Can Taxing The Rich Save The U.S. Economy?

[Phantom909]

The rich have free reign to do anything they want in this country; that's part of the problem now..... To sit up here & state loopholes can't be created is moot; considering the power the rich has in this country.... No one's questioning the legality of the loopholes.... You so call increase taxes on the rich & they will find a way around it....

 

 

i agree but the real problem is us who keep voting in the same politicians for decades who are supported by the rich who help them and also the politicians that are supported by the public sector unions who own them. thats why there should be term limits for every politician

 

Joe

[Den]

Here are the facts:

 

 

Joe

 

 

This is the longest load of crap post I have ever read on here. This is so far from reality its not even funny.

[Phantom909]

This is the longest load of crap post I have ever read on here. This is so far from reality its not even funny.

 

 

Where is your proof that my facts are wrong? Point out what you say are my mistakes and Ill debate them with you

 

Joe

[mediccjh]

Another question on this heated debate especially in this year's election is this? Should the IRS be scrapped for a new tax agency?

 

 

 

Yes.

 

It's already been proven by numerous agencies (including the Congressional Budget Office), that taxing the hell out of the rich will not help pay down the debt.

[Harry]

If everyone in this country would give everything they own (including the shirts off our backs), their still probably wouldn't be enough money to pay off the debt. There shouldn't even be a serious debate over this.

[Phantom909]

If everyone in this country would give everything they own (including the shirts off our backs), their still probably wouldn't be enough money to pay off the debt. There shouldn't even be a serious debate over this.

 

 

Dont give them any ideas Harry. Here is the bottom line. The debt of this country is as of right now $15.988 Trillion dollars, the entire economy of the United states (Gross Domestic Product) is $15.319 Trillion dollars. The debt to GDP ratio is 104.36%. so if the government took every dime of that we`d still be $669 Billion dollars in the hole. So all you drones who spout the crap about the rich "paying their fair share" better realize that its nothing but BS. The out of control spending that this and the previous administration has done is what is destroying us

 

12 years ago, the national debt was $5.701 Trillion. GDP was $9.581 Trillion the debt to GDP ratio was 59.481%

8 years ago the national debt was $7.390 Trillion, GDP was $11.443 Trillion, the debt to GDP ratio was 64.588%

4 years ago the national debt was $10.195 Trillion, GDP was $14.022 Trillion, the debt to GDP ratio was 72.721%

 

now in 4 years at present spending rates the debt will be $22.319 Trillion, GDP will be $17.199 Trillion, the debt to GDP ratio will be 129.767%

 

We are approaching a financial cliff in the future. I would not be opposed to paying higher tax rates if that money went to ONLY help pay off the debt instead of going into the black hole of government spending. But to stop us from going over the proverbial cliff, the SPENDING has to stop. We are basically borrowing 40 cents of every dollar we spend and as the old saying goes:

 

"You cant spend your way out of a recession and you cant borrow your way out of debt"

 

Joe

[Q10 Airport]

The problem is that much of our own debt consists of "untouchables." Therefore we could tax everyone, cut major services, and get out of all wars but we will still have a multi-trillion dollar debt.

[MHV9218]

Dont give them any ideas Harry. Here is the bottom line. The debt of this country is as of right now $15.988 Trillion dollars, the entire economy of the United states (Gross Domestic Product) is $15.319 Trillion dollars. The debt to GDP ratio is 104.36%. so if the government took every dime of that we`d still be $669 Billion dollars in the hole. So all you drones who spout the crap about the rich "paying their fair share" better realize that its nothing but BS. The out of control spending that this and the previous administration has done is what is destroying us

 

 

Your so-called math is irrelevant bullsh!t, your ideology that all spending is bad is bullsh!t, and your bullsh!t point right there is the single reason that this country is heading straight down the crapper: people like you convinced that we can't tax the unbelievably disproportionately rich in our country. That's just flat wrong.

 

I try to avoid replying to you because, well, I don't have the time or energy to dig through the massive pile of sh!t that gets left behind your posts, but this is just ridiculous. Don't act like this is real math, cause it isn't. I'm so sick of this.

 

You wanna know how you fix this country? You end the Bush tax cuts. You massively increase taxes on the rich. You massively cut military spending since we aren't in any wars that we should actually be fighting. You bring back Glass-Steagall and you massively tighten regulations on Wall Street, since we all know that the unregulated free market doesn't work. You stop government subsidies for big oil and the like. And, mainly, you stimulate the economy (that means spending) with projects and incentives and the like. You don't save it by cutting every service that makes life here worthwhile.

[Tokkemon]

Well without that military spending, all those up and coming powers overseas might blow up some missiles on American soil! We can't have that!

 

BTW, I'd love to see the math of your proposals. It seems rife with unintended consequences, similar to FDR's New Deal which prolonged the Great Depression.

[Turbo19]

Well without that military spending, all those up and coming powers overseas might blow up some missiles on American soil! We can't have that!

 

BTW, I'd love to see the math of your proposals. It seems rife with unintended consequences, similar to FDR's New Deal which prolonged the Great Depression.

 

Well the military can do with less right now. I mean who is an immidiate threat right now.

 

And yet FDR was loved and praised by many. His popularity is evident in the number of terms he served. That point is irrelavant.

[Tokkemon]

Popularity at any one time doesn't mean he was a good president. They should be judged by their actions in office, not on the number of years they serve and/or the opinions polls before, during, or after their presidency.

 

The point was, FDR's New Deal, while in the immediate was probably a good idea, caused prolonged unintended consequences which made the Depression last longer than it should have, and we only got out of it because of the sudden massive need for industry for World War II. Kind of ironic that a war saved the economy of this nation.

[Turbo19]

Popularity at any one time doesn't mean he was a good president. They should be judged by their actions in office, not on the number of years they serve and/or the opinions polls before, during, or after their presidency.

Agreed, but the general public usually doesn't give a damn.

[Phantom909]

Your so-called math is irrelevant bullsh!t, your ideology that all spending is bad is bullsh!t, and your bullsh!t point right there is the single reason that this country is heading straight down the crapper: people like you convinced that we can't tax the unbelievably disproportionately rich in our country. That's just flat wrong.

 

I try to avoid replying to you because, well, I don't have the time or energy to dig through the massive pile of sh!t that gets left behind your posts, but this is just ridiculous. Don't act like this is real math, cause it isn't. I'm so sick of this.

 

You wanna know how you fix this country? You end the Bush tax cuts. You massively increase taxes on the rich. You massively cut military spending since we aren't in any wars that we should actually be fighting. You bring back Glass-Steagall and you massively tighten regulations on Wall Street, since we all know that the unregulated free market doesn't work. You stop government subsidies for big oil and the like. And, mainly, you stimulate the economy (that means spending) with projects and incentives and the like. You don't save it by cutting every service that makes life here worthwhile.

 

 

I love when you rant like that, you show what a jealous little socialist drone that you are. Here are the figures:

 

http://www.usdebtclock.org/

 

Now for massively increasing taxpayers on the wealthy:

 

http://taxfoundation.org/article_ns/summary-2009-federal-individual-income-tax-data

 

2009 was the latest thats been done., but it shows that total adjusted gross income for all taxpayers in 2009 was $7,825,389,000,000, the federal government spent $3,517,700,000,000. the deficit for that year was $1.412,700,000,000.

 

http://www.usgovernmentspending.com/year2009_0.html

 

let me give you an economics lesson that you might understand. You see a shirt you want to buy, it costs $35.17, but you only have $21.05. Can you buy that shirt? Does it make sense to borrow $14.12 and put you in debt? Will you be able to pay it back?

 

End the Bush tax cuts which lowered taxes for EVERYBODY. the lowest tax rate under Clinton was 15%, the Bush tax cuts lowered it to 10%. Highest tax rates under Clinton was 39.6%, Bush lowered it to 35%

 

Yes some wasteful military spending can be cut, but since constitutionally, national defense is one of the few powers given to the federal government. not to spend $90 million over 4 years for Mango farmers in Pakistan, or losing $1.2 billion over 10 years in payments to dead people, or sending $17.8 million a year in aid to China, or the $1 billion paid in Home Energy Tax Credits to children and prisoners who DON`T own homes, or my personal favorite, the $592,527 dollars taxpayers gave to the Yerkes National Primate Research Center in Georgia to study why chimpanzees throw feces. thats just a few examples of the waste. Ive already said 100 times that im willing to pay more in taxes, but not for crap like that.

 

Im also on record for Glass-Steagall to become law again

 

Stopping government subsidies for big oil, oh you mean the ones that keep jobs here, help to lower costs on food since fuel for farm equipment are exempt from taxes since fuel taxes are to be used on roads and farm equipment do not use roads, or the subsidy that they get for keeping heating oil prices lower in winter for lower income Americans? Is that what you want?

 

I dont have a problem with spending as long as we can afford it. To save the country we need to do what works, what Kennedy did in 1961 and Reagan did in 1981 give the private sector the tools to grow, take the foot of government that is standing on the throat of the private sector Real .Americans want liberty, where they have can determine whats best for them, not the tyranny of big government that tells them what to do.

 

Joe

[VWM]

They gave them the tools to grow already... no regulation. How has that worked in our favor?

[lilbluefoxie]

 

Well the military can do with less right now. I mean who is an immidiate threat right now.

 

 

 

Iran is defenately an immediate threat to the free world especially if they get nukes. North Korea and communist China are a threat toour allies South Korea and the republic of China (aka Taiwan)

[Phantom909]

They gave them the tools to grow already... no regulation. How has that worked in our favor?

 

 

No regulation? Obama alone has added 106 new regulations that have cost Americans $46,000,000,000

 

http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2012/03/red-tape-rising-obama-era-regulation-at-the-three-year-mark

 

Joe

[SoSpectacular]

You know, if this country would stick to being "neutral" and stop minding the rest of the world's business we'd be a lot better off to begin with

[Via Garibaldi 8]

You wanna know how you fix this country? You end the Bush tax cuts. You massively increase taxes on the rich. You massively cut military spending since we aren't in any wars that we should actually be fighting. You bring back Glass-Steagall and you massively tighten regulations on Wall Street, since we all know that the unregulated free market doesn't work. You stop government subsidies for big oil and the like. And, mainly, you stimulate the economy (that means spending) with projects and incentives and the like. You don't save it by cutting every service that makes life here worthwhile.

 

 

Yeah, that's the answer... Tax the rich more and the upper middle class... We all know that the upper middle class folks that are considered to be the ones who need their taxes raised are the small businesses that create those jobs that have been non-existent under Obama's watch. Gee, I wonder why? Of course you'll keep blaming Bush even though it has been Obama who has been in office for almost 4 years now. Oh and he's been spending... In fact he's been spending like a drunken sailor... Stimulus this... Jobs that... Still no jobs!! I agree that monies need to be spent to create jobs and stimulate the economy, but if the monies are going to be spent, they've got to ensure that Americans are being put back to work AND stop looking to the upper middle class and rich folks as the answer to the problem. The problem here is far more complex.

[SoSpectacular]

You know, I have no problem with someone who makes 100-350,000 a year because I think that's pretty normal, but if you're getting paid upwards of 30-40 million in bonuses then something is definitely wrong.

 

It's overly inflated. What does one do with all that money? If it were me it'd be better directed at improving the other employees' morale/paychecks.

 

But hey, it's whatever. Keep in mind that the stimulus package was whipped up by Bush but Obama decided to carry it out (which I personally think shouldn't have been done)

[Via Garibaldi 8]

You know, I have no problem with someone who makes 100-350,000 a year because I think that's pretty normal, but if you're getting paid upwards of 30-40 million in bonuses then something is definitely wrong.

 

It's overly inflated. What does one do with all that money? If it were me it'd be better directed at improving the other employees' morale/paychecks.

 

But hey, it's whatever. Keep in mind that the stimulus package was whipped up by Bush but Obama decided to carry it out (which I personally think shouldn't have been done)

 

 

Well apparently the folks earning 100 - 350k need to be taxed more according to some folks, which is ridiculous. As for the folks earning big bonuses, they earned it and worked hard for it and they should be able to keep it. It's called being successful and last I checked we don't punish people for hard work. The firms that pay big bucks do so to retain the highest talent in the world and if it takes big bonuses to make their companies successful then so be it. The way I see it, the ideology is to punish the successful folks by taking away what they've worked for while giving it back to the failures of society. Ridiculous. On the other hand, these athletes and such that earn big bucks and then suddenly are bankrupt... I have no sympathy for... When you make a lot of money you have to learn how to manage it and not squander it.

[Phantom909]

You know, I have no problem with someone who makes 100-350,000 a year because I think that's pretty normal, but if you're getting paid upwards of 30-40 million in bonuses then something is definitely wrong.

 

It's overly inflated. What does one do with all that money? If it were me it'd be better directed at improving the other employees' morale/paychecks.

 

But hey, it's whatever. Keep in mind that the stimulus package was whipped up by Bush but Obama decided to carry it out (which I personally think shouldn't have been done)

 

 

The Bush stimulus of 2008 was $152 billion. Obama`s stimulus of 2009 was over 5 times that at $787 billion, both failed

 

Joe

[Phantom909]

Well apparently the folks earning 100 - 350k need to be taxed more according to some folks, which is ridiculous. As for the folks earning big bonuses, they earned it and worked hard for it and they should be able to keep it. It's called being successful and last I checked we don't punish people for hard work. The firms that pay big bucks do so to retain the highest talent in the world and if it takes big bonuses to make their companies successful then so be it. The way I see it, the ideology is to punish the successful folks by taking away what they've worked for while giving it back to the failures of society. Ridiculous. On the other hand, these athletes and such that earn big bucks and then suddenly are bankrupt... I have no sympathy for... When you make a lot of money you have to learn how to manage it and not squander it.

 

 

Thats the Socialist way , right out of their playbook, Punish the successsful by creating jealous little drones.

 

joe

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Thats the Socialist way , right out of their playbook, Punish the successsful by creating jealous little drones.

 

joe

 

 

That's exactly what it is... "I don't have as much as you do, so let me take from you to make my pockets fatter." Disgusting.

[VWM]

No regulation? Obama alone has added 106 new regulations that have cost Americans $46,000,000,000

 

I'm talking I. The sense of big oil and energy... Americans are going have to live down being the largest factor in destroying this earth. And without regulations on the gluttonous industries, more loopholes will be written every day

[CDTA]

I love when you rant like that, you show what a jealous little socialist drone that you are. Here are the figures:

 

http://www.usdebtclock.org/

 

Now for massively increasing taxpayers on the wealthy:

 

http://taxfoundation...income-tax-data

 

2009 was the latest thats been done., but it shows that total adjusted gross income for all taxpayers in 2009 was $7,825,389,000,000, the federal government spent $3,517,700,000,000. the deficit for that year was $1.412,700,000,000.

 

http://www.usgovernm...year2009_0.html

 

let me give you an economics lesson that you might understand. You see a shirt you want to buy, it costs $35.17, but you only have $21.05. Can you buy that shirt? Does it make sense to borrow $14.12 and put you in debt? Will you be able to pay it back?

 

End the Bush tax cuts which lowered taxes for EVERYBODY. the lowest tax rate under Clinton was 15%, the Bush tax cuts lowered it to 10%. Highest tax rates under Clinton was 39.6%, Bush lowered it to 35%

 

Yes some wasteful military spending can be cut, but since constitutionally, national defense is one of the few powers given to the federal government. not to spend $90 million over 4 years for Mango farmers in Pakistan, or losing $1.2 billion over 10 years in payments to dead people, or sending $17.8 million a year in aid to China, or the $1 billion paid in Home Energy Tax Credits to children and prisoners who DON`T own homes, or my personal favorite, the $592,527 dollars taxpayers gave to the Yerkes National Primate Research Center in Georgia to study why chimpanzees throw feces. thats just a few examples of the waste. Ive already said 100 times that im willing to pay more in taxes, but not for crap like that.

 

Im also on record for Glass-Steagall to become law again

 

Stopping government subsidies for big oil, oh you mean the ones that keep jobs here, help to lower costs on food since fuel for farm equipment are exempt from taxes since fuel taxes are to be used on roads and farm equipment do not use roads, or the subsidy that they get for keeping heating oil prices lower in winter for lower income Americans? Is that what you want?

 

I dont have a problem with spending as long as we can afford it. To save the country we need to do what works, what Kennedy did in 1961 and Reagan did in 1981 give the private sector the tools to grow, take the foot of government that is standing on the throat of the private sector Real .Americans want liberty, where they have can determine whats best for them, not the tyranny of big government that tells them what to do.

 

Joe

 

 

Here's what I don't get. Your'e pretty much saying F*** science, and the environment. There's a reason taxes go into that. As for the rest of your post, what VWM said.

They gave them the tools to grow already... no regulation. How has that worked in our favor?

 

 

 

 

You know, if this country would stick to being "neutral" and stop minding the rest of the world's business we'd be a lot better off to begin with

 

 

This. We wouldn't need the billions we put into the military, if we just MINDED OUR OWN BUSINESS. I get it we have allies and all, and we need to help them, but NONE of them are in danger right now. And there's absolutely NO reason to be at war with the middle east right now. That's like saying, "Oh, I pissed off this bear, so let me see if stabbing it will make it any less angry."

 

 

Well apparently the folks earning 100 - 350k need to be taxed more according to some folks, which is ridiculous. As for the folks earning big bonuses, they earned it and worked hard for it and they should be able to keep it. It's called being successful and last I checked we don't punish people for hard work. The firms that pay big bucks do so to retain the highest talent in the world and if it takes big bonuses to make their companies successful then so be it. The way I see it, the ideology is to punish the successful folks by taking away what they've worked for while giving it back to the failures of society. Ridiculous. On the other hand, these athletes and such that earn big bucks and then suddenly are bankrupt... I have no sympathy for... When you make a lot of money you have to learn how to manage it and not squander it.

 

 

What the hell could you possibly do that you would get 30 MILLION DOLLARS!? And WHY would you need all that money? I can understand Bill Gates, seeing how he doesn't blow it all on worthless crap, but seriously, unless your'e giving it to someone else, how the hell do you spend $30 Million a year? And even if you do find a use for that, it sure as hell isn't as good as giving it back to a country that's struggling.

 

 

That's exactly what it is... "I don't have as much as you do, so let me take from you to make my pockets fatter." Disgusting.

 

 

We don't want the money at all. You act as if we are taking your money. We want the government to get the money, so that they can try* to re-build their country. So don't give me this bs, about we're stealing your money. I want my country to prosper, and you don't? Yes, it MIGHT benefit us, EVENTUALLY. But your logic is pretty much "It's not enough that I succeed, but you must also fail."

 

 

I'm talking I. The sense of big oil and energy... Americans are going have to live down being the largest factor in destroying this earth. And without regulations on the gluttonous industries, more loopholes will be written every day

 

 

Holy crap, you've done it again. This. This. This.