R train between Manhattan and Brooklyn still several weeks away: officials

[BreeddekalbL]

quick question how does the R turn at jay street?

 

another thing did anyone see the ny1 story of the lady crying she has to spend $20 dollars because the R train is cutoff from manhattan and brooklyn?

[Fresh Pond]

quick question how does the R turn at jay street?

 

another thing did anyone see the ny1 story of the lady crying she has to spend $20 dollars because the R train is cutoff from manhattan and brooklyn?

 

 

There's a double crossover between Jay St-Metrotech and Court St

[Threxx]

Why doesn't the run to Court Street then?

[itmaybeokay]

I keep on hearing unconfirmed rumors that the cast iron rings of the Montaugue St tunnels had suffered such severe damage that even if it has'nt happened yet the engineers are fearing that the tunnel can still collapse due to corrosion damage from sea water. (Some has suggested that that concrete slabs had already collapsed inside the tunnel) Can anyone provide this insight and clarity on this once an for all?

 

 

https://twitter.com/MTA_NYCT_Vocero/status/267814693010305025

 

This MTA spokesperson answered me a few days ago on twitter. Says the rumors are false. In the absence of anything resembling a confirmed report to the contrary, I'm inclined to believe him.

[realizm]

https://twitter.com/...814693010305025

 

This MTA spokesperson answered me a few days ago on twitter. Says the rumors are false. In the absence of anything resembling a confirmed report to the contrary, I'm inclined to believe him.

 

 

Thank you for bringing me back up to date. That was the answer I was looking for

[alejr88]

Why doesn't the run to Court Street then?

 

 

Last I heard about the Montague flooding, the water was 500 feet away from Court St and at Atlantic you can always transfer to the Brooklyn IRT for Borough Hall. It's not necessary to send it to Court St.

[R32 3838]

to me they should just cut the between 34th and 71st and just extend the or to 71st until the whole service is usable again, i don't see the point of the split service, astoria can deal with one line for a bit, its not like its gonna be out for months, yeah i know theres alot of ridership in astoria and etc. but they can increase Astoria service while you have ether the or the go to 71st IMO, the shuttle between jay st and 95th makes sense, the 34th to 71st to me doesn't, people still stay on the past 34th, and the reason why no trains can't go pass canal Upper level is because there is no power beyond that point, thats why the is only going to chambers also

[Quill Depot]

Why doesn't the run to Court Street then?

 

 

There's probably not enough demand for Court. Also, same with the water. I think service should have about 1 more train to handle the crowds.

[Shortline Bus]

As an alternative, the J train should be sent to 95th when the tunnels are ready, and the R can then run Whitehall-Forest Hills all times except late nights. The J runs regular intervals and doesn't have the problem of other trains cutting in front of it, causing delays. It's just not possible to have such a lengthy local R route (Forest Hills to 95th) with numerous merges along the way and not experience horrendous delays on a regular basis.

 

Or else, the R train really needs to have its length split in two. 95th- Court and Whitehall-Forest Hills. It's a win-win situation for Queens riders and for Brooklyn riders. Those who need connecting service between lower Manhattan & downtown Brooklyn have tons of extra connections: 2, 3, 4, 5, A, and C (all of which would be considerably faster than waiting for a delayed R train that has to run from Forest Hills all the way to 95th).

 

 

Actually that for another topic. If there was a way for the as they did years ago to propose buliding a mini subway yards at Sunnyside (between Queensboro and 39th Ave stations)you couldhave ran a 24/7 between Astoria and 95th-Bay Ridge, just like before 1987. Biggest problem is the is too long but that for another thread. If anything maybe a 24/7 (just throwing it out there)line between Chambers and 95th, (with the new Bway-SAS line opens the 96th-2nd-9th Avenue Brooklyn taking over)

 

 

 

 

Back to topic. I think under the circumstances this is the best plan and I agree with the on split service until the tunnel is reopend. With that said, I would done these minor changes:

 

1) and make all stops in Manhattan between Canal and 57th in both directions. Weekends/Overnights switches to express between Times Sq. and 57th.

 

2)"limited" number of trains would run the full route via Manhattan Bridge during the rush hours between Forest Hills and 95th to help Bay Ridge and 4th Ave local riders a direct train to/from Midtown.

 

Or as R32 3838 suggested send the daily 6am-Midnight to Forest Hills and overnights terminates at 57th/7th as what happened in post 9/11/01 service pattern when the went to 71st Ave.

[Snowblock]

There was NO cave-in/collapse in the Montague tunnel. Quit spreading that rumor. The tunnel DID sustain severe salt-water damage from the flooding though, and repairs are still underway in there.

[RtrainBlues]

I don't think there is capacity to send any uptown R trains express from Brooklyn in the morning rush hour. The uptown D & N are at capacity along 4th Avenue during morning rush-hour, often stopping so many times along the express track that it is quicker to stay on the R local if you're only going to Atlantic Ave from Bay Ridge. At 8am, the problem is especially present. And if you send the R via bridge starting at DeKalb, that would cause merging problems with the B and Q which are also at capacity (and also the N and D approaching the bridge).

 

I ultimately think (when everything is back to normal) that split service 95th-Chambers and Whitehall-Forest Hills would help the R maintain reliability and cut down on the merges that contribute to frequent delays. In the meantime, it seems that the uptown Q needs to run local to pick up passengers at the busy Prince St, 8th, 23rd & 28th St stops (to supplement the N).

[RollOver]

I think its better that the goes to Forest Hills and leave the at Astoria alone. Since the Brighton Line has much higher ridership between Newkirk Plaza and Brighton Beach due to many residents at the eastern side of Midwood, Flatbush, Gravesend, Sheepshead Bay, and Brighton Beach, they can run it every five minutes like they do on weekdays but ten minutes on weekends. Have the run every eight minutes at rush hour and ten minutes off-peak. Make all trains local on Broadway with the running only between Jay and 95th Streets. The Sea Beach, West End, and Culver lines run quite pararell somewhat anyway, giving riders attractions and/or options there.

 

Anyways, either of which replaces the northern section is the best idea IMO, as long as Astoria and/or Brighton are getting frequent service they get now, most notably five minute headways of course.

[Fresh Pond]

I ultimately think (when everything is back to normal) that split service 95th-Chambers and Whitehall-Forest Hills would help the R maintain reliability and cut down on the merges that contribute to frequent delays. In the meantime, it seems that the uptown Q needs to run local to pick up passengers at the busy Prince St, 8th, 23rd & 28th St stops (to supplement the N).

 

 

Once again, you're just shifting problems to another line.

 

For starters, you can't send the to Chambers since you can't send 75' cars over there on Nassau St. Even of you decide to use 160s, the train is still going to be too long for the platforms. Then you have to worry about the getting in the way of the and with the merging.

 

Second, if you split service, you're just gonna confuse people with two different trains, and destroying a one seat ride for people. once again, sure it's slow as molasses, but it's still an effective one-seat ride for everyone who uses it.

[RollOver]

And to also add a few more things to what you said, it just wouldn't work any other way. The BMT Eastern Division station platforms and tunnels only fit 60 footers but with 8 car segments of them. And since skip-stop service is every 5 minutes with the Jamaica and Nassau Street lines in the reserve direction at rush hour, why make the terminate at Chambers Street when the are already beginning and ending there plus with the severe damages already done by Sandy to the Broad and Fulton Street stations? That would also require more crews, costs, and switching. Either way or whatever, it wouldn't work. I would say that if there were no damages to the Montague Street Tunnel and the Lower Manhattan stations on the Broadway Line, the only way to have the rank above average on service regularity and run at perfect 10 minute or 5 minute headways is if you had it begin at Canal Street (Upper Level) or City Hall (Upper Level) stations after relaying at the unused express tracks that come from the lower level of City Hall station. That would reduce the interactions the already has with other lines, the on Queens Boulevard, and the and on the 60th-59th tube and Broadway.

[Eric B]

Also, that whole idea would assume that the tunnel as far as the Nassau turnoff was ready before the section beyond there, and Whitehall. The worst damage might not be past the turnoff, so you may not be able to get that section back before the rest.

 

If they didn't, it would be a matter of extending the to 95th (as they did post 9-11), but now, the problem is getting enough 8 car trains.

[Grand Concourse]

Once again, you're just shifting problems to another line.

 

For starters, you can't send the to Chambers since you can't send 75' cars over there on Nassau St. Even of you decide to use 160s, the train is still going to be too long for the platforms. Then you have to worry about the getting in the way of the and with the merging.

 

Second, if you split service, you're just gonna confuse people with two different trains, and destroying a one seat ride for people. once again, sure it's slow as molasses, but it's still an effective one-seat ride for everyone who uses it.

 

I've been tolerant till this point, but now he's gone off the deep end. I'm not sure about south of Bowery, but I thought R46s are ok there too? The main issue is the Willy B (trains in both directions sideswiping each other) and the Cresent St curve.

=

Again, the very least that they could do is (when the tunnel is back in service again) maybe terminate select Brooklyn trains at Whitehall and run them back to 95th. There's no need to involve the lines as they are short trains because of the . If that's not enough then whatever...

[Wallyhorse]

If they didn't, it would be a matter of extending the to 95th (as they did post 9-11), but now, the problem is getting enough 8 car trains.

 

Which is why if it were up to me, I would be revisiting the four-and-five car linked sets and look at going back to the old way of two-car sets and/or singles, which in a situation like this would better allow for being able to for example extend the as was done post-9/11. The other option would be to if necessary in that scenario run some five-car trains to 95th if there are not enough cars to do it with eight-car trains (unless you can move the remaining R32s not currently on the Rockaway Shuttle to the on a temporary basis if needed).

[TwoTimer]

Once again, I SMH at some the pretenders who think they know stuff...

 

1. When the tunnel is back in service the will run its full route, barring any other unrelated GO's. None of this exotic foam-filled concoctions I've seen here. The tunnel won't return to service until the entire thru area is ready. The only thing that might be seen is Whitehall get up and running to terminate trains there, but only when the rest of the station (minus the IRT connection) is ready.

 

2. The only thing they can do right now is on weekends anyway, run the its full route via Bridge in both directions. If they so wish, a shuttle can run between Dekalb and Jay (exclusive use single track shuttle)... or put everyone on IRT trains, just like they did prior to the BMT/IND transfer opening.

 

3. Continuity is important. Railfans are very attentive to everything around them while underground, both inside the car, on platforms, outside windows, etc. The normal customer is not, and never will be. A replacing a train in Queens, while it occurred then, doesn't mean it won't confuse now. The current idea allows TA to maintain close to normal service in the 60th street corridor and in Astoria, where ridership is high. But as was said earlier, the can make all stops in Manhattan.

[Wallyhorse]

Two Timer:

 

That is true, but I also think we have learned post-Sandy that greater flexibility is needed as well. That was why the idea of having the (or perhaps a brief revival of the "Brown ") run via Nassau to 95th if Whitehall is not ready BUT Montague can otherwise be used.

 

Back in the day, people used to pay much greater attention to things like that (I certainly did in the 1980s when I had to know the routes because of the nature of my work at the time) and as I would do it rewards people who know their alternate routes and know that trains are capable in some cases are running on lines they normally don't. Sometimes, in my view it's better to make necessary changes when needed to more efficiently run things from an overall view and make it so those who know, pay attention and are aware changes can be made as needed are rewarded for doing so. Some people just are stubborn, and those who are would have to realize that those who are not are the ones who would be rewarded, with the message made clear: Pay attention to how the lines can run in an emergency or for some other reason (G.O., etc.).

[j express]

How about adding more trains on weekends or extending the to Brooklyn on weekends to handle crowds heading to/from Battery Park untill full service is resumes. This is a better way than sending the to 95 St. Lexingtion Av stations are very close to stations.

[Fresh Pond]

Two Timer:

 

That is true, but I also think we have learned post-Sandy that greater flexibility is needed as well. That was why the idea of having the (or perhaps a brief revival of the "Brown ") run via Nassau to 95th if Whitehall is not ready BUT Montague can otherwise be used.

 

Back in the day, people used to pay much greater attention to things like that (I certainly did in the 1980s when I had to know the routes because of the nature of my work at the time) and as I would do it rewards people who know their alternate routes and know that trains are capable in some cases are running on lines they normally don't. Sometimes, in my view it's better to make necessary changes when needed to more efficiently run things from an overall view and make it so those who know, pay attention and are aware changes can be made as needed are rewarded for doing so. Some people just are stubborn, and those who are would have to realize that those who are not are the ones who would be rewarded, with the message made clear: Pay attention to how the lines can run in an emergency or for some other reason (G.O., etc.)

 

Look who's talking...

[Wallyhorse]

How about adding more trains on weekends or extending the to Brooklyn on weekends to handle crowds heading to/from Battery Park untill full service is resumes. This is a better way than sending the to 95 St. Lexingtion Av stations are very close to stations.

 

That is what should be done on weekends until further notice (sending the to Brooklyn), especially since it looks like (as of now) at least through the holiday season the Montauge tunnel will not be in service.

[QM1to6Ave]

Once again, I SMH at some the pretenders who think they know stuff...

 

1. When the tunnel is back in service the will run its full route, barring any other unrelated GO's. None of this exotic foam-filled concoctions I've seen here. The tunnel won't return to service until the entire thru area is ready. The only thing that might be seen is Whitehall get up and running to terminate trains there, but only when the rest of the station (minus the IRT connection) is ready.

 

 

 

I hope that happens!

[CenSin]

Which is why if it were up to me,

We should all be thankful that isn't the case.

 

That is true, but I also think we have learned

Some people just are stubborn

We all learned something from reading other people's posts. You're the only one not learning that a to 95 Street isn't the brightest idea—namely the likely possibility that the damage once fixed will enable both the Broadway and Nassau Street connection from the Montague tunnel, and you know which train is going to stay in Manhattan.

[R32 3838]

Two Timer:

 

That is true, but I also think we have learned post-Sandy that greater flexibility is needed as well. That was why the idea of having the (or perhaps a brief revival of the "Brown ") run via Nassau to 95th if Whitehall is not ready BUT Montague can otherwise be used.

 

Back in the day, people used to pay much greater attention to things like that (I certainly did in the 1980s when I had to know the routes because of the nature of my work at the time) and as I would do it rewards people who know their alternate routes and know that trains are capable in some cases are running on lines they normally don't. Sometimes, in my view it's better to make necessary changes when needed to more efficiently run things from an overall view and make it so those who know, pay attention and are aware changes can be made as needed are rewarded for doing so. Some people just are stubborn, and those who are would have to realize that those who are not are the ones who would be rewarded, with the message made clear: Pay attention to how the lines can run in an emergency or for some other reason (G.O., etc.).

 

Dude the Tunnel is closed off, meaning you can't send the to 95th, if the can't go what makes you think the will go down there or the brown <R> returning

 

@ two timer i get where your coming from with the , but to me it doesn't make sense to have the run in two sections, just leave the in brooklyn, astoria can survive with the , just make both the (N)/(Q) local until they restore full service, they have enough equipment to do it, i ride the most of the time and people DO go lower than 34th st that ride the train, the only good thing about the going to 34th, it uses the express tracks after 5th ave to 34th