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nostalgia

Relaying at Parkchester

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During the week, the (6) express goes through to Pelham Bay Park and the (6) local terminates at Parkchester. Why doesn't the local go through to Pelham Bay Park and express relay at Parkchester? Under this scenario, the express reverses direction on the same track it arrived and the local continues to Pelham Bay. Now, the express crosses over to the local tracks and continues to Pelham Bay and the local has to cross over to the opposite side for its return trip.

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That would make the trip much longer for people coming from those further out stops on the (6).

 

If the length of the trip was a consideration, the express would run on weekends. But it doesn't.

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If the length of the trip was a consideration, the express would run on weekends. But it doesn't.

 

 

Why do you think its laid out the way it is now, the expresses extend further out so the further out stations dont have to make so many stops and become overcrowded by the time they reach the south bronx stops.

 

Weekends there isnt as many people riding the Pelham line, which is why its a weekday express only.

 

Think of the other expresses for the most part, the (A) runs further out than the (C), the (F) goes all the way to 179 Street, while the (M) only goes to 71 Ave. The system is designed to have the express trains start further out in the system. There are exceptions, such as the (R) which originally went to Astoria while the (N) went further into Queens. On the south end, the (1) goes to South Ferry while the (2) and (3) keep going into Brooklyn.

 

The (B) is one of the few that buck the trend and end earlier on the line than the local (Q).

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Why do you think its laid out the way it is now, the expresses extend further out so the further out stations dont have to make so many stops and become overcrowded by the time they reach the south bronx stops.

 

Weekends there isnt as many people riding the Pelham line, which is why its a weekday express only.

 

Think of the other expresses for the most part, the (A) runs further out than the (C), the (F) goes all the way to 179 Street, while the (M) only goes to 71 Ave. The system is designed to have the express trains start further out in the system. There are exceptions, such as the (R) which originally went to Astoria while the (N) went further into Queens. On the south end, the (1) goes to South Ferry while the (2) and (3) keep going into Brooklyn.

 

The (B) is one of the few that buck the trend and end earlier on the line than the local (Q).

 

 

I'm still waiting for somebody to explain the relay procedure. A relaying local has to contend with an express crossing over in front of it before it can cross over AND a local coming from Pelham Bay.

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During the week, the (6) express goes through to Pelham Bay Park and the (6) local terminates at Parkchester. Why doesn't the local go through to Pelham Bay Park and express relay at Parkchester? Under this scenario, the express reverses direction on the same track it arrived and the local continues to Pelham Bay. Now, the express crosses over to the local tracks and continues to Pelham Bay and the local has to cross over to the opposite side for its return trip.

So? It's similar to the set up with the (2)(5) at 180th where the (5) on the express has to cross over to the local to access that Dyre Av tracks. I don't see what the big deal is about the way the <6> and (6) runs. I thought it was strange when I first rode it several years ago, but now I understand that there's no real difference and if it suits the riders, then so be it. They get a one seat express ride and don't have to deal with transfering there. Other than one train waiting for the other to clear the switch, it doesn't cause that much of a hold up. Edited by Grand Concourse

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So? It's similar to the set up with the (2)(5) at 180th where the (5) on the express has to cross over to the local to access that Dyre Av tracks. I don't see what the big deal is about the way the <6> and (6) runs. I thought it was strange when I first rode it several years ago, but now I understand that there's no real difference and if it suits the riders, then so be it. They get a one seat express ride and don't have to deal with transfering there. Other than one train waiting for the other to clear the switch, it doesn't cause that much of a hold up.

 

The (5) doesn't relay during the day at E. 180 so it's not the same as the Parkchester situation. And when it does relay from Dyre Avenue, it relays from the SAME track it entered E. 180th.

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Because trains CAN'T relay on M Tk in the station! That would require switches south of the station.....

 

Futherremore, if the S/B expresses began at 177, they would be running empty into Manhattan since they only make 3 stops, while the locals from Pelham would be crushloaded.....

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If Pelham Bay Park was a three-tracked terminal, then the <6> would be fully express the entire way while the (6) makes all the local stops (reducing the local relay at the express track north of Parkchester) and making all trains go to Pelham Bay Park every single time............

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The (5) doesn't relay during the day at E. 180 so it's not the same as the Parkchester situation. And when it does relay from Dyre Avenue, it relays from the SAME track it entered E. 180th.

My point was the local and express crossing each other past the station. Why does it matter that the local is the one that doesn't go past 177th? If people are going to transfer to the express there, then why not just run the express from Pelham Bay Park from the start and let the local start at 177th to divide the loading? And Snowblock answered it perfectly - trains can only relay north of the station. Edited by Grand Concourse

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Because trains CAN'T relay on M Tk in the station! That would require switches south of the station.....

 

Futherremore, if the S/B expresses began at 177, they would be running empty into Manhattan since they only make 3 stops, while the locals from Pelham would be crushloaded.....

 

That explains why the express can't relay at Parkchester. Does the local use M track beyond the crossover to the local track to relay?

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Because trains CAN'T relay on M Tk in the station! That would require switches south of the station.....

 

Futherremore, if the S/B expresses began at 177, they would be running empty into Manhattan since they only make 3 stops, while the locals from Pelham would be crushloaded.....

 

No, the platform would be more crowded with transferees at E. 177 St, most people would not stay on the local. People even get off the local at Hunts Point if the express is there.

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*Sigh*

 

A relay is a turnaround procedure that revolves the train going into a "relay position" (that does not have an operable platform adjacent to it) to operate back in the direction in which it came. This does not occur in terminals ending in bumping blocks or tail tracks. The train must be devoid of passengers as per rule before it is allowed to relay. Relay positions on specific tracks do allow traffic (signals) to be reversed direction on that same track so trains can indeed proceed in the opposite direction under signal control, if needed.

 

At the moment, (6) trains terminate at Parkchester on 3 track. Usually a <6> crosses in front of it, and the train relays between Parkchester and Castle Hill on M track behind it. Track layout requires this to be the case. As stated earlier in the thread, the (2) and (5) switch tracks between Tremont and E180 (no (5) trains relay at E180 except during GO, they either continue on north in service or go into the yard from there). The primary reason Pelham trains run express is to even out ridership above 125, not specifically to shorten the commute time. In the rush, assuming no connections (which are rare), (6) and <6> trains have roughly equal passenger loads entering 125. It works as designed. As usual, the reason two tracks are used in the peak direction is to slightly increase the number of trains that can be run into Manhattan. In the PM rush, the fact that the trains are split using a high speed switch just below 3Av allows a low headway to be maintained in Manhattan.

Edited by TwoTimer
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Why do you think its laid out the way it is now, the expresses extend further out so the further out stations dont have to make so many stops and become overcrowded by the time they reach the south bronx stops.

 

Weekends there isnt as many people riding the Pelham line, which is why its a weekday express only.

 

Think of the other expresses for the most part, the (A) runs further out than the (C), the (F) goes all the way to 179 Street, while the (M) only goes to 71 Ave. The system is designed to have the express trains start further out in the system. There are exceptions, such as the (R) which originally went to Astoria while the (N) went further into Queens. On the south end, the (1) goes to South Ferry while the (2) and (3) keep going into Brooklyn.

 

The (B) is one of the few that buck the trend and end earlier on the line than the local (Q).

 

How could you forget, the most obvious exception; the (3) AND (4) In Brooklyn. This is something they've thought of fixing.

 

Also, the (N) and (R) in Queens have nothing to do with it. Astoria and Queens Blvd are two totally different branches with two separate terminals, not one line short turning while another goes past its terminal. Astoria always (since 1920) had an express and local like now, while Queens Blvd-Bway was always a local. The express to Astoria was eliminated in 1967, so both Queens services only had locals; and in 1976, the (N) was sent to Queens, which was mostly express, but a few were made local to replace the earlier service.

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During the week, the (6) express goes through to Pelham Bay Park and the (6) local terminates at Parkchester. Why doesn't the local go through to Pelham Bay Park and express relay at Parkchester? Under this scenario, the express reverses direction on the same track it arrived and the local continues to Pelham Bay. Now, the express crosses over to the local tracks and continues to Pelham Bay and the local has to cross over to the opposite side for its return trip.

 

 

The only time it does this is i think at 9 in the morning til 1PM the 6 runs Local from Parkchester to Hunts Point and then Express to 3rd Ave-138 St and runs with a <6> not a (6) the Local 6 to Parkchester will run express Between Hunts Point and Parkchester, go strait and relay, the Local 6 to Pelham runs normal no waiting there. Does that answer your question?

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The only time it does this is i think at 9 in the morning til 1PM the 6 runs Local from Parkchester to Hunts Point and then Express to 3rd Ave-138 St and runs with a <6> not a (6) the Local 6 to Parkchester will run express Between Hunts Point and Parkchester, go strait and relay, the Local 6 to Pelham runs normal no waiting there. Does that answer your question?

 

 

My question dealt with N/B service to Pelham Bay. I think your answer is in the opposite direction.

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My question dealt with N/B service to Pelham Bay. I think your answer is in the opposite direction.

 

Im talking about it relays on the middle track between i think 9 or 10 am to 1 pm and the 6 runs LCL To Hunts Point Dwn and Uptown the 6 to Parkchester runs EXP and the 6 to Pelham goes straight

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Im talking about it relays on the middle track between i think 9 or 10 am to 1 pm and the 6 runs LCL To Hunts Point Dwn and Uptown the 6 to Parkchester runs EXP and the 6 to Pelham goes straight

 

 

Thanky you. Now I understand.

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If the length of the trip was a consideration, the express would run on weekends. But it doesn't.

 

 

The 6 runs every 4 minutes or better for most of the span of express service on weekdays. Splitting the service into Bronx locals and expresses gives each an 8 minute headway.

 

On weekends, the 6 runs every 8 minutes. If it were split into Bronx locals and expresses, each would have a 16 minute headway. Even long-distance riders are better off with the current 8 minute local service.

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The (6) and <6> cant switch terminals mainly because Pelham Bay Park cannot not take a train holding a boatload of passengers that's the reason the <6> goes there let alone even being made because as one person said before Pelham Bay Park is not a three tracked terminal so it cnat take a lot of traffic, this is different from the <7> and (7) both going to Main Street, Queens because since it has more room it has the ability of holding more traffic its worse on rush hours therefore it just makes more sense having the (6) go to Parkchester and the <6> continue to Pelham Bay Park because there won't be as much traffic on either of the trains.

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