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mark1447

Leaders/TWU President Say Part Time Bus Ops will Put Community at Risk

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Dear Governor Andrew Cuomo & MTA Chairman/CEO Joseph Lhota,

 

We oppose the MTA's contract demand of expanding One-Person Train Operation (OPTO) and Part-Time Bus Operators.

 

While the MTA currently uses OPTO on shuttles and on the G train during nights and weekends, these trains only use four cars when in operation. Expanding OPTO to full length trains increases the risks to passengers while they are entering or exiting the trains, greatly raises the difficulties and hazards involved if a train has to be evacuated, and makes it harder for a passenger who needs assistance to get it. This is especially important at a time when crime on the subways is rising. We believe that the presence of uniformed conductors on our trains is vital for the safety and assistance of passengers, especially in our full-length trains.

 

We also greatly disapprove of the MTA's desire to introduce Part-Time Bus Operators, which we believe puts the safety of the members of our communities at risk as they travel to work or school. Unable to support families on part-time work, these Bus Operators are likely to work two or three jobs. This, in turn, will make them more prone to fatigue and to accidents.

 

For example, under the MTA's proposal, a part-time operator at today's wage rate -- based on 25 hour work week-- would earn just under $27,000 a year (before taxes). After two years, the next wage progression would bump them to just under $29,000 a year (before taxes).

 

Read the rest:

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/john-samuelsen/faith-based-leaders-and-t_b_1843566.html

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Well, they're right, as usual (I don't even think part-time ops get benefits), but it's just gonna be one tough mess as usual for Lhota and indirectly Cuomo as contract season comes up.

Edited by MHV9218
  • Upvote 1

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We oppose the MTA's contract demand of expanding One-Person Train Operation (OPTO) and Part-Time Bus Operators.

We also greatly disapprove of the MTA's desire to introduce Part-Time Bus Operators, which we believe puts the safety of the members of our communities at risk as they travel to work or school.

 

How much of the TWU members' "community" is actually within the City limits? Don't most TWU members live in the suburbs?

 

 

 

Unable to support families on part-time work, these Bus Operators are likely to work two or three jobs. This, in turn, will make them more prone to fatigue and to accidents.

 

What about retirees who want to supplement their pensions with part-time work? I wouldn't mind a retired cop driving my bus.

Edited by Gotham Bus Co.

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I dunno how much of a difference OPTO makes, since most transit systems use only one person in the train, such as BART or the T.

 

As for part-time drivers, as long as they aren't demoting full time drives to part time, I can't see the issue with adding on a few part timers to work the rush hour route which only have a few runs. If the pay isn't good enough, someone with a CDL is free to look elsewhere for a different job, perhaps at one of the airport taxis or as a school bus driver.

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PLEASE let me know when the MTA starts hiring part time. It would be a great opportunity for me and the many many other people who need $$ but cannot commit themselves to a full time job.

Edited by error46146

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I'm for part-time. Makes people commit to their jobs more, I think.

Edited by Quill Depot

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Part time B/O's, in my opinion are great. They save the agency $$, and assuming the MTA puts the part time operators through the same training course, are just as safe.

 

OPTO: What systems, other than ex-railroads like PATH, use conductors these days? My idea is to do this:

 

-Remove conductors

-Remove all station agents with less than 10 transactions per hour

-Add platform conductors, 5 per platform during the rush hour, 3 midday/evening/weekend, for the top third of non-terminal stations by ridership. Pay these platform conductors somewhere between station agent and C/R.

Edited by Amtrak7

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I'm for part-time. Makes people commit to their jobs more, I think.

 

 

Why would having poorly-paid ops with no benefits who have to work multiple jobs have anything to do with job commitment?

 

 

Part time B/O's, in my opinion are great. They save the agency $$, and assuming the MTA puts the part time operators through the same training course, are just as safe.

 

OPTO: What systems, other than ex-railroads like PATH, use conductors these days? My idea is to do this:

 

-Remove conductors

-Remove all station agents with less than 10 transactions per hour

-Add platform conductors, 5 per platform during the rush hour, 3 midday/evening/weekend, for the top third of non-terminal stations by ridership. Pay these platform conductors somewhere between station agent and C/R.

 

 

I think we learned from the massive increase in 12-9s and crimes after the station agent cuts just what a bad idea it is to cut station agents. You want to run the system by math, which I get, but I can tell you right now is wrong. There are some things you just can't measure, like how much more comfortable passengers feel in stations with agents, or how many jobs part-time ops have to balance to make ends meet. Running the cheapest system is far from the best system, and you shouldn't need an employee strike to tell you that.

Edited by MHV9218
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I work Mon-Fri full-time with steady hours and would consider taking a part-time, weekend only position - probably with NJ Transit (not with the MTA), but would have to do more research if it is feasible (and hope I get to Wayne garage).

 

I might finally get to the bottom to my desire to find out where the weekend 161 buses go or why they (in the past year) been terribly late (weekdays are fine).

Edited by 161passenger

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And that's for the full-time B/Os...the part-time guys get IIRC zero benefits, lousy pay, and little job guarantee.

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And that's for the full-time B/Os...the part-time guys get IIRC zero benefits, lousy pay, and little job guarantee.

 

 

Indeed, it's a bad deal for all.

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I dunno how much of a difference OPTO makes, since most transit systems use only one person in the train, such as BART or the T.

 

As for part-time drivers, as long as they aren't demoting full time drives to part time, I can't see the issue with adding on a few part timers to work the rush hour route which only have a few runs. If the pay isn't good enough, someone with a CDL is free to look elsewhere for a different job, perhaps at one of the airport taxis or as a school bus driver.

 

 

IMO a compromise could be used for 1)Rush Hour express bus lines 2)special weekend services such as GO's for subway shutdowns and summer only service. Nothing against the TWU/ATU and I know i be blasted for saying this but this is 2012 not 1972. Time to make changes. Plus some lower used station *cough* *cough* the Rockaway Park Shuttle stations should be 24/7 MVM's. Just install cameras at a few select stations along with NYPD police patrols and call it a day. I agree with Foxie. Even with part time they still have to be union members.

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As someone who is a PTBO for NJT I hate it what is to keep the MTA from purposely adding more PTBOs than the depot have work so they know OT is under control and they don't have to worry about the PTBOs not getting any hours and complaining bcuz they're are others that have no problem taking the BS....or even worse go the NJT route and make it so that all new hires start out PT only and have to jump through specific hoops to get FT but at the same time have management ready to write u up to ruin your record so they can deny you....all of which I have experienced working for NJT so TWU and ATU fight to the bitter end to keep PTBOs out of the MTA it's a horrid idea and gauranteed to make a bad work environment

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And that's for the full-time B/Os...the part-time guys get IIRC zero benefits, lousy pay, and little job guarantee.

 

One of my college jobs was as a part-time building doorman/porter. Even with only 20 hours per week, I still got FULL health benefits in exchange for paying FULL dues to S.E.I.U. Local 32B/32J.

 

I could see the TWU accepting part-time bus operators, maybe, subject to these conditions:

 

(1) all part-timers get the same benefits as full-timers, and

 

(2) new part-timers get the full hourly rate from day one instead of the current 70%-80%-90% steps.

 

This way, MTA would save money while the union would gain additional dues-paying members.

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I could see the TWU accepting part-time bus operators, maybe, subject to these conditions:

 

(1) all part-timers get the same benefits as full-timers, and

 

(2) new part-timers get the full hourly rate from day one instead of the current 70%-80%-90% steps.

 

This way, MTA would save money while the union would gain additional dues-paying members.

 

 

Those two criteria wouldn't save that much money, unless the hiring of part time B/O's lead to the layoff of full time B/O's. Do you think the TWU would be more conducive to split shifts with unpaid swings instead of part time B/O's?

Edited by Amtrak7

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Nothing against the TWU/ATU and I know i be blasted for saying this but this is 2012 not 1972. Time to make changes.

 

 

theyre the sacred cow of the forum, and Im in the mood for steak lol

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I was actually quite suprised by the news posted by the OP. I was under the naive impression that this cutting back on the workforce is occuring for the most part in the private sector. Guess I was in for a rude awakening.

 

What I am beginning to see is that even as the idea of even working for a goverment agency (or a public benefit corperation such as the MTA) is appealing even if all they offer is part time work, it may not provide seekers with the job satisfaction or job security that they are looking for.

 

Not speaking for the MTA, just my opinion based on my limited knowledge on this, but in general this is the recent trend I am seeing with goverment agencies and corporations affiliated with the state or federal government. Basically the same deal as with the private sector - cutting back on payroll costs and any other costs associated with the provision of benefits. Most goverment agencies and the corporations affiliated with it do so by hiring part timers only. Many times they accomplish this by hiring temps. I believe Con Edison was doing this in full swing since the strikes they recently had back in July during that mean heat wave we've had.

 

I would love to pursue a job for the MTA even if I don't end up on the payroll right away. But it's when I encounter news like this I can't help but to take two steps back and appreciate that there are still room for growth within the private sector. It isn't as bad as some may think.

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So I went to spring creek for training in May and all I heard was complaining out of the part time bus operators.....no pay raise....no benefits....kinda like a scab bus operator....maybe when they r done driving the bus they can go ump a football game.....

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Yes! I am all for only one group of part time bus drivers!

 

The ones that make up the bus schedules, work on planning bus routes, write the bus diversions for us and in similiar and related positions (for example) are excellent canidates for part time bus drivers.

 

They should be the part time bus drivers as now they would have to see how their work impacts upon the bus drivers and passengers that take the services that have changed for one reason or another. Let these individuals hear the complaints from the riders and see for their own eyes what they have created. Just think about the possibilities for the express routes where they drive the bus to Manhattan for their one trip in the morning, working at their desks for 4-5 hours and then driving the bus back home in the afternoon.

 

in other words, it is called cross-training and that is something that management likes to talk about and now they will have the opportunity to try it out with the right group of workers

 

Now they would be part-time bus drivers and part-timers in the agency with full time work!!

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IMO a compromise could be used for 1)Rush Hour express bus lines 2)special weekend services such as GO's for subway shutdowns and summer only service. Nothing against the TWU/ATU and I know i be blasted for saying this but this is 2012 not 1972. Time to make changes. Plus some lower used station *cough* *cough* the Rockaway Park Shuttle stations should be 24/7 MVM's. Just install cameras at a few select stations along with NYPD police patrols and call it a day. I agree with Foxie. Even with part time they still have to be union members.

 

 

No reactions to my proposals above lol?

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Don't tell any MTA bigwigs to go to Boston because the MBTA just became all OPTO (they call it SPTO) within the past year, and some stations don't have station attendants (Boston's equivalent of S/A's) at all. What's scary (for TWU's sake) is that the Orange line trains are 65ft x 6 cars (390 ft) and the Red line trains are about 69.5 feet x 6 cars (417 feet), above MTA's 300-foot policy. Sure the MBTA system is smaller than the NYC subway system, but the precedence is there.

 

The MTA wishes they can get away with what Boston has gotten away with.

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Don't tell any MTA bigwigs to go to Boston because the MBTA just became all OPTO (they call it SPTO) within the past year, and some stations don't have station attendants (Boston's equivalent of S/A's) at all. What's scary (for TWU's sake) is that the Orange line trains are 65ft x 6 cars (390 ft) and the Red line trains are about 69.5 feet x 6 cars (417 feet), above MTA's 300-foot policy. Sure the MBTA system is smaller than the NYC subway system, but the precedence is there.

 

The MTA wishes they can get away with what Boston has gotten away with.

 

 

And yet, Boston's Subway is much cleaner and doesn't look like its falling apart like many of the NYC Subway stations do. The oldest trains in their fleet (not counting the PCCs on the Mattapan line) are from 1981, vs our anchient relics on the (C) and (J) dating back to the Johnson and Nixon administrations. If you use the CharlieCard vs the paper/mag stripe CharlieTicket, the fare in Boston is cheaper than New York.

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