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BrooklynBus

Our Mass Transit Future Parts 2 and 3 - What Happened to Democracy?

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I agree with you on the points of mass transit advocacy. The amount of people who seemingly want to destroy our public transit system also seem to be the ones who attack the (MTA) when they are forced to raise fares and cut service.

 

However, as for an SBS route along Avenue P and Flatlands, there's no demand for a service like that, especially SBS. 

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I agree with you on the points of mass transit advocacy. The amount of people who seemingly want to destroy our public transit system also seem to be the ones who attack the (MTA) when they are forced to raise fares and cut service.

 

However, as for an SBS route along Avenue P and Flatlands, there's no demand for a service like that, especially SBS. 

 

There would be demand if the route serves Gateway Mall and perhaps goes as far as JFK.  There is no way to get to JFK from southern Brooklyn by mass transit quickly. The current trip to Gateway takes minutes to 2 hours and two fares by bus.  the time would  be reduced and it would be cheaper if there was an SBS. 

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There would be demand if the route serves Gateway Mall and perhaps goes as far as JFK.  There is no way to get to JFK from southern Brooklyn by mass transit quickly. The current trip to Gateway takes minutes to 2 hours and two fares by bus.  the time would  be reduced and it would be cheaper if there was an SBS. 

 

I actually have an idea similar to this, but it's only a LTD. If demand would prove itself to be as high as you claim, then maybe it could be SBS: https://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=213458373195564989412.0004ce7c590f8d241708f&msa=0&ll=40.669962,-73.881683&spn=0.150773,0.308647

Edited by Threxx

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I actually have an idea similar to this, but it's only a LTD. If demand would prove itself to be as high as you claim, then maybe it could be SBS: https://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=213458373195564989412.0004ce7c590f8d241708f&msa=0&ll=40.669962,-73.881683&spn=0.150773,0.308647

Put a stop at Remsen/Flatlands and this would be a better way for me to go to work at JFK! ^_^

Edited by Metro CSW

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What happened to democracy is a small minority of loud idiots hijacked it. That's why nothing gets done: because we constantly have to appease mad-as-a-dog lunatics and NIMBYs who hate everything and want to drag NYC back to the 1950s. Look at the NYC mayoral candidates. They're all competing over who can talk more shit about bike lanes and tolls. None of them even mention public transport once, because it isn't important to them. They all compete over who loves cars and highways more.

 

You see it with our governor who put his face on every MTA press release during Sandy to make it seem like he was responsible for service restorations and forgot about the MTA the second the system was fixed up. He doesn't mention anything about transit, but got that joke of a Tappan-Zee bridge replacement through with no provisions for a rail line. That's in addition to the millions he's taken out of the MTA budget to give out to non-MTA counties. Our governor is a suburbanite who literally couldn't care less about public transit, and our city's politicians are more than happy to play along with the state government. It started with Pataki robbing the MTA, and Paterson and Cuomo have done the same, because they face no criticisms over such actions, and have politicians in Albany who are complicit. They cut and cut and cut, and then throw fake outrage at the MTA for daring to try and meet its budget constraints. They get away with it because local reporters also don't give two shits about transit and just repeat what politicians tell them to say.

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Put a stop at Remsen/Flatlands and this would be a better way for me to go to work at JFK! ^_^

 

Thought there was one... well, it's there now.

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What happened to democracy is a small minority of loud idiots hijacked it. That's why nothing gets done: because we constantly have to appease mad-as-a-dog lunatics and NIMBYs who hate everything and want to drag NYC back to the 1950s. Look at the NYC mayoral candidates. They're all competing over who can talk more shit about bike lanes and tolls. None of them even mention public transport once, because it isn't important to them. They all compete over who loves cars and highways more.

 

You see it with our governor who put his face on every MTA press release during Sandy to make it seem like he was responsible for service restorations and forgot about the MTA the second the system was fixed up. He doesn't mention anything about transit, but got that joke of a Tappan-Zee bridge replacement through with no provisions for a rail line. That's in addition to the millions he's taken out of the MTA budget to give out to non-MTA counties. Our governor is a suburbanite who literally couldn't care less about public transit, and our city's politicians are more than happy to play along with the state government. It started with Pataki robbing the MTA, and Paterson and Cuomo have done the same, because they face no criticisms over such actions, and have politicians in Albany who are complicit. They cut and cut and cut, and then throw fake outrage at the MTA for daring to try and meet its budget constraints. They get away with it because local reporters also don't give two shits about transit and just repeat what politicians tell them to say.

 

Didn't finish reading the entire articles provided in the OP by BrooklynBus so I will wait before I start my usual rant on the politicking and lobbying, which is a wasting of our time, upstairs in Albany while the Tappan Zee Bridge is on the verge of collapsing into the depths of the abyss, as well as these killjoy NIMBYs and their agenda in killing mass transit forever. (For that matter, the NIMBYs and the rezoning of LGA? Laughable.)

 

However I would like to make one point about Bloomberg in response to your post:

 

As much as he, along with the NIMBYS, has irreversibly promoted ridiculously counterproductive projects such as the installation bike lanes that reduces needed capacity on important roads for passenger auto and commercial truck traffic for the sake of catering to the treehuggers, I do have to give to mayor Bloomberg kudos to advocating for the the transfer of funds that was supposed to go towards funding the now dead ARC Tunnel to NJ (Thanks to NJ Gov Christie) to advocate for the modification of the (7) line extension for the construction of the tubes to connect the IRT to Secaucus NJ.

 

OK, on that I have to give credit (I can see the jaws dropping in shock for this rare occasion where I am actually praising Bloomberg). It's understood btw that he wanted to make his last hoorah as he leaves City Hall soon, and get himself into the transit history books by advocating for such an extension to NJ from the IRT (7) line extension that makes up the A division of the NYC Subway Transit system. 

Edited by realizm

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Didn't finish reading the entire articles provided in the OP by BrooklynBus so I will wait before I start my usual rant on the politicking and lobbying, which is a wasting of our time, upstairs in Albany while the Tappan Zee Bridge is on the verge of collapsing into the depths of the abyss, as well as these killjoy NIMBYs and their agenda in killing mass transit forever. (For that matter, the NIMBYs and the rezoning of LGA? Laughable.)

 

However I would like to make one point about Bloomberg in response to your post:

 

As much as he, along with the NIMBYS, has irreversibly promoted ridiculously counterproductive projects such as the installation bike lanes that reduces needed capacity on important roads for passenger auto and commercial truck traffic for the sake of catering to the treehuggers, I do have to give to mayor Bloomberg kudos to advocating for the the transfer of funds that was supposed to go towards funding the now dead ARC Tunnel to NJ (Thanks to NJ Gov Christie) to advocate for the modification of the (7) line extension for the construction of the tubes to connect the IRT to Secaucus NJ.

 

OK, on that I have to give credit (I can see the jaws dropping in shock for this rare occasion where I am actually praising Bloomberg). It's understood btw that he wanted to make his last hoorah as he leaves City Hall soon, and get himself into the transit history books by advocating for such an extension to NJ from the IRT (7) line extension that makes up the A division of the NYC Subway Transit system. 

Yes, let's make improving transit in NJ a priority for NYC mayors. New Jersey voted that clown Christie in, let them deal with their own deserved transit issues. NYC needs to keep its commitment to improving transit in *NYC*.

 

Also, bike lanes don't always hurt. My street got one and nobody complained, since traffic was light anyways; and people use the bike lanes. Bloomberg, if he needs a last hurra, needs to stop those novelty-seeking fools in Queens from destroying the Rockaway ROW to build their High Line-wannabe and get rail service back on that corridor. The folks of Woodhaven and Ozone Park would thank him.

Edited by Culver
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Yes, let's make improving transit in NJ a priority for NYC mayors. New Jersey voted that clown Christie in, let them deal with their own deserved transit issues. NYC needs to keep its commitment to improving transit in *NYC*.

 

Also, bike lanes don't always hurt. My street got one and nobody complained, since traffic was light anyways; and people use the bike lanes. Bloomberg, if he needs a last hurra, needs to stop those novelty-seeking fools in Queens from destroying the Rockaway ROW to build their High Line-wannabe and get rail service back on that corridor. The folks of Woodhaven and Ozone Park would thank him.

 

OK good points. But do understand that many people come in droves from NJ to work in NYC every day where the high paying jobs are. Ever see how much of a madhouse Penn Station looks on a given rush hour commute? Plus on the PATH? From New Jersey, the numbers of reverse commuters into NYC has grown 72% between 1996 to 2006 alone and, of course, still counting!

 

That's a huge astronomical jump in ridership. Hence the very valid proposal of the NJ (7) link from Manhattan as proposed by the City of New York.

 

For the sake of bringing needed money to the MTA via fare collection revenue, that this extension would actually be productive profit wise for this public benefit corporation in the long term. Who knows it may make the cut in funding the actual completion of projects such as the SAS in it's entirety as well as pay the bills for future capital construction projects to keep our system running in the years to come?

 

No foamerizm here it's all about the economic benefits of cross state mass travel that will be a huge convenience to NYers, NYers, and the funding/revenue desperate MTA which helps us get where we need to go to work etc. It will benefit us in the long run.

Edited by realizm

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Didn't finish reading the entire articles provided in the OP by BrooklynBus so I will wait before I start my usual rant on the politicking and lobbying, which is a wasting of our time, upstairs in Albany while the Tappan Zee Bridge is on the verge of collapsing into the depths of the abyss, as well as these killjoy NIMBYs and their agenda in killing mass transit forever. (For that matter, the NIMBYs and the rezoning of LGA? Laughable.)

 

However I would like to make one point about Bloomberg in response to your post:

 

As much as he, along with the NIMBYS, has irreversibly promoted ridiculously counterproductive projects such as the installation bike lanes that reduces needed capacity on important roads for passenger auto and commercial truck traffic for the sake of catering to the treehuggers, I do have to give to mayor Bloomberg kudos to advocating for the the transfer of funds that was supposed to go towards funding the now dead ARC Tunnel to NJ (Thanks to NJ Gov Christie) to advocate for the modification of the (7) line extension for the construction of the tubes to connect the IRT to Secaucus NJ.

 

OK, on that I have to give credit (I can see the jaws dropping in shock for this rare occasion where I am actually praising Bloomberg). It's understood btw that he wanted to make his last hoorah as he leaves City Hall soon, and get himself into the transit history books by advocating for such an extension to NJ from the IRT (7) line extension that makes up the A division of the NYC Subway Transit system. 

why not just add a union city station to NJT with timed connections from LIRR or extend 3rd rail to Secaucus NJ to let LIRR serve that area rather than using the (7).

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why not just add a union city station to NJT with timed connections from LIRR or extend 3rd rail to Secaucus NJ to let LIRR serve that area rather than using the (7).

 

In terms of added capacity that only standard railroad dimension cars can offer as compared to IRT cars that might actually might be a good idea as an alternative, that's something to think about. Plus it would be less costly to implement then an entire set of underwater tubes from 34th Street with the price tag in the billions of dollars.

Edited by realizm

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What happened to democracy is a small minority of loud idiots hijacked it. That's why nothing gets done: because we constantly have to appease mad-as-a-dog lunatics and NIMBYs who hate everything and want to drag NYC back to the 1950s. Look at the NYC mayoral candidates. They're all competing over who can talk more shit about bike lanes and tolls. None of them even mention public transport once, because it isn't important to them. They all compete over who loves cars and highways more.

 

You see it with our governor who put his face on every MTA press release during Sandy to make it seem like he was responsible for service restorations and forgot about the MTA the second the system was fixed up. He doesn't mention anything about transit, but got that joke of a Tappan-Zee bridge replacement through with no provisions for a rail line. That's in addition to the millions he's taken out of the MTA budget to give out to non-MTA counties. Our governor is a suburbanite who literally couldn't care less about public transit, and our city's politicians are more than happy to play along with the state government. It started with Pataki robbing the MTA, and Paterson and Cuomo have done the same, because they face no criticisms over such actions, and have politicians in Albany who are complicit. They cut and cut and cut, and then throw fake outrage at the MTA for daring to try and meet its budget constraints. They get away with it because local reporters also don't give two shits about transit and just repeat what politicians tell them to say.

 

 

If they are babbling about bike lanes and tolls, they aren't pro automobile. A true pro automobile mayor would not be cutting off broadway and building silly plazas in the middle of everything. A true pro car mayor would not be building bike lanes everywhere, increasing the amount of hazards to driving.

 

The Tappan Zee Bridge needed replacement years ago, every day that old bridge is patched up is another day we risk having a huge tragedy  and a large traffic nightmare on the nearby bridges. 

 

As for the MTA, it seriously needs to learn to live within its means, you wanna see theft, look at the bridge toll revenue that gets siphoned off of maintaining the bridges and tunnels and over to the Subway. The bridge tolls would be around $2-3 each way if the bridges kept all of their toll revenue.

 

New York State is more than just New York City, and the Governor and the state government need to consider the needs of the entire state, not just New York city.

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If they are babbling about bike lanes and tolls, they aren't pro automobile. A true pro automobile mayor would not be cutting off broadway and building silly plazas in the middle of everything. A true pro car mayor would not be building bike lanes everywhere, increasing the amount of hazards to driving.

 

The Tappan Zee Bridge needed replacement years ago, every day that old bridge is patched up is another day we risk having a huge tragedy  and a large traffic nightmare on the nearby bridges. 

 

As for the MTA, it seriously needs to learn to live within its means, you wanna see theft, look at the bridge toll revenue that gets siphoned off of maintaining the bridges and tunnels and over to the Subway. The bridge tolls would be around $2-3 each way if the bridges kept all of their toll revenue.

 

New York State is more than just New York City, and the Governor and the state government need to consider the needs of the entire state, not just New York city.

Well that's the point. The 2013 candidates agree tolls need cutting, bike lanes are evil, and public transit is irrelevant. They're pandering to a relatively small, SUV-driving portion of the city.

 

No, NYC isn't all of NY state, but the problem is that NY state has no problems taking MTA payroll tax revenues and throwing it around non-MTA counties. The MTA wouldn't need to raise fares and tolls if the state didn't consistently raid its budget. And then we have suburbanite state legislators from Long Island demanding that only NYC pay the MTA payroll tax, even though the MTA serves more than just NYC. There's plenty of problems with the MTA's funding, and they come from corrupt Albany politicians and entitled, affluent LI suburbanites demanding that mostly lower-and-middle-class NYC subsidize everything.

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I believe my B22 proposal does have a stop there. Http://BrooklynBus.tripod.com

allow me to perfect your B22 proposal with this it's called the belt area corridor. Problem is no route in NYC not express to nyc can be productive with hourly service. It must be at least 20 mins off peak to see the demand but it will need a support to support different trips.

 

B22 Bay ridge super LTD stops at va hospital to bay ridge express to ceasar's bay for bay parkway stop next stop sheepshead bay subway for (B)(Q) then express to canarsie pier next stop is cross bay blvd followed by airtrain lefferts to JFK for now Or to JFK postal facility(select trips) via federal circle airtrain.

 

That is just a taste to augment the corridor B84 is restructured extended next stop is cross bay blvd then lefferts airtrain then express via nassau expressway to baisley blvd then farmers blvd to murdock ave and springfield blvd to queens village LIRR. Q83 service to queens village LIRR eliminated. B84 gains more service to serve the corridor. SE queens now has a fast 2 bus trip to southern brooklyn and beyond.

 

Q9 to kings plaza via canarsie pier skips cross bay blvd extends via aqueduct casino and rockaway blvd then aqueduct rd to lefferts airtrain. Links available to other brooklyn lines at kings plaza and Q35 at flatbush. Connections available from B22 to casino via Q9 transfer as well as jamacia and south jamacia and south ozone park. B84 modified links to st albans and locust manor via a fast link. @ rush let Q9 serve gateway mall or extend Q8 full time or off-peak only to canarsie pier for better links to B42 via belt.

 

Another route can be introduced later on or 2 if the corridor of these lines has decent ridership.

 

 

That B22 routing and Q9 extension require a permit from DOT and based on what some bus ops here told me it appears as that B22 routing is possible as well as Q9 extension BUT that was based on info I recieved from other threads. 

Edited by qjtransitmaster

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What happened to democracy is a small minority of loud idiots hijacked it. That's why nothing gets done: because we constantly have to appease mad-as-a-dog lunatics and NIMBYs who hate everything and want to drag NYC back to the 1950s. Look at the NYC mayoral candidates. They're all competing over who can talk more shit about bike lanes and tolls. None of them even mention public transport once, because it isn't important to them. They all compete over who loves cars and highways more.

 

You see it with our governor who put his face on every MTA press release during Sandy to make it seem like he was responsible for service restorations and forgot about the MTA the second the system was fixed up. He doesn't mention anything about transit, but got that joke of a Tappan-Zee bridge replacement through with no provisions for a rail line. That's in addition to the millions he's taken out of the MTA budget to give out to non-MTA counties. Our governor is a suburbanite who literally couldn't care less about public transit, and our city's politicians are more than happy to play along with the state government. It started with Pataki robbing the MTA, and Paterson and Cuomo have done the same, because they face no criticisms over such actions, and have politicians in Albany who are complicit. They cut and cut and cut, and then throw fake outrage at the MTA for daring to try and meet its budget constraints. They get away with it because local reporters also don't give two shits about transit and just repeat what politicians tell them to say.

 

Catering to NIMBY's are a real problem, but unfortunately is one of the side effects of having a democracy.  But that is not what I was referring to when asking the question, "What happened to democracy?"  I was referring to not doing a fair study of the North Shore Line and not study both alternatives for the Rockaway Line?  How do you in good conscious fund one alternative and not the other?  Why do you start an engineering assessment of SBS on Woodhaven Boulevard without consulting the community first to solicit their opinion if they even want SBS on Woodhaven Boulevard? Shouldn't the engineering study begin after the affected community gives their blessing? How do you not fairly assess SBS projects by considering all the effects before declaring success as use them as a panacea for all long range projects excluding rail alternatives?  That is what I was getting at by posing that question.

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Catering to NIMBY's are a real problem, but unfortunately is one of the side effects of having a democracy.  But that is not what I was referring to when asking the question, "What happened to democracy?"  I was referring to not doing a fair study of the North Shore Line and not study both alternatives for the Rockaway Line?  How do you in good conscious fund one alternative and not the other?  Why do you start an engineering assessment of SBS on Woodhaven Boulevard without consulting the community first to solicit their opinion if they even want SBS on Woodhaven Boulevard? Shouldn't the engineering study begin after the affected community gives their blessing? How do you not fairly assess SBS projects by considering all the effects before declaring success as use them as a panacea for all long range projects excluding rail alternatives?  That is what I was getting at by posing that question.

Well instead of SBS, they should just reactivate the abandoned Rockaway ROW and connect that to the stub tunnel east of 63 Drive on the IND Queens Boulevard. That would move more people and not mess with traffic flow on Woodhaven; it would probably ease traffic, too.

 

And as I said, listening to NIMBYs is one thing, allowing them to completely hijack our democracy and have a small minority of I-hate-everything douchebags have complete control is another.

Edited by Culver
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Well instead of SBS, they should just reactivate the abandoned Rockaway ROW and connect that to the stub tunnel east of 63 Drive on the IND Queens Boulevard. That would move more people and not mess with traffic flow on Woodhaven; it would probably ease traffic, too.

 

And as I said, listening to NIMBYs is one thing, allowing them to completely hijack our democracy and have a small minority of I-hate-everything douchebags have complete control is another.

Well said but woodhaven traffic is nowhere near standstill level. Heck I was on a Q11 bus leaving cars in the dust to my shock!! So the need for rail service I have mixed views but it is better than a park. To be honest I didn't know there was a stub tunnel on the IND leading up to the rockaway ROW. But no that I do I am actually leaning towards making it a subway instead of a railroad branch with subway like frequencies. It can become the (K) line 2nd ave express woodhaven blvd line via queens blvd local or express. It can go local till jackson heights then express via (F) then directly to 2nd ave with (Q) being local this (K) will be express. The oak point connector can be separated from MNRR hudson and be converted to subway linking the GWB terminal to another subway line OR leave this (K) at 125th for now. Then Let other things like modified hudson line with new station serve GWB usually with express trains and limited stop trains going via that path but that is for another discussion.

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Well that's the point. The 2013 candidates agree tolls need cutting, bike lanes are evil, and public transit is irrelevant. They're pandering to a relatively small, SUV-driving portion of the city.

 

No, NYC isn't all of NY state, but the problem is that NY state has no problems taking MTA payroll tax revenues and throwing it around non-MTA counties. The MTA wouldn't need to raise fares and tolls if the state didn't consistently raid its budget. And then we have suburbanite state legislators from Long Island demanding that only NYC pay the MTA payroll tax, even though the MTA serves more than just NYC. There's plenty of problems with the MTA's funding, and they come from corrupt Albany politicians and entitled, affluent LI suburbanites demanding that mostly lower-and-middle-class NYC subsidize everything.

 

Why should Long Islanders pay a tax for the MTA if many Long Islanders don't even use the system on a regular basis. In New York City people are more reliant on the Subway and Bus, most Long Islanders only take the train when they are going to work in Manhattan. Theres a good amount of Long Islanders who work in Nassau or Suffolk county and drive to work. Why should they have to pay for something they don't use.

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Why should Long Islanders pay a tax for the MTA if many Long Islanders don't even use the system on a regular basis. In New York City people are more reliant on the Subway and Bus, most Long Islanders only take the train when they are going to work in Manhattan. Theres a good amount of Long Islanders who work in Nassau or Suffolk county and drive to work. Why should they have to pay for something they don't use.

Because you LI folk use the LIRR. Lots of you do. And some use the subways from Penn Station and Flatbush terminal. What you suggest is grossly entitled and selfish. So if Nassau had their way, the mostly affluent residents of Nassau get to use the very-expensive-to-run LIRR (and then if needed as part of commute, the subways) with a complete subsidy from the mostly lower-and-middle class NYC. That's almost insane in its shameless sense of entitlement.

If you don't want to pay the MTA payroll tax, then that's fine by me; just have LIRR trains bypass Nassau county stops and end Port Washington branch service at Douglaston.

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Well instead of SBS, they should just reactivate the abandoned Rockaway ROW and connect that to the stub tunnel east of 63 Drive on the IND Queens Boulevard. That would move more people and not mess with traffic flow on Woodhaven; it would probably ease traffic, too.

 

And as I said, listening to NIMBYs is one thing, allowing them to completely hijack our democracy and have a small minority of I-hate-everything douchebags have complete control is another.

 

That would have been more financially feasible back way when the City Of New York was more prosperous through manufacturing other such industries compared to now, with inflation factors worked in, and was in the position to do exactly that with the IND Second System with that connection from the QBL in mind. Unfortunately however that was killed as we went to war in 1944. Then we  It would have made perfect sense then, or even now if a proper allocation in funds from Albany and the federal government through subsidies can be made to supplement the fare collection revenue the MTA earns as profits for their public services and more support from the public, and less influence from NIMBYs who yield major influence in New York politics for this the LIRR Rockaway via QBL option to happen actually happen. Which it wont. 

 

In other words it's not affordable after WW2, Vietnam, the 70's fiscal crisis and now after the 2006 market crash resulting in the bickering in the cabinet in Albany we are seeing now to the point it's exasperating to many NYers 

 

That's why everyone here in discussion in this thread I can see is opting for the SBS service as an alternative. (dollars and cents) Which can serve the needs of the underlying neighborhoods in question. The MTA has to work with what funds they have as apparently Albany are closing their ears shut to any proposal towards a direct link to the Rockaways as a new Queens Crosstown route that I believe that is in major need. Instead of listening to NIMBY elitists who would rather see the LIRR Rockaway Division turn into a park rather then simply electrifying the rails once more on the Rockaway LIRR and utilizing the Rego Park QBL stub.

 

NYS politics can be so jaded sometimes its surreal. 

Edited by realizm

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That would have been more financially feasible back way when the City Of New York was more prosperous through manufacturing other such industries compared to now, with inflation factors worked in, and was in the position to do exactly that with the IND Second System with that connection from the QBL in mind. Unfortunately however that was killed as we went to war in 1944. Then we  It would have made perfect sense then, or even now if a proper allocation in funds from Albany and the federal government through subsidies can be made to supplement the fare collection revenue the MTA earns as profits for their public services and more support from the public, and less influence from NIMBYs who yield major influence in New York politics for this the LIRR Rockaway via QBL option to happen actually happen. Which it wont. 

 

In other words it's not affordable after WW2, Vietnam, the 70's fiscal crisis and now after the 2006 market crash resulting in the bickering in the cabinet in Albany we are seeing now to the point it's exasperating to many NYers 

 

That's why everyone here in discussion in this thread I can see is opting for the SBS service as an alternative. (dollars and cents) Which can serve the needs of the underlying neighborhoods in question. The MTA has to work with what funds they have as apparently Albany are closing their ears shut to any proposal towards a direct link to the Rockaways as a new Queens Crosstown route that I believe that is in major need. Instead of listening to NIMBY elitists who would rather see the LIRR Rockaway Division turn into a park rather then simply electrifying the rails once more on the Rockaway LIRR and utilizing the Rego Park QBL stub.

 

NYS politics can be so jaded sometimes its surreal. 

Just hire the right lobbyists to work for the MTA. Nassau is getting more state cash for their bus operations, and that'll just go directly to Veolia's pockets with no increase in service. All it took was probably a couple thousand bucks in campaign donations on Veolia's part (state politicians are cheap).

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Because you LI folk use the LIRR. Lots of you do. And some use the subways from Penn Station and Flatbush terminal. What you suggest is grossly entitled and selfish. So if Nassau had their way, the mostly affluent residents of Nassau get to use the very-expensive-to-run LIRR (and then if needed as part of commute, the subways) with a complete subsidy from the mostly lower-and-middle class NYC. That's almost insane in its shameless sense of entitlement.

If you don't want to pay the MTA payroll tax, then that's fine by me; just have LIRR trains bypass Nassau county stops and end Port Washington branch service at Douglaston.

 

As a side point yes many people also reverse commute to NYC from LI using the LIRR then the QBL. And the ridership is ridiculously increasing which is one of the reasons why the MTA is serious about the CBTC project on the Queens Bvld LIne whether lobbyist like it or not. Ditto on the already in service 63rd St connection to the QBL which was built in mind with growing reverse ridership fro the LIRR and local neighborhoods such as Jamaica, Forest Hills, Elmurst and many others.

Edited by realizm

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Why should Long Islanders pay a tax for the MTA if many Long Islanders don't even use the system on a regular basis. In New York City people are more reliant on the Subway and Bus, most Long Islanders only take the train when they are going to work in Manhattan. Theres a good amount of Long Islanders who work in Nassau or Suffolk county and drive to work. Why should they have to pay for something they don't use.

The rationale behind it is that the LIRR (and indirectly the public transit system in the boros) takes cars off the road. The people that are using public transit would otherwise be driving to the city or their destinations. Since those cars aren't on the road other than getting to a train station, it reduces congestion for those who do not have the viable option of mass transit.

 

For example: Say that there is no service east of Ronkonkoma, Huntington, or Babylon (as there was this weekend). More people would need to drive to those stations to get a train. That adds to congestion for those who aren't going to a train station.

 

Same idea, but apply it to the entire island. The same could be said for Metro North and bus/subway within the 5 boros.

 

Short version: it frees up road space for those who need it more and thus benefits both MTA users and other drivers, which benefits businesses and other entities. I know this primarily deals with the island but, as we saw with the Sandy bus bridge, it's true throughout the entire MTA region.

Edited by RestrictOnTheHanger
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