that far fetched.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realizm Posted August 25, 2012 Share #144 Posted August 25, 2012 Hmmm... Considering that the will not need those switches to gain access to Second Ave through 63rd Street, neither the from 6th Avenue theroetically only the will be utilizing those switches on the 63rd Street line before the Lexington Ave Station .... but the switches before 57th street is the only way the can access the spur into 63rd street ..... unless the track map I am referencing to is wrong. That may cause delays on the then into Second Avenue with major bottlenecks at 57th. Yeah I know I'm thinking long term. It can work as a short term solution but once the Second Ave line is operational a few years from now, then what? That may need to be taken into consideration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threxx Posted August 25, 2012 Share #145 Posted August 25, 2012 Hmmm... Considering that the will not need those switches to gain access to Second Ave through 63rd Street, neither the from 6th Avenue only the will be utilizing those switches on the 63rd Street line before the Lexington Ave Station .... but the switches before 57th street is the only way the can access the spur into 63rd street ..... unless the track map I am referencing to is wrong. That may cause delays on the then into Second Avenue with major bottlenecks at 57th. Yeah I know I'm thinking long term. It can work as a short term solution but once the Second Ave line is operational a few years from now, then what? That may need to be taken into consideration. Here is the TPH: : 9 TPH Post-SBS: 12-13 TPH : 15 TPH In the tunnel, there'd be 24 TPH, and there'd be 9 TPH moving through. (at the switches before 63rd) It could work. However, I think that the may end up having to be split b/w 60th Street and 63rd Street because of that. A bottleneck at 57th could be avoided. The easiest way to fix that is to put switches beyond 63rd Street as well, but then you'd have the problem of giving 63rd Street too much service and clamping down the as well... Here's a crappy mockup of an via 63rd Street: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realizm Posted August 25, 2012 Share #146 Posted August 25, 2012 Gotcha. But the last set of switches to the express tracks on Broadway lie just before 57th Street and that's the only way of access to the 63rd Street spur. That might buckle down the via 63rd Street with trains heading up Second Avenue already in the station running in sequence. trains running in the tunnel itself, yeah that could cause buckling down with the you're right, but at 36th Street on the QBL where the connector ends? I'm starting to think weekend service might be a better idea after all with all these points being brought out. Let the MTA deal with the costs. They can find a way, it's feasable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSubwayStation Posted August 25, 2012 Share #147 Posted August 25, 2012 Really, why isn't there capacity in the 60 St tunnel??? I have yet to understand that. We're talking about weekends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realizm Posted August 25, 2012 Share #148 Posted August 25, 2012 Because of what is seen on the weekdays as it is in the 60th Street tunnel. Imagine increased capacity on the creating similar conditions even as its the weekend as much as it is definitely needed if not service on the weekend if at all possible. There is an increase in weekend ridership systemwide. That would include the QBL without question. The MTA chairperson officially acknowedged this growth of weekend ridership at a recent press confrence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSubwayStation Posted August 25, 2012 Share #149 Posted August 25, 2012 Because of what is seen on the weekdays as it is in the 60th Street tunnel. Imagine increased capacity on the creating similar conditions even as its the weekend as much as it is definitely needed if not service on the weekend if at all possible. There is an increase in weekend ridership systemwide. That would include the QBL without question. The MTA chairperson officially acknowedged this growth of weekend ridership at a recent press confrence. Exactly, but why are people suggesting running the through 63 St because of a supposed capacity constraint? I thought that the 60 St tube could handle increased weekend service. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realizm Posted August 25, 2012 Share #150 Posted August 25, 2012 Because it's called thinking things through and analyzing facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.